JPF Home Page Forums General Messages Songwriter Message Forum Writing a song that you can't finish?

Call the
"Fountains Of Wayne Hotline"

They'll give you some ideas.
So dead-on. I love it.

Why the hell should I call this hotline when so many great writers are right here with me?

Really, I use rhymezone and/or a thesaurus when I need a little help, but that's about it.
I have repeatedly left my self open to co-write with anyone, but only a few have taken said plunge and worked with me.

I do thank you for the post, it's a great idea, and it may be just what some people need to get their pieces completed.

For me, it's not online tools that I need, it's the heart and soul of another artist.

Sam.
Click the link.
It's not what you think.

Oh, fine...
there's a song there, about halfway down the page... you can stream it.
the song is called "Fountains Of Wayne Hotline" and it's a brilliant piece of satire.

Seriously.
Click it!

It's cute, P.T.

Have to say I do it already, after a fashion, and it doesn't always work. I'm forever asking myself, "Okay, how would Emmylou Harris (for instance) finish this? Okay, if she gave up, or got grossed out by the dead animals, how about Bob Dylan?"

Joe

Never wrote a lyric I couldn't finish, goes against my religion. However I do have some lyrics without melodies, so in that respect they are unfinished.

Thanks for sharing PT:

Full shred country... now that's original... sorta! LOL!

Best,

Dave

http://www.ShowCaseYourMusic.com/DaveRice

Oh yea..... I was looking through several unfinished songs the other day - and threw most of them away. To me, there is no satisfaction in an unfinished song. I like closure.

Tom

Great link! Thanks for sharing it.

Donna

Why the hell should I call this hotline when so many great writers are right here with me?

Actually, the above question from my earlier post was meant as a joke...I thought that people might take it as a funny little compliment...

As for the hotline link, I'll check it out.....Thanks for the heads-up!

Thanks Pop!

Enjoyed the Heck out of it...(& that Video for "Stacy's Mom"...truly Brilliant/Totally Fun!)

Whee..."Oh, it's THAT Gerald".. What a HOOT~
Best Weekend Wishes & a Big I.O.U. Guy-Hug,
Stan

I have a bunch of unfinished songs. I never throw them away. Some have been gathering dust for many years. But about two or three times each year, I finish one of said culprits. Also, just because I didn't/couldn't finish it doesn't mean that there are no good lines, hooks, ideas in them. I might cannibalize them for a future project. One of the best songs I ever wrote was finished in 20 minutes...lyric and music. Another one of my really good ones was 6 years in the making.

Nothing I write for music or one of my novels ever gets thrown away.

I have 6 folder son my computer desktop with various types of unfinished songs. I visit those folders at least once weekly. The labels: "Good Lyric, No Music", "Good Music, No Lyric", "Lyric & Music...Lyric sucks", "Lyric & Music...Music Sucks", "Lyric & Music...Both Suck", "Bits & Pieces".

Wishing you everything good.

Alan

I'm with Al... I never throw a song away. No matter how crappy it may sound or how terrible the lyric may be. After all, it represents an investment of sorts. I simply file it away after cataloging and ranking it and let it "stew in it's own juices" for awhile. Later on, maybe years later, I might run across it while I'm reviewing how my songwriting efforts are going... and every now and then... a sow's ear can be re-written into a silk purse. (Naturally, that's the exception... rather than the rule.)

Regardless, I never would advise anywone to "discard" a lyric or song that was written to completion or recorded. It won't take up that much space on your hard drive or in your collection of songwriting notebooks. You might actually have a diamond in the rough.

Dave

http://www.ShowCaseYourMusic.com/DaveRice

http://www.daverice.bandcamp.com

For me, it's not online tools that I need, it's the heart and soul of another artist. Quote from Sam.

There's a song in that.

What I need
Is the heart and soul
Of another.

You mean like:

Can I borrow your soul for just a little bit
I just need to finish this song

Joe

One time it took me 14 years to finish a song.

I have lots of them, golly gosh, but I will finish them. Lots of good idea's so I hang onto them hey.

Michele

Al, I can see the value in what you do with your unfinished songs - and I like you system of organization.

Tom

Tom,

Did you say "organizatio"? My wife would beg to differ with you that anything I do is organized!!!

Actually, it'sa very simplistic system that has been extremely effective for me.

Alan

Hi Argo!

Long time no see. Nice to hear from you. I have one I have been working on since 1978. I have posted several variations here at JPF at one time or another and have received many suggestions that have improved it immensely. But, it's still not "just right". Alnost everyone has agreed that it is a solid song, but needs that little something more. That little something more has been very elusive! I have receives at least a dozen different suggestions for the last verse, but none of them are exactly what I am shooting for. Some deviate too far from the original intent; some suggested wording I thought was awkward, etc., etc., etc.

Am i frustrated? No, not really. I just keep plugging away at it.

One of these days!!!!!

Alan

Al, what is the song you are referring to?

This topic makes me think of doing a song that turns out exactly how it was in the mind.What is finished seems to have more to do if it is something more personal or professional.
It must be great for those that can do both.

I started out playing synth pop and wanted to try stuff performing and growing up with musicians like that (with guitar and all played), even though I don't want to play places or make a life out of it.
Just from knowing musicians that do that.

But I have heard acts in the state where I live like the Suburbs, as well as acts out of New York like the Talking Heads and Television.
Inspired by acts like Roxy Music that went out of their way not to be mainstream.
They saved that for the album they broke up with.
I don't want to get in to the image thing with it, but I was always drawn to how they brought more in to the pop scene.
Not all schtick or what a program gives.

But I find that what I personally thought I did better often is what people like the least.

Many I noticed establish what they are better or worse at and go with what they are better with.

I can not make such a compromise.
I love all the music in all its forms too much even though listeners overall may not like my idea of what I feel is good music.
I go to forums to try and keep the listener in mind yet not compromise myself.

But I notice that the first thing a beginner is tought is to do what the click does.
Those that do not have the capacity for technical talent seem to be forced to regurgitate and determine from going by ear what they hear.
Throwing chords and hooks out basically.

I don't want to go with the one or two things I may be better at or cop a style.

In a professional sense, I could not expect to be looked at in a serious way professionally doing that.

But in a practical sense, I figure since I do not have huge money making goals being a musician that I may as well try and do something more interesting.
The bit I can do in more of a professional sense, people have heard a million times before.

But how many have done something that they personally feel was their best that people liked the least?

Over the years, the best way I've found to shake a song loose from the quicksand is to do something mindless, an activity where muscle memory takes over -- driving, walking, ironing, gardening (but in silence, without the radio, TV or iPod).

Motor activity can free the subconscious mind -- which is where all great writing is born. With the intent of meditating on your work in progress, put your conscious mind to the task of something mundane while letting your subconscious ramble, taking mental notes on the ideas that might be valid. Almost every time I walk the dog, or take a drive with a song in midstream, I make some good progress.

Here's to inspired writing by all...

Rand Bishop
songwriter/producer/author - Makin' Stuff Up, secrets of song-craft and survival in the music-biz
www.makinstuffup.net

Jean,

Sorry to be so late replying to your questions. My life is pretty busy and sometimes I'm lousy at getting back to stuff. Sorry!

The song is "Sweetheart Lover And Friend". I posted it six or seven years ago, with several rewrites over the nest year or two. I then put it back to sleep because I was frustrated. A lot of good wroters here offered some great ideas. But, a final product never came together. First verse and chorus are working real good. The last verse stinks up anything within a hundred feet of it. And that last chorus has been rewritten at least 25 times. if you're interested in taking a look, let me know. But, FYI, it is one of those that is one the cusp of traditional Country and Contemporary Country. It may not be as relevant to the Country music scene as it once might have been. let me know if you want to take a look anyway! Thanks for asking.

Alan

Jean,

here's an link to the original posting of the song, with all the comments:

http://www.jpfolks.com/forum/ubbthreads.php/ubb/showflat/Number/8394/page/272#Post8394

It's the last 4 lines of verse 2 that won't come together. If you're interested, I'll go post it over on the Lyrics 3 Forum and get it away from this thread. Let me know!

Alan

Hi, Al. Got your PM.