Who's Online Now
28 registered members (couchgrouch, Gavin Sinclair, adf, 9ne, Fdemetrio, Everett Adams, Irwin, Gary E. Andrews, 7 invisible), and 338 guests, and
Key: Admin, Global Mod, Mod
Shout Box
Member Spotlight
Marc Barnette
Marc Barnette
Nashville, Tn.
Posts: 5,071
Joined: January 2009
Show All Member Profiles 
What's Going On
Best upload site
by Martin Lide. 06/18/19 07:03 PM
Why are there so many lyric-only folks?
by Michael LeBlanc. 06/18/19 06:18 PM
Washed Away Each Time It Rains
by JaneK. 06/18/19 04:32 PM
Nervous Breakdown
by Gavin Sinclair. 06/18/19 01:11 PM
London Calls
by Gavin Sinclair. 06/18/19 01:01 PM
A Sailor's Life
by 90 dB. 06/18/19 11:06 AM
I started out with nothing. Vic
by Vicarn. 06/18/19 10:48 AM
Stairway Lawsuit
by John Lawrence Schick. 06/18/19 09:59 AM
If I Have Another Tear To Cry
by Gary E. Andrews. 06/18/19 09:44 AM
Crazy Carousel (free to use instrumental)
by Mimmo. 06/18/19 07:24 AM
On Our Crazy Carousel Of Love.
by MFB III. 06/18/19 03:19 AM
The Will To Stay
by Deej56. 06/18/19 12:25 AM
Girl with a smile
by Deej56. 06/18/19 12:24 AM
Bouquets and Goodbyes
by Deej56. 06/18/19 12:21 AM
I Want To Do Method Acting; Help
by R&M. 06/17/19 11:58 PM
Careful What You Want
by Neil Cotton. 06/17/19 10:46 PM
Gold Heart, Bleeding Heart
by Michael Zaneski. 06/17/19 09:51 PM
Forever Hers
by nightengale. 06/17/19 08:40 PM
Beyond All Those Eons Of Neon.
by MFB III. 06/17/19 12:20 PM
Lonely fool
by Travis david. 06/17/19 07:27 AM
::: CRUSH ON YOU :::
by Travis david. 06/17/19 07:17 AM
Kerry Moon.Thread sewn up.Thanks for all help.
by MFB III. 06/17/19 02:59 AM
I'm Almost Halfway Through My Third Life.
by MFB III. 06/17/19 02:57 AM
Mysterious Circumstances
by couchgrouch. 06/17/19 12:54 AM
New Bend In an Old River
by couchgrouch. 06/16/19 09:41 PM
You turn me on
by Guy E. Trepanier. 06/16/19 07:30 PM
When I Get To Sing
by Neil Cotton. 06/16/19 07:22 PM
Commercial/ Promo...
by John Lawrence Schick. 06/16/19 06:25 PM
Roots
by Neil Cotton. 06/16/19 11:10 AM
Top Posters(All Time)
Calvin 19,732
Travis david 11,501
Kevin Emmrich 10,544
Jean Bullock 10,330
Kaley Willow 10,240
Two Singers 9,572
Joice Marie 9,186
Mackie H. 8,844
glynda 8,590
Mike Dunbar 8,574
Tricia Baker 8,318
Colin Ward 7,903
couchgrouch 7,514
Corey 7,357
Dave Rice 7,226
Wyman Lloyd 6,578
Mark Kaufman 6,461
Joe Wrabek 6,403
ben willis 6,099
Vicarn 6,086
Lynn Orloff 5,788
Louis 5,725
Linda Sings 5,604
niteshift 5,477
KimberlyinNC 5,210
Derek Hines 4,893
Neil Cotton 4,806
DonnaMarilyn 4,648
Blake Hill 4,528
Bob Cushing 4,356
Bill Osofsky 4,199
Tom Shea 4,179
Cindy Miller 4,178
nightengale 4,054
TamsNumber4 4,033
Roy Cooper 4,022
Caroline 3,865
Kolstad 3,799
Dan Sullivan 3,710
MFB III 3,699
beechnut79 3,494
Dottie 3,427
joewatt 3,411
E Swartz 3,333
Bill Cooper 3,279
John Hoffman 3,199
Skip Johnson 3,027
Pam Hurley 3,007
Terry G 3,005
PopTodd 2,890
Harriet Ames 2,870
Nigel Quin 2,812
MidniteBob 2,707
Nelson 2,570
Tom Tracy 2,558
Polly Hager 2,526
Jerry Jakala 2,524
Al Alvarez 2,499
Eric Thome 2,448
Hummingbird 2,401
Stan Loh 2,263
Sam Wilson 2,242
Judy Hollier 2,232
Wendy D 2,206
Erica Ellis 2,202
TrumanCoyote 2,096
Marty Helly 2,012
DukeWill 1,984
floyd jane 1,982
maccharles 1,942
Clint Anglin 1,904
cindyrella 1,888
David Wright 1,866
Clairejeanne 1,851
Cindy LaRosa 1,824
Ronald Boyt 1,675
Iggy 1,646
Noel Downs 1,620
Rick Heenan 1,596
Cal 1,574
Jack Swain 1,554
Pete Larsen 1,537
Ann Tygart 1,529
Tom Breshers 1,487
Martin Lide 1,463
RogerS 1,461
Tom Franz 1,453
Chuck Crowe 1,441
Ralph Blight 1,440
Kenneth Cade 1,429
Rick Norton 1,428
bholt 1,411
GocartMoz 1,411
Letha Allen 1,408
in2piano 1,404
Stan Simons 1,402
mattbanx 1,384
Jen Shaner 1,373
Charlie Wong 1,347
KevinP 1,324
Vondelle 1,316
Tom W. 1,313
Jan Petter 1,301
scottandrew 1,292
DakLander 1,265
PeteG 1,242
Ian Ferrin 1,230
Glen King 1,214
IdeaGuy 1,209
AaronAuthier 1,177
Fdemetrio 1,162
Diane Ewing 1,158
Gerry 1,142
summeoyo 1,120
joro 1,081
BobbyJoe 1,075
lane1777 1,059
S.DEE 1,040
yann 1,037
Tony A 1,016
Deej56 1,014
argo 986
peaden 984
Wolvman 960
IronKnee 947
Jak Kelly 912
krtinberg 890
Drifter 886
Petra 883
9ne 878
RJC 845
Brenda152 840
Nadia 827
Juan 797
TKO 784
90 dB 782
frahmes 781
teletwang 762
Andy K 740
tbryson 737
Andy Kemp 733
ant 732
Jackie444 731
3daveyO3 704
Dayson 703
Dixie 701
Joy Boy 695
Knute 686
Lee Arten 678
Katziis 652
R.T.MOORE 638
quality 637
CG King 622
Irwin 622
douglas 621
Mel 614
Pat Hardy 611
NaomiSue 601
Shandy 589
Ria 587
TAMERA64 583
Moosesong 579
qbaum 570
nitepiano 566
pRISCILLA 556
Tink2 553
musica 539
deanbell 528
RobertK 527
BonzaiWag 523
Roderic 522
BB Wilbur 511
goodfolks 499
R&M 490
Zeek 487
Stu 486
Steve P. 481
KathyW 462
allenb 459
MaxG 458
Philjo 454
fanito 448
trush48 448
dmk 442
arealrush 437
DGR 436
avweek 435
Stephen D 433
Emmy 431
Rob L 426
marquez 422
kit 419
Softkrome 417
kyrksongs 415
RRon 408
Laura G. 407
VNORTH 407
Debra 407
eb 406
cuebald 399
EdPerrone 399
Dannyk1 395
Hobart 395
Davyboy49 393
Smile 389
GJShades 387
Ezt 384
tone 380
Marla 380
Cecilee 379
iggyiggy 378
coalminer 377
java 374
spidey 371
sweetsong 370
Register Today!
Welcome to the Just Plain Folks forums! You are currently viewing our forums as a Guest which gives you limited access to most of our discussions and to other features.

By joining our free community you will have access to post and respond to topics, communicate privately with our users (PM), respond to polls, upload content, and access many other features. Registration is fast, simple, and absolutely free; so please join our community today!
Previous Thread
Next Thread
Print Thread
Rate This Thread
#916701 - 08/19/11 03:42 PM lyrics separately of a song  
Joined: Oct 2009
Posts: 357
Alek Offline
Top 500 Poster
Alek  Offline
Top 500 Poster

Joined: Oct 2009
Posts: 357
Ukraine
Hi all, one question appeared and I should answer to it, but I have a doubts what to do: I was proposed to use my lyrics from a song separately of a melody -
ie I have a song with a melody and a lyrics of mine, so, is it legal if I allow any person to use a lyrics only?
And next: if I allowed this and then somebody wants to use complete song - both music and lyrics, so, is it legal when the same lyrics is used in different songs(melodies) in a same time?

#916760 - 08/19/11 08:30 PM Re: lyrics separately of a song [Re: Alek]  
Joined: Jan 2009
Posts: 5,071
Marc Barnette Offline
Top 50 Poster
Marc Barnette  Offline
Top 50 Poster

Joined: Jan 2009
Posts: 5,071
Nashville, Tn.
Alek,

Once music is affixed to a lyric, that is one song. While I am sure you could probably take it and do it with other music, you are only going to create legal and ethical problems for yourself.

People have done this with great problems by selling "tracks", existing backing music with no lyrics, and that has created several ethical and legal questions for songwriters.

My view is that it is far too easy to write more lyrics and why would you want to use one lyric on several melodies. To me, it simply doesn't make any sense and actually is lazy songwriting. The idea is to be continually creative. If you can't create more than one lyric, that is not very creative. Why ever try to write another song? Just recycle the same lyric over and over.

As far as music and lyrics done separately, it is done all the time. Actually the way Elton John And Bernie Taupin and almost every writer up until the 60's were done. There was almost always a composer who did the music and lyricists that did the lyrics. In plays and operas, there were often a librettist also.

There are so many songs out there I can't imagine why anyone would just want to do the same melody or lyric over and over again on purpose. We all recycle both of them but to sit down and actually MEAN to do it, doesn't make a lot of sense to me.

Imagine if you actually got a song recorded for a television or motion picture or even a cut. And before that song is released, you suddenly get a "cease and desist" order from someone who you had written the same thing with on another song. Not only would it totally screw up your chances of having it used in anything, costing the film or television people troubles that could potentially mean thousands of dollars in schedule overruns, but also would succeed in destroying any chance you would have of ever having a career. No one likes dealing with legal issues, lawyers and confrontation.

Doing what you are talking about invites all of those.

MAB

#916957 - 08/20/11 08:27 PM Re: lyrics separately of a song [Re: Marc Barnette]  
Joined: Oct 2009
Posts: 357
Alek Offline
Top 500 Poster
Alek  Offline
Top 500 Poster

Joined: Oct 2009
Posts: 357
Ukraine
Marc, thanks for your input, and, as always you're to the point, but my question is more complex: I have TWO lyrics for the same song! One is of mine and another is by another person, but heck, that singer chooses my lyrics (as said without music)! I feel that song has a potential (another singer recorded it but I declined her variant) and, honestly, I see now: at least two aspiring artists want to use my song whether whole or lyrics only.
Well, I decided - or the whole song or nothing.
PS. Later, maybe, I place both lyrics at lyrics forum for comparison plus a link to a beat of a song.

#917221 - 08/22/11 01:35 PM Re: lyrics separately of a song [Re: Alek]  
Joined: Jan 2009
Posts: 5,071
Marc Barnette Offline
Top 50 Poster
Marc Barnette  Offline
Top 50 Poster

Joined: Jan 2009
Posts: 5,071
Nashville, Tn.
Alek,

I really can't tell you what to do on your song because personally I would never get to that point. If it is single lines, or particular parts of a song that are multiples, I would find the best and boil it down to one. If I had two completely different lyrics, it would be two different songs. Period.

I believe that some of the biggest problems songwriters get into are self inflicted. They are confusing on what they are writing, songs really not making sense to the outside world, which I refer to as "Songwriter Tunnelvision." It is some personal statement that really only appeals to them, usually about a lot of pain or heartache and most people simply don't care about that. They have enough heartache in their own lives and the last thing they want is to listen to music to hear about heartache. Music is most often an "escape" from reality. Not a reminder of reality.

When it gets to things like you are talking about here, I hear people talking about "retitleing" or going to the copyright office, and wanting to make changes. Are they KIDDING? There are about 3 million song applications, 4-10 million patent applications, 1 BILLION songs a month on the Internet alone. And people are talking about creating confusion within one song? It simply doesn't make any sense to me.

Profssional songwriters write a LOT of songs. It is what they do as a job, so they spend their time raising their overall level, practicing, marketing themselves for audiences and the industry. They know that there is no time with the public to weigh through some multiple versions of songs, and with publishers, labels, pluggers artists, etc. they have NO INTEREST WHATSOVER in things that have confusion in them. They only have one word for those type songs, "NEXT."

You are talking about people that listen to an intro, a tempo or two lines of a song, then fast forward to the next, not people that are going to sit there and weigh through the various intellectual dynamics of some songwriter's vision. People simply don't have time to do that.

In my opinion you should write two separate songs, get them down and move on to other songs. If you have people interested in one of them, go with that. If there is confusion, you need to make a decision because no one else will do it for you.

This is pretty much a "here, it's done" world now. There is quite simply too much out there to bring along questions on it.

The only other thing I would suggest you do would be this. Get three people whose opinion you trust. People who you know their music, who like you. Send them both a personal email and ask if they will help you. Then send them the duplicate songs and what you have. If two people say the same thing, go with that.

Other than that, I really can't help you.

MAB

#987787 - 12/13/12 05:51 AM Re: lyrics separately of a song [Re: Alek]  
Joined: Sep 2011
Posts: 611
Pat Hardy Offline
Top 500 Poster
Pat Hardy  Offline
Top 500 Poster

Joined: Sep 2011
Posts: 611
I believe you can do anything you want if all parties concerned agree, in writing. But, why would you do this?

I have agreement with a lyricist, if we don't have a song become
a success on some level, say, in two years, we dissolve the copyright and she is free to shop her lyric to another melody,
as I am free to shop my melody to another lyric, but, in my contract, I don't allow her ( the lyricist ) to shop her lyric
during the agreement term ( works both ways ). That's how I do it.

Caveat: " IANAL ".

Pat Hardy Lockwood


#988023 - 12/14/12 12:09 PM Re: lyrics separately of a song [Re: Pat Hardy]  
Joined: Dec 2009
Posts: 413
Bernd Harmsen Offline
Top 500 Poster
Bernd Harmsen  Offline
Top 500 Poster

Joined: Dec 2009
Posts: 413
> If I had two completely different lyrics, it would be two different songs. <

And vice versa.

I publish my lyrics with a license that allows everybody to set them to music and publish non-commercially. Or in other words: I don't write for anybody exclusively. I do this to impove my chances to 'pitch' lyrics/songs. The effect is that as of today up to four different songs exist with the same lyrics (that sometimes had to be slightly adapted). Meanwhile, a few are also registered with the PROs because they are being performed (the PROs cooperate internationally). No harm in this: different composers, different tunes = different songs.

I you have a contract with your partner - lyricist and/or composer - just look into the contract.


Bernd
[url]http://bernd-harmsen.com[/url]

Support Just Plain Folks

We would like to keep the membership in Just Plain Folks FREE! Your donation helps support the many programs we offer including Road Trips and the Music Awards.


Membership
Join Just Plain Folks
to receive the free
JPNotes Newsletter!
*this is separate from
message board registration*

Newest Members
Kasu, Godsent, Marlyn23, Deall1988, LatoyaLGray
21200 Registered Users
Forum Statistics
Forums116
Topics119,035
Posts1,121,963
Members21,200
Average Posts Daily29
Most Online1,541
Feb 21st, 2019
Just Plain Quotes
"Through the positive and supportive examples we are setting, it is becoming apparent that where our Just Plain Folks lead, the music world will follow!" -Brian Austin Whitney
Today's Birthdays
No Birthdays
Popular Topics(Views)
Powered by UBB.threads™ PHP Forum Software 7.6.0