Originally Posted by couchgrouch
Ben, I didn't see your post earlier.

Dylan won the award for literature. Not being as musical at The Beatles is irrelevant to that award.

Dylan was famous for "protest" songs by '63. But there were more to them than that. Hard Rain is a wonderful lyric, visionary for that time. Is it political? What's political about it? He also recorded rock songs at the time, widely available on bootlegs. Mr. Tambourine Man was being performed in '64, one year later. What's political about that? Even Chimes of Freedom and My Back Pages are nowhere near partisan, his greatest songs from that era. By 64 he'd completely abandoned the stifling, stagnant "protest" movement. He wasn't given the award for politics. That's nonsense. Left wing bloviators like John Lennon and Springsteen (not to mention the insufferable mediocrity Bono)are always spouting their views publicly. Bruce didn't like Reagan, either. None of their opinions have ever mattered in the long run, or made them better writers. Being a good writer is no more dependant on politics than being a good plumber. Neither is "making society a better place." Those are arbitrary standards for creativity imposed by people who, frankly, don't have much creativity to express themselves.

You don't like Bob? Fine. But if they were going to give the award for literature to someone from rock and roll, they was no other choice. And it's nice they did it before he passed. He was a gracious, humble recipient.


I think you might have crossed up some of the ideas. You mentioned that Bob didn't say anything about trump, as if his answer would have been any different than any other far left artists when asked if they like a republican? His answer would be more or less the same so that's not really a pass for Bob.

I mentioned the Beatles being more musical, because you mentioned that none of the Beatles alone are equal to bob. Equal in what way? I always thought literature was not songs. Song are meant to be sung, not read. I mean he rhymes at the end of lines just for songwriting purposes.

Songs are jets, they come and go fast, they are meant to be heard and felt, the lyric alone is not the thing.

Dylan was a songwriter, probably one of the best, but I think there is room for debate as to whether or not lyrics meant to be sung, are literature.

I agree with you, that just because somebody is completely different in views than ourselves, that doesn't mean they can't win an award like this, it should be based on merit. If we eliminated all far left songwriters, we'd undone top ten of all time, so I don't think that should be. Dylan, Neil Young, Paul Simon, James Taylor, Bruce Springsteen, Billy Joel to name a few of the cream of crop.

I find myself in the middle on most issues, I was irritated that the media was so biased against trump, yeah he's a jerk, yeah he sends his own business overseas, but now wants to make other companies stay here, yeah he's a bad example, but you never read a word about Hilliary, I was onto that a long time ago, and it bothered me.

I think that's why trump won, he worked harder on captain and people saw through the biasedness

Back to the Dylan issue, as was highlighted above, is that really, the award itself is political, forget the politics of the nominee, the award itself is political.

If Dylan had been the same great artist, but wrote pro vietnam songs, or pro Nixon songs, or pro trump songs, he wouldn't have been given the award.

If you look at the Kennedy awards, the winners are all people aligned with the presidents views, and it shouldn't be, it should be based on the music.

Bush had to pick the who because they are one of the few that didn't have political convictions.

You don't get many great artists who are not libs, even e modern pop stars are all left.

Maybe you get Ted Nugent or Sammy Hagar.

To clarify I'd say Dylan influence more singer songwriters, the Beatles influenced more pop and rock bands.

But even the Beatles and stones who are English are left in mindset. Keith Richards bashed trump too, so did Jagger. Paul McCartney is a Vegan who is an animal rights activist, and pro gay marriage, he' s way lib too

Anyway, it's still all opinion to who is most deserving. The arts are impossible to nail down, it's all subjective, I'm sure I could find as many as a million people who hate the Beatles, if I had to ability to find them. Likewise for bob or any artist.

There is no 1+1 answer when it comes to tastes
.

Last edited by BenJones; 12/27/16 03:36 AM.