Who's Online Now
14 registered members (couchgrouch, MFB III, JAPOV, niteshift, Scott Campbell, Gavin Sinclair, CTthomas, 3 invisible), and 319 guests, and
Key: Admin, Global Mod, Mod
Shout Box
Member Spotlight
David Snyder
David Snyder
North Carolina
Posts: 219
Joined: November 2017
Show All Member Profiles 
What's Going On
:So Much Left To Do."
by MFB III. 05/05/21 10:15 PM
by summeoyo. 05/05/21 07:57 PM
Some interesting math...
by JAPOV. 05/05/21 07:24 PM
What I did during the pandemic
by VNORTH2. 05/05/21 02:27 PM
i'm not over you
by ckiphen. 05/05/21 01:29 PM
Cold as cold can be
by ckiphen. 05/05/21 01:17 PM
"Home" lyrics
by Val Davis. 05/05/21 10:38 AM
One Song at a Time
by couchgrouch. 05/04/21 07:39 PM
A Heart That's True
by beechnut79. 05/04/21 12:18 PM
Desire to Connect
by beechnut79. 05/04/21 12:16 PM
The chamelon/ Hiding in plain sight
by beechnut79. 05/04/21 12:12 PM
Romance, Candlelight and Daydreaming
by beechnut79. 05/04/21 12:01 PM
Covid in Fiji - An update
by niteshift. 05/03/21 07:42 PM
That Vicious Circle.
by MFB III. 05/02/21 05:48 PM
Jim Colyer, Former Member
by Travis david. 05/02/21 01:37 PM
My birthday today - please help?
by Everett Adams. 05/02/21 06:12 AM
Submssions Wanted for "Pretty Flamingo"
by JAPOV. 05/01/21 07:46 PM
"Sultry Eyes."
by MFB III. 04/30/21 10:53 AM
Unfinished but promising
by Alek. 04/30/21 05:34 AM
"My Radio Man"
by Raymond Byabazaire. 04/30/21 03:33 AM
Latest tune "Home" would love feedback
by Val Davis. 04/29/21 05:07 PM
I'll Be Gone
by beechnut79. 04/29/21 03:03 PM
The wolfs on the loose
by beechnut79. 04/29/21 03:02 PM
The Sooner, The Better
by beechnut79. 04/29/21 02:59 PM
Rocking the headboard/ revised
by beechnut79. 04/29/21 02:58 PM
Ande's Lyric Writing Tips
by beechnut79. 04/29/21 02:55 PM
Control of Life
by beechnut79. 04/29/21 02:50 PM
Just Tracing Circles.
by MFB III. 04/28/21 02:17 PM
Dirty Business of Songwriting
by Everett Adams. 04/28/21 06:49 AM
by CTthomas. 04/28/21 02:57 AM
Top Posters(All Time)
Calvin 19,839
Travis david 12,137
Kevin Emmrich 10,938
Jean Bullock 10,330
Kaley Willow 10,240
Two Singers 9,649
Joice Marie 9,186
Mackie H. 8,944
glynda 8,683
Mike Dunbar 8,574
Tricia Baker 8,318
couchgrouch 7,975
Colin Ward 7,909
Corey 7,357
Vicarn 6,763
Mark Kaufman 6,588
Wyman Lloyd 6,578
ben willis 6,111
niteshift 5,789
Lynn Orloff 5,788
Louis 5,725
Linda Sings 5,608
KimberlyinNC 5,210
Neil Cotton 4,909
Derek Hines 4,893
DonnaMarilyn 4,666
Blake Hill 4,528
Bob Cushing 4,389
Roy Cooper 4,262
Bill Osofsky 4,199
Tom Shea 4,179
Cindy Miller 4,178
TamsNumber4 4,130
nightengale 4,096
MFB III 3,942
Caroline 3,865
Kolstad 3,822
beechnut79 3,758
Dan Sullivan 3,710
E Swartz 3,656
Fdemetrio 3,626
Dottie 3,427
joewatt 3,411
Bill Cooper 3,279
John Hoffman 3,199
Sunset Poet 3,179
Skip Johnson 3,027
Pam Hurley 3,007
Terry G 3,005
PopTodd 2,890
Harriet Ames 2,870
Nigel Quin 2,865
MidniteBob 2,760
Nelson 2,616
Tom Tracy 2,558
Polly Hager 2,526
Jerry Jakala 2,524
Al Alvarez 2,499
Eric Thome 2,448
Hummingbird 2,401
Stan Loh 2,263
Sam Wilson 2,242
Judy Hollier 2,232
Wendy D 2,226
Erica Ellis 2,202
TrumanCoyote 2,096
Marty Helly 2,034
maccharles 2,000
DukeWill 1,988
floyd jane 1,985
Clint Anglin 1,904
cindyrella 1,888
David Wright 1,866
Clairejeanne 1,851
Cindy LaRosa 1,824
Ronald Boyt 1,675
Iggy 1,652
Noel Downs 1,633
Rick Heenan 1,608
Cal 1,574
Jack Swain 1,554
GocartMoz 1,552
Pete Larsen 1,537
Ann Tygart 1,529
Tom Breshers 1,487
RogerS 1,473
Tom Franz 1,473
Chuck Crowe 1,441
Ralph Blight 1,440
Rick Norton 1,429
Kenneth Cade 1,429
bholt 1,411
Letha Allen 1,408
in2piano 1,404
Stan Simons 1,402
mattbanx 1,384
Jen Shaner 1,373
Deej56 1,372
Charlie Wong 1,347
JAPOV 1,336
KevinP 1,324
Vondelle 1,316
Tom W. 1,313
Jan Petter 1,301
scottandrew 1,294
DakLander 1,265
Gerry 1,265
lane1777 1,254
PeteG 1,242
Ian Ferrin 1,235
Glen King 1,214
IdeaGuy 1,209
AaronAuthier 1,177
summeoyo 1,174
Diane Ewing 1,158
IronKnee 1,087
joro 1,082
BobbyJoe 1,075
S.DEE 1,040
yann 1,037
Tony A 1,016
9ne 1,015
argo 986
peaden 984
90 dB 964
Wolvman 960
Jak Kelly 912
krtinberg 890
Drifter 886
Petra 883
RJC 845
Brenda152 840
Nadia 829
Juan 797
ant 786
TKO 784
Dayson 781
frahmes 781
teletwang 762
Andy K 747
ckiphen 744
Andy Kemp 741
tbryson 737
Jackie444 731
3daveyO3 704
Dixie 701
Joy Boy 695
Irwin 687
Knute 686
Lee Arten 678
Moosesong 668
Pat Hardy 667
Katziis 652
quality 637
CG King 622
douglas 621
Mel 614
R&M 605
NaomiSue 601
Shandy 589
Ria 587
TAMERA64 583
qbaum 570
nitepiano 566
Tink2 553
musica 539
deanbell 528
RobertK 527
BonzaiWag 523
Roderic 522
BB Wilbur 512
goodfolks 499
Zeek 487
Stu 486
Steve P. 481
KathyW 462
allenb 459
MaxG 458
Philjo 454
fanito 448
trush48 448
dmk 442
arealrush 437
DGR 436
avweek 435
Stephen D 433
Emmy 431
Rob L 426
marquez 422
kit 419
Softkrome 417
kyrksongs 415
RRon 408
Laura G. 407
Debra 407
eb 406
cuebald 399
EdPerrone 399
Dannyk1 395
Hobart 395
Davyboy49 393
Smile 389
GJShades 387
Ezt 384
tone 380
Marla 380
Cecilee 379
iggyiggy 378
coalminer 377
java 374
spidey 371
sweetsong 370
Alek 369
danny 367
Jim Ryan 360
papaG 353
Z - man 350
JamesDF5 348
John K 348
Jaden 344
ddreuter 341
TheBaz 340
Steggy 339
leif 339
tonedeaf 336
rickwork 334
Eddie Ray 332
Johnboy 328
Bob Lever 328
Helicon1 327
lucian 326
Muskie 321
kc 319
Z. Mulls 318
ptondreau 313
Chris B. 310
trush 304
ed323 297
Ellen M 294
markus-ky 292
lizzorn 291
nicnac49 290
pomeranj 289
Char 286
ktunes 285
mastrose 280
pammie 279
pd 277
Previous Thread
Next Thread
Print Thread
Rate This Thread
#1166731 - 07/17/20 11:57 AM Early recording mistakes...REVERB, REVERB, REVERB  
Joined: Sep 2007
Posts: 767
Steve Altonian Offline
Top 500 Poster
Steve Altonian  Offline
Top 500 Poster

Joined: Sep 2007
Posts: 767
Los Angeles, California
Every now & then I like to go back to early releases & see where I really was at musically at the time....I self-produced some releases, brought in different levels of producers on others, & each release was a stepping stone to getting to the next level...

So I just found my 1996 Cassette tape "You Are The Reason"...As I was given a car with a cassette deck in it. So I unwrapped a brand new cassette tape never opened

This was my "Flagship" release & I was sooooooooooooo proud of it...I was gonna be discovered.......

Washed in soooooooooo much reverb...

What was I thinking?

What's your story?

Steve Altonian---"I'll just do my best & let God do the rest"

#1166735 - 07/17/20 12:57 PM Re: Early recording mistakes...REVERB, REVERB, REVERB [Re: Steve Altonian]  
Joined: Nov 2010
Posts: 6,763
Vicarn Offline
Top 40 Poster
Vicarn  Offline
Top 40 Poster

Joined: Nov 2010
Posts: 6,763
I think everyone makes those mistakes to start.
Maybe a lack of confidence with a vocal or just because it's there so has to be used.
I heard one producer say once, "Put very little reverb on so that you can only just hear it and then take off a bit more".

I tend to use delay or slap back more than reverb on vocals.

It's never too late? Yes it is, so do it now.

If, given time, a monkey can write the complete works of Shakespeare maybe there's hope for me.




#1166736 - 07/17/20 01:05 PM Re: Early recording mistakes...REVERB, REVERB, REVERB [Re: Steve Altonian]  
Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 7,831
Dave Rice (D) Offline
Top 30 Poster
Dave Rice (D)  Offline
Top 30 Poster

Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 7,831
Hi Steve:

I spend most of my time these days (between chores) listening to early songs in my catalog... and re-recording them. Usually several times until I get something I'm not completely ashamed to release.

Funny how we begin to recognize our work that was downright awful, fairly good... or even close to being fit for human ears to hear.

I made the transition from tape to digital many moons ago and it is so much easier to get a recording completed that way.

All the best, ----Dave

#1166737 - 07/17/20 01:14 PM Re: Early recording mistakes...REVERB, REVERB, REVERB [Re: Steve Altonian]  
Joined: Oct 2017
Posts: 3,626
Fdemetrio Offline
Top 100 Poster
Fdemetrio  Offline
Top 100 Poster

Joined: Oct 2017
Posts: 3,626
Reverb is very tricky. I find I lose some of the quality of the vocal when I use reverb, even a small bit.

I also think when the rest of the mix is colorful the dry vocal sounds like it's somewhere else.

I'm not a big fan of reverb, but i will say that if the engineer knows what they doing it can make a world of difference.

The quality of the reverb unit makes a difference too. some pro studios have lexicon reverb units that cost 10k, others that come with your daw aren't very good.

A lot of people mistake reverb as being a way to make a bad vocal sound better. I find it to be the opposite. Who wants to hear a bad vocal bouncing around creating more noise?

Last edited by Fdemetrio; 07/17/20 01:18 PM.
#1166743 - 07/17/20 05:56 PM Re: Early recording mistakes...REVERB, REVERB, REVERB [Re: Steve Altonian]  
Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 3,179
Sunset Poet Online content
Top 100 Poster
Sunset Poet  Online Content
Top 100 Poster

Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 3,179
Houston, Texas
I am redoing a song that I wrote years ago. I did it in a studio with musicians but never really liked the way that it came out. The recording was okay.
But I enjoy playing and singing the song a lot.

So I am redoing it using a combination of BIAB and EZKEYS. So far I am delighted with what you can do with those programs.

The point?

For a modest investment you can go back into your history and take songs that you'd like another shot at and have some powerful tools to re-do them...all by your lonesome. I suggest it with enthusiasm. You've got really good tonal sensibilities Steve. You could do a lot with programs by BIAB (PGmusic) and TOONTRACKS.


#1166861 - 07/20/20 06:55 AM Re: Early recording mistakes...REVERB, REVERB, REVERB [Re: Steve Altonian]  
Joined: Aug 2002
Posts: 1,174
summeoyo Online content
Top 500 Poster
summeoyo  Online Content
Top 500 Poster

Joined: Aug 2002
Posts: 1,174
Harrisburg, PA, USA
Ditto on Martin's suggestion. I started in the music business as a songwriter only - and wrote songs for other artists and bands. Now that I perform, I find myself digging up songs that attracted interest from the industry and rearranging them for my musical style. It's been fun. Why toss a great song just because you couldn't get a recording by someone else? I've received many compliments for such songs that I rearranged.


#1166863 - 07/20/20 10:09 AM Re: Early recording mistakes...REVERB, REVERB, REVERB [Re: Steve Altonian]  
Joined: Dec 2008
Posts: 9,802
John Lawrence Schick Offline
John Lawrence Schick  Offline

Top 20 Poster

Joined: Dec 2008
Posts: 9,802
Try using a slight delay in the vocal instead of reverb. Has the same effect without losing sound quality. I find faster vocals get washed-out easier than slow vocals with reverb.

John smile

#1166879 - 07/21/20 06:31 AM Re: Early recording mistakes...REVERB, REVERB, REVERB [Re: Steve Altonian]  
Joined: Dec 2008
Posts: 3,822
Kolstad Offline
Top 100 Poster
Kolstad  Offline
Top 100 Poster

Joined: Dec 2008
Posts: 3,822
Yeah, reverb in the 80s doesnt age well. I wonder if the same will happen now, when reverb is back and recordings swim in it. There is a difference as reverb now is in a lot higher resolution, and the mixing is better, so I wonder how todays music with reverb will be viewed in a couple decades time?

#1166886 - 07/21/20 11:44 AM Re: Early recording mistakes...REVERB, REVERB, REVERB [Re: Steve Altonian]  
Joined: Nov 2011
Posts: 3,656
E Swartz Offline
E Swartz  Offline

Top 100 Poster

Joined: Nov 2011
Posts: 3,656
Reverb on vocals should be treated different than with instruments IMO. The song's vibe will have some effect on how much or what type used, but I agree about it being over-used with most amateur recordings on lead vocals especially. But man if you need to move the BG vocals back or a sax or guitar, reverb is essential. Contrarily, I do hear some amateur recordings where the lead vox sits so much in front that it needs some reverb to glue it better to the mix. (I consider myself) an amateur as well Steve, and that's why I do sometimes enjoy going back and improving old mixes where effect balances need tweaked. But I also appreciate stronger reverb when it works well with the vibe--example Hollies used a lot of reverb and delays. One area I know I need improvement on with my mixing is better balance with depth : front. L : R I feel pretty good about, but using a combination of volume/compression/reverb for depth is more challenging when the song has several instrument or harmony tracks.

John S -- Don't see you as much in the "shout box" these days--don't let those Island rascals push you out!

#1166892 - 07/21/20 03:51 PM Re: Early recording mistakes...REVERB, REVERB, REVERB [Re: Steve Altonian]  
Joined: May 2001
Posts: 2,865
Nigel Quin Offline
Nigel Quin  Offline

Top 100 Poster

Joined: May 2001
Posts: 2,865
Birmingham, UK
I look back on my old recordings with a range of views, from 'that was actually quite good' to 'what on earth was I thinking?' I've always said that I learn something with every mix, and that is still true for me.

I would never be too harsh on old recordings, just put it down to experience, or possibly the fashion at the time.

With regards to reverb in particular, yes I have overused it in the past but have learned that it will never fix a poor mix, however if used wisely it can sprinkle a little bit of magic dust on a good one smile

Support Just Plain Folks

We would like to keep the membership in Just Plain Folks FREE! Your donation helps support the many programs we offer including Road Trips and the Music Awards.

Newest Members
lesleedp, totalctrl, fowler47, Entegrity_Oneal, luc
21333 Registered Users
Forum Statistics
Average Posts Daily25
Most Online37,523
Jan 25th, 2020
Just Plain Quotes
"Do not endeavor to be the smartest kid in a dumb class. Instead, you are better off being the dumbest kid in the smartest class, where you will be challenged and you will learn. If you aren't growing, you are dying." -Brian Austin Whitney
Today's Birthdays
chris nickey (57), Jim S (69)
Popular Topics(Views)
Powered by UBB.threads™ PHP Forum Software 7.6.0