JPF Home Page Forums General Messages General Message Forum "George Bush Doesn't Care About Black People,"

`Bush' song gets more than million Web downloads

http://www.mcall.com/news/local/chi-0510030008oct03,0,2693817,print.column?co ll=all-newslocal-hed


here's where you can hear it:

http://www.k-otix.com/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=55&Itemid=2

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Ande Rasmussen
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http://www.AndeRasmussen.com
http://songramp.com/ande

http://www.MySpace.com/anders

Editor Of "Inspirations for Songwriters"
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[This message has been edited by Ande Rasmussen (edited 10-03-2005).]

Well,
The Jesse Jacksons of the world still don't want to give up slavery, segregation, racisim, etc. Because when they have to give all those things up they have to face the real world. I think most of us have moved on even many blacks that don't agree with the same old gibberish. Have you heard what Dr. Walter Williams or Bill Cosby has said. The Liberal left is out of power and will be for the next 30 to 50 years. I won't miss (most) of them.

I can see this one's gonna be a HUGE can of worms! My heart goes out to the hurricane victims{of ALL races!} but I'm so sick of the"race card"being played at every possible oportunity!!! What,no WHITE people were affected??? Was there a different set of rules? I think not! P.S KANYE IS AN IDIOT!

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bc

Since Jesse Jackson wasn't responsible for slavery, segregation or racism, I'm struggling to understand why you'd lay it on his doorstep.

Speaking only for my self, I'd rather be upset at the policies that made Jesse necessary.

Getting back to kanye, he's a young man with strong beliefs. As a popular artist he's been given a platform. He'd serve his cause better if he could articulate his views with just a teensy bit more grace.

That meltdown on national TV didn't really serve his cause, however in his record he's saying something that a lot of people, right or wrong, believe.

As an artist, he doesn't have to be right, just sincere.

He's SINCERLY an idiot,and no, Jesse didn't create past social injustices,he just likes to exploit them now.

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bc

I don't particularly care where racism comes from.. I don't really tolerate it from any perspective, nor will I accept it as a valid retaliation or response to some other idiots racist comments. For everyone in this discussion.. please keep that in mind.

Brian

Brian, you are correct{as usual} I can see this thread has the potential to get ugly in a hurry,so I'll just pour myself a strong one, and chill!

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bc

hmmm... personally I'd change the title to "George Bush doesn't care about anything but holding onto power at the cost of human lives of any colour" like most politicians, he's good at looking like he's doing something while doing as little as possible so as not to offend anyone who helps him stay in power.

sorry to get cynical

hummingbird is the most 'right-on' so far and kanye west IS an idiot. i remember when he lost out to gretchen wilson last year for a grammy he cried too... until john rich of big and rich told him to kiss his country ass .... all those politicians will use anything to keep their power

The real story here is how two largely unknown musicians saw an opportunity to do something clever, and basically cut-and-pasted a song together (illegally!) in less than an hour to become a sensation-of-the-moment.

Who here can claim as much?

From the article:

Created in less than 30 minutes by two Houston musicians, the free song marries the comments by Kanye West with the drums and vocals of the rapper's song "Gold Digger." Bubbling for weeks on the Internet, the track also has made it to radio.

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Scott Andrew
Lo-fi acoustic pop superhero!
http://www.scottandrew.com/music

"By not taking money from it, we haven't infringed on any copyrights,"

Seeing as this statement is completely incorrect, the potential liability for 1,000,000 downloads is not insignificant.

Marty - that's a REALLY good point! That statement is completely incorrect...but it's something a lot of people believe...you know what tho...in rap and urban music that happens all the time, out in the open even, with people getting paid for it, and it's kinda accepted. There was a record store in Indy that sold "mixes" on CDs, which would be unsanctioned (meaning the proper licenses were not obtained) recordings re-mixing different hip-hop stuff like EMINEM (sp?). Some of the mixes even had the artists endorsing them on the CD. From the article I read, this appeared to be commonplace throughout the country. The record store got raided by the FEDS or the city, can't remember which, and the owner was trying to figure out why and he was scoffing at the idea they would take him down for copyright infringement, as again, it seems this is commonplace. The reason they raided was because some of the other big name retailers wanted him out of business because he was selling new releases before the street date, meaning these other businesses were potentially losing sales...

When Moses Avalon wrote that article about the CDBABY digital contract, one of the things he said (I'm paraphrasing here) was that the contract hurts or discriminates against urban music. What I'm talking about is what he meant...in my opinion Avalon was saying it discriminates against urban music because apparently a good portion of it is again unlicensed, and of course the contract makes sure you have all that done. Now, that's an absolutely ridiculous statement by Avalon, as he knows full well (as does anybody else) that CDBABY and any legitimate download service has absolutely no choice but to ensure the music is all licensed...I am fully confident CDBABY would welcome any kinda of music, but they can't if it's not licensed....



[This message has been edited by Liszt Laughing (edited 10-04-2005).]

True, they were taking a big legal risk by releasing that remix. It's 100% infringement.

That said, the song has been out long enough (I first heard it weeks ago, a few days after Kanye made his statement) that I figure Kanye's lawyers would have acted on it by now.

A million downloads really isn't that much in internet terms, and if I were the brass at Kanye's label, I'd let the song live, since it helps keep Kanye in the media spotlight.

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Scott Andrew
Lo-fi acoustic pop superhero!
http://www.scottandrew.com/music

excellent point, that was one of the reasons I shared it, I don't know if their million download is true, but writing that it's had a million downloads will make people check it out.

I also knew the topic phrse would stir up some controversy and give people something to take sides on and write about.

While I may not agree with what the lyrics say, they don't pull punches and I believe that many fans will connect with it's message and delivery.

Their possible copyright violation is a whole other issue to sort out and it will be if there's a pile of money to contend with. Basically their work will be considered a derived work.

Harold Payne had a similar situation when a well known rap artist sampled one of his songs with out getting permission. The artist failed to get permission to use the song and CD's were pressed and printed.

When ever some sort of big event like Rita, New Orleans or 911 happens, you can bet there'll be a slew of songwriters writing about it. Some of the songs will actually be good and some will wind up doing well.

like
"where were you when the world stopped turning" by alan jackson was a really excellent song that was very well received

"bring on the rain" by jo dee messina struck a chord

indie alex bach had a song "Miles to Go"

Eric Horner, the band leader for Lee "Proud to Be an American" Greenwood wrote and performed a really excellent song called "We Will Stand" that many radio stations played and Lee allowed Eric to perform it at his gigs. Eric's wife previous husband was killed in a terrorist attack in Beruit and 911 dredged up all those memories for her. Eric wrote "We Will Stand" as a response to that.
http://www.erichorner.com/bio/ericbio.htm

Ande



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Ande Rasmussen
AndeRasmussen@aol.com
http://www.AndeRasmussen.com
http://songramp.com/ande

http://www.MySpace.com/anders

Editor Of "Inspirations for Songwriters"
Message archive:
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[This message has been edited by Ande Rasmussen (edited 10-04-2005).]

I have to believe that a million downloads of that song is a load of crap. Especially since that other great entity called the RIAA has made it so that currently a song that sells 100,000 copies at the digital sites constitutes a platinum status. Far short of the 1,000,000 needed in non-digital sales. I haven't checked how many songs/albums have reached digital platinum but I'm betting its not that many yet.

I lost any respect for that "news" the moment I read that they did this without selling it, thus it's ok to spread via the net. It's illegal. They could get the pants sued of them, period. I'd say they are rather lucky.

I listened to about 30 seconds of that. Unfortunately it's not very good and I just closed my browser window.

Jody

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Music That Makes Your Soul Happy!
www.jodywhitesides.com

if they had to pay mechanical royalties at 8.5 cents per download would be a significant chunk of change for most folks

ande

brian? do you have any opinions about moses avalon?

ande





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Ande Rasmussen
AndeRasmussen@aol.com
http://www.AndeRasmussen.com
http://songramp.com/ande

http://www.MySpace.com/anders

Editor Of "Inspirations for Songwriters"
Message archive:
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this talk about sampling reminds of the MTV interview with Vanilla Ice / Robert Van Winkle when he said something like (i'm paraphrasing)

"We did not sample the lick from "Pressure" when we wrote "Ice Ice Baby""

in the interview he went on to say here's how theirs sounds
"dee dee dee do dum dum"
and here's how ours sounds
"do do dee do dum dum"
he said it was close but not exactly the same. which was a fib.

I do believe they settled later.
I also remember some sort of talk about a rapper who said he was a cowriter on it and threatened him to relinquish some share to him.

here's the writers and publishers on the song now:
http://repertoire.bmi.com/title.asp...=0&ShowSeqNbr=0&querytype=WorkID

I don't remember the particulars.

Vanilla Ice got a lot of milage from that song. It earned him a fortune to blow and i think he dated madonna for a blip.

ande


[This message has been edited by Ande Rasmussen (edited 10-04-2005).]

I have many opinions about Moses Avalon aka Josh Melville. None of them good.

Brian

I'll second that notion about Josh (I am Moses he who leads independent artists astray Avalon) Melville. I had to deal with his spam for quite a while and help to defend Derek/CD Baby in the process.

Like Brian, none of my dealings or notions about him and his material are any good.

Jody

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Music That Makes Your Soul Happy!
www.jodywhitesides.com

Hubby and I were on vacation, stuck in Chicago traffic, when we happened upon the song on the radio. At the time, we couldn't concentrate on the lyrics because of the traffic noise, but the refrain caught our ears and made us laugh...because, taken at face value, it appears to be true. I felt dubya had been "outed"...and I was glad for it.

However, Katrina's destruction of lives and property has reverberated in a political and human rights mess with which, I'm afraid, we may be dealing for a long time to come. I suspect the summer of 2006 may begin a repeat of the civil rights "disturbances" of the '60's...and perhaps, although unfortunate, it is overdue...?

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www.dianatyler.com
Earthy songs about heaven...and heavenly
songs about more earthy things, too. - Will Cheshier

By "disturbances" do you mean"riots'? Once again, am I missing something here,or were people of ALL races and walks of life affected by Katrina???

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bc

am I missing something here,or were people of ALL races and walks of life affected by Katrina???

Yes. But the majority of them were poor and black.

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Scott Andrew
Lo-fi acoustic pop superhero!
http://www.scottandrew.com/music

Just a couple Notes, FACTS:
for those not paying attention
or refuse to read what really happened.

The mayor is black
the police Chief is black

Dubya declared a State of Emergency before the
storm even hit.. (View the tape)

Dubya asked the Govenor who is (white) if she needed THe national guard Days before the Storm and She was assured by the Police Chief and mayor (black)that they had enough men to handle the situation.

THE FEDERAL GOVERNMENT DOES NOT INTERVENE
IN A STATE UNLESS THE STATE ASKS FOR IT.
GOVENORS REQUEST..
EVEN AFTER A STORM HITS
THEY STILL NEED TO REQUEST HELP.
THAT IS WHY WE HAVE DIFFERENT STATES...

THE mayor (black) decided not to use the Public school buses because he didn't want to pay them overtime to come in and bus people out..

Clearly the local and State Government is at the biggest fault here.
And sadly the folks not hearing the warnings by DUBYA to get out..
But I can understand that people tend to get immune to warnings when they are given all the time.
My assumtion is the FEDERAL GOVERNMENT is not at fault here
It's just another attempt the blame Bush for all society's ill's.

And how is that Dubya has the most ethnic diverse cabinent OF ALL TIME...
Powell, Rice..

He must not care about Condoleeza...

Kayne could of said Bush doesn't care about poor people.

That might be a more accurate statement.

Humm,
I think if you take in the whole Gulf Coast and now parts of Texas I doubt if the majority were black, maybe poor tho.

I don't know if this artist really believes President Bush really doesn't like black people or he is just exploiting the situation.

Don King the black boxing promoter supported Bush for President and Bush has black members of his Cabinent so I think the charge is pretty phony. It will take a lot of years to re-build the Gulf Coast and President Bush is doing all he can to help the people succeed. If 80 percent of New Orleans is below sea level those that lived in that part will never be able to return because of the huge cost to re-build.

Some of the most stupid statments like Bush will do anything to hold onto power don't even get traction in the Liberal Press. Why would anyone run for President just to be a power broker and take all that heat? And Bush started the Iraq war just so his "cronies" could get rich and control the Oil. He could have done that without being president. And all of his "cronies" are already rich.

But ignorance abounds thru out the land so who am I to tell them to get an education. They already know it all. Write a hit!

Bravo David and Ray! I'm sorry but Diana's comments really irked me,so run for cover cause' here comes a rant! I AM caucasion, but I was NOT born into wealth or privelege. During my teens I was a miscreant{dependent on booze and drugs by age 15,dropped out of high school at 16,left home for good at 17} I even lived under a bridge for a short time! But at some point a little light came on, and I realized I didn't want to live this way anymore,so guess what? I kicked myself in the ass,got my GED, went to college, and proceeded to WORK MY ASS OFF to become good and sucessful at my passion in life which is MUSIC,and I suceeded! My point is that Im sick and tired of people {regardless of skin color} whining about their situation{often,as in MY case of their own doing.}and pointing fingers at everyone else for their misfortune and playing the "victim". If your in a bad situation,{your fault or not} DO something about it instead of expecting the govenment to wave a magic wand and bail you out!

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bc

Hooray for you. I'm sure your story will be of great comfort to all those dead and grieving people in New Orleans.

I'm sure there were people whose last thoughts were "gosh, if only I had worked harder and not been poor..." as they drowned in filthy, poisoned water.

I'm sure all those elderly people who lost their homes because they couldn't afford to move to safer homes were probably just lazy, right?

You're a class act, B.C.

It's funny when people line up to fight about either side of an issue, the facts of which they've heard about on a tv news show. It's even funnier when those facts change with the channels (commie news network or faux news). It makes me think that those politicians and the political/media industry has figured out how to light up everyone's buttons.

Last election we had a huge turnout. All it took was divisive, machiavellian messages from either side demonizing each other. Hmmm, sounds like kin to racism. Yep, the politicos, lobbyists and the pundits win, the populace loses. We've been played like a cheap violin. Maybe if they keep playing us well enough, we'll not notice that they've all dropped the ball.

As to whether George Bush cares about whomever, how in the world would anyone know? All we know about him is what we are told, and that has been designed and manipulated by highly paid professionals. JPFers probably know more about me than they do about W.

About race. What would Jesus post here?

All the Best,
Mike




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You have to practice improvisation. -Art Tatum

Mike Dunbar Music

Ah,Scotty boy,Taking my quotes out of context again! I was merely responding to the suggestion that there should be some sort of upheaval {riots} in response to the situation. I happen to have friends down there who were affected,and some lost everything. I have also peformed for a few people the last couple of weeks who's displacement has brought them to my town.To suggest that I don't care about the plight of those people is out of line and DEAD WRONG!!!

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bc

Every door that has opened for me has closed for someone else. I rue the days I forget that.

When a door closes in your face KICK IT DOWN!

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bc

It was never my attempt to "inflame" anyone here.

BC, my comments were not that "riots" *should* be started...I was simply stating my fear that they MAY, indeed, take place as a backlash to the slow response of help--for whatever reason--getting into the flooded areas.

As evidenced by the hurricane-induced flood, people (like levees) can withstand continued amounts of limited excess pressure...over a period of time...before things finally fall apart.

In opposition of what you may suppose, I don't cheer this possible outcome--rather, I grieve the potential nightmare for all involved.

I usually stay out of political discussions...I simply don't have the stomach for them. (Much of that loathing is because people often try to read more into one's words than was ever intended. I'm guessing that's why Jesus remained steadfastly silent before Pilate...?) My original post was simply an attempt to share my personal experiences regarding the topic song.

Regarding my conjecture about what *may* lie ahead: I pray that my personal foreboding is unwarranted, instead of prophetic.

In closing, may we remember that we are all entitled to our opinions, and may we try to understand one another as we share those opinions.

Blessings,

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www.dianatyler.com
Earthy songs about heaven...and heavenly
songs about more earthy things, too. - Will Cheshier

Hey Diana, we're cool!

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bc

That certainly serves to explain a lot of things. I'm glad YOU said it and not me.

Its all about choices, after all.

Diana, To elaborate on my last post, I've been to your web-site,and your'e a talented and classy lady,and I apologize for misconstruing your meaning! God Bless.

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bc

Back to the original post:
this may have already been said, my eyes glazed over while scrolling down the page.

right after the hurricane hit, a black man was interviewed on tv.
he said it this way, George Bush doesn't hate black people he hates everybody.
Which is more or less true. Unless you are very rich, own a large corporation, or perhaps a country with lots of oil, and have tons of money to contribute to the republican party.

He has pulled the rug out from under just about every working class person in this country.
Sure a lot of folks think he's the man, but wait a few years when they don't have a pot to piss in, from the cuts and deals he made..
I have met several people who were die hard Bush supporters who are singing a new tune now. Mainly because they don't have a job, or he cut something that was important to them.

My own brother is a contractor, funny thing after the republicans got into office, he couldn't get any bids.
He recently signed on and, took a couple of guys from his old crew and went to work in Afghanistan, for....You guessed it, one of those big Republication contractors (haliburton) rebuilding the cities.......
No work here..........Why is that????
hmmmmm.............

None of this is about race. It's all about power.

Peace, Liz

OH PLEEEZE!
Joanne

Nothing positive is coming out of this post. I think it's time to shut it down. At least folks didn't get into attacking each other which is good.

I will say that our org. is evenly divided between conservatives and liberals with a small Independent segment in the middle just like the rest of the world. I have never found a party of any type that doesn't have problems nor have I found one that is always wrong. I also have never found a party who would intentionally harm people in a hurrican, even though arguments could be made against both parties here that it happened. Humans make mistakes, even with the best intentions. Humans also make mistakes of ommission. There's plenty of blame to go round and frankly both parties will take some heat in the next elections (if folks haven't forgotten and moved on to the next distraction). I appreciate that things didn't devolve into a flame war here, but I don't really want to tempt fate any further. People are simply too passionate about these topics and often common sense and facts are left behind when people's blood is in a boil.

Let's more on to some music related topics for a bit.

Brian