JPF Home Page Forums General Messages Mentor Questions Forum Business Question-equitable arrangement

I need some advice: If i wrote a song, played the rhythm guitar and sang the vocals, then collaborated with four other people--a bass player, a keyboard player, a drummer and a lead guitarist, then began selling this song, what would an equitable financial arrangement be?
I was thinking that since there are seven different aspects of the song involved( writing, rhythm, vocals, bass, drums lead and keyboard ) that each person should get 1/7th of the net sales for the part they performed--meaning I would get 3/7th's of the net sales. Is this fair?
Thanks
Tim

You would have to break this down into two separate parts Tim. First off; you wrote the song. That's your baby. You're entitled to 100% of future writer performance royalties from your PRO (radio/TV performances). And also the publishing share if you’re taking on that role.

The songwriter would also be entitled to mechanicals. I believe the current rate is 9.1¢ per song. 500 copies sold would generate $45.50 for the songwriter (per song). You better check with the experts on this though.

Part two is the sound recording. Figuring out the value of each part would be very difficult, if not impossible. Placing equal value on each part to generate a bigger slice of the pie for you would be a bit tacky, if not inaccurate.

Whatever computation used to distribute payment shares (other than an equal division) are sure to produce mixed feelings among the crew. Similar arrangements in the future with this crew may be jeopardized.

Then there's the question of paying for the recording, CD's (if applicable), distribution, advertising, etc... These costs should be paid to the entitled parties before profits are distributed.

This is only my opinion Tim. There are far more knowledgeable people here on this subject than me.

Good luck, John

I would pay the guys 50$ each, and make them sign a simple work-for-hire agreement. Then you own everything. If you have a band situation, it could be more complicated, and something along the lines you suggest may be an option. You should still get the full publishing, though, while signing say 5%, off of the mechanicals to each performing musician.

That sums up the deals I've been involved in, of this nature.

If this is not a band but just musicians getting together to record a song, I think you should get the songwriter's royalties and the others should be paid a fee for their time. Then if it makes any money, it's yours, and if it doesn't, the musicians have been paid and are happy and willing to do another.

If it is a band, then you get the songwriter's royalties and everyone splits everything else evenly.

What they said --- simplicity is a virtue. Pay them for their work, get a work for hire agreement in writing and it is yours.

Tom

Tim,

You're asking the wrong people. You've got to ask your musicians what you owe them. You can't just "give" them fifty bucks unless they accept it. There is no "fair price" set for recording music as there is for mechanical licenses. They are now on top of the negotiation. Offer them fifty bucks apiece or whatever, then hope they take it.

I recommend in the future that you get these things agreed to in advance, it makes it much easier. If you're not in a band where you have an agreement as to how profits are shared, then I recommend that you become the sole owner of the recording.


I've learned that it's much better to either be the sole owner of your work (and pay any others who might help) or to simply be paid for your work.

For example, a few years ago, against my better judgment, I was partners with a writer's night host. They hosted the night and I was the bandleader. My partner kept putting us into situations where we weren't getting paid. Pretty soon the band wanted to be included in everything I did apart from the band. They felt, rightfully so, that they were putting in work for which there was no compensation, so they should have some say in the work. I ended up hiring them on projects for which they weren't suited. On one particular project, a session for a small record label, I hired them to record four of ten songs. I picked the songs they could do, but got other musicians to do songs the band could not properly do. They got mad. They thought I owed them the right to record all ten songs. Now, understand, the recording project and the writers night had no connection. I was hired by someone who didn't know I was even part of a writers night. Still, I was told...by my band...that there was going to be a band meeting and I had to attend. I told them I quit. I quit my own band. I told them they could have the band and hire themselves for everything they got.

I learned a lesson. No, actually I had already learned that lesson...I just had it reinforced. The lesson is TANSTAAFL. There Ain't No Such Thing As A Free Lunch. If you go into a bar and eat the "free" sandwiches, you've gotta buy the beer.

Now, I know you're not looking for a free lunch here. You just ordered the sandwich without asking the price first.

It's a good lesson.

All the Best,
Mike

Thanks Mike- actually I haven't ordered the sandwich yet!!!lololol I was asking because I'm about to record a small demo and will need the other components for the song and I wanted to know what I was getting into before I leaped in ( like I usually do).
You have given me some trouble saving wisdom swami Mike!!!
Thanks brudder
Tim

Tom, Colin, Songcabinet and John--
Thank you for the advice-I wasn't even in the ball park--I haven't recorded it yet so I'll take ya'lls advice and pay for play--now--how much should I pay the bass player?!?!?!?!lolol
Thank You Guys!
Tim

Hey Mike,

Was that the bad with Ray Mann and the guy who played two saxophones? That was so funny. Ray would play bass AND guitar AND sing, and the guy played two saxes at the same time. I had trouble playing my songs because I was laughing at how good those guys were.

I think Chas played guitar on that and did chart classes. Was taht then?

MAB

Yeah, funny Marc! Our sax player did that as well with a tenor sax and alto sax. Tuned a perfect 5th apart. So he could finger both saxes the same and play 5ths. Sounded great on certain jams.

John

Lol if it's country, how bout Pizza!! The drummer gets half :-)
Make sure to audition at least a couple guitar players and tell the best he can join, if he'd play for free exposure :-) Then You only have the singer to worry about. Flatter usually get's you a couple free vocals, though hehe

Get the paperwork ready.. lol

Hey Marc, no, it wasn't those guys. I just played a benefit for Steve Bivins not too long ago with both Chas and Ray. I used to sub for Ray on bass and a drummer subbed for him on drums and we'd split Ray's pay LOL. No, the guys in the band I mentioned above will go nameless.

Those bands I had with Chas, Mike Daly, Steve Holland and others all got paid. With the band mentioned above, as a favor to someone, I lent my name and the name of my band, "The First Take Band" and played some of the friends' writers nights for the door. I've learned my lesson. Doing favors, asking favors, cutting corners, cutting prices to help folks out etc. almost always ends up being a mess. LOL.

HAAAAAAAAAA!!!thanks for the advice song cabinet!!!!lololol

I believe all payments should be indirectly proportional to the size of the musicians ego. :-)

Just playing!