JPF Home Page Forums General Messages General Message Forum OT: Have you heard, Elections are for sale?

What a sad state of affairs. Romney actually bought the Florida Primary by spending millions of dollars with the liberal media. What ever happened to just having the doggone convention and letting the candidates "duke it out" on the floor there? These "caucuses" are nothing more than a sham to allow those with the largest "war-chests" to fatten the coffers of the media and spend their way into the limelight.

Nope, the Republicans have not listened. Mark my words, Ron Paul will be running on the independent ticket while Plastic Man Romney will be the GOP choice... and Obama will win the election without having to spend George Soros' ill gotten money.

What a world... Washington might as well forget the bi-lingual routine they have forced upon public schools and local governments. It needs to be tri-lingual... and Mandarin would probably be a good choice for our third language.

Just my opinion.

Chinese and Spanish should be mandatory in our schools.

Kevin

So what else is new? I hate to inform you Dave, but the Inmates are still running the asylum! Last time it was Obummer. This time who knows for sure. It was reported on the News just this morning that, American Airlines, I think, is laying off 15,000 workers. Real excitment huh? Too many people think they have escaped the Salt Mines! I got news for 'em. There ain't no escape. My number 2 Grandson works at Wal-Mart in maintenance 32 hours a week. Just think, in a few years he will be one of the 1 Percent! And that's the good news!

The truth can be painful, Ray... LOL! Do you think your #2 grandson might be able to get me on there at Wally-World as a "geezer-greeter?"

Kevin... you gotta pick a dialect... I think the Chinese have at least 100 but somewhere in my fading memory banks, I believe I heard that Mandarin is most predominant... LOL!

Thanks, guys... for listening to an old man gripe about a system that continues to dis-empower the voters.

I wonder why anyone would be surprised. Elections are bought one way or another.

Ray check this out. I am sorta retired. I get Social Security and do some work to keep myself busy.

How bad has it gotten. I thought I might try a part time job. For the last couple years I have been remodeling my house. I figured that was like a part time job. Well I am done. So I thought a part time job in an industry I was familiar with might be the way to go. So I applied online for a job at one of the major Home improvement lumber companies. A couple weeks later I get an e-mail informing me I have been selected for an on the phone interview for a position.
It would pay $9.75 per hour.
I Call them and they did the on the phone interview. At the end of the interview I was told to expect a call if they thought I was suitable.
About an hour later I got the call. It was to inform me I was selected for a personal in store interview. They set the interview for two weeks out.
Two weeks later I go the the in store interview. It took about 45 minutes. After the interview was over they said I would be contacted for a second interview if I was selected for a position. It would not be a guarantee of a job but if that interview went well I would be forwarded to the Manager of the store for final selection

That all sounded good. They then asked me what positions I thought would fit me best. Since I have about thirty five years experience in residential remodeling work I listed off the things I was skilled at. Lumber, plumbing, electrical, mill works, windows and doors, etc, etc.

The guy then asked me if I would be interested in the Garden department. Garden I thought?
I said I might consider it but I didn't know anything about plants and such. He said that was OK they might be needing someone to water the plants.
Water the Plants?
I've got thirty Five years experience in residential remodeling and they want me to water plants? Three interviews and they want me to water plants?

Well what the heck it pays $9.75 an hour with no benefits so why not, LOL

I was making $15.00 an hour 20 years ago and they are paying $9.75 an hour now?

Guess what. I still have not received a call for the last in store interview. They must have found someone more qualified.... To water plants..

We are in trouble folks.

Oh BTW I have decided to just buy another property and renovate the house. That'll be my part time job.

I heard elections were for sale way back in 2010.

Back in 1907, the Tillman Act banned corporate political contributions to national campaigns. I think that was a good idea.

Over the years, a lot of court cases eroded the effectiveness of the Tillman Act. Back in 2002, the McCain-Feingold Act seemed to offer a definitive bipartisan answer to the problem of "buying elections". Seemed like a good idea to a lot of folks on both sides of the aisle.

The next year, 2003, Mitch McConnell sued the Federal Elections Commission to overturn it, but the Supreme Court upheld the constitutionality of McCain-Feingold. It was a 5-4 decision...the liberal judges voted for, the conservatives against.

Political Action Committees gained ground in 2007 in the case of Federal Election Commission vs. Wisconsin Right to Life, Inc. It weakened McCain-Feingold and allowed more exceptions to the ban of corporate funding of political ads.

But 2010 was the year we killed McCain-Feingold and the Tillman Act with the case of Citizens United v. Federal Election Commission, which finally ruled that the free speech of corporations are protected under the First Amendment, as they are comprised of people...in other words, a corporation is now considered a state of personhood...and furthermore, the ruling paved the way for Super PACs, which allows unlimited funding of political ads.

Bad idea, I think. I also think the majority of both my liberal friends and my conservative friends are all sensing the wrongness of the result---you see the effect of these millions and millions of dollars.

Dave says it's the fault of the liberal media. I say it's the fault of those who fought tooth and nail to support the notion of "corporate personhood". What we're all lamenting about on this thread was unleashed by that Supreme Court ruling in 2010.

Good Post Mark

I wonder if this is a case of the Supreme court Legislating from the bench.

It seems they do that a lot lately.

Where's Robespierre when we need him?

I'd prefer today's problems to another Robespierre...

Bill:

Sounds like the employee relations department there is trying to "stay busy" to avoid the layoff axe... LOL! Geez, umpteen interviews for an hourly job. Sorry you got "jerked around" that way. It's really become a frustrating world.

...legislating from the bench seems to be prevalent now... and we need to streamline the "accountability" of these judges on a broad front. I'm for making them stand for election after a brief term on the bench. Let the voters clean 'em out... 'cause those buffoons in congress sure won't.

Aaron:

You may be on to something... LOL! We both know ol' Mark is right but wouldn't it be fun to see the San Francisco bench cringing before the shadow of the guillotine for a minute or two?

I wouldn't throw in the towel yet Dave. Yes the uninformed went for what they saw on TV ads and voted accordingly as a result of the dumbing down system that has been in place for the last couple of generations. The election hasn't been bought yet. Perot tried it. Forbes tried it. Kerry tried it (with his wife's money that she got from Heinz).

You mentioned the link between money spent on ads and the media (who is the recipient of the money), does bring up a question of where the media stands. Are they going to be unbiased? Or are they going to give the top spender a free ride?

It's as much a question about how the media treats a candidate as it is a question about how much the candidate has to spend. So far, as I know, the media is exempt from any election laws other than contributions. They don't have to spend money to further their ideology, they only need to broadcast negative stories about their enemies. Of course that's their Constitutional right. So does the amount that a candidate spend on ads influence the reporting? Most likely, but it's not illegal.

Political Ads have never influenced me. I usually already know who I am going to vote for. Since we live not far from the Florida Line we mostly watch the Jacksonville Stations. And the Political Ads are pretty bad. I think most people have already made up their minds. There is usually more than enough s*it out there. You just have to put your boots on! Gabby Hayes for Prez!

Hi Ben:

As usual, you are probably right. No, the election has not been "bought" yet but it could possibly be if this trend continues. I'm not railing against the rich either, 'cause I aspire to be rich myself after my next CD goes viral... LOL!
One of my concerns with all this "caucus" malarky is that the liberal press will drum up things for the candidate they think will be easy for Obama to beat.

PACs are not illegal but they should be. Heck, I wish they would reduce the campainging down to two weeks after posting a self-written article by each candidate outlining their beliefs and platforms.

No, I don't let political ads or phone calls influence me either. My mind has been made up about getting rid of the current "Clown in Chief" for quite some time.

Wouldn't that be great? I agree. I miss the whole idea of platforms--these days, candidates seem to constantly change their platforms based on daily polling. Not a platform so much as shifting sands...

I actually wish we could vote for platforms INSTEAD of candidates...the candidates could be kept isolated from the public so we don't get influenced by their looks, charm or hot air...and once the platform got elected, we would finally meet the boring candidate who would then be absolutely beholden to the platform.

What a dreamer...

I'm not sure who said it, but "the more often you repeat a lie the more true it becomes". Such is the philosophy behind political campaigns as currently run, and the reason why the most money spent equals the winner.

if we, as a people, are dumb enough to believe anything our televisions tell us, then we will get (and have gotten) the leaders we deserve.
I think it's rather interesting that the TV networks continue to quote polls they conduct themselves, when their own self interest is in having all of the candidates continue to spend money on ads on those same networks.
political campaigning has become a sub industry of the global media corporations. I am pretty sure they already speak Mandarin or Farsi - if the price is right.

The irony to this is:

1. They are buying a win for Romney. He governed to the left of Obama when he had the chance in MA. He'd do it again if given a chance, because the idiot Rhino's would approve the same left wing tripe like Obamneycare, Cap and Trade, massive Bailouts of banks and Wall Street etc. because heck, it's being driven by a guy with an R by his name! Hooray!

2. However, they are going to realize the mistake they made by thinking it was a good idea to push home this concept of supporting the candidate with the most money winning. Because we all know Obama will have far more money than even Romney, so if that is sound politics, they'll lose by winning. Who here really thinks Romney is going to be able to outspend Obama? And when you take away the money, Romney would be running 4th right now based on ideas and integrity of belief.

3. Romney goes whichever way the political wind blows. He's been anti Reagen, Pro Tsongas, he's claimed he was left of Ted Kennedy (might be the only time he was honest) and he stands for nothing except being against caffeine and whatever other manifestations of his religion's dogma (unless of course being against it would get him more votes). He's dishonest and a coward because he tries to lie while hiding behind other people and he conducts typical uber rich actions while hiding behind super pacs run by his staff. Ack. He's been caught in one lie after another but allows the lies to stand. Does anyone really want another politician of any party who so casually lies to our face even when he knows we KNOW he's lying to us? It's borderline psycho!

4. The Rhino's think that having a guy who can barely credibly separate himself from Obama on all the major issues and who is far weaker on National Security issues (i.e. zero experience or knowledge) is going to stand ANY chance against him? And did I mention Obama will outspend him?

5. This sure smells a lot like 2004 when the Democrats mysteriously nominated the ONLY candidate that was running who couldn't beat Bush... Kerry.... perhaps because of my final point...

But, even with all that above being true, there's a good reason that they want a puppet like Romney. Because they have a puppet in office now in Obama. His policies in truth have been nearly the same as Bush (even the new entitlement Obamaare is just a continuation of Bush's major entitlement Medicare Part D, which has been great (I mean it sincerely) for elderly to be able to get medication, but in truth simply ensures the massive increases in Pharma profits continue since the Government will pay the bill. And remember, the idea of a government mandate came originally from the braintrust of the right, but they needed a left wing puppet to pass it.

So my point is this: It doesn't matter who wins, the puppet Obama or the puppet Romney. They are both cartoon characters with perfectly scrubbed backgrounds created to do what the real bosses say... the men behind the curtain. And they are the same men pulling the strings either way. Obamney 2012... well all lose even if half of us think we've won.

If Ron Paul or some other serious and honest third party candidate runs, I will vote for them. I am tired of being TOLD who my candidate will be long before I even get to vote on it. The system is as fixed as it ever has been to make sure we all keep serving the same bosses no matter what. It's all an illusion at this point. Meanwhile, Obama didn't mention the crushing national debt or crushing budget deficits or the reality that entitlements and our military are causing about 750 Billion dollars over our tax income in the red no matter who is running anything without painful cuts which no one will even try to make. Even Paul Ryan's sole attempt which was panned by both sides left us way in the red every year going forward. The bipartisan Simpson Bowles solution still didn't balance our budget, let alone pay off our debts. Soon the interest alone will enslave us to China and others dumb enough to keep buying our debt.

This is the most important election in our lifetimes and it's been bought on both sides so the same power brokers (give or take a few special interests) can rape us and our children and enslave our grandchildren. At best they are driving us to civil war, but they got that covered when they passed laws allowing Obama or his replacement to imprison Americans (or anyone else) without charge and without chance of due process. And now that they are flying drones over our cities, they can listen to, watch, follow and kill or capture and imprison anyone they please anytime they want. And I said that was best case scenario. Worst case is they drive the USA to become the most evil country in the world to get ourselves out of massive debt and keep our country from massive civil war where we have the most heavily armed population in the world and 100 million people could die in a month if it broke out, so instead they can point our power towards lesser powers and the USA will turn into an uber evil empire.

Or, we can become SANE and not allow money to buy off our election, electing non establishment Republicans and Democratsand either coming to our senses and electing a non establishment candidate from a major party or from a third (or fourth or fifth party) to save us all from ourselves.

At least that's my fear. Hopefully I have it all wrong.

Brian

That's why this year I'm campaigning (again) for Cthulhu. Why vote for a lesser evil?

Well this election I see it is a tossup between Joe Btfspik and the Shmoo. The Shmoo is in office now. Ask and you shall receive! With Btfspik you can't escape the Rain Cloud!

Ray:

I wonder if anyone at JPF (other than you and me) knows about Schmoos or Joe B? (LOL!)

My objective in the 2012 election is to send the Schmoo packing. I'd prefer Joe Btfspik, Mammy Yokum or any of Al Capp's long gone characters.

Brian:

Well said! My only concern about a vote for Ron Paul (whom I admire a great deal for his honesty and integrity) will be that unless he is the Republican Party's Candidate... a vote for him will almost guarantee that the "liar" will be re-elected.

WEll I see I can't fool you Dave. It's amazing how you can pull up things from the past that fit right into the present huh?

For you younger folks, just Google Al Capp.