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#1161907 - 02/26/20 12:28 PM Someone needs to do Demos...  
Joined: Oct 2017
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Fdemetrio Offline
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Fdemetrio  Offline
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Just learnt that Mike is no longer doing that, and it was a great bargain for people who cant record or dont have a vision for their song beyond the basics.

He helped alot of people take songs from bare knuckles into something decent. Although I was critical of the overall usefullness of BIAB, he sure helped make some winners out of clay.

Who will be the next Mike? If people dont have a way to record their songs they will lose interest.

Any other BIAB experts? people needing a few bucks on the side?

#1161928 - 02/27/20 07:41 AM Re: Someone needs to do Demos... [Re: Fdemetrio]  
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Everett Adams Online content
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I used Michael's service and was quite happy with it. I'm one of those that can write but my singing and playing ability is limited to say the least. I can put the song down enough to get the melody across and leave it to someone that are blest with more musical and vocal skills than I have. The demo studios I've checked on have increased their prices beyond my price range so I think I'll bow out of doing demos all together. I have about 600 plus songs demoed, still have three times that many without demos, but at my age I'll never make back what I've invested unless a miracle happens and I get a hit, but I'm not holding my breath, especially the way the music industry is today.

#1161931 - 02/27/20 08:13 AM Re: Someone needs to do Demos... [Re: Fdemetrio]  
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Originally Posted by Fdemetrio
Just learnt that Mike is no longer doing that, and it was a great bargain for people who cant record or dont have a vision for their song beyond the basics.

He helped alot of people take songs from bare knuckles into something decent. Although I was critical of the overall usefullness of BIAB, he sure helped make some winners out of clay.

Who will be the next Mike? If people dont have a way to record their songs they will lose interest.

Any other BIAB experts? people needing a few bucks on the side?


Found this gig on fiverr. He does music for songs but without vocals as far as I can see.... £40.59 for 3 mins plus fiverr commission.

https://www.fiverr.com/the_vicken/c...is_pro=false&context_alg=text_to_gig

I haven't used him but his pricing seems worth a go and there are loads of tracks on fiverr that he has done to listen to. Maybe he will mix in the vocals as well.. who knows

He also has a soundcloud page to listen to.

https://soundcloud.com/vicken-jimenez

Be your own judge

God Bless

Roy


'You Have To Kiss A Lot Of Frogs To Find A Prince'

Our Record Label
#1161933 - 02/27/20 10:15 AM Re: Someone needs to do Demos... [Re: Fdemetrio]  
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Gavin Sinclair Offline
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I miss seeing Mike around here. He is one of the most incisive and helpful commenters, very generous with his knowledge and experience. I think I got more solid, actionable advice from him than anyone, and always cheerfully delivered.

#1161934 - 02/27/20 10:17 AM Re: Someone needs to do Demos... [Re: Roy Cooper]  
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Fdemetrio Offline
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Originally Posted by Roy Cooper
Originally Posted by Fdemetrio
Just learnt that Mike is no longer doing that, and it was a great bargain for people who cant record or dont have a vision for their song beyond the basics.

He helped alot of people take songs from bare knuckles into something decent. Although I was critical of the overall usefullness of BIAB, he sure helped make some winners out of clay.

Who will be the next Mike? If people dont have a way to record their songs they will lose interest.

Any other BIAB experts? people needing a few bucks on the side?


Found this gig on fiverr. He does music for songs but without vocals as far as I can see.... £40.59 for 3 mins plus fiverr commission.

https://www.fiverr.com/the_vicken/c...is_pro=false&context_alg=text_to_gig

I haven't used him but his pricing seems worth a go and there are loads of tracks on fiverr that he has done to listen to. Maybe he will mix in the vocals as well.. who knows

He also has a soundcloud page to listen to.

https://soundcloud.com/vicken-jimenez

Be your own judge

God Bless

Roy


I dont need a demo guy, my songs are for me to record, but I also have at least 100 or so songs that I wouldnt record myself...I sent myself a rejection letter! Some songs are just creative exercises and not something I get behind. I have alot of those lying around and would be fun to see what somebody does.

The important part for especially lyric only people is that its affordable. They will stop visiting here if they dont have demos to share.



Last edited by Fdemetrio; 02/27/20 10:19 AM.
#1161958 - 02/27/20 09:01 PM Re: Someone needs to do Demos... [Re: Fdemetrio]  
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couchgrouch Online content
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what happened to Mike?


Nashville demos etc:

https://www.soundclick.com/bands3/default.cfm?bandID=431939

other demos:

https://soundcloud.com/wabash-cannibal

Amazon Kindle books by Robert George you may enjoy:

1) Americana

2) Teenage Graceland

3) The Will to Be

4) Fort Mystery

5) Wheel Sea

6) My One True Love
#1161970 - 02/28/20 02:47 PM Re: Someone needs to do Demos... [Re: Fdemetrio]  
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lane1777 Offline
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I think Mike moved on Couch. He really was the go to guy here. He finished some songs for me, they would never have amounted to much of anything without His work. He will be missed. Lane



"Blessed are the words of truth and fiction,
one might save you from the other...Vincent
#1161973 - 02/28/20 07:11 PM Re: Someone needs to do Demos... [Re: Fdemetrio]  
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couchgrouch Online content
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Ahh, ok. Well, I wish him the best. He was a fantastic producer. Nurse Yes, Gone with the Ghost of the Sun, Fade to Blonde and Strange Apparitions among others would have suffered greatly without, not only.his talent, but his vast knowledge of musical styles.

I was concerned he was ill. Vaya Con Rios, Mike... smile


Nashville demos etc:

https://www.soundclick.com/bands3/default.cfm?bandID=431939

other demos:

https://soundcloud.com/wabash-cannibal

Amazon Kindle books by Robert George you may enjoy:

1) Americana

2) Teenage Graceland

3) The Will to Be

4) Fort Mystery

5) Wheel Sea

6) My One True Love
#1162022 - 03/01/20 11:30 PM Re: Someone needs to do Demos... [Re: Fdemetrio]  
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Hi, all:

Mike was an amazing talent . . . Iím happy for him that heís moved on to better things, but heíll be missed here. Heís one of the many people who graciously welcomed me to JPF when I first joined. My best to you, Mike . . . Know that youíve done so much for so many who love music, with dreams of hearing their words put to song.

On the broader question, I donít think there will be a next Mike. From a pure business perspective, I would guess that the amount of time it takes to ďproduceĒ a song (in BIAB, for example) relative to the fees that one may be able to charge for those efforts is not commensurate. Iím a novice to BIAB, but I can tell you regardless I spend at least 20 hours working on a song until Iím comfortable enough to make it public . . . and even then, itís flawed. Experts are very likely to be far more efficient than I, but itís still a ton of work.

I donít know what Mike charged for his services, but I would hazard to guess far less than what it might cost for a demo . .. and I would also guess, relatively speaking, far less than value Mike delivered.

It would be wonderful thing to have another Milke Zaneski on the board . . , just not sure weíll see the likes of his talent and support again.

My thoughts for what they are worth.

Regards,

Deej

#1162030 - 03/02/20 12:20 PM Re: Someone needs to do Demos... [Re: Fdemetrio]  
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Gavin Sinclair Offline
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Totally agree Deej. There's much more to Mike than just knowing his way around BIAB. That's really only one tool towards producing a great track. He clearly knows his stuff when it comes to musical theory and production, not to mention a natural talent that some folks just have. Whatever he's up to these days, I'm sure he'll make a success of it.

#1162031 - 03/02/20 12:30 PM Re: Someone needs to do Demos... [Re: Fdemetrio]  
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Fdemetrio Offline
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Oh there's no doubt that the reward does not equal the time invested, unless you have nothing else to do. People dont realize how much work is involved

Mikes voice and harmonies helped make the songs better and available to people who dont sing.

It's still BIAB no matter how you look at it, BIAB is playing all the isntruments. Some folks are not even able to get an acoustic guitar demo fo their songs cause they dont play.

Using BIAB to generate a basic acoustic strum pattern and sing over it, is still light years of somebody playing an out of tune guitar who cant play it and cant sing, and does not know how basic chord progressions work.

There could be a next Mike, we're not here to make a competition out of it, where here to help people realize a song they wrote.

Not sure why Mike is not able to come to the forum suddenly, that is what is happening with all the rest of people who dont come here any more

Im getting bored myself. Stop making it a eulogy to Mike, we all wish him well, but we were just talking about how the site was going under and losing members, well there ya go

Last edited by Fdemetrio; 03/02/20 12:31 PM.
#1162034 - 03/02/20 04:18 PM Re: Someone needs to do Demos... [Re: Fdemetrio]  
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lane1777 Offline
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your just trolling for a fight...



"Blessed are the words of truth and fiction,
one might save you from the other...Vincent
#1162035 - 03/02/20 06:05 PM Re: Someone needs to do Demos... [Re: lane1777]  
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Fdemetrio Offline
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Originally Posted by lane1777


your just trolling for a fight...


No im not, I told Brian people come here when there is something in it for them. No more demos, no reason to come....

Why does it mean Mike has gone from the site, simply because he's not doing demos?

And other people get decent results with biab, lyric only people would be delighted.

Their Forum for song demos is always full and new people posting all the time. Why? Because people have a chance to be heard https://www.pgmusic.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=postlist&Board=50&page=1

BTW, I see Floyd hangs out there now

Last edited by Fdemetrio; 03/02/20 06:17 PM.
#1162038 - 03/03/20 08:26 AM Re: Someone needs to do Demos... [Re: Fdemetrio]  
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Posted this on the other thread as well :

I'm not a professional musician, but if you like what you hear on these, message me and I may be able to do demos for you. I played all the instruments here, sometimes with live drums, sometimes with drum machines :

https://open.spotify.com/album/5AgxPZyxVlVWJhooJVIE3t

https://open.spotify.com/album/75xxr9bOsMf4hFxANVJfz7

https://www.facebook.com/bratcavedorkestra/

#1177333 - 06/05/21 05:54 PM Re: Someone needs to do Demos... [Re: Fdemetrio]  
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I produced a song called "spring break ferry" for Dave Rice who is on this site. I charge $150 for creating all of the music parts. I can find you a great vocalist, too. They usually charge about $150, as well.

Work Samples - https://soundcloud.com/larrymagee/sets/production-examples
Check out my 99 songs used on TV and in films. soundcloud.com/larrymagee/sets/songs-used-in-film-tv
Please reply to me at larrymagee@yahoo.com (larrymagee at yahoo dot com) if you are interested.

#1177334 - 06/05/21 06:26 PM Re: Someone needs to do Demos... [Re: Fdemetrio]  
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mchzanes2@aol.com

Has anyone tried to contact him?

#1177417 - 06/08/21 11:04 AM Re: Someone needs to do Demos... [Re: JAPOV]  
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Hi Tony,

Still alive and well; I just have my head in other things right now like learning video software. I could spend several lifetimes learning Adobe After Effects and still only be scratching the surface.

Miss y'all and sincerly apologize for being selfish with my time but will probably surface later in the year to share some stuff, including a cover of a "seasonal" Joe Wrabek song that Dave Rice commisioned and Wendy DuMond sang lead vox on and was completed (after Joe had died) well over a year ago..then sadly Dave passed as well..it's been a rough couple of years, hasn't it?

Mike

Last edited by Michael Zaneski; 06/08/21 11:29 AM.

Fate doesn't hang on a wrong or right choice
Fortune depends on the tone of your voice

-The Divine Comedy (Neil Hannon)
from the song "Songs of Love"
from the album "Casanova" (1996)
#1177420 - 06/08/21 11:46 AM Re: Someone needs to do Demos... [Re: Fdemetrio]  
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Fdemetrio Offline
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But who is gonna do the demos? Can anybody save us from eternal damnation? Is anybody hearing our prayers?

Last edited by Fdemetrio; 06/08/21 11:47 AM.
#1177421 - 06/08/21 11:53 AM Re: Someone needs to do Demos... [Re: Michael Zaneski]  
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Great to hear from you, Mike. I hope this means that at some time in the future we're going to see some great videos from you smile

#1177422 - 06/08/21 11:54 AM Re: Someone needs to do Demos... [Re: Fdemetrio]  
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But who is gonna do the demos? Can anybody save us from eternal damnation? Is anybody hearing our prayers?

#1177429 - 06/08/21 03:12 PM Re: Someone needs to do Demos... [Re: Fdemetrio]  
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VIDEO! Now you're talkin'! smile

#1177701 - 06/13/21 04:22 PM Re: Someone needs to do Demos... [Re: Fdemetrio]  
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I can guarantee that when Mike surfaces with video making skills that whatever he turns out will be stellar

And FD...maybe start a thread...who does decent demos?

And I was lucky enought to be able to submit a lyric to Mike for some music he had posted that he'd received from a friend

This is what turned out...so you know if you use him when he surfaces you will get great work

https://soundcloud.com/michael-zaneski/galways-sons



If writing ever becomes work I think I'm going to have to stop

My Youtube Channel <<<>>> iAccountant
#1177703 - 06/13/21 05:54 PM Re: Someone needs to do Demos... [Re: Fdemetrio]  
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Well i kinda already know why Mike doesnt do them any more, and for the same reason I wouldnt do them, Its not worth the time invested for the money it might bring in. Even if you charged a hundred bucks, which is probably alot for most people here wanting a simple demo, and the song took you a total of 8 hours to do everything, thats only 12 dollars an hour. Its not worth it, I dont know
now what he charged but it was probably less than that even.

I wouldnt mind doing acoustic demos or piano demos where i didnt have to do much accept program and sing.

Id probably be more interested in doing something where I really like the lyric. and doing it for free as a collab. People would then need to watch what kind of stuff I like to do.

Well see, i gott a long road to get my own stuff done slowly but surely.

#1177704 - 06/13/21 06:40 PM Re: Someone needs to do Demos... [Re: Fdemetrio]  
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VNORTH2 Online content
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Fd wrote
Even if you charged a hundred bucks, which is probably alot for most people here wanting a simple demo, and the song took you a total of 8 hours to do everything, thats only 12 dollars an hour.

Please tell me this is not true, Fd. Who expects a demo to be made for 100.00?


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#1177705 - 06/13/21 06:51 PM Re: Someone needs to do Demos... [Re: Fdemetrio]  
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I had a guy pm once and said "hey you sing good, would you sing and play one of my songs, I dont have much money, i could pay you 10 dollars maybe' lol Im serious. And the question "would you sing and play one of my songs" As if the singing and playing is like a cup of tea. But yes, I gurantee you people think a hundred bucks is too much, cause for a bit more you can get it done by demo services.

Technically, if you play even a bad rhythm guitar, can sing a little and can add a click track to it, you can send it to people on fiverr who will add drums, bass, piano, and sing it probably for less than a hundred. Some you can get for as little as 5 bucks.

Of course its not going to be produced, or arranged, like Mike might do, you are basicly just jamming with them.

Im gonna use fiver my self and document the steps and share it with our group here, but I wanna see how much of a difference it will make.

Be nice to have a female background singer, real horns, harmonica, stuff I cant do myself. id really like real instruments doing everything but that may get costly for as many songs as I wanna do.

Last edited by Fdemetrio; 06/13/21 06:52 PM.
#1177736 - 06/14/21 11:33 AM Re: Someone needs to do Demos... [Re: Fdemetrio]  
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Over here in northern europe, tariff for studiorecordings is about 130$/ hr, and minimum 3xhrs. So about 360$ is the absolute cheapest you can get a demo for here, and that is only if one musician can do the job alone in that time. You can probably do a simple guitar/piano/vocal that will sound pro in that time, but a full demo with drums, electric guitars and backing vocals would be too much of a stretch. So itís about the same as Nashville, where you can get a top notch demo for about a 1000$, with a full band recording.

But 100$.. I doubt it would be very useful for pitching to publishers ect. The competition is feirce these days, because so many can produce well. I would think a 100$ for nothing is more expensive than 300$ for something.

Iím in awe of MZís demo work. What an opportunity for the writers on here!

#1177737 - 06/14/21 12:12 PM Re: Someone needs to do Demos... [Re: Fdemetrio]  
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Yes but first off, people here know you, so they think you are one of the guys and not somebody making a business out of it. And you would almost have to be cheaper.

Secondly, im not really a demo shopper, 300 is a fair price if done well, but id think that would get expensive for say a lyricist, if they write alot.

Its so much easier just to play the damn instrument...ya know? If you own a small studio and can play guitar, piano, bass and drums pretty well, why waste time with software. SOftware is time consuming, not the other way around. Thats how I think anyway

Fiverr can make that happen so long as you can bring something to the table yourself. You need to know how to write a ful song, and know what the chords are, i guess there are people on there who would do it all, but results may vary.

Plus im sure there are people on there who will do a whole demo alot cheaper than 300






Last edited by Fdemetrio; 06/14/21 12:34 PM.
#1177788 - 06/17/21 04:29 AM Re: Someone needs to do Demos... [Re: Fdemetrio]  
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Im sure there is, and Fiverr can be good. But in the end, it's not about getting a demo cheap, but getting a presentation of the full potential of your song.
This is very important for publishers and A&R, because they have to present it to others and have their name at stake, so you will do yourself a big favor to invest the best you can or wait another month till you can.

But if you just want a record for your self and family to keep, then of course you can be happy enough with just a good, audible recording.
Context is everything.

#1177790 - 06/17/21 07:55 AM Re: Someone needs to do Demos... [Re: Fdemetrio]  
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I think therein lies the problem with "affordable" demos, they arent good enough. Especially today where they want sometimes THE track and just have their singer sing over it. You could pay thousands for a commercially releasable song. Not good enough "ish"

So if not good enough, why waste the 300 anyway, unless you really want to hear what it might sound like.

#1177791 - 06/17/21 08:24 AM Re: Someone needs to do Demos... [Re: Fdemetrio]  
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One time all publishers wanted to hear was a vocal/guitar or piano rough demo and they would produce the finished demo at their expense, now they want a finished demo at the songwriters expense and they want to take 50% of the song. They have become pitching agents.

#1177792 - 06/17/21 09:00 AM Re: Someone needs to do Demos... [Re: Fdemetrio]  
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Yeah, I think that was when country music was "three chords and the truth" Now, country is basicly pop music with a country flavoring. I think rock and pop always needed a solid backing track.

This service to me sums it all up. You got 4 songwriter packages...lol one is $40 dollars more than other one, so you have to ask what difference it will make.

But then the bopper one.... the one that you need if you are an artist looking to get a deal, is an ungodly $5,950, compared to the other $300-$400 variety demo. http://www.pandaproductionsofnashville.com/song_demo_recording_studio_pricing.html

I think that price is way high considering the availabilty of home recording, but still it gives you an idea of the difference between a demo and a finished product.

If you use that same logic, by trying to get a song cut, you are essentially up against it as much as the artist looking for a deal, so thats the price range youll pay to get a record quality..ahemm demo.

Somebody had posted this video of a songwriter who got a cut from Reba, he explains how it happened,...unlikely... and also how important the demo is, basicly said demo not good enough, nobody will notice it.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VH2_lbPy5Yk





Last edited by Fdemetrio; 06/17/21 09:04 AM.
#1177794 - 06/17/21 11:21 AM Re: Someone needs to do Demos... [Re: Fdemetrio]  
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The price for the 10 song CD doesn't sound ungodly to me. From what little I know, $600 per song for up to 8 instruments and background vocals sounds like a very good deal, assuming they are any good, of course. In fact, all the packages look to be reasonably priced.

#1177796 - 06/17/21 12:42 PM Re: Someone needs to do Demos... [Re: Fdemetrio]  
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Ahhh, my bad, I thought that was for one song, lol. Following their ads it was all for one song until that, got it. Thats clears up alot, but also at 600 dollars a song, those demos are not radio quality. Just a more instrumentated, better performed and mixed demo.

You're probably better off with the 300 dollar version, it wont change your odds much.


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