JPF Home Page Forums General Messages General Message Forum So who has played with Udio?

Are you 5? "Jimmy called me a name first!!!!" That is a child's argument. Stop it, and going forward if people are attacking you, let me know. I am sick of ALL the bickering. In most cases, at least I know who these people are, you are still anonymous.

But this isn't new territory right? It isn't like you never gratuitously attacked someone right?

People (EVERYONE), if someone (anyone) is being attacked without provocation or just gratuitously, let me know. It is all a cancer. It runs everyone off to the point that we are today. Younger folks will not register because they do not like conflict. If they do, they aren't looking for it here. Go to X and get your frustrations out.

When someone comes to me who I know, who has contributed positively to the community (including financially to help keep the doors open) they get the benefit of the doubt and way more rope. If you are anonymous, or have used the site for sometimes DECADES and never helped out in any way, your rope is short. Hang yourself if you wish. I have banned 3 humans in our history. 26 years! I really hate it. But cancer sometimes has to be cut out.

In FD's defense, he can sometimes be positive with content etc. But this bickering isn't fun for anyone but apparently those involved. So just stop it already.

Any questions? And I don't care who "started" it. Everyone is at 0. Be a plus or minus going forward.

Brian

Brian

If Dom is here, there are going to be insults flying. To expect anything else is not reality.
This thread starts with me asking you a simple, polite and straightforward question.
And then Dom made it about him and started in on me.
His insults and bullsh*t are allowed to go on and on and on, so I just assume I'm going to be on my own to hand it back to Dom, which I can do.

Stop Dom and the site quiets down.
Let him stay and the sh*t stays.

I know there are people here that want to blame me for some of it, but other than Dom, I challenge anyone to present a post where I was not cordial and civil.

You and your admins clean it up or it doesnt clean up.
What you said about losing the benefit of good people such as Mike Z and the younger people is absolutely true.
But cleaning it up can only be done by the admins and you.

Martin

Not true your leaning on old pre conceptions to justify treating me like shite.

Your using this to get what you want , a forum that moves slowly to accommodate you.

Not everybody dislikes me, I've made some friends over the years on online forums

Fascinating.

I am a 71 year old male who never lost a passion for his guitars or writing songs.
I am working on a song at the moment. On the way back to the house tonight I stopped by a Brewery that am redesigning to discuss the song with a bartender/guitar player who is a lot better than me and going to add a solo and fills. Productive and pleasant.

That is who I am.

I come on this site, because it is one of the only places an avid hobbyist with my circumstance can post his stuff and interact...easily from my home computer. It is convenient and familiar.

That is also who I am.

The only problems arise when freaks come around and twist that all up, and the admins wont do anything about it.
I have 2 Honda motorcycles. I go to owner FB pages all the time. There is a lot of good info to be had. I have helped and been helped much. The sites are productive and beneficial. If a guy like you shows up...he's gone fast.

But not here.

Why does it matter to you who posts what?

Why do you want to determine what people can post?

Dom,
I see no point in going back and forth with you any longer.
Your world view is bizarre and your capacity for denial is bottomless.
And I don't want to be drawn into your cat box, for now.

I'll wait for Brian to respond. If he lets you stay and you launch on me when I post an opinion, and then start with the insults...I will look at it as I do now...as sport.

It's way more bizarre playing dictator. Can draw some assumptions from that.

Personally if somebody .wants to post a song using a dollar store recorder, I have no problem with it

Low fi can be interesting

But the idea is to have more traffic, which we've been getting

I'll take the bait one more time tonight.

That statement is fallacious.
If I were "dictator" you would be gone years back.

I accept the fact that nothing is my decision to make here, but if the admins are going to let you and your insults hang around...I'm gonna have some fun with it.
Stated another way...if they are going to allow you to make this site your personal internet cat box...the I'll go with that.

Rick Beato has an interesting take on AI music and Udio: rick beato on ai music

I watched it earlier and posted it in this thread, I think.
Beato has exceptional skill and mental clarity.

Dang! I checked the thread for this link and missed your HUGE youTube link! Oh well.

Rick beato is great, big fan.

I would love to present any of my work to him for review.

He knows good songs, it wouldn't change how the demo was made.im interested in songs

Once you have that you have ways to get it done, withiout songs ?

Lipstick on a pig

And I seriously doubt it's artistic reasons why u are against it.

I didn't realize it was you posting, haven't seen u here in ages.

Watching the video, his kids recognize it cause they know what it is

I too hear it in parts sounds robotic.

But I haven't heard anything that was completely ai generated music lyrics together that was great.

if you enter interesting lyrics it can give you interesting back, it can give shite too.

But there are just too many great human songs that kick this things arse.

Until I see it write hotel California by itself without any help, or human input, I'll side with us humans

I don't think it has capacity to understand the human condition.

But as a tool, give it a real human condition it can do a great job assisting you

AI is the genius product of human work.
Furthermore, AI will become genius in it's own right achieving an IQ of 200 and more per what I have read.
chatGPT is already astoundingly phenomenal and fast.

But AI is not assisting me in the creation of a song when I use it by putting in a few prompts or ever a full set of lyrics (poem).
I AM ASSISTING the power of AI in the endeavor. I am along for the ride. It's akin to sitting on a horse and saying "giddy-up."
I believe it is important to realize that.

Thanks for the answer.
I missed this last night when I came back in. Only saw the last page.

I havent created any complete Udio songs. People seem to be producing mp3s and then uploading those to SoundCloud, Click etc.
I'd like to see a separate section, because the AI songs are becoming prolific, to me a bit boring as a result, and they seem less "personal" than ones originated with a G/V. Additionally, I'm used to songwriters being able to play a musical instrument. Maybe that is my age and obsolesence.
Poem-Prompt-Click-Presto seems impersonal and it is flooding the one MP3 section that you have.

Nonetheless, I understand the practical concerns and if I am a minority of one, I understand that also.

Marty

It's based on the past. It will probably be more efficient at doing what us songwriters already do....bs on a forum... No, recycle previous stuff.

But it will force us all to up our game, but nothing to worry about for a while yet

Duly noted Dom.
With your response, should I consider the issue closed out here at JPF, or is it ok with you if I wait for Brian to answer.

Whatever you say is fine. I'm not trying to "dictate" here.

Do what you want, I'm not sure it will change the landscape. Songs are or were very rare here, exceedingly rare here last year or so.

Eyes will still travel to ai area.

I just donr think it's fair to somebody using ai to say... Ok they're not real, we are.

Just my lyrics alone being used injects a personality into it.

And I haven't started with music side of it yet.

And I'm still trying to figure out how to use it to make Dom recognizable as Dom.

That will come through performance style, production style , and pov

I played around with it , but I'd rather just play my guitar and come up with something , But they do have some good stuff . I'm sure later it will perfected . Not sure where that leaves session players . You really can't use it being a artist. I guess just a multitude of AI songs with feat. Whoever as the song writer.

You said its bad lyrics , which usually means they suck . They back story on this song , Diane had to plead for her to cut the song.

It probably leaves everything exactly as it was . There was already a gazillion songs in existence, which 1% were heard large scale.

Now they'll be 2 gazillion.

It will still come down to luck, marketing, being in right place right time.

No matter what or who you use to record.

Alot of songs are pure entertainment anyway.

Others dig deeper into what it means to be human.

I dont the the deer in headlights at a guitar shop leading kids to say " hey dad can you buy me that" is going anywhere.

My dad did it for me prolly thinking what a waste of money hell never play this thing in a week

40 years later here I am still playing,bringing, writing.

And YouTube is full of people playing real instruments, it's not going away


Look at this family racking up views on covers. I mean that's what it's all about. Nice that they dint allow comments, protect the kids from haters.

Covering Bruce here...

This question about a separate section for AI songs is not easy to answer. Initially, I was all for a separate section just because the MP3 section is currently being flooded by Udio songs that were generated within minutes by a computer without any creative involvement by the composer, musician or producer. Those songs happen randomly, kind of by accident.

I’m more a traditional guy and it takes me some 30-50 hours to write, record and mix a complex track. When I’m done, I proudly post it in the MP3 section and nowadays after 2-3 days 20 other AI generated songs are posted in the meantime and my track is so far down in the list that nobody sees it anymore. That’s a bit frustrating. With a dedicated AI section that wouldn’t happen anymore.

But what do you do with tracks, where AI was used as a tool, for example, a vocal generated by an AI model? It’s a lot of work to get a voice to sing not only your words but also your notes. If you add AI background vocals you can be super creative. This is also one facet of AI in the music production. In which section would a song with AI generated vocals have to go? I personally would leave that in the non-AI section because there is human creativity involved. But I have to admit, it’s very hard to draw a line here.

One of my favorite songs from 80s.

Even have the right weird tuning.

Seriously stfu dude.

Your not even a musician, we're trying to make peace here and your talking like your fackin Pete Townshend

Your only able to produce songs because you can cut and paste boxed music into a daw

Your decisions are limited to whatever acceptable boxed music you can find that sounds good enough to sing over.

I'ma musician and a singer writer, I can do everything you do only much better.

Just stop already, be in the group

I says the verse was bad, the hook was great

This is bad enough that probably anybody on this site could have written it.

Don't leave me in all this pain
Don't leave me out in the rain
Come back and bring back my smile
Come and take these tears away
I need your arms to hold me now
The nights are so unkind
Bring back those nights when I held you beside me

Brian,

Dom is broke and not fixable.
This diatribe is directed at one of the most cordial personalities here and a good songwriter with some actual music business experience.
This comes on the morning immediately after your intervention.
It is your site and your call to make.

But if Dom is here. This is what happens...and it ramps up from here.

Brian,
You wrote above that if someone (anyone) is being attacked without provocation or just gratuitously, let me know.
Here is a great example. This is not fun. Getting responses like this makes me ask myself why I’m posting stuff here at this site in the first place.

Fdemetrio wrote:
Your not even a musician, we're trying to make peace here and your talking like your fackin Pete Townshend
Your only able to produce songs because you can cut and paste boxed music into a daw
Your decisions are limited to whatever acceptable boxed music you can find that sounds good enough to sing over.
I'ma musician and a singer writer, I can do everything you do only much better.
Just stop already, be in the group

This guy is not sticking to your comment guidelines: Do post respectful and insightful comments. Don't flame, hate, spam.

Right , lets tell Diane Warren that . its not just the lyric , its the melody and production , of course its Toni singing it . I highly doubt AI could get it done , at least for now. There is a whole movie on her, she basically has to beg artists to cut her songs : (Drama City )

Of course it's more than the lyric, it doesn't hurt to have world class session players, singers, and arrangers and engineers and producers ..I said the same thing.

The topic started saying unbreak my heart was a great song. It's a great lyrical hook

It's not great writing in general, but probably doesn't need to be

Production is not writing though

Because instead of trying to be cordial, your going back to "I'm superior the way I do it*

Your no different to someone using ai for a song, your not writing any of that music.

Somebody says..." That piano is great"

First of all it's not, secondly you had nothing to do with that piano .

You keep insisting that your superior cause you allegedly write your own songs.

Your songs are not good regardless.

You've dumped on me too long, I'm not taking flap from hacks

Production is not writing though ? Sure it is , its all part of a package . that's why it made millions . Not great writing ? I guess its a matter of opinion.
But the subject is AI . I don't think AI could beat that song .

UN-Break My Heart,
gets my personal nomination for the most exquisite popular song ever made. I'm not alone in that.
It is musically gorgeous, wrought with convincing emotion, dignified and mature sounding, nuanced beyond belief, and all of it's part pull together into one monolithic but multidimensional whole.
No part of it, is not an excellent addition to the whole.

So, you can believe your lying ears and what you read here....
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Un-Break_My_Heart

or you can believe some UDIO prompter on a website of hobbyists. Choice is yours.

A song is lyric and melody, everything else is interpretation

Ok if ai songs go to new spot nobody will post there, beyond Carrol

It never stops so I'm not dealing with it

Ai is the hot topic now,though, in music generating. Thanks for starting this thread Brian Whitney.

I'm really curious to hear someone use Udio to produce their own music and lyric.

Now we see how Udio and others making some money....by adding these extra hard to ignore features and charging for it.

I don't think current musicians will suffer. They are the ones that will have an inside track.

Bill

The lyrical sentiment is undeniably cheesy: asking a lover to un-break one's heart and take back tears is a bit too sappy for my taste. That said, heartbreak is agonizing, and one could easily make declarations this cheesy whilst in the throes of immediate romantic dejection. The arrangement is sensuous and well-executed, with the acoustic guitar picking and Spanish guitar stylings working to the song's advantage. The chorus has a nice melodic arc, and it's properly set up. The biggest issue, once again, is the performance. Braxton's habit of cutting off her phrases and failing to use her vowels effectively does grate on my nerves. Her alto has some nice resonance, but her ability to simultaneously over-perform and under-perform makes the song an ineffective delivery for her talent. There are too many improvisatory gestures for the piece to be called minimalist, too few moments of improvisation to be properly performative. While by no means a bad song, "Un-Break My Heart" fails to live up to its potential.

3.0 thought it was the best song ever?

https://rateyourmusic.com/release/single/toni-braxton/un-break-my-heart/

I cut out most of the silliness and kept the gist.

So this...is the real truth about UNBREAK MY HEART according to ? Dom? Bugsey? Who?

This is getting so ridiculous, it's cringey.

You don't know everything, never did still don't , you were so sure everyone should agree this was a great song.

The forum can go back to one mp3 a month

Diane Warren is an American songwriter who has a net worth of $100 million. I wish I sucked like Diane and Toni .
I should be practicing, But they chime in .


https://americansongwriter.com/what-do-songwriters-think-of-a-i-music-we-asked-and-they-answered/

Diane Warren writes to a market, she's successful.

Doesn't mean she's incapable of writing weak verses.

Good article Elvis...thanks for finding it and posting.

I've finally hit a stopping point.
As much as the mischievous Marty enjoys helping Dom paint himself into a corner and taping his own self contradictory words to his forehead...

If the following is going to be allowed to go on and on and on and on and on and on....and not stopped?


And the following level of oblivion, ridiculousness and inanity has become the typical discourse on this site, because of Dom's ubiquitousness and omnipresense here?


Then...if I continue to stay, essentially I become the inanity also.

A few months ago some text here was so "radioactive" that I withdrew and stayed gone because I wasnt going to be on a site where it was occurring.
I was contacted by an admin and asked why I wasnt around. The issue appeared to get fixed, I returned.

Dom is not that serious a concern. He is just a troll/ghoul. Dom is insults and pointless stupidity and the site has allowed him to make it JustPlainDom. But as Dom stated, he cant continue to carry this site on his back. (priceless)

So...Dom has outlasted me here, and I am self exiling.
I may put up a song when I finish it and let people say what they want about it, but other than that...

If Brian and his admins ever purge Dom, I'll return unless the site has devolved into Trump, Jesus and Alex Jones ranting as the election approaches. But I suspect that Dom will be around for as long as he likes. There seems to be some belief that "controversial threads" drive interest even if the threads are ultimately inane and destructive to the site. Maybe those people are wiser than I. But I doubt it.

Consider me exiled.

And whether we shall meet again I know not.
Therefore our everlasting farewell take:
For ever, and for ever, farewell,!
If we do meet again, why, we shall smile;
If not, why then, this parting was well made

Marty

A wise decision. I think I'll join you.

All the best
Robert

All the best to you as well Rob.
If you find a site where songs can be put put up and discussed in a friendly and cordial atmosphere without the pointless stupidity and trolling...pm me with the URL here. I'll check it every so often.

Marty

Right every song I posted was shite on by you both, nobody believes your whines, they see.. nobody cares

I can leave the site, i have great music to work on, you trolls don't.

That's why you need each other.

Marty, donated money here so he thinks that will buy him the right to treat people however he wishes, and recruit others to do same

How much did he donate?, I'll l match it, he stinks anyway

Well back on topic . Spotify with millions behind them , might fill it with AI songs . I don't see all the hoop-la on AI songs , if you cant walk in a bar and play guitar and sing it , its not really your song . but I guess it can be used for ideas .

Yeah I imagine it will be a new tool for the 5 % of artists in the real game , Hard to say on $'s to get mind blowing melodies . Not for 5 bucks a month or whatever they are charging . That is funny though Toni can't sing and Diane is a hack , That song is so great , it hurts to listen to it . I'm sure AI will be a big deal and huge AI stars. Racking up the $$$$$.

Yawn.

Remember, everyone started a 0. Most have violated the very concerns they said they had with FD. It truly is like little children in 7th grade.

There are a couple of people who have refrained from the bickering. The AI discussion is deep and interesting and all smart sides have valid concerns and also see promising opportunities.

If you use computers in ANY way to make music, you have no rational argument against A.I, (For the record, A.I. is a lie. It does not exist and it really isn't even close. All of it is human programming. At best it can take high end human created solutions and make them available to the masses. Believe me, high end artists are ALL using technology. Once you go beyond hitting two rocks together you are ALSO using human made technology.

The funny thing (it it really is hilarious and hypocritical) is that some people decide they want to pick the moment of technology to STOP IT FOREVER because only THEIR technology has merit. The new stuff does not. Well, kids are laughing at you and making incredible stuff with the tools of THEIR youth, just like you all did. Guess what? In 50 years, those kids will want to STOP new tech because THEY are the REAL artists and the new stuff is lame. Ande so it goes and always will.

I lived through the days of Synths and Samplers that were going to END MUSIC! Same with Midi and digital keyboards. Only music played on PIANO was real, the rest was lame and invalid.

I am 100% for ALL new tech that raises the floor on music production for EVERYONE, not just rich corporations and rich musicians who an hire session players and arrangers and engineers and producers and visual arts experts and marketing teams etc. Now ANYONE has access to all of it. Guess what? Much of the music on radio will be A.I. in 5 years. But it will still be the smartest, most clever people who will find a path to success, just like it always has been. But better, all artists will become immortal! Their voices, their playing style, their ideas, every song idea they come up with will be fully produced, acting as a force multiplier X100,000 or more so that your artistic output will never be bad sounding (except when you WANT it to) and your family will be able to hear music in the style of Grandpa or Grandma forever. It will be like a living archive and production machine for their enjoyment, or if the person was talented enough, for the WORLD to enjoy.

The band Kiss is being converted to A.I. as we speak. Their entire archive, visual, live performance, live playing and styles and songwriting is being fed into the machine to make new Kiss music forever! I am all for that. I can't wait for the Beatles to sign such a deal so we can get new Beatles material. And new tools will allow each of us to become the fifth Beatle and co-write, perform with, and make new content together. It is ALL going to happen and more.

And it will happen regardless of what people on a message board think of it. Just like wagon makers decried automobiles for putting them into the dustbin of history.

I am only said these tools were not ready for my youth. But I am excited for my Granddaughter who is just starting piano lessons. If I can live a few more years, I may be able to put my writing and music into the system so she can write songs with me if she wants. My father was a big band drummer, but was gone before I ever got to play with him. These losses will be a thing of the past in the future.

I welcome opposing viewpoints, but keep the 7th grade attacks to yourself. I carry a big stick if I ever have to use it.