JPF Home Page Forums General Messages Songwriter Message Forum Producer Seeks Material for Country Pop Duo

Oop's double post.

[This message has been edited by ric4music (edited 06-03-2005).]

Fair enough Rick ...
And this is the reason why some of these folks are hesitant about demo services from Nashville. ... obviously you've had a bad experience. But that doesn't mean you shouldn't try another production house..not everyone in Nashville is a flake. There's plenty of great demo services that do a great job.

Hmmmmmm very interesting……… David I’m not a shill for Travis. I’ve been on this forum off and on for 4 years.

For those of you that feel Travis is here to pump up his demo biz ……if he is ...he’s doing a poor job!!!. Like I said I called him and talked for a ½ hour. I sent him the links to my co writer Paul Pedersen.

Almost all of them are done in a Nashville studio. I categorized the songs I thought were the best (even though I realize none of them are straight up in the style Travis is seeking) I even sent him a link to one I did myself….yikes!!!

Paul tunes are being pitched in Nashville. They are good songs with good recordings IMO…. They just aren’t Nashville demo singers .It’s Paul (and an artist he was working with doing his songs) singing them That’s probably enough to make it hard to listen too.(even though I think Paul has a way cool voice!)

I haven’t heard back from Travis. Obviously it’s not something he’s looking for. So I wouldn’t feel slighted if you don’t hear back also .You seldom do if the songs aren’t up to snuff or it’s not something they are looking for. If Travis was trying to shark me he would have called back and said ..hey good songs buddy…. but they need a better demo to get listened to in Nashville.

BP


[This message has been edited by BP (edited 06-03-2005).]

Okay, I've read through most of this thread now and feel inclined to chime in.

We are songwriters...we write songs.

Travis is a recording engineer/producer, that is what he does.

Some of use here are blessed with the ability to multitask musically...that is write songs and perform and produce our own demo material.

It has been my experience that good songs will find the light of day on their own to some degree. I have been co-writing with one guy off and on for 20+ years and he is a fair guitarist and has a good ear for vocal parts etc. but he can't really sing that well. But I have probably 50+ demos of material he and I have produced over the years. To make a long story short, a tune we recorded back in the late '80's with a country flavor to it has now been cut and is to be included on an R&B release due late this year or early 2006.

My point being, the crappy demo we have held on to for nearly 20 years ended up getting re-demo-ed and pitched and "that's all I got to say about that".

This business is full of all types, with varying levels of talent, ethics, and finances.

Now I could ramble on here forever, or I could go work on some of my "works in progress", I choose the latter.

Moral of this story: There's more than one road to just about anywhere you want to go. Don't get stranded on the side of the road by letting your ego, mediocre talent, (INSERT YOUR WEAKNESS HERE) or finances leave you with a flat tire and steam pouring out your radiator. Find others with complimentary talents and motivation and "carpool" your writing projects to greatness.

I've got songs to write...how about you?

------------------
bob

"Chin up! Adapt, Adjust, Carry On!"

What an interesting interaction. I am out here on the road or I would have probably jumped in sooner. For the record, no one speaks for the entire JPF organization except me.

But everyone is welcome to voice their opinion as long as it isn't a gratuitous attack on the other person, or you don't make slams against someone while using an anonymous user name that can't be verified or if your attacks are simply incorrect. Outside of that we're pretty willing to let people have their say.

I find it interesting that someone who is looking for great songs that might be a bit outside the box didn't ever bother to contact me or anyone else with JPF, since I preside over the largest music awards program in the world (10 times larger than the Grammy's) and we screened 140,000 songs last year alone (more than TAXI does in a year) in all genres including Country. But oddly enough, Travis didn't contact us and say "hey, we're representing artist X and we're looking for material.. who do you recommend?" I think that would likely have been a productive way to cut through the noise and find pre screened material from indie writers and artists outside of the Nashville mainstream.

Anyone at any level who is going to randomly surf through mp3 files offered randomly by unfiltered people posting on any message board is clearly not using their time very wisely. Unfiltered random song surfing is far too much of a time waster for anyone active in the business UNLESS (and this is the catch) they are ACTUALLY trolling for something else. Something like.. say.. selling demo services. Ah.. now it all makes sense.

Travis, I don't know you. I don't really have to. This same scenario has played out over and over here and on other org. message boards. Everyone is welcome to come here and post information about a service they would like to offer. All we ask is that you are clear and upfront about what the service is, how much it actually costs (or at least a reasonable "range" (with no forcing people to search your website or call you to get a quote) and give links to find out more info on your background, links to demos of your work and so on. That's perfectly acceptable and often is a productive way for legit businesses to get some new customers. However, what isn't acceptable is posting a message asking for songs to be submitted and THEN later trying to sell those who submitted songs your ACTUAL services like demos etc. That is a bait and switch attempted by every scam artist in the music industry on entry level folks (who for the most part don't really see through the scam until it's too late) because of that sexy promise of getting their songs to some up and coming or previously/currently famous artist.

Now, one of 2 things is true. Either you're totally legit and upfront and simply failed to separate the two very different offers: 1. Searching for Songs to place with artists and 2. Offering legitimate Demo services to people who might need them. OR.. you're like the hundreds before you and the hundreds who will come after you who are simply pulling the age old bait and switch to sell demos services that people with unpolished songs DON'T need because guess what? Their songs aren't good enough to justify the investment!

So, you've kind of given away hints that you are in the second grouping. You posted simultaneously that you are looking for songs and offering demo services. You then get some submissions and explain that the demos are sub standard (wow.. what a revelation.. you got unfiltered random links from a tiny number of folks on an open message board that were sub standard.. who would have expected that to happen?) but you make the big mistake in suggesting that these folks invest more money into a song that isn't going to cut it even if Garth and Shania are singing their demo. (And eventually suggest that you could be that company that recorded a better demo for them.. wow.. another surprise we didn't see coming).

It certainly helps to put a song in it's best light. A good clean demo is ALWAYS a good idea. But if the song has fatal flaws to start with, it's terrible advice to tell the writer to get a better demo. That's wasting money. Better to suggest they buy some songwriting books, take some classes, co write more with better writers, listen to a lot more music on the radio, at live clubs, at their local organizational workshops etc. and keep plugging away to improve their skills to the point that it makes sense for them to spend money on a quality demo once they have something WORTH spending the money on. To suggest anything else is to once again fall dangerously close to the worn out scam artist tactics.

Having someone with "credits" take an interest in your work is fun and cool and exciting, especially to entry level writers who still falsely believe it's a cake walk to success in the music industry and that you don't have to be writing songs that are 9.5 out of 10 or better to have any realistic chance and that legit active publishers actually post a call on open message boards and have time to sort through any unfiltered, unendorsed song link they are given searching for that next big hit. But it certainly doesn't mean that just because someone with credits says you should spend some money and improve that demo that you should do it. If the songs were GREAT.. and you really were looking for GREAT songs and you yourself have the ability to create a great demo of them if there was a need, there would be no reason for you to care if the original demos was any good or not because you're going to be recording them with your artist (or if really needed, demoing them yourself, not at the writers expense). Let some guy warble through any number of hit songs and a good producer would say "the demo sucks, but that's a great song my artist should record" and they'd move forward without going back to the writer and saying "gosh.. uh.. you need to record that with a better demo...."

So please choose what you are. Either you're looking for great songs (like everyone on the planet would be as a producer) and you give a yes or no and move on.. OR you're offering demo services to people with lousy quality recordings to make a buck like any other demo service and if that is the case, just do it up front and in the open and everyone around here will be happy to check it all out and make their own decision. Take the suspicion out of it and don't act like every single other scam artist that came before you and folks like David won't have much to question you on.

And finally, David asked totally legit questions. You responded with personal insults. He still managed to respond in a good natured way to your insults, so you just heaped on more. I think that was right about the time when it was clear David must be awfully close to the truth. (And I don't often agree with David about much.. ).

And having Butch Price endorse you didn't do you any favors either. It's nice to see Butch back yet again with his 7th or 8th different user name. Move on Butch.

So, as you threatened to do, you can leave and never come back.. or prove you're for real, stay and be upfront about your goals and services. But either way, you've already been given more than the simple benefit of the doubt.

Brian

Brian,

Obviously when I posted, I didn't know anyone on here. If I knew who the real talking heads were, I would have gone straight to them.
I stated several times throughout the postings that I wasn't here to promote my services but rather looking for material.
Instead I failed in my frugal unsuccessful attempts of trying to educate and offer advise to those who made comments like "I have not heard of one serious Publisher I have ever dealt with that listens to MP3 links" I retaliated with links to major publishing catalogues to prove a point that major publishing companies are tuned into the web. Just these two companies alone host Alan Jackson's, Keith Urban's and Garth Brook's catalogues and not to mention many other successful songwriters. They will listen to outside material if you have a contact with them. They will only contact you if they are interested in the material.

How I ended up on JPF was mentioning to one of my clients (who is a good songwriter) that we were looking for material for a vocal group that I'm producing. Apparently she is a member of the JPF community. She said there were good writers amongst this crowd whom she's met personally at NSAI meetings and suggested that I make a post on JPF looking for songs. In that post I made the mistake of mentioning my services and caught all hell for it haunting me ever since. I never stated that I was this big time producer with all the success in the world. (if I was, I certainly wouldn't be digging here for material). I do however have plenty of contacts from some of the top publishing companies in Nashville where I find great songs all the time. I posted here only because my client writes enough in-bounds for Nashville but still very outside the box. I was only hoping to find more of that here and not the same cookie cutter stuff you find in the typical publishing catalogues.

Had I not mention that I own a recording studio with a unique service, I think things would have gone much differently. But since I also mentioned that I am not this big time producer but rather someone who has a name and a career with just as much hope as anyone on here, I chose to defend myself when there were insinuations or a mention of words like "scams" "sting" or "shark" on a topic that I originally created. So yeah, there were a few shots back and forth ... But after the fact I also received several emails advising me to ignore the ignorant comments and thanking me for giving the JPF community an opportunity to pitch their songs. I took that advice and I also emailed DavidW requesting a "truce" and I Invited him or anybody on here to give me a call if they feel that a voice might be better than bitter sounding words on here. And sorry to those whom I've not had time yet to return their call....

It's too bad that there are crooked people that have put the screws to innocent, unsuspecting people on here. But that's not my fault. And it's ok to question a newcomer who makes the mistake of mentioning a service. But If I was a scam, I don't think I would be spending more time here defending myself than looking for songs. I simply advised people that they need better demos because it's true. Your whole presentation is everything .. if it sounds like [naughty word removed] .. well it probably is [naughty word removed]. Again, its much easier to turn off a crappy sounding demo than it is a polished turd if their song turned out to be not that great after all. My problem is that my business caters to mostly independent artists and I love helping them. I speak at independent writer functions & I donate my services to a lot of independent songwriter events and charitable fundraising functions.

When I moved to Los Angeles from Nashville, I didn't realize that there was such a huge difference in economy. Just to give you an idea of what its like, In Nashville I rented a decent 2 bedroom apartment for only 650 / month and I had my own driveway to park in every night. Here in L.A. I rent a 3 bedroom with less square feet and I'm paying 2300/ month, parking on the street. Every house in my neighborhood is a million dollars or more to buy. It's ridiculous here and you just know there's a bunch of songwriters in the same damn boat.

When I started "Nashville Tracks in L.A." I wanted to keep my prices at Nashville's economy prices so that songwriters in L.A. could afford it. I am so slammed with business here because I don't profit from the difference in economy. My crew is all based in Nashville and my Los Angeles clients are all word of mouth and repeat clientele. I don't need clients from a post on the web. But tell me, what kind of a business person would I be if I didn't self promote in a community that I thought I would be welcome in ?

I will say that I agree with you Brian .. seeking songs using this message board was clearly not using my time very wisely....
I will also say that I don't need stick around and prove anything to anyone. I am legit period. I may have only worked on a few major label records but I have produced thousands of demos for great songwriters & independent artists. I'm 35 and the first major artist that I produced is due out on radio this summer. I have a lot to look forward to than wasting my time on here arguing with know it alls who haven't experienced half the music business I have. I'll stick with the Nashville publishing catalogues and perhaps try to hook this group up with good writers that I know and Trust.

[This message has been edited by nashvilletracks (edited 06-05-2005).]

Travis,

Thanks for the thoughtful reply. Had this all started out on the same vibe, I imagine everything would have gone differently.

If you think that fly by night folks don't come here over and over to defend themselves, just take a look at the Don Reed aka Affinity Productions link. Now THERE'S a well known shark to just about everyone in the industry. And he keeps coming back and coming back.

As I state above, we have no problem with anyone advertising their services here. Even if your single goal was to sell demo services, that would be just fine as long as you are simply upfront about it. On the other hand, if you really are just looking for songs, there's plenty of resources to connect you to those folks as well. Though I never stated (it must have been someone else) that labels etc. don't use MP3 files, I did state that they don't randomly troll links without any endorsement or filter or recommendation because there's too much noise in the system. But we've had many labels and publishers come to us and ask about material we've screened during the awards process which has a much better chance of being in the ballpark of what they are hoping for than a random search.

As I said before, you previously said you were leaving and never coming back. If that's your desire, good luck moving forward. I also said you're welcome to stay around and learn more about the group outside of just the message board which really only represents a small portion of the JPF membership. It's also more often representative of either lyricists only or folks still learning their writing skills. Check our awards nominees to see some of the artists who are writing songs already good enough for radio etc. Many of them either have cuts or deals or are on their way there. Some of the folks who post on the message board will also find success, but as stated before, we've already filter 250,000 total songs in the last 4 music awards periods and identified the ones that have risen to the top of that process. Our song of the year winners have already had success. Wide Open Spaces (as recorded originally by JPF member Susan Gibson) obviously did well for the Dixie Chicks. Our song of the year in 2001 was from a Canadian artist who is commercially successful up there. The 2002 Song of the Year Christine's Refridgerator has been big on the NPR circuit and still gets regular nationwide airplay on some of their shows. Our 2004 Song of the Year Pictures was first Debuted by Steve Seskin (who wrote it with Chuck Jones) at one of our JPF Shows in San Diego back in 2002. John Michael Montgomery recorded it but was released from his label before the song was released, or that probably would have been Steve's 8th #1 Country Song last year.

There's plenty of talent out there. There are also folks who need good demo services from someone who will charge them a fair price and do quality work. We have room for both sets of people and are happy to work with and help anyone who is honest and does good work for our membership.

Brian

Hey Travis,I went to one of the sites you mentioned and listened to two songs(would like to listen to more but I am on dialup and it takes forever to down load).No doubt they are quality demos but the two songs I listened to were not all that great,in other words I did not say I wish that I had written those,IMHO I write songs just as good or better all the time,I just can't afford to spend the kind of money that these demos must have cost.

I've had reasonably priced demos done in Nashville that did a good job of showcasing the songs without breaking my wallet.I think a good song will shine through a low priced demo where a poor song will bomb, regardless of how good the demo.I am a very prolific writer and I try to demo 20 songs a year(I write 50-100 a year)therefore I can't spend $500.00 per song or I'll have to give up eating.I'm not rolling in money. If I only wrote one or two good songs a year,then I could afford to do so.I'm trusting there are enough good ears out there that when they hear a good song,the quality of the demo will not turn them off.A diamond in the rough can be polished to a brilliant shine but a lump of coal will still be a lump of coal after it is shined.

Well, in my naive optimism I still send out an occasional CD to those who say they're looking for material.

In order to see if this guy was 'for real', I went ahead and sent a 3-song CD of professionally demoed material, suitable for genre and type of act advertised...

All three songs had either been, in the past, cut by indie artists and/or won some sort of award/contest on the better internet song boards, AND been under contract by more than one publisher within the past seven years.

In short, the material "didn't suck"...

What I got back was two impersonal spam e-mails addressed to the world ('undisclosed recipients' is the usual line), advertising songplugging services and demo services.

As far as I'm concerned, it's the same old story... harmless looking fish in the water that may prove to be some sort of shark... until futher notice, beach is closed.

Do me a favor, Travis... if you haven't already tossed the CD into the circular file, at least use it as a coaster... that way the cost of the mailing and time on my part didn't totally go to waste, and...

I can at least say my material is being used in a big time California studio.


[This message has been edited by RobertK (edited 06-06-2005).]

double post deleted

[This message has been edited by RobertK (edited 06-06-2005).]

ECA - you are a successful writer by just about any benchmark - I wouldn't worry about defending your demo stratagy...

Not that I need to join in on this...but...I guess I was thinking two things...one is Travis probably runs a legit demo service, but perhaps didn't use a good tactic in wording his first post here (I'm not personally gonna pass judgement because I myself didn't find his initial approach a problem). And two, if you are looking for songs outside the box, and can "hear past the demo", and you own a demo service, then logic says if you found something you believed in, you could re-demo it cheap. So, a bad demo isn't really an issue in this case and would be something easy to overcome if the song was great. That used to be the publisher's job anyway, to do the pitching quality demo at their cost (which if you are looking for songs is kinda the role you are playing).



[This message has been edited by Liszt Laughing (edited 06-06-2005).]

Excellent points by LisztLaughing...

I'm sure this is a 'reputable' demo service, that is, you pay your money and you get back a demo performed by competent musicians and singers... if that's what you're looking for, no problem.

What's not reputable is using a "looking for songs" lead-in to drum up business and/or increase your e-mail list of potential clients.

In short, it's all right if you wanna wear several hats, but be good enough to only wear one at a time...

And hopefully the right one for the person you're currently dealing with.

If you're acting as a publisher, then publish... if you're a producer, then produce... if you're looking to drum up demo business, then, well...

Don't try to rope in new clients with the publisher/producer carrot.

Man you guys are a tough crowd.
Yes, You both bring up Excellent points.
Yes, I can demo it cheap IF I was a publisher or a song plugger who would take % of the publishing. That's not my role here .... My problem is NOT that some of these songs are SOOO bad, its the demos that are made to accommodate them. I just asked someone on here to please resubmit their song as just a guitar/vocal because I thought was good. I honestly think that some of these songs probably don't a fair shake because the demo is not good enough. I don't know if certain people in the biz who aren't musicians, (attorney's, managers, and even some singers) can truly listen past the sequenced demos people are pitching. When I get demos like these, I feel like I need to play it again and tell them to ignore the singer, ignore the programmed steel guitar, drums and strings and just listen to the words and melody ... You'd be surprised that only then does the light bulb go off above their head.
If your sequencing your demos ... save yourself the time and just do a clean guitar / vocal ...No flashy reverbs ... just the guitar and your voice ...

Just because I added a few email address from people in this topic to our database doesn't mean I'm playing the dangling carrot game! I added your email because I truly hope that one of you guys would win our drawing and share your experience with the others on here ...My clients are all word of mouth. So much for offering ...

Fair enough, and I heartily agree that most music decision makers (heck, people in general, even those who fancy themselves to have good ears) don't have the time or imagination to "hear past" a weak demo.

We've become a nation of limited attention span, only responding to sound-bytes and a slave to first-impression, but I digress...

But ust to keep the record straight...

Don't say you only added e-mail addresses to your database from this thread. I got your two spam e-mails yesterday, but had made no post to this thread until this morning.

Ergo, you got my e-addy from somewhere else... and I understandably suspect it was from the package I sent out a week ago.

Anyway... onward with our lives, then...

And good fortune to all honest endeavors.

Mr Tracks: Hello. Feel free to look over what I have demoed on that following site:

http://www.soundclick.com/bands/3/paultwentworth_music.htm

I was really cringing when I saw that response you got from that other guy, because he is like I was about a year ago. I gave a pretty famous songwriter some attitude because he wanted 125 dollars for a personal session with me and pissed him off. I appologized profusely but I never heard from him again. Learnde my lesson.

I believe you are the real deal and I hope you can give some of this music just a listen.

Thanks...Paul

I have some acoustical tracks up and I am on dial-up. I have keyboard mixed in for a strings sound combined with steel string because I do not have the money to buy a strings instrument, or a steel string. The songs are not all that Country and more Folk. You said a keyboard mixed in instead of a plain guitar would sound cheesy. I am more in to music for the songwriting then performing. Do you have anything to do with getting performers to do demos from songwriters?

I don't want to be too quick to cast down links because I am new here. But if you have the time and would like a listen to my "songs", my web site can be found in my profile.


[This message has been edited by My Name? (edited 06-22-2005).]

Thank you for your info. And I also forgot to add that the Nashville promotor was completly upfront in the pitch that this might cost something. Which is not the same as a spammer saying they like you and asking you to pay later that may have never even listened. There was no pre-determaning what is acceptable. I hope some of these negative posts do not discourage promotors and such to reach out to artists. We could use all the honesty we can get.

[This message has been edited by My Name? (edited 06-23-2005).]

I just wanted to update everyone and thank those who've submitted their material to this project.

After several months of reviewing everything submitted we've settled on the songs we plan to use for the record.

As a producer, I'm willing to listen to your material. Please understand that I will give you the industry standard courtesy of contacting you IF we decide to use your material. On the contrary, please understand that I don't have time to contact everyone submitting material to let them know WHY we didn't use their song.

As far as the demo service my studio runs,
I'll give you one more bit of Spam that some of the people on this forum might actually appreciate. Here at Nashville Tracks we hold a Monthly Drawing for a FREE demo production of your song. It's all top quality production, utilizing excellent Nashville studio musicians.

All you have to do is join our email list. When you receive our monthly email notice REPLY with "freebie" in the subject line and you are entered. Its 100% Free to enter the Email drawing and there's no additional costs or hidden fees ... Keep in mind that this is the track only. We will mail you the master tracks on DVD format and you can
record the vocals and mix at the studio of your choice ! If you have Pro Tools, Nuendo, Cubase Cakewalk, Sonar, You can import these files right into your home studio !

If you wish to join the Nashville Tracks email list please email info@nashvilletracks.com with your name and all contact info.

Best of Luck to ALL

Trav

Travis Allen
2917 Swan Place
Los Angeles CA 90026
323-953-NASH
travisallenproductions@yahoo.com
www.nashvilletracks.com

_____________________________________________
Maybe I am wrong here, but I hope and pray that I'm not. Out of all the publisher's I have dealt with over the past five years, I have never had to pay for a (Pro Demo). I submit rough demos....and if the publisher believe's in the material....then the publisher has paid out of his own pocekt to make the pro demo. Now, I have not had an artist cut one of my songs, but I have had some of the A&R folks with major record labels at least listen to and respond to me(via thepublisher/songplugger). So I am just speaking from my history since I have been with BMI. Have I been informed wrong...that we as the songwriters provide our material and that if the publisher believes in our works and truly sees potential in it...that if a pro demo needs to be done, that they will pay for it?


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michael

I'd be careful of this guy. worked with him in the past and he will take your money whether it's finished product or not and he does have a rep in nashville. worked with him, was the guy that was a&r at warner bros. just ask rebecca bradley when he used the dig tapes of her stuff and erased some stuff and tried to charge her for them and said that he didn't charge a producing fee so it's not his fault. be careful...

Just in case there’s a few of you who are not quite ready to burn the evil witch to ash & bone.....

Chris’s comments stem from relationship of topics that span over 10 years. If things were so bad, why did our relationship continue to progress?

I did a light load of our dirty laundry replying to Chris Wedebrook's comments at his other post on this site. http://www.justplainfolks.org/ubb/Forum4/HTML/002080.html

I do not wish this to go any further than what's been already said and done. It’s not because I have anything to hide. It’s because I simply do not have the time or negative energy to spend on this same site & posts defending myself as I did last year. I regret ever seeking out songs on this site because it seems the majority of this site’s users are more into crucifying one’s efforts than dignifying them. All I can say is that people should focus on the positive side of the music business if they plan to ever get anywhere in it.

Hopefully this is the last time I’ll feel the need to defend myself here and that Chris and I can cordially resolve our differences privately via email or phone. I only wish the best for Chris and his future endeavors and hold no ill will toward him because of these statements.

Hi Nashville Tracks,


Unlike a lot who post here ,I have had some success,in the U.K. but there have been a few rip off merchants, posting so I can understand some of the questions.

I really think that most , (not all) are not up to a standard of even coming close to being semi pro, if there is such a thing,
and you would be wasting your time ,looking for material for top acts, here.

Nashville is crawling with writers, who are trying to make it, That's the place to go, surely. If you have worked in Nashville ,
where are your contacts.

I went there for a month, .representing a Publisher and Record label, and found enough contacts, to last us/me a life time



Split Level.






[This message has been edited by Split Level (edited 06-20-2006).]

Man, this is better than daytime tv!

Yeah, Travis, it's a tough crowd here. My hat is off to anyone who can crack through it while offering multiple services. Not that multi stuff is necessarily a scam, just that it makes "bait and switch" easier, and this crowd knows it. Do they sometimes get over the top and come down hard on the innocent stranger? You bet they do. But, on the other side of the coin, they DON'T get scammed.

So, this is the problem with looking for material on the open web. These people can talk back at you. Imagine if the songwriters sitting across the big publishers desk suddenly started talking back with attitude? Well that's the nature of the web. Again, my hat will be off to any producer, publisher or whatever who can crack it. And offering multi services makes it exponentially harder.

Now, you think this is hard? What if a used car dealer opened a blog on his website!! THAT would be hard.

All the Best,
Mike

------------------
You have to practice improvisation. -Art Tatum

Mike Dunbar Music

Check out my post here:

http://www.justplainfolks.org/ubb/Forum4/HTML/002080.html

I've spoken with Travis just now, he's going to contact Brian personally and try to straighten this out.

All the Best,
Mike

------------------
You have to practice improvisation. -Art Tatum

Mike Dunbar Music

"I don't have the time to reply to everyone who has sent me links to their material.
Its the same reason why you don't hear from any other major label / producer /publisher who's passed on your material.
I'm sorry folks I just don't have the time, Not to mention the time I have spent on this forum as it is...I do not wish this to go any further than what's been already said and done. It’s not because I have anything to hide. It’s because I simply do not have the time or negative energy to spend on this same site & posts defending myself as I did last year. I regret ever seeking out songs on this site because it seems the majority of this site’s users are more into crucifying one’s efforts than dignifying them." (must be downtime right now) well, I'll make time for you songwriters and potential artists if it saves someone TIME and MONEY. our relationship did NOT progress, this is not chris weedebrook and just to let you guys know that someone that says they don't hold anything against me on this topic and on another topic throws out remarks about my family is not someone you want to be affiliated with. I was on this site for a reason and like I said you don't need over priced demos, just an acoustic and vocal works just fine. remember it's not THEIR song, it's YOURS!

My, my. What an interesting read. It took me a little while to realize that all but the last few posts were from a year ago. Since that revelation gives us the perspective of time, I would--out of curiosity--like to ask a few questions to the group:

For those of you who sent material, or posted information on how Travis could listen to your material, how many of you received a solicitation for his demo service?

Now that a year has passed, who was the duo whose CD was going to hit the stores last summer, and how did it do?

OKAY!!!! Enough Already, You lodged your complaint, aired your dirty laundry, whatever you want to call it. Build a freaking bridge and get over it already. So you got your little feelings hurt by Travis Allen. He was courteous to me when I had contact with him and didn't try to blow smoke up my ass. Quit your damn whinnin and get on with whatever it is you do!