JPF Home Page Forums General Messages Songwriter Message Forum How does this stay on the Country charts for 35

I had the opportunity to see Jimmy Wayne perform at the Elliot Hall of Music on the Purdue University campus a few months ago. He was the openner for "Lonestar". He played a 30 minute acoustic set by himself with a guitar. This guy oozes talent and will be around for a long long time. As far as the writing stucture or the lyrical content of "You Are"? I believe he is sincere and women will love that in a young fellow that sings as well as he does. Granted this song is not Shakespear in a cowboy hat; however you folks are beating a dead horse here!!! LOL!!! I hope my next song is half as good as this one.

Jerry

"You Are" by Jimmy Wayne

------------------
DAWG TRAX HOME PAGE
DAWG TRAX NEWSLETTER

Kris,
Your right,No doubt, we expect an honest critique when we post a lyric in these forums. My point is that this writer did not post this lyric and ask for critique. The lyric was posted by someone other than the writer and this other writer bagan to bash the lyric. My skin is pretty thick and i've been told more than once that a song stinks, that dosnt bother me. But please dont take a lyric of mine and without my permission, post it and degrade it. This is not a critique. It is a bashing!! It is the most un-ethical thing I have ever seen on JPF.
Lets look at the big picture here.

With all respect

Robert Gann

David,
I simply answered your question.

Robert

Robert why are you continuing this are you not very good at reading. I already answered YOU above when I said "touche"

David,
I appoligize. I misread your post.
Can we be friends? I have no ill intentions.
I have nothing but the highest reguard for every member here.
I have this slight problem with speaking my mind.
Again I appoligize!

Robert

Lyrics?
I often wondered how much input "RAP" lyrics
contributed to making the huge amounts of $$$ the songs have made in the industry, verses the music itself; the beat being so popular.
I could go on a rant regarding that topic.
I do love some of the tracks (loops) being created currently in "House/Hip-Hop" music-
Even some of the themes and lyrics are pretty
nice.
One song I loved from the first minute I heard the song was: HEY YA by OUTKAST.
I was drawn in by the beat, and production.
The Group won grammies for;
Album of the year, Best Rap Album, and came in #2 for best record of the year.
2004, that is.

Cal

P.S.
On a forum such as this, everybody should be entitled to their opinions; regardless if you agree, or disagree.


[This message has been edited by Cal (edited 10-09-2004).]

Robert,

I mean no disrespect to you in what I have to say here. I think your wrong about the posting and critique. Once you put your music and written lyrics out on the internet, public performances, CDs, and the like, as was in this case. You have handed people your "art". The public domain. They now posess it, love it, hate it, or worse, ignore it. You can't prosecute people for their opinions about art. There would be no freedom of expression then. You can ignore them. Or in this case. Have the last laugh all the way to the bank as this writer obviously did. It bugs me. I have to admit that. What I see in country music today generally makes my oatmeal hit the wall. I like all kinds of music. The truth is; Commercial music has become a fashion show for product placement and has little to do with the art of music. I am a musician & writer. Therefore I am biased. Biased because I understand this. A non musical person probably has no clue about it and couldn't care less. It's not wrong to do things that way, it's business. The American way. We also have the right to dissagree about it.

Pick up a copy of rolling stone sometime or one of the other rags and you might see what I mean about a fashion show. There are older major artists out of Nashville that feel this way as well and I have heard them express those points in front of their audiences. Will their points make a difference? Probably not. They can't go against corporate entertainment anymore than you or I could.

That said, I write because I like to. And not for any other reason. If money comes from it, all the better. To me it's like playing the lottery. Winning is a nice dream.

Good luck to all of us.

Kris Karr
http://www.soundclick.com/bands/2/kriskarrmusic.htm

The meat of the issue is: If you have the talent, connections, and truly a HIT song, the song will sell itself.

COMPLICATED Avril Lavigne
WIND BENEATH MY WINGS (several covers)
I HOPE YOU DANCE Leann Womack- and others,
all have a great mixture of lyric, rhythm, music, melody, and production.
These are great songs.
I also believe few songs make it based on the lyric, or music alone.
I think it's a bit of "Fluff" when one uses terms as "fashion show" or other excuses for songs that he/she doesn't consider good songs- which make it on the charts.
There are many songs on the charts, that I also, really never or will like.
The creative artist, songwriter, producer, or agent, must take advantage of any tool available, to be different, when needed, to get those competitive spots on the charts.

Just my opinion

Cal

Kris' You are right, We live in a free society where we are free to say what we want.Its better than living under a dictatorship but there is a matter of common courstey which we should (not have to)give to all of our fellow writers. After all, arent we all reaching for the same goals. If a fellow member strikes gold with lyrics that we dont consider "up to snuff", should we rain on his parade, or should we be happy that another one of us "made it". That should give us confidence that we can make it too. I know that we have our music "critiques in Rolling Stone, they get paid big money for what they do and they do it well, thats their job. My job is to write the best that I can and i also consider it my job to help and encourage others trying to do the same thing. So if you consider this lyric bashing the right thing, then by all means, that is your right. We have so many rights in this great country and I'm proud of that. But just because you have a right to do something, does it make it right to do it even when it hurts someone else?
I have the right to stand on the street calling people fat,ugly,thin, whatever I want but would I do that, NO and I dont suspect you would either.
Do you have a legal right to do this? Sure you do! By all means go for it but dont expect it to get you anywhere is this business, in fact, I suspect it will do you more harm than good. Is it worth it? You and only you can decide.

With all respect

Robert Gann

[This message has been edited by palidin (edited 10-09-2004).]

Any of us that have been at this for a while have experienced the "instant" song....
the one that just seems to write itself.


after we finish one of those, we usually don't take it very seriously...after all..if 99 songs take a week each and then one burps out in 5 minutes or so, it's logical that we would take it lightly.

Thing is..when folks hear a song, they don't know if it took six minutes or six months..or six years.

Jimmy Buffets career is built on Margaritaville.

Sure..he's had other hits, but lets face it..Margaritaville is the career song.

Six minutes...that's right..he just strummed the chords and played the song.

He says the way you hear it today is exactly the way it sounded as it came out...

My point is that it's absolutely OK to look at a piece of work and judge it...we're members of the same club...we're allowed.

But, we should not lose sight of what really matters..
What WE think doesn't mean a damn thing..
It's what people like my wife think..
She doesn't know a whit about music..but she knows what she likes..and that's what she buys..

God Bless her...she thinks I'm pretty good...so...that makes the whole rest of the world wrong..and that's fine with both of us !

So..if some inane mumbling with a few dumb chords spills out as your latest attempt...well....you just might have a big hit on your hands !
And guess what....it'll be OK if folks in this business don't think its great...you can bet your spotted butt they'd love to have it in their catalogue.

Bob

[This message has been edited by bob young (edited 10-09-2004).]

[QUOTE]Originally posted by palidin:
[B]Kris' You are right, We live in a free society where we are free to say what we want.

Boy, I must have to much time on my hands-

Particulary on the internet. There are no rules or laws that govern what one can say (post) on-line.

Robert, don't you think you should accept the fact that Kris has the right, to say exactly what Kris feels?
Same principal applies to you Robert, and everybody else who posts here- or on any web-site.
I don't think these comments posted here on this board would ever hurt any succsessful artist-
Why should they care?

I think some of us have made a personal issue out of this thread, and digressed from the topic. No one is hurt from these comments, but those who have said such.

I am in support of philosophical, psychological, and moral views-
The trouble with these personal approaches to the music industry is; they are practically irrelevant.
This is a rough, disciplined, and criteria oriented business.
Sometimes life isn't fair.
Improvise.

Cal







[This message has been edited by Cal (edited 10-09-2004).]

Cal, I think that I said in my last post that Kris and you and I and all people from everywhere have the right to speak their minds here in America.

I happen to think that the virtues you mentioned above ARE relevant. I think there are still some good folks out there in the industry who judge you on your moral views as well as your talent. It is not all dog eat dog! You may say thats nieve, but I will chose to believe it.

Rob







[This message has been edited by palidin (edited 10-11-2004).]

There's no real secret here, it's a guy singing about how wonderful his girlfriend is, and girls eat that gooey romantic stuff up....try telling your girlfriend/wife....she's wonderful, and I bet she'll be cooing in your arms in no time at all. Singing a star attractions lyric doesn't hurt either. Hey have you ever listened to early Beatle slop *i wanna hold your hand*, i just don't see the mystery¿¿?¿

------------------
http://www.ampcast.com/music/26305/artist.php

[This message has been edited by sweetjoyce (edited 10-12-2004).]

Wow, this is a very interesting topic. What is interesting about it is that is spills over into other areas as well. My area is one of song writing contests, or joining an organization to get a song pitched. If a lot of these ‘hits’ are lame, then those writers who really write good lyrics and music don’t stand too much of a chance of getting a deal.

So does this mean we have to ‘dumb down’ our talents to get paid? I have went to some of your web pages and listened to your music, really good stuff. I have also heard the same about my music. Yet, when you submit a song to be reviewed by an organization for a large label, and they say it’s not what the label was looking for, it makes you wonder. I once submitted what I considered (as others did) a pretty good country song for consideration, and the response was that it was not written on the ‘format’ of country tunes, when I actually copied the ‘format’ of a couple of hit country songs!! I guess you have to wear the tuxedo if you want to be in the wedding!

I was listening to a station here in Cincinnati that had new music, sounded Indie, and man, was it refreshing! Great songs, great musicians, I loved it!

Anyways, keep doing what you’re doing writers, you know you got it, we just gotta get it out there!!!

Good luck!

Orlando Luckey
Label 19 Records
www.label19records.com
www.cdbaby.com/orlandoluckey2

"So when I see lyrical rubbish that I could of wrote when I was twelve it tends to flare my Hemorrhoids"

Why would you keep you day job if you capable of writing songs that will stay in the top 40 for half a year?

“My family and I no longer listen to commercial radio. Haven't for about 5 or 6 years.”

Also, I think that people that have not listen to the radio in years, shouldn't have an opinion on why certain song are on the radio!


------------------
I write, therefore I am....

Freebird,

I am highly capable of it.
What I am not capable of is paying someone a hundred thousand or more to play it on the major media conglomerates.
I guess you just don't Get it!

Good news, David. You don't have to have the money. Simply present your great songs to the right people in the industry and THEY will pony up the money to promote it.

The publishing and recording industries are looking for hit songs 24/7. Send yours right away!



[This message has been edited by TrumanCoyote (edited 11-03-2004).]

Truman,

I'm doing that practically every month.
Actually waiting on a few right now.
We'll see if the stars are aligned this time.
The Wright song at the right place and the Wright Time.

DAvid

David, If you have a great song they will find it AND fund it!

What else do I need to get?
------------------
I write, therefore I am....

[This message has been edited by Free Bird (edited 11-03-2004).]

Nuttin! Freebird

You could be right, we'll see.

Lyricaly, this song is incredibly tacky! I wrote something like that to a girl on valentines' day in the 2nd grade... and she was blind!
But if you hear this on the radio, you will understand why it was at #20 on the charts last month. The melody is super catchy and super simple. It's easy for the average, non musical, person to digest while they are sitting in traffic after a bad day. Sometimes they just don't want to have to realy think about what the singer is portraying. Their sub-contious plays to it better.
d*rock
http://www.soundclick.com/danracadiosongwriter

Lyricaly, this song is incredibly tacky! I wrote something like that to a girl on valentines' day in the 2nd grade... and she was blind!
But if you hear this on the radio, you will understand why it was at #20 on the charts last month. The melody is super catchy and super simple. It's easy for the average, non musical, person to digest while they are sitting in traffic after a bad day. Sometimes they just don't want to have to realy think about what the singer is portraying. Their sub-contious plays to it better.
d*rock
http://www.soundclick.com/danracadiosongwriter

Drock,

Your probably right on...

Hey I just listened to your tune on Soundclick.
"Just Like that" was wonderful. Very modern pop mixed with country. Great style and very commerical delivery..
Have you written more?
Good Stuff.

DAvid