JPF Home Page Forums Musician Gear and Techniques General Technical Forum Your 2001 CD Release - Hire a Pro or DIY?

Well, since about 68% of JPF members are releasing a new album in 2001, I thought I'd ask if you're using outside studios/producers this time, or doing most/all of the production yourselves.

Have you done it this way before or are you trying something new?

Are you happy with the way you record now? Or would you rather have the money/skills/time to do things differently?

Let's hear from you!



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Later,

Pat

I'm in the middle of recording my second CD now, and I'm doing it all at home. Minimal equipment (one ADAT, few effects) but immense freedom. I never feel rushed, and have all the time in the world to experiment with bizarre mic placement.

I don't get a polished Big Studio sound, but then again, I'm not looking for one... Casual, impromtu/live production suits my style best, so I guess I lucked out...



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Shandy Lawson

http://www.shandylawson.com

And I guess that's what your fans say they like, too?




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Later,

Pat

Well Pat, I can't speak for my fans, as I lost touch with him shortly after the first CD... But the folks that listen usually do toss a compliment my way about the "unorthodox" production. I guess anything that helps you stand out can't be bad, right?

Ooh! You had a fan!

Since this album I'm working on is the first one I'll be charging money for (and making more than 10 copies of), we'll see if I get a fan out of all the effort

And I'm doing it myself. I may have somebody else master it, though, depending on how my production budget holds up.



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Later,

Pat

Just a quick suggestion-- check out http://www.gatemusic.com and poke around a bit.

I used them for my last CD, & I plan to work with them again. They're very pro, have a great graphics team and also offer several different levels/pricing for post-production work. They mastered my disc, & really made a lot out of a little...

I'm also working on a release for this year. I've got 8 songs finished so far. On my previous 3 albums, done several years ago, I've gone to 24 track studios and brought in several studio pro friends. For this one, I'm fulfilling a lifelong dream. I'm doing it all myself.

It's being recorded at my studio. I'm only using 8 tracks on ADAT, not going to my hard disk. I start with the rhythm guitar, no click track (I've been playing bass so long my time is decent.) Then I put on the lead parts. I'm using all accoustic guitars, I plan to aim at americana. Then I put on percussion: shakers, tambourines, cabasas, usually two tracks panned hard. Then come the vocal tracks lead and harmony. Finally I put on the bass which I'm mixing way down, almost subliminable (Sorry George.)

I'm using one reverb sound for everything, just a drop of compression on the entire mix. Man, I'm having fun. I've produced 32 track jazz rock stuff, but this is floating my boat. I'm trying to produce an album I would have loved when I was in college.

I have a pretty good studio and I just dumped $10,000 dollars into it but I have to admit that sometimes I wish all that I had was a pen and paper with the acoustic guitar. Why? because the time that I spend learning a drum machine I could be working on my craft of songwriting. A lot of the writers that I work with that have the most talent in writing don't play a note. They just write. They concentrate all their efforts into writing and it shows. Also if you can write great songs and find a great producer then you have a hit making team. I envy those people. Some times you get caught up in the buttons and knobs of the gear. I have to be really carefull of how i spend my time. I make sure that I dedicate time to just writing.

paul lawrence

paul@artistjam.com

here is my studio http://www.artistjam.com/studio

Shandy, thanks for the link. I'll check 'em out. Man, there are so many CD manufacturers out there, it's hard to know who to pick.

Mike, you are using my old tried-and-true recording method of laying that acoustic guitar down first and then playing everything else along with that. I'm using a drum machine this go-round so I'm writing out the rhythm notation first, then programming all the loops into the machine and laying it down on tape with some added reverb & eq to try and make it sound more real. We'll see how it goes.

Paul, I know how you feel, but just think about some of the people we know who have been saving up their money for 5 years to go into a studio, because they know they'd be USELESS trying to do it all themselves. I feel lucky that I've got the tech chops and can still work on the song chops as I go



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Later,

Pat

Hmmmm... I'd say this all depends on the tilt of the filthy lucre for me. My preference is toward working with an engineer/producer (who's also a musician) for one giant reason: quirkiness! I may have some weird production ideas (I've been told this many times LOL) but that other head and perspective gives things a uniqueness that I find invaluable and stimulating. Finding that "right" person is going to prove a tough nut (or damn near impossible) for the egocentric and inflexible. Sure, I could do the do myself (as I try to write songs that can work as guitar/vocal solo; that's all I can play at one time when doing it live anyhoo ;o) ), but in the end, I usually find that self-production stuff sounds exactly like what it is and contains a strictured approach. In some cases it's a good thing (take Shandy's wonky approach, for one), but I prefer a bit more variety in my soundscapes. So, for myself, it comes down to whether I'm willing to pay for multi-faceted production tools and the person of highly varied taste who has the command of them (and the boldness to try the untried). I'm very pleased with results on my album, and to me, the thought and care involved in the production and the input of a wide variety of musicians really does show.

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Ozone
http://artists.mp3s.com/artists/141/ozone_pete.html

Damn, I AM a fan of Ozone Pete's album "Dark Dreams" and I am listening to it as I type this


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Later,

Pat

Aye, another Ozone fan here. Pete's songs lend themselves well to the proper outside direction, as a lot of them have a certain "openness" at their inception that allows for whatever zaniness the right mind comes up with. Dark Dreams is a good example, as the solo versions and studio versions are completely different animals. But both are very, very good.

I'd love to try that approach, but money & the right producer have yet to materialize. I'm lucky in that I like the sound I get at home, but I'll still save my pennies for that Tom Waits-produced dream album...

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Shandy Lawson

http://www.shandylawson.com

Geeeez Guys!
Are you implying I may have TWO fans???
Man, an embarassment of riches!
Thanks buds, backatcha, and keep me aprised of the progress please...

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Ozone
http://artists.mp3s.com/artists/141/ozone_pete.html

Heh, more than two, I'll bet.
I think it's important to get other perspectives even while working by myself. I have a small group of people whose opinions I trust, who get to hear the tracks before anyone else does, and who know they can be honest with me.



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Later,

Pat

Well, you all are light years ahead of me regarding the technology. I hope to release my first CD of original songs in 2002, and I want to go into a studio to do it here in the Louisville, Kentucky, area. That way, I can focus on the writing and the vocals, and let others do the tech stuff and play the instruments.

With very little experience in the studio, I'm trying to get as much advice as I can from fellow Folks. Got any for me?

I'll be going for an acoustic folk/rock sound, probably with lots of vocal harmonies and guitar/bass/drums/piano, with some strings (sort of like Jars of Clay, and Blessed Union of Souls).

Although I don't want to do the engineering for the CD myself, I'd like to have some good demos to take to the producer I eventually choose, so that they can get an idea what I'm going for. To that end, I'm also considering acquiring some sort of inexpensive digital recording gear, beyond Cakewalk Home Studio which I use on my computer.

I am considering buying the Soundblaster Live! sound card and some better recording software for my desktop. But another idea would be to get a WAMI box to use with my laptop. And then there are free-standing digital recording units of different kinds. I really don't know which would be best for me, but it would be great to be able to carry a digital recording gear with me to record from different boards.

So, in addition to advice on studio selection and pricing, here's a question for those of you with tech-smarts:

If you only had between $1000 and $1500 to spend and wanted to get the best portable digital recording gear possible, what would you buy and why?

I'll take my answer off the air. . .



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Peace and adventure,
Michael Carlson

In that price range, I know a couple of folks who are happy with their Roland all-in-one digital workstations.



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Later,

Pat

Pat,

Thanks, I'll check those out.


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Peace and adventure,
Michael Carlson

Okay, I checked them out, and also discovered the Korg and Yamaha models. Which is best? I'd like to get both the workstation, and a really good mic for making digital recordings of voice and acoustic instruments, all for a target price of $1250 or less. Impossible?

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Peace and adventure,
Michael Carlson

In light of what's going on, this project now seems sort of moot. But I know that if anything can help heal people's hearts, its music.

Okay, I've done some more shopping around. I've heard good things about the KORG D16, and it seems more affordable than the Roland units. What are your thoughts (Pat, and others) on the advantages/disadvantages between the two?

I'm hoping to learn a lot through this process of making my first CD, and perhaps learn enough to do it on my own next time.

Peace,
Michael

I don't have firsthand experience with either unit, though the Korg looks good on paper. Don't know. Can anyone help here?


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Later,

Pat

Michael,

With your budget, the important this is to go to a music store and listen to the products first hand if possible. Also, play with the controls and see if they intuitively work for you.

In years past, most sequencers and programming was confusing and difficult to use. I own keyboards by every major (and most minor) manufacturers out there. In years past, my favorite in the ease of use department were the Ensoniq Keyboards. My favorite in the variety department was Roland, my favorite in the cost department were Alesis and my favorite in the sound quality department were Korg. A lot has changed since then. Ensoniq is gone. Alesis is gone. Roland makes great gear. Yamaha makes great gear though it's very difficult to use. Korg, still makes the best sounding keyboards, but now they also make the easiest to use on top of it. That is why, when given the choice of ANY keyboard on the market, we chose a Korg to be our main keyboard for Roadtrips. It was only after hearing our plans of buying one ourselves that Korg offered to donate it. We had already decided on the best board on the market. (OF course, everyone else seems to clearly agree as well.)

Their smaller, less expensive versions obviously have less features as they go down in price, though a big price break comes when you give us the 88 weighted keys for the 61 key synth action. Once you get to that price break, they have lots of affordable options that are great.

Another idea for you is to simply get involved in our membership drive and perhaps you can win a $2500 Korg PA-80 that they donated.. but then I digress..

Good luck,

Brian

Yeah, I've got an Ensoniq ESQ-1, which still works after over 16 years. I've never really owned another keyboard, and now I do my MIDI sequencing with Cakewalk.

I'm actually talking about buying a digital recording workstation, like the ones Korg, Yamah and Roland make, not a new keyboard. I'm comfortable using my ESQ with my Korg X5DR for now, but need something to make my demos. So, my options are either upgrade my computer with a better sound card and better recording software, or buy a digial recording workstation. I'm leaning towards the workstation, because I could take it anywhere I want with me to record.

The Korg D16 seems like a good unit, recommended to me by other musicians who I trust, and it seems to produce good quality digital recordings. It lacks the automation of the Yamaha (does the Roland automate, too?), but the D16 seems a lot more affordable than the others. I can get it new online for around $1025.

On another note, I went into the studio last night to record a demo, and the engineer uses Cakewalk. Maybe I could just make my demo recordings using Cakewalk. Do most studios have Cakewalk? I could just email my demos to the producer/engineer and cut out a lot of time and expense, perhaps. I want to have all the prep work done well before I actually go into the studio to do my project.

Even so, I laid down a keyboard part and a vocal part in one take each, which was really cool because I'd only been in a studio once before. I'm getting excited about recording my 10-song CD early next year.


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Peace and adventure,
Michael Carlson

On the EP I'm recording right now I am using Cubase VST 32 with a RODE NTK mic hooked up through an ardvark sound card...very good sounding and all very affordable. shouldn't be much more than your budget. I use VST soft synths for any sounds I can't make with my guitar and just use a cheap MIDI controller to play those. Only drawback is the amount of computing power you need and the steep learning curve if you have no experience recording at all.

hope this helps,
Ben Stevenson
_______________________________________
http://benstevenson.tripod.com

listen to some audio clips NOT recorded with this setup