JPF Home Page Forums General Messages Songwriter Message Forum How come we don't get more seekers?

Wow Bobbie, so there is business people who are stealing our ideas in progress! If this is general knowledge, it could keep some of the best from posting work-in-progress, could'nt it?

Yeah well, I guess you can't, and would'nt want to, protect an idea. I guess this is one way to get 'inspiration', for people in a hurry. But if the intention is bad from the beginning, I guess they'll never succeed to reach the theta level of making dreams come through, now would they :-)

So luckily, there's a lot more to songwriting, so I guess it's really a cadeau to the creative community in here.

So, I guess, Everett, seekers are not just a good thing, are they? We need some free space to finish out work-in-progress.

Like we songwriters always tell publishers "Don't call us, we'll call you" :-)

When I listen to what makes it to radio, I wonder why. Very rarely does today's songs grab me and hold my attention. Years ago there seemed to be more attention grabbing songs where you'd listen to the lyrics as it actually said something. Today it's more about the beat, if you can dance to it, that is all that matters, the words don't have to say anything interesting or even sensible. Still, for a new songwriter pitching songs, they want the songs letter perfect or it will be trashed. Enough to make you scream.

Interesting comments, Bobbie. Kenny Chesney's song Everybody Wanna Go To Heaven (But Nobody Wanna Go Now) was written by Jim Collins and Marty Dodson, but I do believe they might have "borrowed" the hook from Albert King's recording of a song with almost the same name which was written by Don Nix many years ago.

Of course, all music is derivative and everybody who writes is inspired by what they have listened to all of their lives.

I also agree that someone like Alan Jackson could sing the yellow pages and people would buy it because he is who he is.

I'd like to add a Kind Lyrical Word for Tim McGraw, as well, regardin' LYRICS. Back when I was Paying Attention to Song Pitch Sheets he had a Producer who DIDN'T WANNA HEAR any Demos. Instructions hadya MAILING the LYRICS to a Hawaii Addy.

IF they LIKED the Lyrics, THEN they'd get in touch witcha to HEAR the Demo.

(My Kinda Producer...heh!) Too-bad I forget names so easily...but Tim DOES sell a LOTTA CDS, Don't He?

End of Message,
Big Hugs,
Stan

What has seemed more professional to me in my wee bit of experience has been playing down to my level.
I would love to do an appropriately sung balad like "Lady In Red".
But I have at the best on a good day a medocre voice more suited for belting and mumbling out something.
The recordings I have put up on the net with the thinnest arrangements and more hard rock oriented are my most favored.
The musicians where I live that I know do loud guitar music and are not commercial at all.
Yet at the same time I love artists like Chris De burgh.
I may like his more rocking stuff like "High On Emotion" even more.
But as much as I suck trying to do effective songs in that vein, I do not want to play down to my limitations.
That just does not seem like art to me and I would rather just leave my recordings twisting in the breeze on the net.

I am at this site to better what I can do that is outside of my capacity.

Well this Aussie girl gave up reading all your posts. GOLLY GOSH!

This is what I got to say, I have heard some MEGA HITS on JPF, so come on board to JPF, and check us out!

I have two really good songs, "Don't Push My Buttons" and "Get Over It" that are brilliant, CATCHY, and I can tell you, I won't be giving up so easily.

Many here are wanting to purchase my songs, so I will continue to venture on with my other songs I'm working on, and the day is going to come, that my dreams will become a reality. YIPEE! I WILL NEVER GIVE UP!

Michele

Did I scare everyone off hah? Stay POSITIVE!

Maybe the Eagles will check out my song "GET OVER IT", and maybe I will get to meet them one day, that would be exciting, oh well, no harm in dreaming!

Michele

Hi Michele,

Just gave your "Get over it" a listen, WOW! Thats all I'm sayin..

Sure the Eagles are great, and it probably will happen. But why not have someone like Miranda Lambert recording it first, so the Eagles get the best possible version to their ears? :-)

Oh, well sorry about this small business break, bach to the thread..

The why question about the seekers? Thats what this thread is about..

Hi Magne

Well Miranda Lambert can record my song if she would like, thanks so much for the lovely compliment. I love "Get Over It" and I am very proud of how it turned out, and so pleased you agree, WOW. I would be very excited if the Eagles listened to my song, that would be amazing, and to meet them, golly gosh, I would be lost for words, I have never met anyone famous my whole life, or ever been to one of there concerts, the only one famous I have ever seen in concert is Dolly Parton and Kenny Rogers, and it was fantastic "I love Dolly", but it was like looking at little pins, cause I was seated at a fair distance.

All the Best
Michele

Michelle, I'm not kidding, I think Miranda Lambert would consider doing this song, if you'd pitch it to her. It sounds very much like a match to her style.

Well, I have'nt met anyone famous in music either (as far as I can remember), but I did see Johnny Cash once a couple of years ago. He came on tour in scandinavia, and played a small outdoor venue in my hometown Ålborg at that time. WOW, I tell you, that's a scary guy! He did the 'Hellooo, Sweeden' thing, not realizing where he was geographically :-) Just hilarious, but that did'nt take anything away from his performance at all..

Fantastic!

Hi again Magne, I couldn't place the name, until I googled Miranda Lambert, I new as soon as I seen her face, I love her song Kerosene amazingly, and yeah she would be a perfect match for "Get Over It" and I have others that I'm working on that would suit her fantastic voice also. How do I pitch my songs to Miranda Lambert hah???????????????

Johnny Cash, cool, I'm happy to hear you enjoyed it.

Calling Miranda Lambert!

Thanks for the huge compliment!

Aussie friend
Michele

Michelle, you go first to http://www.allmusic.com/ looking up Miranda Lambert and look if she is recording outside songs.

If so you go look on Billboard.biz (you need to subscribe) to look up the producer she has worked with on her latest album.

Then you call his office asking if anyone there knows who is producing her next album. If you get a name, you call his office asking if she is looking for songs, for her next album.

If you do not get a name, you call her record label, asking who is producing her next album. If she is looking for songs, you ask if you may send them your unsolicited material. And keep doing it untill they accept. If they do not, you put a note in your calender waiting untill she has released her next album, going on tour, and then you call again.

You go to one of her shows with cd's in your backpack and try to get one on one with one of her musicians, asking them if they would present her your cd with 10-20% in return of your mechanical royalties. If you get a call from her producer, you agree to give him 20-30% of the publishing or more if she cuts the song. If you don't get to her show, you keep calling her producers office (the one for her next album), asking if they will accept your material now.

Otherwise you go through Taxi, Songlink or others, finding a publisher who would pitch the song to Miranda.

Well, thats what I have on that subject :-)
Others may assist..

I don't know about anyone else, But I have heard more than my share of great songs on this site. That is why I come back. Heck to me in this day and age, if you don't have a certain look as a country performer male or female you don't get your shot. How many country songs on the radio today (big hits) sound exactly alike, cloned .. the performers cloned, laser light shows and sex appeal .. that maybe where the money is but I don't think the songs are all that much. A few good ones but for the most part I think far less than the original music I have heard here. I could not disagree more that there are no "killer" songs on this site. Killer depends on the listener. All stamped alike one size fits all .. no .. but IMO far better than what I hear on the radio or the country music stations. Got the sex appeal, maybe play and instrument, (not that it really matters) we will surround you with dancers, lasers, and plug the Ok song so much that people will buy it and call it great. That to me is the state of music today. A bet a Dylan or even a Johnny Cash wouldn't get a shot today because they don't fit the stamped out mold

Any way that is my rant for today

Killer song I guess to the industry is one that will make a lot of money ... however "tequila makes her clothes fall off" is a killer song ??..

Oh my gosh, compared to most of the music I heard here, I can only hope that people here continue to "not write killer songs" if that is the case.

To me music is from the heart, translated by the mind into words and melody, not just what can be pushed onto the consumer.

However, I am not in the song writing business, have no aspirations of becoming a song writer. I write for myself and if my friends and family like it that is enough.

I understand people who do this for a living have to write according to the record company's marketing ... but to me it is sad.

This Aussie girl needs to get in touch with Miranda Lambert, as Magne said she would be a perfect match for my song "Get Over It".

Miranda Lambert are you out their hah. When are you coming to Australia?

Hmm, just staying positive!

Michele

Hello guys,

MAB here, I am coming late to some of these threads so I apologize if they are over. I just officially joined JPF three days ago, (Thought I was a member but didn't sign up apparently)
I have been trying to provide a little "Nashville perspective" to your threads to see if I can help in explaining some things from the "other side of the desk."

On why aren't there more seekers here? Mostly it is a time issue. No one has the time or patience to go through all these sites. But also in Nashville EVERYONE is besiged by material. Everybody comes here. Everybody wants their songs heard. Everybody wants the hit.
Imagine if you will that we are all in the Mohave Desert. There are hundreds of thousands of us out there, dressed in the robes, all like Lawrence of Arabia, all walking around with buckets of sand. We are trying to sell our sand to each other. We all have sand. and we are trying to get our sand to publishers, pluggers, artists. record labels. Those people have dump trucks full of sand. They are taking the sand to the customers for sand,those that need concrete, glass, medicines. all the things sand is used for. That is how many people are trying to sell the same product.

What happens with a song and songwriter is much more than just the song. Relationships, connection with inner players in the industry. Inside Nashville we do things like tonights' benefit for a fellow songwriter who is going through health problems. We will all see each other, give money, interact. enjoy each other's company. We are friends here. Now a lot of people from outside who haven't done that, been a part of the community, haven't made friends like that, want to play from outside. When it comes to your livelyhood, you just don't accept that from anyone. And even if you think songs in the mix from here might not be as strong as other songs that might be out there, have you or the other writers done that networking?

And then look at it at one more way. If you are doing this, you and you were to have one chance to pitch a song, would you put another song you didn't write, ahead of your own in line?

That is how we have to look at things. I hope that we will be able to attract more artists to this and similar forums in searching for material. But it starts with word of mouth and reputation. WRite great songs, record them well and network continually and that is the good start.

MAB

So your chances are slim if you are not doing the Nashville scene. I guess that leaves me out. Sigh.

Everett: The other alternative is to find co-writers that are part of the Nashville (or other) scene and collaborate. I would surmise, however, that the same problem might exist in co-writing. Nashville co-writers probably want to write with other Nashvillians first to extend their "inside" contacts. OK, we're still left out (LOL)!

Kevin

Hi Everette

God picked another flower, is the most beautiful song I've ever heard, it's stuck in my head.

The Nashville thing, hey, we are starting to get some Nashville talent here, so come on you guys, don't give up so easy hah.

What I love about all of you here, is your individuality, so special, no hit song gives me what I get here on JPF.

Great friends, great music, great singers, I'm laughing again, in which I haven't done for a very long time, and I'm SMILING. YIPEE! You are all the best hah.

Michele
Keep on SMILING!

Post deleted by Flowergirl

Where's Nashville ? Somewhere near Tasmania ?

cheers, niteshift

Flowergirl,

There is no certain time that artists come to town to look for songs. They are overwhelmed by them all the time. When they are on tour they are writing them themselves, which is the biggest competition we have. Most cuts are "inside" which means the artists, the big writers, the people they have written with them, the producers, the publishing companies they own, etc. You are actually competing with their own material. When was the last time you pitched a song over your own?
It is a constant process and over a year's period, artists and their screening team will go through over three thousand songs. These will be narrowed down to the top twenty or thirty, then those will be cut down to about fifteen that are recorded and twelve that are actually on the CD. So it is a continuous process.
The closer you are to the source, the artist, producer, etc. the better you are. We all use the same pitch sources, pluggers, publishers, etc. but it is very hard to get through the elaborate screening process.
I have just become involved in the contest judging for Just Plain folks and they have gotten over 60,000 submissions. So you can imagine what the industry goest through.
I don't know who has told you what about August, that doesn't ring any bell other than to say some artists might be coming off the road and narrowing down their pitches. They also have to get all the people at the record labels to sign off on every song so you are talking about focus groups, assistants, and sometime entities like corporate bosses that are in other cities and sometimes other countries. It is a very large process.
There is the CMA music week in June where most of the artists are in town for shows, and to meet fans. And the country Radio seminar in Feb. where they schmooze and meet and greet with teh radio people they need to play their records. But as far as one time they all come in to listen to songs. That is year round.

MAB

Thank you Michele, it is nice to have at least one fan. You keep plugging away at song writing and at life, one day you'll get a break from one or the other. God bless.

Dan,

One thing we learn real quick in the real music industry,you always might want to be careful what you say about songs and songwriters. "Tequila Makes Her Clothes Fall Off" is actually a very well written song. It does not make the woman look like a drunk and avoids the same cliche's that are in every other drinking songs do. And a LOT of fans bought that record and requested it. It was one of the most requested songs of that year. It also was one of the most sung on Karaoke nights. And one of my best friend's wrote that song, who happens to be a really great guy and has helped a lot of people with advice and encouragement. Particularly spending time with songwriters who come to town to learn about the industry. I know because he has done it as a favor to me. So before you ridicule things, you need to be careful, cause you never know who might help you one day.
I only say this because my job in life is saving writers from cutting their own throat, and not even knowing they have a knife in their hands. I care a lot for people here and would like to introduce them to people I know that could be very beneficial to them. So I always would like people to understand what they are in to. It is a reason professionals don't participate in a lot of these things.
A killer song is one that the public buys. The record industry cannot force anyone to buy product. And they can't "force" anything down anybody's throat. For every label, there are fifteen acts on it. Of those, three will make enough money to be resigned the next year. The rest, having not earned their keep, are let go. And the three who make money support all the rest of the ones who don't make money. And there are fifty in some form of development to step in. Most never see the light of day.
It is ruled by committees, but the artists have a responsibility to be selling their own product. If they don't, they can't blame nobody but themselves. This is a very unforgiving business. And nobody forces anyone to try. It is for adults who are putting themselves into the breach.
The only thing any of us can do is own up to the challenge, quit whining about what we can't do anything about, and work our butt off to inject reality in our dreams.

MAB

Hey Shift,

Head east 'til ya reach Bicheno, buy a boat and start rowing. You'll be there in no time.

Midnite

Like you say, it's not likely a Nashville writer would stoop to write with an outsider, especially long distance writing.

Well, despite finding this thread long after it's demise, I'm adding my two cents, anyway. Before I do however, please note the following:

* I am a person with very little knowledge about the music business and how it operates.

Meaning: If I say something stupid (and I will), please refer to the boldfaced type above, chuckle a little, and say to yourself: "Aw...Well bless her heart." lol

Okay.(Now where was I? Ah, yes....)
Well I've been to these forums a couple of times now, hoping to find some info. or links to where I might LOOK for songs. If the Resource page includes any, they didn't 'jump out' at me as such(see * above).
My initial impression was that this site is (primarily) a place for songwriters and other industry professionals to exchange ideas/information, etc. and address topics/questions regarding the logistics of the music business itself (I realize there's a lot more here now).

So I was surprised today, when I found this thread. In the time I've spent looking around here, I haven't seen anything that tells me, "Hey, look here for available songs".
I assumed (see * above) that the writers who frequent this site already do (or hope to) pitch their music to publishers, and/or 'signed' recording artists.....and would have no interest in an artist who's unsigned, or doesn't at least have an agent or manager or some other kind of 'foot in the door' already.

If this site is a 'song resource' for the unsigned artist, it isn't presented as such. After navigating the entire site, I can't find anything that tells me the songs posted here are available to 'just anyone'. I assumed writers posting songs solely to get 'peer feedback'. (The mp3 and lyric forums all have 'Feedback' in the title). I should also mention that I went to FAQ page, hoping to find info about where/how artists typically find their songs, but the page is empty.

Adding a 'seekers' forum is a good idea at first glance, but I've visited a few of these. They all seem to end up becoming a collection of threads entitled something like: "Singer needs songs", each followed by several replies saying: "I have songs, here's my link"....followed later by: "So...did you listen to my songs yet?" (Well, they probably did...but didn't happen to like the songs.)
The prospect of having to say, "Sorry, but your songs are not really what I'm looking for" (for whatever reason) is enough to keep me from posting on such a forum at all.

I DO think that adding a forum (perhaps elsewhere, if 'stealing ideas' is a concern here) where those songwriters who wish to could post a message with the following: Basic info along with some kind of link to a playable list of available songs would be the way to go. This way, the 'seeker' could easily get to the actual songs, then they could PM or email the songwriter if they are interested.

I'm guessing there's some reason why this wouldn't 'fly' (see * above). I doubt that I'm the first person to come up with this idea.
If it already exists somewhere, can someone please point me to it? (see above)

-M (aka: one of those rare unsigned artists who do not write.)

MMCS:The majority of postings in the MP3 sections are songs that, no matter what state they are in, can be considered as songs looking for an artist to perform them. Yes, there are some singer/songwriters and performing artists there, but there are a lot of writers/demos looking for a home.

What I would do, is to peruse the MP3 forum and listen to a few of the songs here and there. If you find one you really like, then go visit the writer's home page and you will probably find a lot of songs. Most folks have some kind of link to a home page in their message or in their profile. It may take a few visits.

Welcome to the JPF and I hope you find a song or two you can perform.

Kevin

Like Kevin said, most writers here are looking for artist to record and perform their songs. It would be nice if the artist was well established, but not necessary. The small indie artist today, with the right material, just might be the next big thing. We all have to start some where.

M,

I agree with Kevin's suggestion - peruse the mp3 boards and send a personal message to the poster if you find something you like. The mp3 forum contains links to the songs, usually on Soundclick, so you can listen to them in finished form, or as worktapes. Also post your comments on songs if you want to get to know people on the boards. If you really want to get involved, let people know more about you and the styles or genres you perform - there's not much in your profile. If you state you are looking for female country songs or male hard rockers, you immediately home in on something that is useful.