JPF Home Page Forums General Messages General Message Forum Happy Birthday/ The Day The Music Died

Today is my wife's, Sylvia's, Birthday. She didn't know who those guys were because she was just a child. I knew. I was in 8th grade.

But Happy Birthday to my wife anyway. It wasn't her fault.
R.I.P Buddy, Richie, J P.

Happy birthday Sylvia.

Hey Bill, I am having a little get together this weekend if you would like to come. E-mail me MBarne4908@aol.com

It's too bad that the plane crash didn't have to happen. The pilot was 21 years old, though he may have been experienced flying the "V" tail Beechcraft Bonanza, it was his poor judgment to take off in a snow storm. The pilot in command is the final authority no matter how famous the passengers are.
That particular aircraft is a high performance airplane nicknamed "doctor killer" by experienced pilots because it is a favorite among doctors, and many don't have the precision to fly it correctly. It's like a muscle car with wings.

I tried to look up the NTSB report of the crash, but their online records only go as far back as 1962. My guess is that they either took off with ice on the wings, or that it accumulated ice soon after takeoff which caused an aerodynamic wing stall. That would cause the pilot to lose control and the plane would spin to the ground. Judging from the wreckage, that's probably what happened. It fell like a rock. Wind shear is another possibility. Visibility wouldn't be a problem if they were flying on instruments. They should have waited.

Hi Bill:

My best to Sylvia on her birthday. Don't go to MAB's bash... he's notorious for dancing on tables... LOL!

Buddy Holly. We'll never know what Rock and Roll could have been.

Yeah, Ben. I have a few hours in the v-tailed Doctor killer and you are so very right. It's not like flying a Cessna 180 or lesser bird. We had more than one Doctor perform a "wheels up landing" at Texarkana Municipal back in the day... LOL!

Aluminum showers are usually fatal. Thanks for reminding us, Bill.

Regards,

Dave

I'll have to play a couple of Buddy's tunes tonight in his honor.
P.S Happy B-day Mrs. Robinson.

Happy Birthday Sylvia

Calvin


http://www.soundclick.com/bands/0/calvinstewart

Coo coo ca choo...

Midnite

Happy Birthday Mrs. Robinson


and Ben, thanks for the history behind that fatal crash, this was very interesting to me, things most women wouldn't know..i enjoyed reading it very much..see sir, you are a very smart and wise man.........glyn

Ha!
My wife hates that song.

Yes Pilot error was probably the cause of the crash. It was a nasty snowy night and the plane crashed shortly after takeoff.

Funny thing is Sylvia never knew it happened on her Birthday until I told her. And all I got was; "well, thanks for sharing."
And she didn't look to thrilled.
Imagine that.

Happy yesterday Birthday, Sylvia.

In Waylon Jennings' biography, he tells of the plane crash. Jennings was a member of Buddy Holly's band, and he decided to give up his seat in the plane to another band member. Holly teased him about having to drive all that way and Waylon said, "I hope the plane crashes." they all laughed. Throughout Waylon's life, that haunted him.

I used to have a great book on this, but I can't remember it or find it (never can when you want something) right now but it was all about plane crashes of rock and country stars.

Buddy's plane was pilot error and ice on the wings AND bad storm, everything that could go wrong.
They had been on that tour through the Midwest and it was freezing and the busses kept breaking down with no heat. As he was getting on the plane Buddy, who thought he was being cute, said to Waylon, "I hope your ol' bus breaks down." Waylon said, "
Yeah, well I hope your ol' plane crashes."

It did torture him all his life.


I think musicians should stay away from planes:

Jim Croce, they overloaded the plane with a Fender Rhodes piano.

Stevie Ray Vaughn, didn't see the power lines.

Lynyrd Skynyrd, ran out of gas.

Ricky Nelson, free basing cocaine, and caught the plane on fire.

We probably should stay on the ground. At least there we run a better chance of only putting ourselves out.


MAB

Amen. I've got over 40 hours flying time, quit when the gas prices skyrocketed (no pun intended) under Carter. My flight instructor insisted on one thing: that I NEVER, under any circumstances, flew myself to a gig.

Don't forget Patsy Cline, Cowboy Copas, Hawkshaw Hawkins, and Randy Hughes' plane crash in '63. Marty Robbins heard the plane crash near his home and helped in the search.

HAPPY BIRTHDAY SYLVIA!!! Hope you had a great day! : )
xo Joanne

Here is the NTSB report of Jim Croce's crash. The pilot had a heart attack during takeoff

NTSB Identification: FTW74AF017
14 CFR Part 135 Nonscheduled operation of ROBERT AIRWAYS
Event occurred Thursday, September 20, 1973 in NATCHITOCHES, LA
Aircraft: BEECH E18S, registration: N50JR

----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
FILE DATE LOCATION AIRCRAFT DATA INJURIES FLIGHT PILOT DATA F S M/N PURPOSE----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------3-3541 73/9/20 NATCHITOCHES,LA BEECH E18S CR- 1 0 0 COMMERCIAL AIRLINE TRANSPORT, AGE TIME - 2245 N50JR PX- 5 0 0 AIR TAXI-PASSG 57, 14290 TOTAL HOURS, DAMAGE-DESTROYED OT- 0 0 0 2190 IN TYPE, INSTRUMENT RATED. NAME OF AIRPORT - NATCHITOCHES MUNI DEPARTURE POINT INTENDED DESTINATION LAST ENROUTE STOP NATCHITOCHES,LA DALLAS,TEX SHERMAN,TEX TYPE OF ACCIDENT PHASE OF OPERATION COLLIDED WITH: TREES TAKEOFF: INITIAL CLIMB PROBABLE CAUSE(S) PILOT IN COMMAND - FAILED TO SEE AND AVOID OBJECTS OR OBSTRUCTIONS FACTOR(S) PILOT IN COMMAND - PHYSICAL IMPAIRMENT WEATHER - FOG WEATHER - OBSTRUCTIONS TO VISION TERRAIN - HIGH OBSTRUCTIONS SKY CONDITION CEILING AT ACCIDENT SITE CLEAR UNLIMITED VISIBILITY AT ACCIDENT SITE PRECIPITATION AT ACCIDENT SITE 5 OR OVER(UNLIMITED) NONE OBSTRUCTIONS TO VISION AT ACCIDENT SITE TEMPERATURE-F HAZE 69 WIND VELOCITY-KNOTS TYPE OF WEATHER CONDITIONS CALM VFR TYPE OF FLIGHT PLAN NONE REMARKS- PLT HAD SEV CORONARY ARTERY DISEASE.RAN FRM MOTEL TO NEAR ARPT,ABT 3MI.

Here is the Ricky Nelson report. The fire was caused by a cabin heater.

NTSB Identification: DCA86AA012 .
The docket is stored on NTSB microfiche number 29185.
Accident occurred Tuesday, December 31, 1985 in DEKALB, TX
Aircraft: DOUGLAS DC-3, registration: N711Y
Injuries: 7 Fatal, 2 Serious.
AT 1708:48, WHILE CRUISING AT 6000', A PILOT OF N711Y ADVISED ATC, 'I THINK I'D LIKE TO TURN AROUND, HEAD FOR TEXARKANA HERE, I'VE GOT A LITTLE PROBLEM.' HE WAS PROVIDED A VECTOR & ADVISED OF CLOSEST AIRPORTS. SHORTLY AFTER, HE STATED HE WOULD BE UNABLE TO REACH THE AIRPORTS. AT 1711:49, HE SAID THERE WAS SMOKE IN THE COCKPIT. WHILE LANDING IN A FIELD AT 1714, THE AIRCRAFT HIT WIRES & A POLE THEN CONTINUED INTO TREES WHERE IT WAS EXTENSIVELY DAMAGED BY IMPACT & FIRE. THE CREW EGRESSED THRU THE COCKPIT WINDOWS. THE PASSENGERS DID NOT ESCAPE. DURING FLIGHT, THE CREW WAS UNABLE TO START THE CABIN HEATER; DESPITE REPEATED ATTEMPTS BY THE CAPTAIN. SMOKE THEN ENTERED THE CABIN. FRESH AIR VENTS & COCKPIT WINDOWS WERE OPENED, BUT SMOKE BECAME DENSE. THE CREW HAD DIFFICULTY SEEING. THE OXYGEN SYSTEM & HAND HELD FIRE EXTINGUISHERS WERE NOT USED. FASTENERS FOR THE HEATER DOOR WERE FOUND UNFASTENED. EXAMINATION INDICATED THE FIRE ORIGINATED IN THE AFTCABIN AREA, RIGHT HAND SIDE, AT OR NEAR THE FLOOR LINE. THE IGNITION AND FUEL SOURCES WERE NOT DETERMINED.


The National Transportation Safety Board determines the probable cause(s) of this accident as follows:

FUSELAGE,CABIN..FIRE
REASON FOR OCCURRENCE UNDETERMINED



Contributing Factors

FUSELAGE,CABIN..SMOKE
FUSELAGE,CREW COMPARTMENT..SMOKE
EMERGENCY PROCEDURE..NOT FOLLOWED..PILOT IN COMMAND
CHECKLIST..NOT USED
OXYGEN SYSTEM..NOT USED
OBJECT..WIRE,TRANSMISSION
OBJECT..UTILITY POLE
TERRAIN CONDITION..TREE(S)

Earl Scruggs owned and flew a plane. Crashed it in the 60's, don't know exactly when but he was injured pretty bad. He was lucky.

WELL HOW ABOUT JOHN DENVER? HUH HUH? DON"T HE COUNT.

Yes, and has anyone mentioned...

Richie Valens (La Bamba)

and

The Big Bopper.....(Chantilly lace~~"Chantilly lace a pretty face and a ponytail hangin’ down A wiggle in her walk and a giggle in her talk Make the world go ’round Ain’t nothing in the world like a big eyed girl To make me act so funny, make me spend my money Make me feel real loose like a long necked goose Like a--oh baby, that’s a-what I like!

Can't help but want to dance with that one!!
This is from my mom's generation, but I still enjoy it
Get this...when I was a kid...for the longest time..I thought the song was saying...Chantilly lace and a pretty face, a BONY tail..hanging down.." and one day I asked my mom, I was about..14...why would anyone like a bony tail? My mom laughed herself silly....
~Kimberly

if anyone mentioned them and I missed it, I am sorry...

NTSB Identification: LAX98FA008 .
The docket is stored in the Docket Management System (DMS). Please contact Records Management Division
Accident occurred Sunday, October 12, 1997 in PACIFIC GROVE, CA
Probable Cause Approval Date: 1/26/1999
Aircraft: ADRIAN DAVIS LONG-EZ, registration: N555JD
Injuries: 1 Fatal.
The pilot had recently purchased the experimental, amateur-built Long-EZ airplane, which had a fuel system that differed from the designer's plans. The original builder had modified the fuel system by relocating the fuel selector handle from a position between the front pilot's legs to a position behind & above his (or her) left shoulder. There were no markings for the operating positions of the fuel selector handle, which were up (for off), down (for the right tank), and to the right (for the left tank). This deviation from the original design plans did not require FAA approval, nor did it require a placard to indicate such change from the original design. On 10/11/97 at Santa Maria, CA, the pilot received a 1/2-hour flight and ground checkout in the airplane by another Long-EZ pilot. The checkout pilot reported that the pilot needed a seatback cushion to be in position to reach the rudder pedals, and that he had difficulty reaching the fuel selector handle while seated with the cushion added. The pilot then departed on a 1-hour flight to his home base at Monterey with an estimated 12.5 gallons of fuel in the right tank & 6.5 gallons in the left tank. The checkout pilot estimated about 9 gallons of fuel were needed for the flight, and he noted the fuel selector was positioned to the right tank before departure. On 10/12/97 (the next day), a maintenance technician assisted the pilot in preparing for another flight. During preflight, the pilot was not observed to visually check the fuel. The technician noted that when the pilot was seated in the airplane, he had difficulty reaching the fuel selector handle. Also, he gave the pilot a mirror to look over his shoulder to see the unmarked, non-linear, fuel sight gauges, which were located in the rear cockpit. The technician estimated the available fuel and advised the pilot that the left tank indicated less than 1/4 full and that the right tank indicated less than 1/2 full. He said his estimate was based on the assumption that the gauges were accurate and linear. The pilot declined an offer for additional fuel, saying he would only be airborne about 1 hour and did not need fuel. The technician observed that before the engine was started, the fuel selector handle was in a vertical position; however, he did not note whether it was up (off) or down (right tank). As the technician went to the hangar, he heard the engine start & run for a short time, then quit. He saw the pilot turn in the seat toward the fuel selector handle, then the pilot motioned with his hand that things were all right. The technician did not observe whether the pilot had repositioned the fuel selector. The pilot restarted the engine, taxied, took off, and performed three touch-and-go landings in a span of about 26 minutes, followed by a straight-out departure to the west. Ground witnesses saw the airplane in straight and level flight about 350 to 500 feet over a residential area, then they heard a reduction of engine noise. The airplane was seen to pitch slightly nose up; then it banked sharply to the right & descended nose first into the ocean. The major structural components of the airframe were found fragmented on the ocean floor near the engine, but no preimpact part failure was found. The fuel selector valve was found in an intermediate position, about 1/3 open between the engine feed line and the right tank, and about 2-4% open to the left tank. Tests using another engine showed that the engine could be operated at full power with the selector in the as-found position; however, when the cap was removed from the left port (simulating the effect of an empty left tank), fuel pressure dropped to less than 1/2; & within a few seconds, the engine lost power. Conditions were simulated using another Long-EZ to evaluate the maneuver required to switch tanks from the front seat. The simulation revealed that 4 actions were required to change the fuel selector in flight: 1) Remove pilot's hand from the control stick; 2) Loosen shoulder harness; 3) Rotate upper body to the extreme left to reach the fuel selector handle; & 4) Rotate the handle to a non-marked (not logically oriented) position. During the evaluation, investigators noted a natural reaction for the pilot's right foot to depress the right rudder pedal when turning in the seat to reach the fuel selector handle. With the right rudder depressed in flight, the airplane would pitch up slightly & bank to the right.

The National Transportation Safety Board determines the probable cause(s) of this accident as follows:

the pilot's diversion of attention from the operation of the airplane and his inadvertent application of right rudder that resulted in the loss of airplane control while attempting to manipulate the fuel selector handle. Also, the Board determined that the pilot's inadequate preflight planning and preparation, specifically his failure to refuel the airplane, was causal. The Board determined that the builder's decision to locate the unmarked fuel selector handle in a hard-to-access position, unmarked fuel quantity sight gauges, inadequate transition training by the pilot, and his lack of total experience in this type of airplane were factors in the accident.

Happy Birthday Silvia !

Patsy Cline, Otis Redding & Stan Rogers(helicopter fire on runway in Cinci...

We actually do a set we call S.A.D. Songs....Small. Airplane. Dead.

And was it Glenn Miller back in the 40's?

Midnite

Happy Birthday Sylvia! So, you can now LEGALLY drink in all 50 states?

This a busy time of the year for us:

1. Mother-in-law Birthday (recently deceased) - January 11th
2. My Mother's Birthday (still living in Branson) - January 25th
3. Sister-in-Law's Birthday - January 30th
4. Daughter-in-Law's Birthday - Jan 31st
5. My Father's Birthday (died in 1969) - February 1st
6. My Younger brother's Birthday - February 2nd
7. Mine and Helen's Anniversary - Tomorrow, February 6th (17 years)
8. My Daughter's Birthday - February 8th
9 Son-in-Law's Birthday - February 9th
10.Youngest brother's Birthday - March 3rd
11.Helen's Birthday - March 19th
12 My Birthday - March 22nd

The checkbook wants to run and head this time of year! Other than Helen, they only get a card and a phone call. Checkbook has stopped sweating.

So Al, what are you doing with all of your spare time?

Well Alan
Happy Birthday to all your kin.

Hey My Brother is the 7th. Guess I better remember to call him.

The Civil Aviation Board (CAB) was the precursor to the NTSB. This is the closest that I can find to an official report on Buddy Holly's plane crash.

In 1959, Buddy Holly, Ritchie Valens, and the "Big Bopper" (J.P. Richardson) died when their Model 35 Beech Bonanza (V-tail) airplane crashed. Charles Hardin, Richard Valenzuela and J. P. Richardson were members of a group of entertainers appearing in Clear lake, Iowa, the night of February 2, 1959. The following night they were to appear in Moorhead, Minnesota. Because of bus trouble, which had plagued the group, these three decided to go to Moorhead ahead of the others. Accordingly, arrangements were made through Roger Peterson of the Dwyer Flying Service, Inc., located on the Mason City Airport, to charter an aircraft to fly to Fargo, North Dakota, the nearest airport to Moorhead.

A Beech Bonanza crashed at night approximately 5 miles northwest of the Mason City Municipal Airport, Mason City, Iowa, at approximately 0100, February 3, 1959. The pilot and three passengers were killed and the aircraft was demolished. The aircraft was observed to take off toward the south in a normal manner, turn and climb to an estimated altitude of 800 feet, and then head in a northwesterly direction. When approximately 5 miles had been traversed, the tail light of the aircraft was seen to descend gradually until it disappeared from sight. Following this, many unsuccessful attempts were made to contact the aircraft by radio, The Wreckage was found in a field later that morning. This accident, like so many before it, was caused by the pilot's decision to undertake a flight in which the likelihood of encountering instrument conditions existed, in the mistaken belief that he could cope with en route instrument weather conditions, without having the necessary familiarization with the instruments in the aircraft and without being properly certificated to fly solely by instruments. It is believed that shortly after takeoff Pilot Peterson entered an area of complete darkness and one in which there was no definite horizon; that the snow conditions and the lack of horizon required him to rely solely on flight instruments for aircraft attitude and orientation. The high gusty winds and the attendant turbulence which existed this night would have caused the rate of climb indicator and the turn and bank indicator to fluctuate to such an extent that an interpretation of these instruments so far as attitude control is concerned would have been difficult to a pilot as inexperienced as Peterson.

They cite the cause as the inexperience of the pilot in the aircraft flying under instrument conditions. I still believe that ice was a contributing factor.