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#146896 - 06/05/04 05:12 AM Join Free Compilation?  
Joined: Apr 2004
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Adam Gentry Offline
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Adam Gentry  Offline
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Indiana, USA
I'd like to test out a hypothetical idea: We all know that if someone wants you to pay to put your song in a compilation, it's probably a scam. What if it's free, though? Say I get permission from a dozen artists in a certain niche found online, put a song from each on a CD, and sell them. I'd get a big chunk of the profits since I'm doing the footwork and production, then give the other artists some per-CD royalties in addition to a referral bonus if an album is sold off their site.

Does it sound like a good, legitimate offer? If you're one of those artists, is there anything that would make you suspicious (in spite of the fact that it's all on the up-and-up)? Would you go for it if the contract explicitly said it was non-exclusive and didn't affect your copyright powers? If you've done something like this or are familiar with either side of the deal, what might be a reasonable royalty/bonus rate? Thanks in advance.

------------------
====================
**Tunes by Gentry**
Original Christian and Classical Music
http://www.gentrytunes.com
(New low-carb version!)

[This message has been edited by Adam Gentry (edited 06-05-2004).]


====================
**GentryTunes! by Adam Gentry**
Original Christian and classical music
http://www.myspace.com/gentrytunes
#146897 - 06/05/04 12:25 PM Re: Join Free Compilation?  
Joined: Nov 2003
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Joe Wrabek (D) Offline
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Joe Wrabek (D)  Offline
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Adam:

I think my answer to your hypothetical question would be a tentative yes. A follow-up question or two, though. Are you taking for your CD only fully-produced whoopies from artists who've already made the investment in professionally-produced demos? If so, then I'm not playing in your league.

I may be a good writer (I'll let the audience make that judgment, though), but I'm nothing special as a guitarist and as a singer--well, I may have a future in earplug promotion<g>. Nothing I've written since 1980 has been recorded in a professional studio or with a real band.

What would you do with someone like me? It seems like if anything I'd written were going to be on your CD, there'd need to be a fairly substantial investment made in a quality recording with a real singer and a real backup band. Are you saying you're prepared (maybe, under the right conditions) to make that investment? Or are you only dealing with people who've already made that investment on their own at their own expense?

If the latter, well, I ain't there yet. My small-town-remote from-civilization domicile (hey, we do got electricity most of the time now), my income, and my time all say I'm not getting around to having any professional demo done of my stuff any time soon. Maybe someday. Don't hold your breath--but if you're still alive, and still doing this, when it happens, maybe we can do business.

Otherwise, yes, I'm always potentially interested in a cost-free deal that's got exposure for my stuff wrapped up in it somehow. Let me know.

Joe

#146898 - 06/05/04 02:14 PM Re: Join Free Compilation?  
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Ozone Pete Offline
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Adam,
I'd probably sign on to such a venture, although success (lucre-wise) of such a thing [on your part] is always a crap-shoot.
In that vein, let's take a look at some hypothetical [and easy] numbers...

12 separate artists paid 25 cents per copy sold (figure just for ease of computation).
There's three bucks off personal profit, per copy.

Gotta stay "reasonable" on the price. Let's say 12 bucks for sake of arguement. Take off 2 bucks for mail-age. You got your 10. Minus the 3 for the "artistes". You got 7.

What's it costing for the printing and pressing? Say you get that down to about 2 bucks per copy for a pressing of 1000.
(Kinda got to be realistic here, if you want something that looks and reads well, versus shoddy and hasty.)

Well, you have 7 grand on a 2 grand investment, for a profit of 5 grand (providing you flog 'em all, of course).
So, not really too bad for a mom and pop deal.

For the participants, it's not much of a cash incentive ($250 at the far end, which could likely be made in a couple solo gigs), but it does provide, as you say, for some extra exposure and some potential sales of their own personal project CD's. So I don't see anything "negative" there, either.

As far as Joe's query; yes, you'd have to accept only quality, "done-deal" productions, that aren't going to require any fooling about (other than getting the peak volume levels the same from cut to cut).

If you can scrape up the 2 grand, and think you have a potential ready-made market, why not? Doesn't sound like a life-altering financial risk, at any rate...

------------------
Ozone
http://www.soundclick.com/bands/1/ozonepetemusic.htm

#146899 - 06/05/04 02:33 PM Re: Join Free Compilation?  
Joined: Jul 2002
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Michael James Moore Offline
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Michael James Moore  Offline
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Hi Adam.You might contact Michael Borges on this.He was responsible for putting together a project called" America and friends" a cd compilation to raise money for Vets.If you go to my news page you can read how its is done.This cd is on many internet sites but i dont know haw many have been sold. http://www.mjmrecords.com

------------------
[Linked Image]

#146900 - 06/06/04 01:41 PM Re: Join Free Compilation?  
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Cal Offline
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Cal  Offline
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Allen Park, MI
Any one know if your song itself is protected?
Who owns the publishing rights of your song?
Better be careful what you sign-
If your song gets attention from a major label, you may someday find out it is not your song anymore.
I think one should know all of the legal
aspects of these "compilation" CD's.


Just a thought

Cal

#146901 - 06/06/04 06:18 PM Re: Join Free Compilation?  
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Adam Gentry Offline
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Adam Gentry  Offline
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Indiana, USA
Roxhythe: I was just thinking about how feasible it would be to take already-made, pro-quality tunes to put directly on an album. I'm not exactly rolling in dough, so the scenario you gave is unlikely at this point, but it's an interesting idea nonetheless.

Pete: Your numbers and input look like a logical, reasonable possibility. Thanks for your thoughts.

Michael: Thanks for the tip. I'll go check that out.

Cal: I'm sorry if I wasn't clear on my explanation. (Good points, though.) I was thinking about if I put together an anthology of indy artists and sold the CDs. I would only be asking them for a non-exclusive license to put one or two of their songs on my compilation CD, from which they'd get a cut of any sale.


------------------
====================
**Tunes by Gentry**
Original Christian and Classical Music
http://www.gentrytunes.com
(New low-carb version!)

[This message has been edited by Adam Gentry (edited 06-06-2004).]


====================
**GentryTunes! by Adam Gentry**
Original Christian and classical music
http://www.myspace.com/gentrytunes
#146902 - 06/06/04 06:30 PM Re: Join Free Compilation?  
Joined: Apr 2001
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Brian Austin Whitney Offline
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Indianapolis, IN USA
There's nothing wrong with your idea at all. We've considered doing the same with with the entire org. One thing I learned, however, is that selling any compilation is a lot more difficult than you'd imagine it to be. I spoke with Derek Sivers at CDBaby. They did a CD Baby/Oasis CD sponsored compilation that they promoted heavily and were only able to sell a tiny number of copies. He said the largest selling compilation on CD Baby in history has only sold a couple hundred copies. So, the concept of selling 1000 is a great, but after a few months of research, I can't find any examples of high profile indie compilation albums that have sold that many. So keep it in mind before spending the money.

Brian


Brian Austin Whitney
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#146903 - 06/07/04 01:30 AM Re: Join Free Compilation?  
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CurlyT Offline
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GA
I am curious, were these compilations specific to genre? or several genres together? You gotta go for the target audience. A CD that is strictly confined to one genre will sell better than one that has several on it. Just simple fact that people like certain music. I like all kinds, but most people don't I would think.


I think the comp CD is a good idea, sure you may not sell as many, but...it is one more way of getting your msuic "out there".

#146904 - 06/07/04 10:10 AM Re: Join Free Compilation?  
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Adam Gentry Offline
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Adam Gentry  Offline
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Indiana, USA
Brian: Sobering thoughts... On the other hand, selling fifty or a hundred CDs is that much more than I would have sold otherwise. Then it's a lesser cost, too. It would just be an experiment and not a make-enough-money-to-live-on venture, so it might work out anyway.

Curly: You have a valid concern and I've thought about that. For the first comp I was thinking about mainstream contemporary Christian -- or perhaps something more specific like "Third Day-esque" if I could find enough content. Styles like alternative or rock might work out, too, seeing as they're probably not saturating the market as much. Thanks for your input.



------------------
====================
**Tunes by Gentry**
Original Christian and Classical Music
http://www.gentrytunes.com
(New low-carb version!)


====================
**GentryTunes! by Adam Gentry**
Original Christian and classical music
http://www.myspace.com/gentrytunes
#146905 - 06/07/04 10:39 AM Re: Join Free Compilation?  
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Ozone Pete Offline
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Unionville, CT, USA
Adam,
I had deduced from your signature that you might be going for the christian/spiritual market. (Not that there's anything wrong with that. [Linked Image] )
I would think that market to be particularly "intertwined" (or "networked", if you will), and is composed of folks that like their messages fairly "pat" and uncontrovertial (the "preaching-to-the-choir" tilt that reinforces the current mind-set). I think you'll get a lot of word-of-mouth referral if you have a truly [musically] good product. It's my considered opinion that your chances of success would be better in this market than any other. As I had said before (but perhaps didn't emphasize enough), the concept of a built-in market would be your most important consideration.

Edit: Ps: I'm a heathen, but that certainly doesn't preclude me from wishing you success if you should go forward with this! (Just please don't include any heathen-bashing tunes; we gots enough troubles, what with going to hell and all. [Linked Image] ) <-- That's a joke; no offence intended please!

------------------
Ozone
http://www.soundclick.com/bands/1/ozonepetemusic.htm

[This message has been edited by Ozone Pete (edited 06-07-2004).]

#146906 - 06/07/04 10:56 AM Re: Join Free Compilation?  
Joined: Aug 2002
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Everett Adams Online content
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Everett Adams  Online Content
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,NL Canada
I would be interested in taking part in such a venture,especially in Gospel,after all the main thing is getting the message out for people to hear.If you can make a few bucks doing it,great.


The more you taste the bitterness of defeat, the sweeter final victory will be

May the flowers of love forever bloom in your garden of life

http://www.soundclick.com/newsflashsounds

http://www.soundclick.com/newsflashgospel

www.cdbaby.com/all/eca333

www.showcaseyourmusic.com/newsflashsounds
#146907 - 06/07/04 01:02 PM Re: Join Free Compilation?  
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Adam Gentry Offline
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Adam Gentry  Offline
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Indiana, USA
Pete: I was just reading an article or two about similar matters. One pointed out how artists like Creed and POD included subtle Christian themes in their mainstream music. Might be an effective marketing niche... Thanks again.

ECA: I'll probably be looking into something more mainstream contemporary at first, but I'll keep you in mind in case I do anything in the gospel genre. Thanks.


------------------
====================
**Tunes by Gentry**
Original Christian and Classical Music
http://www.gentrytunes.com
(New low-carb version!)


====================
**GentryTunes! by Adam Gentry**
Original Christian and classical music
http://www.myspace.com/gentrytunes
#146908 - 06/07/04 01:13 PM Re: Join Free Compilation?  
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Adam Gentry Offline
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Adam Gentry  Offline
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Joined: Apr 2004
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Indiana, USA
Quote
<font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">Originally posted by roxhythe:
Are you taking for your CD only fully-produced whoopies from artists who've already made the investment in professionally-produced demos? If so, then I'm not playing in your league....

What would you do with someone like me? It seems like if anything I'd written were going to be on your CD, there'd need to be a fairly substantial investment made in a quality recording...
</font>


Joe/Roxhythe or people in a similar situation: On second thought, that's an interesting idea.. I have a friend who may be capable of putting together something like that. I doubt I'd be able to put up the money myself, though.. Maybe something like a bigger royalty cut for the producer would work out... Thoughts, folks?


------------------
====================
**Tunes by Gentry**
Original Christian and Classical Music
http://www.gentrytunes.com
(New low-carb version!)


====================
**GentryTunes! by Adam Gentry**
Original Christian and classical music
http://www.myspace.com/gentrytunes
#146909 - 06/07/04 02:21 PM Re: Join Free Compilation?  
Joined: Dec 2000
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Greg C. Brown Offline
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Greg C. Brown  Offline
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Joined: Dec 2000
Posts: 3,256
Suffolk, Virginia, USA
Hi Adam. I'm in a similar boat as Joe, except I play NO instrument at all, and my singing, well, ahem, let's not go there. [Linked Image]

But, I can easily pay $100 and have a very professionally-produced demo made. Would such a compilation CD as you describe be aimed at promoting the song itself (ie: getting exposure for the songwriter) or would it be geared more toward the performer (AND his/her song)?

If it would give me, as a writer only, an opportunity to have a song (or two) heard, then I'd definitley be interested. Thanks.

Greg


If you don't eat your meat, you can't have any pudding.
#146910 - 06/07/04 04:28 PM Re: Join Free Compilation?  
Joined: Apr 2004
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Adam Gentry Offline
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Adam Gentry  Offline
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Joined: Apr 2004
Posts: 70
Indiana, USA
Greg: Though I had initially thought of the project as one to promote artists' songs, your idea certainly has merit. If you joined I would be glad to include a link to your songwriting website, another artist(s) with your music, or whatever you prefer. Do you have samples of your work online?


------------------
====================
**Tunes by Gentry**
Original Christian and Classical Music
http://www.gentrytunes.com
(Aural spiffiness)


====================
**GentryTunes! by Adam Gentry**
Original Christian and classical music
http://www.myspace.com/gentrytunes
#146911 - 06/10/04 01:53 PM Re: Join Free Compilation?  
Joined: Apr 2004
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Adam Gentry Offline
Serious Contributor
Adam Gentry  Offline
Serious Contributor

Joined: Apr 2004
Posts: 70
Indiana, USA
ECA and others: On second thought, I shouldn't limit myself to one genre before I discover how much success I'll have in finding artists.. I'll keep you in mind, ECA, in case I get enough gospel singers interested to do an album.

I'm going to start searching now for any Christian indie artist (and perhaps ones with generally-uplifting music) interested in joining a compilation at no cost to them. I'd appreciate any suggestions from others, too; just email me. Thanks.


------------------
====================
**Tunes by Gentry**
Original Christian and Classical Music
http://www.gentrytunes.com
(Aural spiffiness)

[This message has been edited by Adam Gentry (edited 06-10-2004).]


====================
**GentryTunes! by Adam Gentry**
Original Christian and classical music
http://www.myspace.com/gentrytunes

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