Who's Online Now
12 members (Gary E. Andrews, ckiphen, maccharles, JAPOV, couchgrouch, Alek, Gavin Sinclair, Everett Adams, 2 invisible), 189 guests, and 360 robots.
Key: Admin, Global Mod, Mod
Register Today!
Welcome to the Just Plain Folks forums! You are currently viewing our forums as a Guest which gives you limited access to most of our discussions and to other features.

By joining our free community you will have access to post and respond to topics, communicate privately with our users (PM), respond to polls, upload content, and access many other features. Registration is fast, simple, and absolutely free; so please join our community today!
ShoutChat
Comment Guidelines: Do post respectful and insightful comments. Don't flame, hate, spam.
What's Going On
Prophecy anyone?
by VNORTH2 - 11/29/22 06:44 PM
We Don't Make That Anymore
by VNORTH2 - 11/29/22 01:16 PM
Let's Go Fishing (New Version)
by IronKnee - 11/29/22 10:52 AM
Distrokid
by Sunset Poet - 11/29/22 10:00 AM
Fireside Lounge, Alameda, CA
by Gary E. Andrews - 11/28/22 01:44 PM
Christmas Carols, a 'classroom' on Song Structures
by Gary E. Andrews - 11/28/22 07:03 AM
Modern Folklore
by Gary E. Andrews - 11/28/22 06:10 AM
Skyway, Washington
by Gary E. Andrews - 11/28/22 05:59 AM
Space Ballroom, Hamden, Connecticut
by Gary E. Andrews - 11/28/22 05:47 AM
AN OLD MEMORY
by Travis david - 11/28/22 05:43 AM
The 8 X 10, Baltimore
by Gary E. Andrews - 11/28/22 05:40 AM
Brixton Academy
by Gary E. Andrews - 11/27/22 10:29 PM
If you could co-write with ANYONE?
by Sunset Poet - 11/27/22 05:37 PM
Inspirational Videos Post Them Here
by Sunset Poet - 11/27/22 03:43 PM
Hernando's Hideaway, Memphis
by Gary E. Andrews - 11/27/22 02:46 PM
Taft Theatre
by Gary E. Andrews - 11/27/22 02:21 PM
Portland House of Music and Events, Portland Maine
by Gary E. Andrews - 11/27/22 11:21 AM
Headliners Music Hall
by Gary E. Andrews - 11/26/22 10:27 PM
Bowdoin International Music Festival Brunswick ME
by Gary E. Andrews - 11/26/22 06:04 PM
John Wagner, NM
by Gary E. Andrews - 11/26/22 05:17 PM
Harris Concert Hall, Aspen, Colorado
by Gary E. Andrews - 11/26/22 05:10 PM
Cork N Keg, Taylorville, Illinois
by Gary E. Andrews - 11/26/22 04:58 PM
Good Terms Band, L. A.
by Gary E. Andrews - 11/26/22 12:57 PM
Two lovers too long alone
by ckiphen - 11/26/22 12:39 PM
El Dorado's Food & Spirits, Columbus
by Gary E. Andrews - 11/26/22 11:23 AM
Rockwood Theatre
by Gary E. Andrews - 11/26/22 04:23 AM
Emerald Theater, Mt. Clemens
by Gary E. Andrews - 11/26/22 03:53 AM
Love like I've never known
by ckiphen - 11/24/22 12:53 PM
Sing Me
by Vicarn - 11/24/22 10:10 AM
Rialto Theatre, Lancaster, New Hampshire
by Gary E. Andrews - 11/23/22 09:33 PM
Top Posters
Calvin 19,853
Travis david 12,218
Kevin Emmrich 10,938
Jean Bullock 10,330
Kaley Willow 10,240
Two Singers 9,649
Joice Marie 9,186
Mackie H. 8,991
glynda 8,683
Mike Dunbar 8,574
Tricia Baker 8,318
couchgrouch 8,074
Colin Ward 7,909
Corey 7,357
Vicarn 6,825
Mark Kaufman 6,588
Wyman Lloyd 6,578
ben willis 6,113
niteshift 5,827
Lynn Orloff 5,788
Louis 5,725
Linda Sings 5,608
KimberlyinNC 5,210
Neil Cotton 4,909
Derek Hines 4,893
DonnaMarilyn 4,667
Blake Hill 4,528
Bob Cushing 4,389
Roy Cooper 4,268
Fdemetrio 4,265
Bill Osofsky 4,199
Tom Shea 4,195
Cindy Miller 4,178
TamsNumber4 4,130
nightengale 4,096
MFB III 4,088
Caroline 3,865
beechnut79 3,852
Kolstad 3,844
E Swartz 3,751
Dan Sullivan 3,710
Sunset Poet 3,511
Dottie 3,427
joewatt 3,411
Bill Cooper 3,279
John Hoffman 3,199
Skip Johnson 3,027
Pam Hurley 3,007
Terry G 3,005
PopTodd 2,890
Harriet Ames 2,870
Nigel Quin 2,868
MidniteBob 2,761
Nelson 2,616
Tom Tracy 2,558
Polly Hager 2,526
Jerry Jakala 2,524
Al Alvarez 2,499
Eric Thome 2,448
Hummingbird 2,401
JAPOV 2,361
Stan Loh 2,263
Sam Wilson 2,246
Judy Hollier 2,232
Wendy D 2,226
Erica Ellis 2,202
TrumanCoyote 2,096
Marty Helly 2,041
maccharles 2,017
DukeWill 1,988
floyd jane 1,985
Clint Anglin 1,904
cindyrella 1,888
David Wright 1,866
Clairejeanne 1,851
Cindy LaRosa 1,824
Ronald Boyt 1,675
Iggy 1,652
Noel Downs 1,633
Rick Heenan 1,608
Cal 1,574
GocartMoz 1,559
Jack Swain 1,554
Pete Larsen 1,537
Ann Tygart 1,529
Tom Breshers 1,487
RogerS 1,473
Tom Franz 1,473
Chuck Crowe 1,441
Ralph Blight 1,440
Rick Norton 1,429
Kenneth Cade 1,429
bholt 1,411
Letha Allen 1,409
in2piano 1,404
Stan Simons 1,402
Deej56 1,385
mattbanx 1,384
Jen Shaner 1,373
Charlie Wong 1,347
KevinP 1,324
Vondelle 1,316
Tom W. 1,313
Jan Petter 1,301
scottandrew 1,294
Gerry 1,268
DakLander 1,265
lane1777 1,260
PeteG 1,242
Ian Ferrin 1,235
Glen King 1,214
IdeaGuy 1,209
IronKnee 1,180
AaronAuthier 1,177
summeoyo 1,174
Diane Ewing 1,160
joro 1,082
BobbyJoe 1,075
S.DEE 1,040
yann 1,037
Tony A 1,016
9ne 1,016
argo 986
peaden 984
90 dB 964
Wolvman 960
ckiphen 954
Jak Kelly 912
krtinberg 890
Drifter 886
Petra 883
RJC 845
Brenda152 840
Nadia 829
ant 798
Juan 797
TKO 784
Dayson 781
frahmes 781
teletwang 762
Andy K 750
Andy Kemp 741
tbryson 737
Jackie444 731
3daveyO3 704
Dixie 701
Irwin 697
Joy Boy 695
Knute 686
Pat Hardy 678
Lee Arten 678
Moosesong 668
Katziis 652
R.T.MOORE 638
quality 637
CG King 622
douglas 621
Mel 614
R&M 612
NaomiSue 601
Shandy 589
Ria 587
TAMERA64 583
qbaum 570
nitepiano 566
pRISCILLA 556
Tink2 553
musica 539
deanbell 528
RobertK 527
BonzaiWag 523
Roderic 522
BB Wilbur 513
goodfolks 499
Zeek 487
Stu 486
Steve P. 481
VNORTH2 479
KathyW 462
allenb 459
MaxG 458
Philjo 454
fanito 448
trush48 448
dmk 442
Rob L 439
arealrush 437
DGR 436
avweek 435
Stephen D 433
Emmy 431
marquez 422
kit 419
Softkrome 417
kyrksongs 415
RRon 408
Laura G. 407
VNORTH 407
Debra 407
eb 406
cuebald 399
EdPerrone 399
Dannyk1 395
Hobart 395
Davyboy49 393
Smile 389
GJShades 387
Ezt 384
Alek 381
tone 380
Marla 380
Ann_F 379
iggyiggy 378
coalminer 377
java 374
spidey 371
sweetsong 370
danny 367
Jim Ryan 360
papaG 353
Z - man 350
JamesDF5 348
John K 348
Jaden 344
ddreuter 341
TheBaz 340
Steggy 339
leif 339
tonedeaf 336
rickwork 334
Eddie Ray 332
Johnboy 328
Bob Lever 328
Helicon1 327
lucian 326
Muskie 321
kc 319
Z. Mulls 318
ptondreau 313
ONOFFON 312
Chris B. 310
trush 304
ed323 297
Ellen M 294
markus-ky 292
lizzorn 291
nicnac49 290
Char 286
ktunes 285
mastrose 280
pammie 279
Top Likes Received
JAPOV 19
Previous Thread
Next Thread
Print Thread
Rate Thread
Joined: Nov 2006
Posts: 613
Top 500 Poster
OP Offline
Top 500 Poster
Joined: Nov 2006
Posts: 613
What is the best small subwoofer for live sound? So far the best thing I've seen is the EV SB122. It has one heavy duty 12 and handles 400 watts. It weighs 33 pounds. The sound is tight and you can definitely feel it.

Anyone had any experiences with these, or maybe something else that is small and light and sounds good?


Richard MacLemale
Music = http://www.richardmac.com
Joined: Nov 2006
Posts: 8,463
Top 20 Poster
Offline
Top 20 Poster
Joined: Nov 2006
Posts: 8,463
http://www.mackie.com/products/swa1501/

Mackie SWA1501. we have two. EV are good my keyboard player used to have them till he heard the Mackies. I do not know about price caomparison but even if they are more expensive I would always go with Mackies over EV or just about anything else any day.
However unless you intend to play really large halls with a full setup you should not need a bass bin. The Mackie SRM450 produces a full meaty sound without the need for subwoofers.

If money is no problem then Bose do a new system column with a tiny bass bin. We are just getting to grips with this new setup for small venues. I still secretly prefer the Mackies but this thing is featherlight in comparison and takes seconds to set up with the new sound generator package it has preset eq all stored in.

Joined: May 2001
Posts: 7,412
R
Top 30 Poster
Offline
Top 30 Poster
R
Joined: May 2001
Posts: 7,412
I haven't looked at any equipment lately but I would agree with Big Jim that you probably don't need a sub-woofer wherever you are playing. In a small venue any good basic system should provide all the bass you need. In a large setting if you have a bass player using a bass amp it should be more than adequate.

If a system isn't providing enough bass you may need to upgrade the system to something that provides more volume.

A music store can give you good information on systems.


Ray E. Strode
Joined: Nov 2006
Posts: 8,463
Top 20 Poster
Offline
Top 20 Poster
Joined: Nov 2006
Posts: 8,463
I have to clarify what I mean by small and large. Small for us is 100-200 people. Large is a theatre seating several hundred. From what I can gather Richard you are referring to playing venues under fifty people. In that case one SRM450 will give you full range sound with plenty in reserve.

Joined: Nov 2006
Posts: 613
Top 500 Poster
OP Offline
Top 500 Poster
Joined: Nov 2006
Posts: 613
Well, I've been reluctant to go with 15's because of the size of the things. My thought was maybe I go with small speakers on poles and one 15 sub to give me the low end I need. Carting around two 15's isn't as much fun - though to be perfectly honest, there's probably enough room in my car for, say, the SRM450's. They're fairly small for their size.

OK, I'll audition some two way 15 systems and see what I think...


Richard MacLemale
Music = http://www.richardmac.com
Joined: Nov 2006
Posts: 8,463
Top 20 Poster
Offline
Top 20 Poster
Joined: Nov 2006
Posts: 8,463
I repeat unless you are planning on doing really big venues you do not need subs. For audiences up to about 200 I can get away with two SRM450 which produce a quality full range sound with as much low end as you could want and still have plenty oomph to spare. Remember we play quite loud rock. I have used the same at open mics and the acoustic boys are very happy with the sound. Keyboard players cannot believe the sound for the size of speakers. Audition Mackies and you will be hooked.

Joined: Feb 2006
Posts: 26
N
Casual Observer
Offline
Casual Observer
N
Joined: Feb 2006
Posts: 26
Originally Posted by Richard Maclemale
What is the best small subwoofer for live sound?



I am going to withhold my opinion of "what's best", due to lack of context.

Could you answer a few questions?

What are you reinforcing? What type of music?

Where do you perform?

What equipment will this subwoofer have to mate with?

What is your budget?





Joined: Nov 2006
Posts: 613
Top 500 Poster
OP Offline
Top 500 Poster
Joined: Nov 2006
Posts: 613
Getting back to this thread after a little while. Here's where I'm at.

I do NOT want to buy two way 15's. They're too big for my car and too heavy for my back. So that's out.

Noiseboy, here's some more info.

I'm a solo singer/songwriter who is performing at coffee houses and once in a while a small outdoor gathering. I sing and play acoustic guitar on some songs, and sing and play digital piano on other songs. My keyboard setup is an M-Audio 88 key MIDI controller connected to either an Intel iMac or a MacBook Pro, running Logic. So I've already got the computer in place to add backing tracks if I want to.

My current system is a small mixing board, a Mackie power amp that is about 200 watts per channel (into 8 ohms,) and two Peavey PR12's mounted on poles. My mic is an EV ND767A and I absolutely LOVE the way it sounds, even through the PR12's. The setup actually sounds pretty good, but there's no low end. For the piano, you really notice it.

Additionally, I'm toying with the idea of adding background tracks to some of my tunes. But when I try to do that, the lack of low end on the PR12's really shows up and it sounds bad.

So whether I stick with just piano or guitar, or I add background tracks, I feel like I need more low end. Not a ton - I play adult contemporary. When I play covers, it's stuff like Elton John. But I need more low end!

Now, the constraints. Anything I buy needs to be able to fit in my car with all the rest of my gear. And it can't weigh a ton and a half. And it can't cost more than $400.

There are two that I've found that sort of meet that description - Peavey makes a sub 15 for $200 in the PR series, and it's not too heavy, but it is a little large. EV makes a sub 12, the SB122, and it's smaller than the Peavey, and it's under $400. It's probably what I'll end up buying.

The long term goal I have is to have a pair of EV ZX1's, and a pair of SB122 subs. I've auditioned this system many times and it sounds fantastic for it's size. But if I were to buy it all at once, it'd be like $1,400, and that's without the amp, and I'd need a bigger amp to power the whole deal, so the entire price tag would be $2,000. But in my opinion it is the best small (ie can fit in car) sound system you can buy for that amount. You can buy systems in that price range that sound better, but they're not fitting in a Ford Taurus. smile

So my plan, at this time, is to just start buying the pieces to my dream system, one at a time. After I buy the sub, I'll start saving for a pair of ZX1's, and then I'll dump my PR12's and get the ZX1's. After that, I'll start saving for a bigger power amp. After that, I'll add another subwoofer, and I'll be done. I have to do this bit by bit because my short term budget is small, but over the long term I'm willing to drop bucks into this.

So that's where I'm at.




















Richard MacLemale
Music = http://www.richardmac.com
Joined: Nov 2006
Posts: 8,463
Top 20 Poster
Offline
Top 20 Poster
Joined: Nov 2006
Posts: 8,463
Richard I cannot get my head around your prob. What you are using if set up correctly should produce a good bottom end. Maybe your mixer is the prob.

Joined: Feb 2006
Posts: 26
N
Casual Observer
Offline
Casual Observer
N
Joined: Feb 2006
Posts: 26
Quote
I do NOT want to buy two way 15's. They're too big for my car and too heavy for my back. So that's out.


I am with you there. The problem with 15's, aside from the weight and bulk, is that midrange coverage suffers.

Quote

My current system is a small mixing board, a Mackie power amp that is about 200 watts per channel (into 8 ohms,) and two Peavey PR12's mounted on poles. My mic is an EV ND767A and I absolutely LOVE the way it sounds, even through the PR12's. The setup actually sounds pretty good, but there's no low end. For the piano, you really notice it.


Given that you are happy with the sound of the PR12's, I understand and agree with your inclination to use a subwoofer to augment these speakers. The speaker system isn't broken, it just needs some help on the bottom.

Quote
There are two that I've found that sort of meet that description - Peavey makes a sub 15 for $200 in the PR series, and it's not too heavy, but it is a little large. EV makes a sub 12, the SB122, and it's smaller than the Peavey, and it's under $400. It's probably what I'll end up buying.



I don't have first hand familiarity with either product. I know a bit more about EV, than Peavey, and am well versed in spec sheet.

I looked up the EV SB122. Yes, it is a passive sub. While it is inexpensive and compact, the performance is hardly stellar.

Given that you will be driving it with your (200 watt)powered mixer, I am not optimistic about the outcome.

With $400 to spend, there isn't much to choose from. However, if you can find the means to increase your budget, have a listen to the EV SB2A. It is the powered version of the SB122, and is capable of driving an aux sub or full range speaker.

While it is a hair over twice your budget, it won't overtax your powered mixer, and will outperform the passive version.

In any case, a compact sub sounds like a good addition. Good luck.



Joined: Nov 2006
Posts: 613
Top 500 Poster
OP Offline
Top 500 Poster
Joined: Nov 2006
Posts: 613
The SB2A is the same speaker as the SB122, only with an amp in it. Same 12 inch driver.

In the short term, I'm planning on driving the two PR12's with one side of the amp and the SB122 with the other side. Not ideal, but it will only be for a few months. Eventually I'll either trade in my amp for a more powerful one, OR buy a second amp and bi-amp it, OR trade it in and get one of those 600 wpc combo mixer/amps.

I'm OK with the PR12's in the short run, but in the long run I'm planning on getting the ZX1's.

Jim,
The Peavey PR12's don't give very good bass - even in the store. They're inexpensive, light speakers for musicians on a "budget."




Richard MacLemale
Music = http://www.richardmac.com
Joined: Nov 2006
Posts: 8,463
Top 20 Poster
Offline
Top 20 Poster
Joined: Nov 2006
Posts: 8,463
You should bite the bullet and buy decent Mackies they do a smaller full range A BABY BRO OF THE SRM450. Awsome sound worth paying extra and no need for powe amp.

Joined: Feb 2006
Posts: 26
N
Casual Observer
Offline
Casual Observer
N
Joined: Feb 2006
Posts: 26
Originally Posted by Richard Maclemale
The SB2A is the same speaker as the SB122, only with an amp in it. Same 12 inch driver.


Jim,

I stand corrected, these are nearly identical speakers, save the active crossover and power amplifier in the SB2A.

At first glance of the cut sheets, it appeared that the SB122 rolled off faster at the bottom, than the SB2A.

That said, I still favor active devices for simplicities sake.




Link Copied to Clipboard
Support Just Plain Folks

We would like to keep the membership in Just Plain Folks FREE! Your donation helps support the many programs we offer including Road Trips and the Music Awards.


Newest Members
daniellisa16, Jones1, Skeptic1, MarchAngel, John524
21,386 Registered Users
Forum Statistics
Forums116
Topics123,255
Posts1,150,472
Members21,386
Most Online37,523
Jan 25th, 2020
Just Plain Quotes
"Some problems are really just blessings with strings attached." -Brian Austin Whitney
Today's Birthdays
There are no members with birthdays on this day.
Popular Topics(Views)
Powered by UBB.threads™ PHP Forum Software 7.7.5