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#598389 03/20/08 12:33 AM
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Hit songwriter shares his secrets

By CINDY WATTS
Staff Writer

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There's more to teaching songwriting than providing pointers on how to craft the perfect lyric, according to hit songwriter Jason Blume.

It's about constructive honesty, support and hope.


And Blume should know: He has taught free songwriting classes once a month at BMI for the past 10 years. All people have to do to attend is show up the day of class and register.

"I struggled for 11? years before I got my first break, and for some of that time I was eating cat food to survive," Blume said. "I lived in one room, no kitchen or bathroom, junkies and hookers down the hall. I share things like that to show (students), 'Yes, it can be really tough, but it's not impossible.' Sometimes I think that's more important than sharing the tools and techniques, because that keeps them hopeful and keeps them writing."

Blume relayed that story at the beginning of February's class on hit song lyric analysis, which reached its 50-person capacity by 9:30 a.m., three hours before the class started. The teacher said he encourages people to arrive early to sign up, then go grab a cup of coffee or write a song while they wait. When class started, promptly at 12:30 p.m., songwriting students of varying skill levels and with interests in multiple genres of music occupied every chair around the massive conference table and filled every seat lining the walls.

"We're here today to analyze hit song lyrics," said Blume from the head of the table. "Why? To rip them off," he said jokingly. "No, but to figure out what works."

Blume passed out packets of lyrics to hit songs from various genres and then spent the next two hours combing through them to find the elements he thinks made them hits. Sometimes it was a fresh idea, melody or lyric. Other times it was simply the fact that the artist who recorded the song was also a co-writer or the only writer.

"There's a world of difference to writing lyrics you can pitch to other artists and lyrics for yourself," he told the class.

Then Blume gave suggestions on how to make songs more appealing to artists who are willing to record material from outside sources.

One observation: Singers tend to gravitate toward songs that are "very literal." "In country they like detail, action and storytelling," he said. "Pop is a statement of how the singer feels, and hip-hop (artists) are the masters of scene setting."

They can pitch a song

During the second half of class, Blume brought in John Ozier, A&R coordinator at Curb Records, to listen to songs class members had brought with them.

"Typically (I bring in) a publisher, and other months each person gets to play a song for me and I do a critique," Blume said. "Sometimes they pitch a song and sometimes they get it critiqued, but they get to bring a song to every class.

"One of the exciting things that happens because of that is that each writer gets to audition 50 potential collaborators. If you come and you hear someone else's song that you love, it's an opportunity to talk to them and say, 'Hey, you wanna write some songs together?' "

Ozier said later that he walked away from the class with 20 CDs from students. That day he was looking for songs for Clay Walker, Jo Dee Messina and others, and while he isn't sure he found either singer's "next big hit," he emphasized that you never know where that hit song might come from.

"It's good to actually go out and hear songs," he said. "I've done several of these 'pitch to a pro' classes. I keep a few of the songs I've found in a stack, and when we're looking for (songs) I bring them out.

"People always talk about how it's so hard to get in the door, and oftentimes it is. There's so many more writers than there are executives. That's why those workshops are great ? because you get to meet with 50-100 songwriters at once."

Blume's March class, which is scheduled for Tuesday, will teach students how to pitch their songs, followed by a song critique. Blume said he knows the idea of presenting a song for critique can be nerve-racking, but it's a step that's imperative to grow as a songwriter.

"I've had many people come month after month and not play a song, and confide in me they are terrified," Blume said. "I say to those people that I respect their feelings, but I still hope they find the courage to take that leap.

"The only way we can get better is by learning not only what's working but what's not working. It might sting a little bit, but I would rather have my ego temporarily squashed than to never have tried. I urge people to take the risk, take the chance and trust they will be strong enough to survive the rejection."

'I feel so alive'

Blume has had songs recorded by artists ranging from Britney Spears and The Backstreet Boys to Gipsy Kings and The Oak Ridge Boys. He has even managed to have songs on the country, pop and R&B charts simultaneously.

Blume's passion for his art is evident. What might be more ambiguous is why Blume has spent the past 10 years donating his time to help others hone their craft when he could be writing more hit songs to benefit himself.

The answer turns out to be simple: He loves to teach.

"Teaching is my passion," he said. "It might sound strange, but I knew I wanted to teach songwriting from day one, when I attended a workshop. I don't know why, but I looked at the teacher and I knew that I wanted to be a successful enough songwriter to get the credibility to teach.

"I feel so alive when I'm teaching, and every big cut that I got ? I'm remembering the Backstreet Boys, and at the time that was the biggest you could hope for ? my very first thought was not, 'Wow I'm going to make so much money,' but, 'Wow, nobody will ever be able to touch my credibility now as a teacher.' "



http://www.tennessean.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20080314/TUNEIN02/303140012/0/TUNEIN


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I always wondered about the cat food thing...

It's not that I don't believe him...but there are more appealing options in that price range... :O

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Exactly my sentiments Mark...what he he got against dogs!!

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Or rabbits!!

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I'd highly recommend listening to Jason's songs and studying his lyrics carefully.


Nashville demos etc:

https://www.soundclick.com/bands3/default.cfm?bandID=431939

other demos:

https://soundcloud.com/wabash-cannibal

Amazon Kindle books by Robert George you may enjoy:

1) Americana

2) Teenage Graceland

3) The Will to Be

4) Fort Mystery

5) Wheel Sea

6) My One True Love
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Why?

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I was
Living in a fantasy
Waiting
For somebody to rescue me
But I found a way to light the dark
It was always here inside my heart
No more fairy tale pretending
I’ll make my own happy ending

(chorus)
If I wasn’t meant to fly
I wouldn’t have these wings
I wouldn’t reach up to the sky
Every night in my dreams
There’s a voice inside of me
Saying “I can do anything”
‘Cause if I wasn’t meant to fly
I wouldn’t have these wings

There’s a
Star that’s shining down on me
Reflecting
Everything that I can be
Every journey starts inside my heart
There’s no mountain that’s too far
‘Cause if I set my mind to it
Whatever it is I can do it

Chorus

To take me farther
Than I ever thought I’d go
Higher than the Heavens
‘Cause deep inside I know

Chorus


Can anybody tell me what is so good or so special about these lyrics. Personally I see nothing out of the ordinary. I bet they would be considered just average if posted in our lyrics forum by Joe Bloggs.

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I think anyone who teaches creativity ought to have their stuff looked at. smile


Nashville demos etc:

https://www.soundclick.com/bands3/default.cfm?bandID=431939

other demos:

https://soundcloud.com/wabash-cannibal

Amazon Kindle books by Robert George you may enjoy:

1) Americana

2) Teenage Graceland

3) The Will to Be

4) Fort Mystery

5) Wheel Sea

6) My One True Love
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Please take a look at what I just posted and give me your thoughts.
PS I think that anybody who teaches creativity should have their head looked at.

Last edited by BIG JIM MERRILEES; 03/20/08 05:42 PM.
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is that one of Jason's?

the music industry has two backdoor ways of making $$$...one is only accepting expensive demoes thereby turning songwriters into producers and arrangers. Studios and session cats make a killing. There's not much songwriters can do about that.

another is the literal army of "teachers" out there charging good money for "critiques". can these guys write themselves? or did they just lucky ten years ago and now they make a living "teaching". check it out for yourself. That's all I recommend.

It's bogus that we have to cough up cash we don't have for full demoes because pubs can't hear a song. but that's the biz. Songwriter's DON'T have to pay out good money to hear vague advice from people who can talk and talk but can't write. not all such teachers are scam artists but many are. take ten minutes and look at their stuff.



Nashville demos etc:

https://www.soundclick.com/bands3/default.cfm?bandID=431939

other demos:

https://soundcloud.com/wabash-cannibal

Amazon Kindle books by Robert George you may enjoy:

1) Americana

2) Teenage Graceland

3) The Will to Be

4) Fort Mystery

5) Wheel Sea

6) My One True Love
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I've written four pieces so far this week...Boardwalk Phonebooth, Vacuuming In the Nude, Casey Kasem and Memorial Day. I've also got 50 songs(many published and pitched) on soundclick. Anyone can listen to those and read my stuff on Lyrics 3(and Taxi). Compare it to Jason's and they'll know what I think. I'm learning a leetle about diplomacy. smile


Nashville demos etc:

https://www.soundclick.com/bands3/default.cfm?bandID=431939

other demos:

https://soundcloud.com/wabash-cannibal

Amazon Kindle books by Robert George you may enjoy:

1) Americana

2) Teenage Graceland

3) The Will to Be

4) Fort Mystery

5) Wheel Sea

6) My One True Love
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I have got it in the neck so many times for saying that
1. A lot of stuff in the charts is mediocre
2. A lot of top pop singers have little or no talent
3. There is a back door and people with little, average or no talent get pushed through regularily.
4. So called Pro Critiquers are a waste of money.
5. Producers should be able to spot a good song through just a simple, even badly recorded demo and a copy of the lyrics.
6. Country music is in a time warp because they only accept clones of tried and tested formulas and will not move with the times.
Well I have been challenged to PROVE my stance. Now I challenge anybody to prove the above statements are wrong.

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Jim, writing good songs is the best proof there is.


Nashville demos etc:

https://www.soundclick.com/bands3/default.cfm?bandID=431939

other demos:

https://soundcloud.com/wabash-cannibal

Amazon Kindle books by Robert George you may enjoy:

1) Americana

2) Teenage Graceland

3) The Will to Be

4) Fort Mystery

5) Wheel Sea

6) My One True Love
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Folks can listen here to several snippets of Mr. Blume's songs:

http://www.myspace.com/jasonblumesongwriter

Some folks will like them, some won't. Just as some folks like Bob Dylan, some folks don't.

What Jason Blume does excellently is to make the rhythm of the music more important than the rhythm of the lyric. Many writers will craft beautiful stories with clever twists and memorable events, but then the music doesn't enhance it...nobody feels like dancing.

In Country, for example, a lot of writers will listen to a song like Bobby Braddock's classic "He Stopped Loving Her Today" and be so enamored by the words, that they forget how well his words fit the music and how much space is given for the music to play. In the song, George Jones spends a measure singing "He Stopped Loving Her Today..." then the Pete Drake gets an equal measure to play a soaring pedal steel part along with the string section.

All too often, writers will craft the words first, then "shoehorn" some music to it, or vice versa.They end up with songs that only have enough space to take a breath, or that have words squeezed into musical sections in order to fit. Mr. Blume's songs are a first rate example of prosody.

As well, I'd admonish folks to listen to Mr. Blume's advice. Are his lyrics up there with Bob Dylan? Well, for one thing, that depends on whom you ask. For another, granted that Mr. Dylan's work as a lyricist and songwriter will be revered critically for generations to come, what lessons can a JPF songwriter take from them without ending up sounding like one of the endless, boring Dylan clones (the few writers who can compete with Mr. Dylan in his own arena are certainly the exception). However, Mr. Blume provides a blueprint that is accessible to the talented, confident, songwriter who is not afraid to work. But be ready to work, Mr. Blume's songs are deceptively simple.

All the Best,
Mike


You've got to know your limitations. I don't know what your limitations are. I found out what mine were when I was twelve. I found out that there weren't too many limitations, if I did it my way. -Johnny Cash

It's only music.
-niteshift

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If you guys think that all it takes to make it in the music business is to write the best songs possible, then by all means, show me.

Great songwriters make it. Not so great songwriters make it. Why? It's not JUST because they wrote a great song. There's more to it than that.

If you think it's that easy, then show me.

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By the way, you may or may not like Jason Blumes' stuff. But I will tell you this. Jason Blume is a BRILLIANT businessman.

He deserves the credibility he earned.

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Gregory, here's a song we should cowrite:

Cuts Talk, Demos Walk.

PM me.


You've got to know your limitations. I don't know what your limitations are. I found out what mine were when I was twelve. I found out that there weren't too many limitations, if I did it my way. -Johnny Cash

It's only music.
-niteshift

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here's one that Jason cowrote with Karen Taylor Good
it's one of my favorites
Karen does such a brilliant job with it

"She's Gonna Fly" / "on Angels Wings"
recorded by Collin Raye

This is the woman
Who had all the answers
The one I would lean on
For comfort, for strength
She's never forgotten
One grandchild's birthday
Now she can't remember my name
And it makes me so angry
I shake my fist
And cry out to the heavenly one

Why would you play
Such a cold hearted trick
I thought your job was to love
And the answer came down from above

She's gonna fly
When her time here is through
First she'll have to let go
Of some things she can't use
'Cause people and places
Memories and faces
Are just way too heavy it seems
To carry on angel's wings

This is the woman
Who saw things so clearly
The one who could pick out
One crumb on the floor
She saw through a white lie
Saw me through love's eyes
She hardly can see anymore

And it makes me so sad
And it just isn't fair
Why should so much be taken away
But when I cry out
For all that she's lost
I silently hear someone say

She's gonna fly
When her time here is through
First she'll have to let go
Of some things she can't use
'Cause people and places
Memories and faces
Are just way too heavy it seems
To carry on angel's wings

And oh, the wonders she'll see
And I know she'll remember
To watch over me

She's gonna fly
When her time here is through
First she'll have to let go
Of some things she can't use
'Cause people and places
Memories and faces
Are just way too heavy it seems
To carry on angel's wings

To carry on angel's wings


Ande Rasmus sen
Ande R a s m u s s e n@aol.com
Ande R a s m u s s e n.com
SongRamp.com/ande
MySpace.com/anders

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writing good songs is just the starting point

There's so much more to it, like:

Networking:
+ going where the music business happens,
+ meeting the people who make great music,
+ building relationships and friendships then
+ collaborating with them.

Finding Talent

Helping people

~ ~ ~

Different songs fit different markets and follow different guidelines.

It would be silly to critique a hip hop or pop song using country lyric criting guidelines

I wish that people would see merit and embrace it, but the industry looks for accomplishment, each songwriter who truly desires commercial success has to make a journey to it.

Get a big cut or have a big single or write a career making single for an artist and you'll find many doors open.

Demos pitched to artists and producers need to sound awesome.
Unfortunately awesome is expensive, plus when you write a lot of songs it's hard to figure out which songs to do up right.

I believe
a bad demo can disquise a great song
but
a great demo can't disguise a bad song




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I have found that a great lyric is only half the battle. Mike has added the other half.
Prosody. The music has to fit and the music has to bring out the emotion of the song.
I have been actively participating in workshops, Publisher critiques and pitch to publisher nights in Nashville.
Matter of fact I am going to one tonight. I will be one block from Music Row.
I am starting to get a glimpse of what they are looking for. Now all I have to do is write it, LOL.

I am mostly a Country writer. I don't really care whether anyone else likes country music or not. What I care about is do the publishers in Nashville like my country songs. No one else matters.
I am not interested in a record deal. I am interested in cuts. Not just any cuts either. I want Major league cuts. TOP 40 cuts and a couple number ones would do just fine.
And anyone who thinks you can't get rich writing country songs is full of it. A number one is probably worth 3/4 million the first year. That's Rich to me.

Any one who thinks Nashville publishers don't know what they are doing is fooling themselves. Half the Profesional critiquers are publishers. You know why they do it. They are looking for writers, writers who can write hits songs.
They also do it because it is their passion. They eat, drink, sleep, and crap music. 24/7 that's what they do.
If you go to a critique session at night you are being critiqued by a person that was probably up a 5 AM, at work by 6 AM and you are talking to them at 8PM when they are still working.

You guys talk about Achy Breaky Heart. Say its crap.

Wake up....The song was Brilliant. Listen to the lyric then listen to the music. They are a perfect fit. Then add that to the line dance craze. Another perfect fit.
The song made millions and songwriters are sitting there saying how crappy the song was.
Well if I could write crap like that at the right time I'd be a very happy guy. And since I am an old guy my heirs would be happy also, LOL.


Bill
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I'll add this
I was at a pitch session to a major publisher earlier this week. the publisher had a couple recent number ones to his credit.
He listened to about 25 songs. Many were professionally done.
He asked two people to contact him because he wanted to hear some more of their songs.
NONE of the two had a Professional demo. They were sung live right there on the spot, Guitar/vocal and Keyboard/vocal.
I think he also asked one person that had a recorded Guitar/vocal CD that was done by the songwriter.
So much for Professionally done demos.


Bill
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http://www.dreamqueststudio.com
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"The democracy will cease to exist when you take away from those who are willing to work and give to those who would not." --Thomas Jefferson didn't say it

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Mike, be specific...what do you admire about Jason's lyrics. please don't be vague...quote lines and why you feel they're well written. comparing Jason to Dylan seems like a bad analogy...go to allmusic.com ...artists there are listed with their influences. Dylan's name comes up all the time. never seen Jason's. Last year's article in American Songwriter had many interviews with classic writers concerning their influences. Dylan was mentioned by several writers...Jason wasn't.

Ande, does Jason teach a course in business(networking etc) or a course in how to write a good song. In the area of songwriting, I only suggest anyone being asked to shell out good money examine the "teacher's" own work. I would think any such teacher would welcome the examination.

another angle is this: devotees of these teachers often sing their praises. Have a look at what these students write. if their writing is fresh and creative, that's a solid recommendation right there. if it's not...that tells you something, too.


Nashville demos etc:

https://www.soundclick.com/bands3/default.cfm?bandID=431939

other demos:

https://soundcloud.com/wabash-cannibal

Amazon Kindle books by Robert George you may enjoy:

1) Americana

2) Teenage Graceland

3) The Will to Be

4) Fort Mystery

5) Wheel Sea

6) My One True Love
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Specifically, "She's Gonna Fly" moved me nearly to tears. Other than that, I did, specifically, say what I admire about his lyrics. They so perfectly fit with his music. Jason to Dylan is a bad analogy, how? Specifically?


You've got to know your limitations. I don't know what your limitations are. I found out what mine were when I was twelve. I found out that there weren't too many limitations, if I did it my way. -Johnny Cash

It's only music.
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Couch,

If you think you can write a better song than Jason, furthermore, if you think you can get a song you wrote to the #1 slot on the charts and do it better than Jason, then SHOW me.

If you can do it, hats off to you.

But if you can't, then don't slam those who have. They did something you obviously haven't.

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It's so funny no matter what thread is posted it always some how turns into an attack, criticism or downer on anything current, popular, successful.

I try to avoid these threads as they don't accomplish much. My need to try to help people is probably the thing that gets my attention when I catch stuff like this.

Really trying to make me people "Get It" It's amazing how some and many just don't get. Can't believe how we can't separate things and see what's what...

And you wanna critize the music industry?

Greg, good luck buddy you'll never get through smile


Thanks!
Peace Mike
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Mike, what about She's Gonna Fly moves you? which lines? What you like most about Jason's lyrics is that they fit with his music? so you recommend them on the basis of good metering? I already mentioned why the Dylan/Jason analogy was bad here "comparing Jason to Dylan seems like a bad analogy...go to allmusic.com ...artists there are listed with their influences. Dylan's name comes up all the time. never seen Jason's. Last year's article in American Songwriter had many interviews with classic writers concerning their influences. Dylan was mentioned by several writers...Jason wasn't."

Greg, I nowhere slammed Jason's songs...I only suggested that people listen to them. You're saying, what...they shouldn't?


Nashville demos etc:

https://www.soundclick.com/bands3/default.cfm?bandID=431939

other demos:

https://soundcloud.com/wabash-cannibal

Amazon Kindle books by Robert George you may enjoy:

1) Americana

2) Teenage Graceland

3) The Will to Be

4) Fort Mystery

5) Wheel Sea

6) My One True Love
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Mike, please show me where I attacked Jason. show me.


Nashville demos etc:

https://www.soundclick.com/bands3/default.cfm?bandID=431939

other demos:

https://soundcloud.com/wabash-cannibal

Amazon Kindle books by Robert George you may enjoy:

1) Americana

2) Teenage Graceland

3) The Will to Be

4) Fort Mystery

5) Wheel Sea

6) My One True Love
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couch, you're cracking me up. You're being specifically vague in your non-attack against no one in particular...but you APPEAR to be calling Blume's talent into question, or not.

That's what most of us are specifically seeing...

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Originally Posted by couchgrouch
Mike, please show me where I attacked Jason. show me.


I never said you attacked Jason Blume. Show me where I said it, show me.



You've got to know your limitations. I don't know what your limitations are. I found out what mine were when I was twelve. I found out that there weren't too many limitations, if I did it my way. -Johnny Cash

It's only music.
-niteshift

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By the way, you may or may not like Jason Blumes' stuff. But I will tell you this. Jason Blume is a BRILLIANT businessman.

He deserves the credibility he earned."

Gregory I will give you that point and it kinda proves mine. Money is primary talent and quality secondary. IMHO it does not matter how good a businusman you are you should be producing quality products to get anywhere in this business. The fact that good business wins over talent on a regular basis is what makes me angry about this business. It ceased to be art many many moons ago and is now a factory churning out cheap immitations.
If you want examples of this crap look at the UK current top 10 pop charts. I have a short critique on the get rich quick thread giving a rundown. It is worth a look and a listen to some of these turkeys.

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if not me, who were you addressing Mike? me or Big Jim? man up...who were you talking about when you said this: "It's so funny no matter what thread is posted it always some how turns into an ATTACK, criticism or downer on anything current, popular, successful."

it also looks like you left off trying to explain what it is you like about Jason's songs.


Mark, I only asked that people listen to Jason's songs. that's only an attack if it's already recognized by others he's not a good writer.

for example...Rosie O'Donnell goes into business giving beauty tips and I say...look at her picture.

or...Catherine Zeta Jones goes into business giving beauty tips and I say...look at her picture.

once again...listen to Jason's songs.

Last edited by couchgrouch; 03/20/08 09:35 PM.

Nashville demos etc:

https://www.soundclick.com/bands3/default.cfm?bandID=431939

other demos:

https://soundcloud.com/wabash-cannibal

Amazon Kindle books by Robert George you may enjoy:

1) Americana

2) Teenage Graceland

3) The Will to Be

4) Fort Mystery

5) Wheel Sea

6) My One True Love
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For the record, Jason's songs don't appeal to me much...however, I have a great deal of respect for his success as a songwriter. He's not a one-trick pony...he writes for different specific markets and hits the mark that is being asked for. In fact, he is very good at that.

Personally, I prefer to listen to Dylan. But if Blume and I were in a competition to write the next hit Adult Contemporary Pop song, Jason Blume would whip the poop out of me.

Still, he was a fool to eat cat food.

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Arguing about this is a waste of time.

I'm with Mike Caro and Mike Dunbar. Lets just write and see who comes out on top.

Bam. That's my take.

Love ya all

GWATT

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Originally Posted by couchgrouch
Mike, what about She's Gonna Fly moves you? which lines? What you like most about Jason's lyrics is that they fit with his music? so you recommend them on the basis of good metering? I already mentioned why the Dylan/Jason analogy was bad here "comparing Jason to Dylan seems like a bad analogy...go to allmusic.com ...artists there are listed with their influences. Dylan's name comes up all the time. never seen Jason's. Last year's article in American Songwriter had many interviews with classic writers concerning their influences. Dylan was mentioned by several writers...Jason wasn't."


Grouch, I'm moved by all of "She's Gonna Fly." It reminds me of my grandmother's passing. The music fits it perfectly. I wouldn't single out one line, just as I wouldn't single out one eye of the Mona Lisa. I find no line in it that is weak.

I'm not, by the way, qualitatively comparing the Mona Lisa to "She's Gonna Fly." Nor am I suggesting that I expect Mr. Blume's work to be as regarded by future generations. Very few works of art will ever reach that level of acclaim. I'm using the Mona Lisa as an example of a work of art which most people know, and using it as a bolster to my decision to not be antiseptic in my analysis of what's good. I chose the Mona Lisa because it is dissimilar, as a work of art, to the song "She's Gonna Fly" except in that I wouldn't focus on one part as emotionally moving to me. This is also an analogy, which the dictionary defines as: NOUN: 1a. Similarity in some respects between things that are otherwise dissimilar.

This was how I compared Dylan and Mr. Blume. They are dissimilar. Dylan is older, and more well known. Dylan is considered a giant among songwriters and Mr. Blume, though widely respected, is not. This is proven by your observation that many classic writers mentioned Dylan as an influence in American Songwriter magazine, but not Mr. Blume. Dylan writes and wrote serious intellectual pieces, and wrote most of his work for himself as the singer. Mr. Blume writes popular music in many genres and is covered by other artists. They are dissimilar. What I pointed out as a similarity, was that some folks like Dylan, some do not. I will prove this: I like Dylan, my friend Dave does not. Similarly, some folks like Jason Blume, others do not. I will prove this: I like Jason Blume, my friend Dave does not.

So, proving they are dissimilar, and proving they are in some ways similar satisfies the definition of "analogy." As to it being qualitatively judged as a good or bad analogy, I defer to my own judgement...it's good.

Further, I went on to point out another dissimilarity. Copying Dylan's style, in my opinion, will not garner hit quality songs for young songwriters...he's too hard to copy successfully. Copying Mr. Blume's style will.

All the Best,
Mike


You've got to know your limitations. I don't know what your limitations are. I found out what mine were when I was twelve. I found out that there weren't too many limitations, if I did it my way. -Johnny Cash

It's only music.
-niteshift

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Oh and Couch, you've got your Mikes mixed up. Read the names of the people posting and it will prevent you from barking at the wrong person.

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Originally Posted by couchgrouch
Mike, be specific...what do you admire about Jason's lyrics. please don't be vague...quote lines and why you feel they're well written. comparing Jason to Dylan seems like a bad analogy...go to allmusic.com ...artists there are listed with their influences. Dylan's name comes up all the time. never seen Jason's. Last year's article in American Songwriter had many interviews with classic writers concerning their influences. Dylan was mentioned by several writers...Jason wasn't.

Ande, does Jason teach a course in business(networking etc) or a course in how to write a good song. In the area of songwriting, I only suggest anyone being asked to shell out good money examine the "teacher's" own work. I would think any such teacher would welcome the examination.



Hi Couch

I thought you were replying to Mike D and this post above...

I was just responding in general to this thread and too many others like it and mainly to Big Jim as he's always at the head of these posts smile

I can tell the difference between Jason Blume & Bob Dylan and I can recognize what each ones talents are. And admire them both, of course I personally favor Dylan (duh) and I don't own songs from Jason but give Jason Blume tons of credit.

You sound like your saying he should look at his own work before giving advice and teaching others? Is that what your saying?



Thanks!
Peace Mike
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Originally Posted by couchgrouch
if not me, who were you addressing Mike? me or Big Jim? man up.


OK, MR. GROUCH, I'LL MAN UP. SHOW ME WHERE I SAID THAT. COME ON. YOU MAN UP.


You've got to know your limitations. I don't know what your limitations are. I found out what mine were when I was twelve. I found out that there weren't too many limitations, if I did it my way. -Johnny Cash

It's only music.
-niteshift

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Mike D, all apologies...I didn't realize you and Mike C were different folks. too much microdot in my teens. really...I apologize.

Mike C, I'm just saying before songwriters pay good money to "mentors", they oughtta do a background check. whether it's Jason Blume or anybody. There are a million workshops in Nashville and on the Net. take a few minutes and see if you're impressed with the folks dishing out the advice before you pay for a plate.



Nashville demos etc:

https://www.soundclick.com/bands3/default.cfm?bandID=431939

other demos:

https://soundcloud.com/wabash-cannibal

Amazon Kindle books by Robert George you may enjoy:

1) Americana

2) Teenage Graceland

3) The Will to Be

4) Fort Mystery

5) Wheel Sea

6) My One True Love
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Originally Posted by couchgrouch
Mike D, all apologies...I didn't realize you and Mike C were different folks. too much microdot in my teens. really...I apologize.



I knew that, I was just jerking your chain. You look so cute when your face gets all red like that, you big Ol' Grouchie, you.


You've got to know your limitations. I don't know what your limitations are. I found out what mine were when I was twelve. I found out that there weren't too many limitations, if I did it my way. -Johnny Cash

It's only music.
-niteshift

Mike Dunbar Music

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well, anyway...so ends my afternoon, haha.


Nashville demos etc:

https://www.soundclick.com/bands3/default.cfm?bandID=431939

other demos:

https://soundcloud.com/wabash-cannibal

Amazon Kindle books by Robert George you may enjoy:

1) Americana

2) Teenage Graceland

3) The Will to Be

4) Fort Mystery

5) Wheel Sea

6) My One True Love
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Any ways on a lighter note Maybe we have got it all wrong.
We should all go to business school first then learn how to play instruments and write songs. It seems that the businessmen are the only ones who make money in this game.

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I never really understood how anyone could critique lyrics without having a song with them. Just seems pointless to me. There are so many ways to match lyrics to music that you could have deep, poetic lyrics performed poorly with stupid music underneath, making the song itself stupid, or meaningless lyrics that sound beautiful in context.


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Hey Mike, I think your friend Dave is a contrarian, but my friend, Dave does not! Sometimes I think I am caught in a nexus between parallel universes. Hey, there goes that Doctor Who music again....

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Well boys and girls I am back
The pitch session went ok I guess. My song was ignored,,,again. But so were the 40 or so songs before me...except one.

I did not hear any Dylan's or Blume's either.I have to wonder about some of the songs I heard tonight. They were pretty weak. There were a couple that I thought were pretty good but none I would have said would get cut....except one.
I knew it was a good one before the first verse was done and by the end of the chorus I was sure of it.

Ya want to know how I knew?

It sounded familiar. I was sure I had heard the chorus before.
I hadn't of course but that's the point. It sounded like the other HIT songs I have heard on the radio for the last year or two.
It was the only song the Publisher was interested in.

Now here's the rub.
Remember I was at a publisher critique session earlier this week. I said there were a couple songs the publisher liked. Well the one he liked the most I had heard before......what's that you say? heard before? Yep I have been hearing it on the radio for the last year or so.....It was a perfect fit for todays market. It sounded like every other song I have been hearing for the last couple years.

So you folks out there that say todays music sucks and you don't listen to the radio........wellllll. what can I say. I think I will keep listening to the radio. A lot. I am going to learn to write what they want to hear....and cut..
You folks that don't listen to the radio keep writing what you write.

Oh and I was wondering....when was Dylan's last number one, or top ten. I never heard Modern Times, Thunder on the Mountain, on the radio. I wanted to buy it but both times I looked for it at Best Buy they did not have it. Personally I liked it but it just does not seem to get any attention in todays market.

Last edited by Bill Robinson; 03/21/08 02:00 AM.

Bill
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"There's a world of difference to writing lyrics you can pitch to other artists and lyrics for yourself." - this is so true.

I find it so interesting that as soon as there's a post about someone who has actually SUCCEEDED in getting hit songs placed and getting jobs as a staff writer, all these people come out spewing negativity. I've read Jason's books and I've heard him speak in person. You may think that his kind of success comes from "selling out" - well, try it, see how easy it is.

Jimi Heath posted something in her blog that I think is very true:
"Don't Diss Radio ...as a writer who is trying to make it you HAVE to respect the work that was put into getting that song recorded by that artist and then give props to the writer. Remember, that writer worked his ass off to get where he/she is and at the end of the day, the check is coming to their mailbox, not yours. Like the song or not, it is to be respected. You never know, one day it might be YOUR song that some newbie writer thinks sucks."

read the complete article at
http://www.jimiheath.com/art2.htm



Vikki Flawith: Songwriter/Composer, Singer/Voice Teacher

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Vikki,

Jimi Heath makes right look wrong. (OK, JPFERS, I WANT FIVE SONGS WITH THAT AS A HOOK...NOW!!) That's exactly what it's like. Nashville, if you can make it here you can make it anywhere (where have I heard that?) The same rules apply, just different grooves. Mr. Blume "gets" that, so he gets cuts here, he gets Rock cuts, Pop cuts, R&B cuts and Rap cuts. He listens (I don't know this for sure, but...I know this for sure) to every style, studies it. Doesn't think, "How can I make fun of this to impress my friends?" Rather, he thinks, "How can I get 'inside' this world and create something that makes folks feel and gets them dancing?" and he does a great job of it. Just listen to his songs on his MySpace site.

Also, here's the part I love, as a JPF mentor, he could be reading this thread that Ande (another true friend of the songwriter) started. Jason Blume would be a very valuable ally if he were to click on someone's soundclick site and was blown away by what he heard.

As Jerry Lee Lewis once said, "Think about it, darlin'!"

All the Best,
Mike


You've got to know your limitations. I don't know what your limitations are. I found out what mine were when I was twelve. I found out that there weren't too many limitations, if I did it my way. -Johnny Cash

It's only music.
-niteshift

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There is this musician whose last name is Blunt, can't remember his first name off hand (I hav'nt followed new music much in this century even though I'm probably younger than most here), along with Coldplay.
The song seems to really matter to those acts.
Then there is the more album oriented or non-mainstream format.
Some are not out to win a contest but have something of their own that they want to offer to the plate and may have even garnered a certain listenership. I respect both methods.
Much hinges on what someones goals are.
I want something done around song ideas myself.

The last person that claimed to do that here I talked to over the phone tried to hustle me for a thousand dollar a month internet lessons.
I'm not out to sound like the other guy or make recordings around samples and call that an artistic work.
I would like to take an idea and get the people around that idea without someone trying to hustle or change me.

And I don't think that I am the only one that thinks that with the "how to be a winning musician" adds.

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Originally Posted by Mike Dunbar
Mr. Blume "gets" that, so he gets cuts here, he gets Rock cuts, Pop cuts, R&B cuts and Rap cuts. He listens (I don't know this for sure, but...I know this for sure) to every style, studies it. Doesn't think, "How can I make fun of this to impress my friends?" Rather, he thinks, "How can I get 'inside' this world and create something that makes folks feel and gets them dancing?" and he does a great job of it. Just listen to his songs on his MySpace site.


Exactly


Bill
http://www.soundclick.com/billrobinson
http://www.dreamqueststudio.com
Skype; bill.robinson12

"The democracy will cease to exist when you take away from those who are willing to work and give to those who would not." --Thomas Jefferson didn't say it

http://voidnow.org/
http://www.americansworking.com/
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So...all this time I spent trying to be the very best I can be in bed...was not even necessary??? mad

Joined: Apr 2001
Posts: 8,574
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Not when I'm around it's not.


You've got to know your limitations. I don't know what your limitations are. I found out what mine were when I was twelve. I found out that there weren't too many limitations, if I did it my way. -Johnny Cash

It's only music.
-niteshift

Mike Dunbar Music

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