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#924483 - 09/26/11 03:59 PM Swapping the membrane in a condenser mic?  
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Kolstad Offline
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I have a Shure Beta 87c with a membrane in disorder.

Does anyone know what it costs to get a new one, where to get it, and if I can do it myself?


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#924572 - 09/26/11 10:48 PM Re: Swapping the membrane in a condenser mic? [Re: Kolstad]  
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Colin

I try to critique as if you mean business.....

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#924650 - 09/27/11 07:27 AM Re: Swapping the membrane in a condenser mic? [Re: Colin Ward]  
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Thanks Colin,
I tried, but were not able to find a spare diaphragm for the 87c.

It's an old mic, not very expensive (250$ new, but I love it), so I'm looking for a cheap DIY solution, but cannot find the spare parts anywhere.


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#924653 - 09/27/11 08:29 AM Re: Swapping the membrane in a condenser mic? [Re: Kolstad]  
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I think you will have to search for the "capsule". Not cheap!


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#924658 - 09/27/11 09:39 AM Re: Swapping the membrane in a condenser mic? [Re: Colin Ward]  
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Yeah, I found one for 260$, that's 10$ MORE than what a new mic costs! Lol

It was for wireless, though, so it might be cheaper for cable, buut.. it's probably a gone'er.


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#924668 - 09/27/11 11:06 AM Re: Swapping the membrane in a condenser mic? [Re: Kolstad]  
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Did you follow Colin's link?

You need the part labelled 'R193 Cartridge for Beta 87 and Beta 87A' which seems to be available at

http://www.parts-express.com/pe/showdetl.cfm?Partnumber=242-2166

James.


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#924686 - 09/27/11 12:59 PM Re: Swapping the membrane in a condenser mic? [Re: James Perrett]  
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Humm,
It looks, for all practical purposes you have to replace everything at one time except the housing. Sorta like buying a whole new Microphone. Are you sure the one you have is bad? It could be something else.


Ray E. Strode
#924700 - 09/27/11 01:49 PM Re: Swapping the membrane in a condenser mic? [Re: Ray E. Strode]  
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Sometimes the membrane will get damp and it affects the mic's performance. Try warming your oven up to about 125 degrees fahrenheit, not hot enough to distort any parts or soften the soldering. Turn the oven off as soon as it gets there, then put the mic in, close the oven door, and leave it in until the oven cools. That might do the trick.

I've heard of changing capsules and I've changed a cartidge myself, but I would imagine it would take a skilled technician to change the membrane...if it is even possible to do after the initial construction of the capsule.

Good luck on it.

Miie


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#924728 - 09/27/11 03:55 PM Re: Swapping the membrane in a condenser mic? [Re: Mike Dunbar]  
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James, Ray, Mike,

Thanks guys. Seems it's too expensive to swap the membrane compared to get a new item.

But, I'm going to try your suggestion, Mike. Can't hurt!


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#924937 - 09/28/11 02:02 PM Re: Swapping the membrane in a condenser mic? [Re: Kolstad]  
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If that fails, you might think about sending it to Shure. They have flat fees for mics out of warranty.
Here's the pricing chart.


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#925001 - 09/28/11 08:39 PM Re: Swapping the membrane in a condenser mic? [Re: Dak Lander]  
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I tried this once and it worked......use a vacuum cleaner nozzle on a very light suck setting to suck back the membrane if it becomes deformed or flattened in....but only try it if you are prepared for the worst.
That said sometimes you have to just replace the whole cartridge or buy a new mic as repairs can cost way more than the mic is worth.

PS I just spotted this on Ebay.....a guy is selling a starcloth plus a free beta 87c mic for 50......BARGAIN....even if you throw away the starcloth. Maybe he will ship to Denmark.
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/120-LED-W...ngLEDsStrobes_RL&hash=item3a6ac287f7

#925077 - 09/29/11 07:53 AM Re: Swapping the membrane in a condenser mic? [Re: Dak Lander]  
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Originally Posted by Dak Lander
If that fails, you might think about sending it to Shure. They have flat fees for mics out of warranty.
Here's the pricing chart.


That's interesting. Does this mean, if I send it to Shure, the most I will have to pay is the 101$ flat fee for the Beta 87 (as listed in the pricing chart), regardless the issue?


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#925078 - 09/29/11 07:56 AM Re: Swapping the membrane in a condenser mic? [Re: BIG JIM MERRILEES]  
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Originally Posted by BIG JIM MERRILEES
I tried this once and it worked......use a vacuum cleaner nozzle on a very light suck setting to suck back the membrane if it becomes deformed or flattened in....but only try it if you are prepared for the worst.
That said sometimes you have to just replace the whole cartridge or buy a new mic as repairs can cost way more than the mic is worth.

PS I just spotted this on Ebay.....a guy is selling a starcloth plus a free beta 87c mic for 50......BARGAIN....even if you throw away the starcloth. Maybe he will ship to Denmark.
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/120-LED-W...ngLEDsStrobes_RL&hash=item3a6ac287f7


That's a crazy offer, Jim! Hah, might just do that. I'm shure (no pun intended), my daughter could have fun with the starcloth in her room too!

Learning some great DIY tricks in this thread.. thanks!


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#925186 - 09/29/11 09:33 PM Re: Swapping the membrane in a condenser mic? [Re: Kolstad]  
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Originally Posted by the songcabinet
Originally Posted by Dak Lander
If that fails, you might think about sending it to Shure. They have flat fees for mics out of warranty.
Here's the pricing chart.


That's interesting. Does this mean, if I send it to Shure, the most I will have to pay is the 101$ flat fee for the Beta 87 (as listed in the pricing chart), regardless the issue?


Yep, so I'm told and as long as you mic is a standard Beta 87 series and not one of the other beta series mics. I know of a couple of people who have sent in their SM58s and they came back to them looking like new. That was a few years ago and the cost at the time was $50.00 so the costs have gone up just a bit.

And, of course, you'll have shipping.


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#925277 - 09/30/11 07:20 AM Re: Swapping the membrane in a condenser mic? [Re: Dak Lander]  
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Originally Posted by Dak Lander
Yep, ... as long as you mic is a standard Beta 87 series and not one of the other beta series mics.


Hmm, that's the catch. Mine is a Beta 87c.

I think I'm just going to get a new Shure SM86 in stead..

It suits my setup better, because it doesn't have as much high end. I tend to overdo things because I rely a lot on software presets, so I figure the SM86 has a better starting point for me, anyway.

I want that Shure sound, though. When you're an Indie, it can make you sound almost like you're a real musician :-)


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#925353 - 09/30/11 04:10 PM Re: Swapping the membrane in a condenser mic? [Re: Kolstad]  
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Originally Posted by the songcabinet
Originally Posted by Dak Lander
Yep, ... as long as you mic is a standard Beta 87 series and not one of the other beta series mics.


Hmm, that's the catch. Mine is a Beta 87c.

I think I'm just going to get a new Shure SM86 in stead..

It suits my setup better, because it doesn't have as much high end. I tend to overdo things because I rely a lot on software presets, so I figure the SM86 has a better starting point for me, anyway.

I want that Shure sound, though. When you're an Indie, it can make you sound almost like you're a real musician :-)


Might be worth a phone call anyway to see if yours is the same fee as the Beta A.

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#925536 - 10/01/11 10:04 AM Re: Swapping the membrane in a condenser mic? [Re: Dak Lander]  
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Magne "I want the Shure sound" you make it sound like Shure is the be all and end all when it comes to mics.

I have a moderately large collection of mics including many types, brands and model numbers. I do not think I have ever thrown away a mic that works...and just seem to keep buying new ones....adding to the collection. I have everything from the really expensive Neumann studio to really cheap unbranded dynamic and a couple of really old crystal mics.

I have learned a few things about mics over the years.

Every voice is different and some may be more suited to a different type or model of mic than others.

EQ can change dramatically how any mic sounds.

The type of song can alter how a mic sounds EG the same person singing a soft ballad or a harsh rock song can mean the mic EQ may need altered....or a different model of mic needed to bring out the best.

Each mic has its own characteristics. Two identical mics same make and model can sound slightlly different from each other.

The same mic in different venues can sound different. Depends on acoustics of the room and placement in different parts of the room in relation to beams, pillars, walls, other musicians, electrical equipment, speakers etc ALL can sound different.


The conclusion I have come to is that there is no "best" mic only the one that is best for a particular application and occasion given all I have said before.
Whilst Shure are pretty good (I own a few Shure mics myself) I would not automatically buy one without checking out what other manufacturers have to offer.

#925592 - 10/01/11 03:10 PM Re: Swapping the membrane in a condenser mic? [Re: BIG JIM MERRILEES]  
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I agree Jim, and even though I did not say anything about your misreading "best", it's fine for others reading the thread.

Personally, I'm back to basics with mics for now, after trying out a bunch of low and middle end microphones.

The harsh top end of many Chinese mics annoys me, and as I can't justify the expense of a 1000$ mic, I'm back to square one, trying to make the live mics like Shure SM58 and the condenser version, the SM86 sound nice.

I'm also looking for a more vibrant live sound to my recordings, and I know the Shure mics will help to achieve exactly that.

There are plenty other mics, that sounds different, and "better" depending on what sound you are looking for, but the "Shure sound" IS exactly what I'm looking for, at this particular point.

So, the correct reading is "I want the Shure sound", and not "I want the Shure sound" wink


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#925610 - 10/01/11 04:37 PM Re: Swapping the membrane in a condenser mic? [Re: Kolstad]  
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Magne I get it.....I on the other hand do not like the false bass bottom end enhancement associated with Shure. I prefer my Audia Technica mics which give a more realistic natural sound.... well for my voice anyway..... I seldom have to have anything other than flat Eq and the gain never needs to be set as high as my Shure mics which means less feedback and less hum or hiss than the Shure mics tend to produce. The audia Technica are similar in price to their Shure counterparts BUT have a higher spec covering a wider audio spectrum. When considering buying a new mic they are well worth a look.

#925614 - 10/01/11 05:21 PM Re: Swapping the membrane in a condenser mic? [Re: BIG JIM MERRILEES]  
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That's probably because you have a rich, full sounding voice, Jim (well, I know you have). You are a natural singer, and can make a living off of it, because your voice sounds naturally great. You have a much better starting point to choose mic's from.

I'm, on the other hand, just a songwriter, trying to skimp a vocal here and there on songs that never seem to go anywhere (!). My voice tends to be a bit thin, and pretty harsh sounding in my high range (hmm, wonder why those songs end up on the shelf?), so I think my voice benefits from the more dense sound from the Shure's (at least they make me feel more confindent when tracking vocals, because I like the sound).

Basicly I'm not a very good singer, allthough I do practice, so I'm doomed, I need more help than I can get.. lol I would make any U87 sound like a Chinese gong!

But there's more to it. I don't have great ears for mixing, so I want something with less high end, to sort of compensate when I overproduce things :-)


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#925642 - 10/01/11 09:11 PM Re: Swapping the membrane in a condenser mic? [Re: Kolstad]  
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Magne that is why I stated that certain mics suit certain voices cause everyone has a different voice. That said it is sometimes better to use a mic that as faithfully as possible reproduces what it picks up and then EQ that signal to boost the weak frequencies or cut down on the stronger harsher tones....This is best done using a multiband graphic EQ and of course ears. It is worth considering cutting offending frequencies at the top end rather than boosting lower end frequencies to try to compensate......boosting low end can make the sound muddy and dry sounding and sometimes a "false" sounding vocal. Contrary to common held beliefs it is the middles and top end that create warmth and depth. Thin vocals can usually be sorted by de-essing boosting the middle and cutting back on some of the top....but do not over de-ess. I prefer using roll offs and filters rather than a bassier or more top end mic....although that is harder to do in a live situation.
Here is an interesting article on EQ. It gives a chart of where the human voice fits in with certain frequencies in relation to bass middles and top end.
http://www.behindthemixer.com/content/eq-vocals-101-fix-and-mix
and here is another with more EQ tips.
http://www.behindthemixer.com/content/vocal-eq-settings

PS it is worthwhile reading the replies as they add some other tips and POV.

#925772 - 10/02/11 07:47 AM Re: Swapping the membrane in a condenser mic? [Re: BIG JIM MERRILEES]  
Joined: Dec 2008
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Kolstad Offline
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Kolstad  Offline
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Joined: Dec 2008
Posts: 3,759
Denmark
Great tips, Jim!
Whoo, that's a great link. There's just a wealth of superb information on there!

Thanks


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#925780 - 10/02/11 10:38 AM Re: Swapping the membrane in a condenser mic? [Re: Kolstad]  
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BIG JIM MERRILEES Offline
BIG JIM MERRILEES  Offline

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Joined: Nov 2006
Posts: 8,463
Edinburgh, Scotland. UK
Thanks Magne it should be required reading for a lot of the people who post on the Mp3 forum...LOL


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