JPF Home Page Forums General Messages General Message Forum Tim McGraw's "Back When" breaks the rules

Seems to me "Back When" really pushes the edge when it comes to sexual references. It doesn't bother me in the least. I write some stuff like this. But for Nashille (contemporary country), I am very surprised this song was accepted. I am surprised there wasn't a backlash from very conservative people about what their kids are listening to.

"They" also say to write to your market. What IS the market in contemporary country? This song has many references, in fact, the entire song, is geared towards people who grew up 30 to 40 years ago. That age group doesn't buy may records.

I'm just surprised by both... that it got cut. The song is a big hit.

=

"Back When"
(Stan Lynch, Jeff Stevens and Stephony Smith)

Don't you remember
The fizz in a pepper
Peanuts in a bottle
At ten, two and four
A fried bologna sandwich
With mayo and tomato
Sittin' round the table
Don't happen much anymore

We got too complicated
It's all way over-rated
I like the old and out-dated
Way of life

Back when a hoe was a hoe
Coke was a coke
And crack's what you were doing
When you were cracking jokes
Back when a screw was a screw
The wind was all that blew
And when you said I'm down with that
Well it meant you had the flu
I miss back when
I miss back when
I miss back when

I love my records
Black, shiny vinyl
Clicks and pops
And white noise
Man they sounded fine
I had my favorite stations
The ones that played them all
Country, soul and rock-and-roll
What happened to those times?

I'm readin' Street Slang For Dummies
Cause they put pop in my country
I want more for my money
The way it was back then

Back when a hoe was a hoe
Coke was a coke
And crack's what you were doing
When you were cracking jokes
Back when a screw was a screw
The wind was all that blew
And when you said I'm down with that
Well it meant you had the flu
I miss back when
I miss back when
I miss back when

Give me a flat top for strumming
I want the whole world to be humming
Just keep it coming
The way it was back then

Back when a hoe was a hoe
Coke was a coke
And crack's what you were doing
When you were cracking jokes
Back when a screw was a screw
The wind was all that blew
And when you said I'm down with that
Well it meant you had the flu
I miss back when
I miss back when
I miss back when

[This message has been edited by DukeWill (edited 09-05-2005).]

Hey Duke,

After reading through the lyrics, and mind you I'm not a country music person at all, here's my take.

I really don't get much of the first verse, especially Peanuts in a bottle - ten, two & four. And why didn't they write Fizz in Dr. Pepper.

As for the chorus, I don't see it as sexual at all. In fact, I'm understanding it meaning that the writer doesn't understand why these terms changed their meanings. Where the innocent became corrupted and wishes it weren't so.

To that end, this really doesn't seem to push any edge at all, based on context. At least to me.

Jody

------------------
Music That Makes Your Soul Happy!
www.jodywhitesides.com

I don't get what your saying..
Conservatives like me like this stuff.
It opens some eyes...
He is saying in the song that we have gotten away from being conservative..
I don't see any sexual references other than the hoe not being a garden hoe anymore.

I think the song is perfect..
It says He misses the good old days when a our culture was different.
And is making the listener aware of these changes.

I think what I hear is that
you might have to adapt to the influence
of Black culture on our society.
Let's face it..
the term Hoe is mostly coined by Whom?
You can read that Good or Bad.
I'm not going to specualate and open myself up for being called a racist..

Look at the influence on the youth..
Movies, TV, Rap, Pop culture..
If you are over the Age of thirty you probably have noticed a big change in society as when you were young.
and so did your parents...

When he says I'm reading Street slang for dummies. What does that implie??
He wants to edcuate himself on Pop culture and interject it into country music.
Whether you hate it or not Country is going more and more Street..
THat duet with Nelly should of been a clue.

Probably cause we are running out of generations that appreciate the farm and country way of life..
and those folks are not buying the CD's..
Blue Collar has been turned into a past time.
Middle class is gone...
and the Chinese have all our good Jobs..

I particualy don't want Street Culture and Lingo parading in my media and schools.
But that's not under my control..

DAvid

Well,
I haven't heard the song but these lyrics are something I would file as not being quite good enough to submit to anyone. A good example of what Nashville is giving us. Nothing to write home about in my opinion.

The first verse is about life in the South years ago. Dr. Pepper, popular in the South, used to have (may still , for all I know) have "10, 2" and 4" on the label, implying, I guess, that those were ideal times of the day to enjoy a cold Dr. Pepper. It is a Southern thing to drop peanuts in a bottle of soda. They cause the soda to fizz and impart a nice saltiness to the drink. When you empty the bottle, you get the prize, the soda-soaked peanuts.

That verse is just a reminiscence of days gone by.

That's funny! ASounds like part of a stand up comedians routine than a song however..

I thought the song's verses were well written and clever.
I don't know what the chorues lyrics have to do with
COUNTRY music at all. I'm mean ya'll folks call your woman Hoes? And since when is crack a big country music scene thing?

The sexual points of Screw & Blew were both tasteless and very imature and Beavis & Butthead Like of these writers. Trying to be clever but coming out stupid. Very Very Lame! No suprise Tim Mcgraw would do it.. right after he did a collaboration with
a Hip Hop Star to.. Maybe he wants to start an East Coast/West Coast/South Coast war

Peace
Sub

Are you kidding me, Jody? Hoe means whore. Screw means have sex. Blew means blow job. At least, that's the way I interpret it.

Gosh, I'm flabbergasted you and I don't see on the same page regarding that. As I said, I write some silly stuff with sexual references like this. I'm not slamming that. I'm saying I am surprised this is from one of the big guns in NASHVILLE. It doesn't get much more sexual that whores, screwing and blow jobs.

Of course, the song is waxing nostalgic, I'm just saying having such blatant references is surprising. First time I heard it, I thought, "Wow, what a STOOPID song." Of course, it's a smash. Shows what I know.

And I also mentioned that again, here's a smash hit record that is exactly what they tell you NOT to d -- don't get too overtly sexual for the Nashille market and be sure to write to your buying audience demographics. Again, I don't think baby boomers buy many country records. Although, I don't know for sure. I assume that is true.

Duke,

Sure you can get that out of it, but you can also think this:

Hoe - is a rake that is used in farming.
Screw - is a little metal object used to hold things together.
Wind blew - was the term for what air was doing going from one place to another.

As I read those lyrics, that is what the writer wants to remember them as. Since this is some sort of remembering how life was type of song, and that its a country one at that.

Now outside of country and in modern day those terms have double meanings.

Hoe - can mean a whore.
Screw - can mean to have sex, or get shafted at your job.
Wind Blew - well stretching it, it can mean the act of a blow job.

Duke, I didn't miss those things. But like I said, as I read that, I don't get that impression from the writer. However, you are imposing those meanings based on your view. Now you expect me to think that's the only way to look at it?

Jody

------------------
Music That Makes Your Soul Happy!
www.jodywhitesides.com

I think you are thinking to much without giving it any real thought Duke.
It is an effective lyric.
I could play this quite safely on Hope FM with has a total taboo on anything the least bit dicey and not worry if I had stretched the boundry too far.
Ya know. We had a hitch in a choral arrangement ones. A hole, and couldn't figure why untill we realised one singer was not singing the word gay because of the current day connection with the word.
It is about time this was done.
Again.
There is another one at least out there I can't recall the name of but does the same thing.
Graham

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http://www.soundclick.com/bands/2/grahamhenderson_music.htm

Jody is right.

That is the whole point of the song.
The change of the meaning to these words in society.

Just like when a women says anything to a man
and then the man hears a inuendo in it.

Like in the office
"Mail tool" - meaning email software.

Or on the golf course
Ball Washer... - Golfball Washer
Driver- 1 wood
Shaft- steel or graphite shaft
Grip- Ruber Grip
Stroke- One swing of a Club to advance a ball
Golf has alot..

Think what you want...

best image of the old Dr Pepper logo:

http://www.drpeppermuseum.org/drpepperstore/images/large/1024stool2.jpg

It's a o'timey thing. Dad taught us kids about peanuts in our Pepsi, they were 8 oz. deposit glass bottles back then.

The author intended the modern-say sexual references, that's the point of the chorus. To say you don't get it from reading it is wilful ignorance of every moment you've been exposed to the popular urban-driven culture over the last fifteen years.

And exactly where would one have to have been to have avoided it?

P.S. if the link doesn't work, you can go to http://www.drpeppermuseum.org "Go Shopping", Housewares, and page down to the bar stool. Click to enlarge.

[This message has been edited by ed323 (edited 09-06-2005).]

Jody, of course, you certainly can interpret the lyric to mean what you see. But if this lyric does NOT imply the following, then I have lost my mind.

Are you guys saying there is no implied analogy between the following... the changing meaning of the words of yesteryear to today?

HOE
garden tool / whore
COKE
soft drink / cocaine
CRACK
joke / crack cocaine
SCREW
fastener / have sex
BLEW
wind / blow job

EDIT: Please weigh in, you guys. Do you NOT interpret the above contrasts from that chorus? If not, this is something very important (to me, anyway). Like, this would be one of the most amazing songwriting revelations of my lifetime, haha. That we could see things so differently. To me, it's just right there in the open what it means. Like, how could it mean anything else? Help me out here.

[This message has been edited by DukeWill (edited 09-06-2005).]

David, do you think I am saying anything otherwise? Of course, it's the changing meaning of the words. But the NEW way, for several of the words, is overtly sexual. That's my reason for the post! [EDIT: Plus, the entire lyric being written with references to many things that the young (buying) market would have no idea what it means.]

[This message has been edited by DukeWill (edited 09-06-2005).]

i usually don't comment on things like this... but this is a prime example of that nashville co-writing "huddle in a conference room songwriter cluster hump" (pardon the reference, but i mean when a hump was a hump) to turn out a prescribed hit for tim... nothing more... it was already tagged a chart mover before it was written. it's tasteless, no matter what the implications are and i'm sure they certainly intended the video to steer the imaginations of the listener/watcher... it was designed to support video and they probably didn't even consider the double meanings implied upon the radio listener. anyway you cut it, it's a song that didn't need to be written but this is what happens with that "songwriting machine" business in nashville. they should stick to writing about stuff they know... but the marketing push behind mcgraw will no doubt insure a hefty royalty check. pitiful.
rock on.
chevy

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http://www.chevyford.com

I agree with you Duke on one thing..
that the youth probably doesn't know what the words meant back then.

and I have to agree that those words were probably used to entice the kids in.
so OK there might be some strategic sexual conspiracy corprate planning involved here.
Maybe even market research done with the words.
They sat down a teenager and yelled
Crack, hoe, blew,Coke.
and the teen replied by laughing like Beavis.
THen asked whether they would purchase such material..


Not too many of them have ever picked up a hoe before.. Garden hoe that is..

I did when I was a kid.
Had to make nice straight lines to plant in.

Ok, I guess I'm being attacked for the fact that I understand it's got the ability to have a sexual connotation. But then I'm being slammed for the fact that even though these words have their double meanings, it doesn't get my blood boiling?

Sex sells. Always has, most likely, always will. It's how advertisers move product from beer to beauty cream. In this case, its a song. Actually, in many cases its a song. Lot's of times that sex gets covertly disguised as love, or something else. But its still got a sexual overtone to it. I'd be willing to bet that there were country songs, long before I was born, that were very sexually suggestive being played at the Grand Ol' Opry.

I guess I don't don't find this type of double meaning offensive, neither did you. Apparently Tim doesn't either. Nor does the label that put it out. And I'm going to venture a guess, that the radio stations don't either. Even more funny is that the FCC, who loves to go after one particular individual for such use of language on radio, doesn't think its offensive either.

I've never heard the song, I only read the lyrics that Duke posted. So Duke, I've already admitted it. I'm not a country fan. I don't write country music, generally never listen to it, and in answer to your question - I don't know what is considered contemporary country this week. But I'm guessing it's not what the Grand Ol' Opry used to do 40-50 years ago. Like any genre, things change and in this instance move in a direction based on a commercial sellable standpoint.

Jody

------------------
Music That Makes Your Soul Happy!
www.jodywhitesides.com

the song got people talking about whats written BETWEEN the lines. it got a debate going

this is what GOOD songs are supposed to do.
its good to see a debate about the content of a song. theres so few you can do that with. the last one was "courtesy of the red white and blue"

music is an art, its about representing something. this song seems to do so.
not many nowadays do that.

so in actuality
it IS a GOOD SONG.

being a 20something... I just want to inform everyone that when we say something "blew" or "that blows".. its a slang for saying something was bad, ie: "that sucked" ..

so although "that sucks, you suck" or "that blows, you blow".. may be some derivative of a "suck" or a "blow" job.... when the word is used in an esxpression like the above mentioned, it doesnt translate as "blowjob" as much as it does, something being "undesirable"..

As far as that song goes? I think it blows.