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#486580 - 03/27/07 02:26 AM Best Mic for Vocalist  
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rar Offline
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rar  Offline
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Dear all,
I am looking for a best mic for my sister-in law.
She is a vocalist.I am looking for a mic that records her voice and instruments that are playing.But it should not record any external disturbances.She had a great difficult in her previous performance. All the external noise got recorded and the mic was hauling so her performance went for a toss.

I dont know anything about Mic.Also when she records her performance,only her voice and the archestor's who are playing with her needed to be recorded eliminating the external noise. Please help me to pick a MIC for her.

Thanks & Regards
Ramya

#486594 - 03/27/07 02:59 AM Re: Best Mic for Vocalist [Re: rar]  
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Hummingbird Offline
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Hi Ramya, unfortunately, it's not easy to pick a mic for recording, as each voice has its own requirement. It would be better for your sister to go down to the local music store and try out several mics within your budget. If they don't let you try them in the store, see if you can rent a couple to try them out.

Here's a couple of reasonably priced mics that have been recommended to me:

http://www.sweetwater.com/store/detail/C1Mic/

http://www.sweetwater.com/store/detail/NT1A/


Vikki Flawith: Songwriter/Composer, Singer/Voice Teacher

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#486681 - 03/27/07 11:10 AM Re: Best Mic for Vocalist [Re: Hummingbird]  
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BIG JIM MERRILEES Offline
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Hi Its a minefield. Each type of mic has its own limitations and applications and each person has preferences and dislikes. Mics can cost a few bucks or a few thousand bucks so it might help if we know exactly how much she wants to spend and the exact purpose and application the mic will be used for. I take it that it is a live performance? How is it being recorded? Is she using any amplification? What external noises are we talking about? Does she want the orchestra recorded seperately or on the same mic? It would be very difficult to have one mic that will record clearly all the orchestra plus her vocals but will eliminate any other external noise. More info please.

#486697 - 03/27/07 12:36 PM Re: Best Mic for Vocalist [Re: BIG JIM MERRILEES]  
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Ray E. Strode Offline
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It sounds more like the place you are recording rather than the microphone. If you are in a studio you shouldn't be picking up much outside noise. If you are in a noisy place a better or different mic won't help. A mic will pick up sounds the human ear tunes out, until you play back the recording. Then you hear it all. Most any Mic, dynamic or condensor will work in a quiet environment.


Ray E. Strode
#486807 - 03/27/07 07:42 PM Re: Best Mic for Vocalist [Re: Ray E. Strode]  
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DakLander Offline
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NoDak
rar, you are asking for the impossible for one or two mics.

The only way to get what you are looking for is individual mics on the vocal and individual instruments in an isolated situation, say sound booths.

With that in mind however, you can get some success with the vocal and the instruments on separate mics in the same room. There will be mic bleed between mics but you'll be able to have the overall mic gain levels low enough so that outside, extraneous noise does not show up in the mics.

#487286 - 03/29/07 01:10 AM Re: Best Mic for Vocalist [Re: DakLander]  
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rar Offline
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Thanks for all your replies

Jim sorry got giving more details.
I have tried my best to answer few of your questions.

"Mics can cost a few bucks or a few thousand bucks so it might help "
In an range of $150 - $200

"exact purpose and application the mic will be used for. "
For singing as well as for recording.

"I take it that it is a live performance? "
Yes it is a live performance

"How is it being recorded?"
I guess she had a recorder that had a inbuild mic in it.

"What external noises are we talking about? "
The performance was in a open audithorium.So like people applause,talking , childrens crying everything got recorded.

"Does she want the orchestra recorded seperately or on the same mic? "
No she want the orchestra recorded along with her voice.

I recently went to a musical shop. The person over there recommended to have separate mic for vocal and instruments and give these mic output to the mixer.Then give the mixer's output to the recorder. Just like wat Daklander recommended.

Thanks & Regards
Ramya











#487290 - 03/29/07 01:18 AM Re: Best Mic for Vocalist [Re: rar]  
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cousinotes Offline
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If you need to try to eliminate noise from behind and on the sides of the mic, you might try a mic with a hyper cardioid pattern. It will pick up sounds mostly directly from the front of the capsule. Like a SM87A I think by Shure.



I am director of Ohio South Music Academy and Recording Studio located at 1625 Springhill Ave. Dayton, Oh.
http://www.ohiosouthmusic.com
#487292 - 03/29/07 01:19 AM Re: Best Mic for Vocalist [Re: cousinotes]  
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cousinotes Offline
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It may actually be called a "Beta87A" by Shure.


I am director of Ohio South Music Academy and Recording Studio located at 1625 Springhill Ave. Dayton, Oh.
http://www.ohiosouthmusic.com
#487410 - 03/29/07 10:57 AM Re: Best Mic for Vocalist [Re: cousinotes]  
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Hi rar
Thanks for extra info. It makes giving advice a bit easier. I think that the problem and issue here is the whole setup including amplification, mixing and type of recording device used. It is not just a mic issue. The only way to get a clear recording and eliminate some of the external noise is to use a dynamic cardiod mic for vocals and seperate mic or mics for the orchestra depending on its size but to do this you will also need a mixer. To be honest with you on your very low budget this wont be easy. Any mic no matter how expensive will always pick up external noise eg applause etc. Even a basic mixer all by itself will put you way over budget Shure do a range of mics for all applications but each mic will be about the top end of your budget. The quality of the final product however will depend very much on the type of recording device and mixing desk used not just the mics. There is little point in spending a lot on mics just record on a cheap tape recorder or similar type thing. Hiring might be a better and affordable option. If this concert is already "amplified" and going into a mixing desk then it may be possible just to plug your recorder straight in to the mixer most have this facility reducing the need for a mic and getting the best quality sound. Ask your sis to check this possibility out with the guy operating the sound.

#487490 - 03/29/07 02:42 PM Re: Best Mic for Vocalist [Re: BIG JIM MERRILEES]  
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Larry Read Offline
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For Live Performance with live demo recordings My choice is the the Shure SM58. It's a tried and true mic that is almost bullet proof and has a great sound considering it's low price. I like it better on Male Vocals than the Beta 87a which tends to be better suited to female vocalists. Note: This is a personal Vocal mic and not intended to pick up an entire band

The SM58 also tends to reject sound from outside its pattern which is dynamic hyper cardiod meaning that you must sing directly into it stright on. I own and use several of these in my live sound appearances and they always have performend well.

Street Price it can be had for $99 to $150 depending on where
you shop.

Did I mention rugged? I have personally seen these drop from a mic stand and take a 10 to 15 foot drop stright down and it totally flatens the wind screen/pop filter
( which is replaceable ) pick it up and it still works perfect.


edit addition I now add...
I Just realized this is for a Female Vocalist.. In That case USE
The BETA 87A as recommended earlyier.. same durablity but better suited for female vocals.


30 Year Veteran of the Recording and Music Industry

Last edited by Larry Read; 03/29/07 02:56 PM.

your only a stranger once after that a new found friend
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#487737 - 03/30/07 02:23 AM Re: Best Mic for Vocalist [Re: Larry Read]  
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rar Offline
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Thanks a lot for all your valuable replies.

I will buy Beta 87A Shure as recommended.

Can somebody please advice me on picking a suitable recorder for recording it from the mixer's output.

What brand of recorder.
What should i mention in specific when i buy the recorder.
What type is perferable..cd or tape.


Thanks & Regards
Ramya

#487795 - 03/30/07 08:53 AM Re: Best Mic for Vocalist [Re: rar]  
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BIG JIM MERRILEES Offline
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For economy versatility and quality I would recommend a Minidisc player these can be portable or as a deck and have complete editing facilities and cd quality playback. I use several makes and models but Sony do a very good range.

#487804 - 03/30/07 10:34 AM Re: Best Mic for Vocalist [Re: BIG JIM MERRILEES]  
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re Mini disc players

I had one for a couple of years before it died. Found it was very good , though mine was probably subject to much physical abuse.

I spent some time checking out for a new model and on the minidisc forums ,there seemed to be a feeling that the format was loosing the support from sony with only an occasional high end model being released and some people were reporting decreased stocking of the discs in some places . Possibly a format on the way out ?

Havn't looked for a while , but something to think about.

Cliff


How many song writers does it take to change a light bulb ?

Change !!!! WTF ....

I Ain't changing nuthin ....
#487805 - 03/30/07 10:36 AM Re: Best Mic for Vocalist [Re: Larry Read]  
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cliff turner Offline
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Originally Posted by Larry Read
For Live Performance with live demo recordings My choice is the the Shure SM58. It's a tried and true mic that is almost bullet proof and has a great sound considering it's low price. I like it better on Male Vocals than the Beta 87a which tends to be better suited to female vocalists. Note: This is a personal Vocal mic and not intended to pick up an entire band





Larry

Did you use the shure on songs on your web site ?

Nice sound .

Cliff


How many song writers does it take to change a light bulb ?

Change !!!! WTF ....

I Ain't changing nuthin ....
#487875 - 03/30/07 02:46 PM Re: Best Mic for Vocalist [Re: cliff turner]  
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Larry Read Offline
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Cliff,
First, Thanks for the kind response I am glad you enjoyed them. No the songs on my site were recorded in my personal studio not live like Rama was requesting for live situation on a limited budget.

The Microphones used were a Neumann TLM 149 and U47 for Vocals and AKG 414's for insturments and Direct Boxes. Studio enviroment recording is different than live.



your only a stranger once after that a new found friend
http://cdbaby.com/cd/larryread
http://www.LarryReadsMusic.com
Singer/Songwriter/Guitarist/Audio Engineer BMI &
Audio Engineering Society Member
#487890 - 03/30/07 03:35 PM Re: Best Mic for Vocalist [Re: Larry Read]  
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BIG JIM MERRILEES Offline
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Hi rar and everybody
Minidisc players are as Cliff says probably on the way out. They are fast being replaced by Mp3 and multi media players and the like. However a facility that these things do not generally have is the quality live recording and user friendly editing facilities that minidisc offers. Cassettes and tape recorders are a definite no no for the following obvious reasons. They offer very poor sound quality and are completely out of date.
One other option is recording straight into a laptop. Rar or her sis would have to know what they are doing though and use the appropriate software.

#487972 - 03/30/07 09:16 PM Re: Best Mic for Vocalist [Re: Larry Read]  
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Originally Posted by Larry Read

The SM58 also tends to reject sound from outside its pattern which is dynamic hyper cardiod meaning that you must sing directly into it stright on.


Larry, the SM58 is a cardioid pattern, not hyper-cardioid.
The Beta 58 and Beta 87A are super-cardioid pattern mics.

Actually, the super-cardioid is probably going to reject more extraneous noise than a hyper-cardioid mic anyway because the rear area pickup size is larger on a hyper-cardioid pattern than a super-cardioid, though it's true the front pattern is tighter.

Also, don't forget that the Beta mics have a pretty strong low end bump if the mic is used in close proximity. That may be harder to learn to use effectively.

#487983 - 03/30/07 10:04 PM Re: Best Mic for Vocalist [Re: DakLander]  
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You are correct DAK.. The Beta 57 does have a proximity effect if you get close to it..and the 58 does too. I personally have learned to use it to my advantage in softer parts of vocals it can be quite nice and your correct it does take a little getting use to.

For those who are asking whats a proximity effect?

It's a boost in the bass ( lower range ) of the mic when you get really close to it. It can be quite useful once you understand its uses and how to take advantage of it. Some mics have more than others while some have almost none.


your only a stranger once after that a new found friend
http://cdbaby.com/cd/larryread
http://www.LarryReadsMusic.com
Singer/Songwriter/Guitarist/Audio Engineer BMI &
Audio Engineering Society Member
#487984 - 03/30/07 10:06 PM Re: Best Mic for Vocalist [Re: DakLander]  
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Larry Read Offline
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You are correct DAK.. The Beta 57 does have a proximity effect if you get close to it..and the 58 does too. I personally have learned to use it to my advantage in softer parts of vocals it can be quite nice and your correct it does take a little getting use to.

For those who are asking whats a proximity effect?

It's a boost in the bass ( lower range ) of the mic when you get really close to it. It can be quite useful once you understand its uses and how to take advantage of it. Some mics have more than others while some have almost none.


your only a stranger once after that a new found friend
http://cdbaby.com/cd/larryread
http://www.LarryReadsMusic.com
Singer/Songwriter/Guitarist/Audio Engineer BMI &
Audio Engineering Society Member
#504263 - 05/17/07 07:17 PM Re: Best Mic for Vocalist [Re: rar]  
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Tim Downing Offline
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I would never use anything other than a Shure.

Rock Hard Rock Forever!!

Tim

#504323 - 05/17/07 11:01 PM Re: Best Mic for Vocalist [Re: Tim Downing]  
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Hi twd
A bold statement. What else have you tried but condemmed in preferance to a shure. I have tried just about every make and a good number of models over the years. Quite frankly there is so much myth and false loyalties spoken about mics. I have proved in tests two things that are worth learning.

1. Everybodys voice is different and some makes of mics suit a voice whilst others do not. One man's meat is another man's poison.

2. We tried an experiment. In a blindfolded test people like you who prefer Shure were asked to choose the mic which sounded best. The eq and settings were identical. Everybody except one thought that the best mic was not the shure and were surprised.

I have two sm58 that I carry with me as backups. I prefer Audio Technica which came top in the blindfold test. I have to really jack up the gains to almost distortion level to get the same volume that is crystal clear.

#504423 - 05/18/07 04:26 AM Re: Best Mic for Vocalist [Re: BIG JIM MERRILEES]  
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Tim Downing Offline
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"I am looking for a best mic for my sister-in law." was asked by rar

"I would never use anything other than a Shure." was my reply.

Notice I said "I". I didnt say THE best mic or EVERYONE uses a Shure. And where in my statement do you see my condemning ANYONE for ANYTHING. It is only my opinion. Thats what living in a democracy gives me the right to do. For those less certain of themselves or waiting in the bush to pounce, thats not my concern. You sure did get more out of one sentence than I think my sister has in our whole lives.

"2. We tried an experiment. In a blindfolded test people like you who prefer Shure were asked to choose the mic which sounded best. The eq and settings were identical. Everybody except one thought that the best mic was not the shure and were surprised."

What was the OTHER mic anyway?

Shure has proven itself as an industry standard and has led the race in reliability. But dont take my word for it.....heres just a few reviews:

By Mario E. Guthrie -


"Well i don't have much to say. Anyone who does a lot of vocal performance sees these suckers everywhere. Not only are they terribly common, they are common because they are good sturdy mics. Good sound quality! Happy with mine. Shure has been making good mics forever. It's definitely a safe buy for any performer, especially vocalists."

By Bruce Butler "ga_gandalf" (Mona, Utah United States)


"This microphone is an excellent choice for garage bands, home-recorders and musical enthusiasts--ultra reliable, extremely tough with sound reproduction of a quality which usually requires a much heftier price tag. This is a microphone that will keep you singing a good while."


A rehearsal workhorse, August 15, 2004
By Aaron Rubenson "Frugal Tenor" (Seattle, WA) - See all my reviews


"This is an excellent, general purpose microphone at a reasonable price. I'm a classically trained vocalist, and I use the SM58 for rehearsal and "scratch" recordings. It delivers clear, true, and warm sound under all standard conditions and requires essentially no fine tuning or signal processing. I still prefer the crisp detail of a condenser microphone for formal demo recordings (my favorite is the Studio Projects C1), but it's hard to beat the simplicity and reliability of the SM58 for everyday use."

I suppose having the most posts means you know the most?

Who are you anyway? Have you produced any Top 10's anywhere? What exactly are your qualifications?

One more thing.....make sure you have more facts to back up what your saying anyway. Just sayin it doesnt make it so. I am quite certain I have established myself in my art.

Tim





#504456 - 05/18/07 09:06 AM Re: Best Mic for Vocalist [Re: Tim Downing]  
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I respect your choice as I said it is down to individual preferences.
I do not want an argument.
The point I was making was that a lot of people have not tried anything other than shure and "blinkered vision" people are hardly qualified to comment on other makes. These folk should be open minded about other makes and models. When it comes to testimony I can show you a whole host of famous folk who do not use shure and say that X Y or Z make is the one they would use. Means nothing.
Re me jumping to conclusions. Your unqualified, unexplained BLANKET statement made me do that.
Re the other mics in the blindfold test. We used EV, Audio technica, and sennheiser. All very good popular brands with similar prices and specs. I suggest you try this test yourself even you might be surprised.
Re who I am is totally irrelevant as I am not the one pushing any particular brand. I was asking who you were and what other mics you have tried to qualify a statement that says I would only use shure.
I have been in the music business for over forty years and have tried many many mics gizmos and sysyems. I am open minded and respect other peoples preferences.

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