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#801831 - 03/10/10 04:05 PM The Tools of Songwriting  
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billrocker Offline
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Nashville TN
Craftsmanship in any creative art requires the right tools but doesn't necessarily correlate with the number of tools a craftsman owns.

I get a lot of songs that demonstrate a writer's ability to turn a phrase. That's an important tool to have as a writer. However, many of those songs are written with the purpose of demonstrating that the writer has that skill. In other words, a writer will think of a cool play on words and then make up a story around the play on words. It's as if the writer thinks the play on words will carry the day rather than the story.

If one sets out to build a China cabinet what would be the best course of action?

1. Draw a picture of the proposed china cabinet. Measure. Cut the wood. Assemble using the right tools.

2. Cut up some wood with your new saw you've been dying to try out. Gather up the cut pieces and try and create some kind of china cabinet.

I believe the tools should assist/enhance/facilitate the writer in the creation of his/her work. The creation shouldn't be designed with the intent of having the viewer or listener appreciate his/her tools.

Any thoughts?

Bill Renfrew
Write THIS Music, BMI
www.writethismusic.com

#801837 - 03/10/10 04:24 PM Re: The Tools of Songwriting [Re: billrocker]  
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Steven August Rieck Offline
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Howdy Bill, Gus here. I must be guilty of what you're talking
about, cuz I always start off with my hook, & build the story from there. But following your analogy, I consider this like deciding to build a CHINA CABINET, rather than a linen cabinet, before i start
drawing plans, & looking at how much material is available before
I decide how big it will be, or what quality of item I can build
out of whats available, etc.
This is a great topic, & I would love to get more of your take on this, since I really just a NOOBIE, & I AM TRYING TO LEARN ALL
I CAN........................YAK SOON........Gus


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#801888 - 03/10/10 09:55 PM Re: The Tools of Songwriting [Re: Steven August Rieck]  
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Colin Ward Offline
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Bill,

I hear what you are saying, but it seems that every song has to start somewhere. Whether it is the hook, an instrumental riff, or an outline of the story on a piece of paper, it starts with an idea.

I just did the February Album Writing Month challenge where you write fourteen songs in 28 days. I got fourteen songs done (one of which is an instrumental). They need a lot of polishing. I guess most of them started with a hook or a germ of an idea that came while doing my daily routines. I guess what you are saying is that some people come up with good hooks but never really finish the rest of the song to the same standard. Probably true in my case.

Interesting post!


Colin

I try to critique as if you mean business.....

http://colinwardmusic.com/

http://rosewoodcreekband.com/


#801892 - 03/10/10 10:20 PM Re: The Tools of Songwriting [Re: Colin Ward]  
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BIG JIM MERRILEES Offline
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IMO not all songs need stories...some do...... some do not.....Every song requires hooks however..preferably both lyrical and musical. It also needs a good performance and production to carry it.
The important thing is how good the finished article is not what tools were used or how it was written or produced.

Re a china cabinet...well it does not really matter what tools the cabinet maker used or how he actually made it....the important thing is how it looks when finished....how sturdy it is, how it functions and whether it is of a quality and design you would want to put your best china in.

#801912 - 03/10/10 11:47 PM Re: The Tools of Songwriting [Re: BIG JIM MERRILEES]  
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Terry Moore Offline
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Words are only a part of the jigsaw..how it ends up and sounds are what matter..zillions of songs have been built around a "hook"..whether it be "word-play" or musical...but probably a combination of both...it really is just finding that magic formula....Cheers ..Terry..

#801919 - 03/11/10 12:15 AM Re: The Tools of Songwriting [Re: Terry Moore]  
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Jack Swain Offline
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Jack Swain  Offline
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If your gonna build a cabinet you HAVE TO START WITH A TREE.

Not relevant, I suppose, but I felt like stating that.

#801931 - 03/11/10 01:11 AM Re: The Tools of Songwriting [Re: Jack Swain]  
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Gary E. Andrews Online content
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Gary E. Andrews  Online Content
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I don't think I ever started with THE hook/title and tried to write up to it.

Jason Blume, in one of his books (www.jasonblume.com I think), says most of what is being written in Nashville 'these days' is written that way. The pop or rock market may have a similarly flawed method, rambling around lyrically, failing to hook with verses, and weak on THE hook/title. There seem to be more songs that lose my interest than songs that hook me.

Many songs in the country market seem to only rhyme, or run down a laundry list of 'elements' they think make it a country song, which quickly loses my interest before it ever gets to THE hook. So there's that 'not-living-up' to THE hook. The hook itself may not be all that interesting, or serviceable to the function of summing up.

The verses should tell the 'story,' not necessarily a literal story, but a coherent theme. Their function is setting up for THE hook/title, enabling it to function as the punch line, the line that sums it all up lyrically, or melodically, or both, in conjunction with the instrumentation, riffs, rhythm, percussion.

I think my style may place more importance on line one. If that line comes to me, and hooks me, as the first listener, making me want to know more about what is implied in that line, who the singer-character is, and what they're talking about, then I begin to 'get' the song. I start to conceive the singer-character's point of view, their situation, what they're going through, how they feel about it, the conversation they're having with someone else about it all.

THE hook/title comes to me when it's time for that function to be served. You can't just go on doing the lyrical 'exposition' of the verses forever. There's a certain amount of setup function, and then it's time for THE hook function.

It may be at the end of each verse, a refrain-type chorus. Or it may be a stanza-type chorus, with THE hook-title as line one or the more strategic last line, or both, or more.

The lyrical content of THE hook, refrain or chorus, must be on-theme, serving the function of making sense of the exposition of the verses.

Many lyrics I read, songs I hear, don't seem to have waited to 'get' the story. They went ahead and found a rhyme, or not, but went ahead and wrote lines, got the requisite number 3, or 4, or 8 or 16, then wrote more lines and called it a chorus, maybe went on to another verse, or two or three, maybe repeated the chorus, or wrote some lines and labeled it a bridge. But they never 'got' the song, never really conceived the story, something about real people, or 'ordinary people in extraordinary circumstances.'

Line one. Does it hook you, the first listener? Sometimes we accept line one because we're emoting, we want to emote, we need some words to emote with, and off we go, even though the words aren't all that interesting. Stick a kazoo in your mouth and you can get the emotive notation, rhythm and melody, and if some words come to you that truly hook you, make you want to know what the story implied in those words might be, spit out your kazoo and write the song. If you get stuck, pick up the kazoo again.

Doing it the same old way and accepting what you DO write, or complaining that you don't really like any of your own songs, and getting feedback from others that they don't really like them either, is all market research, indicating there are things wrong that, with some study, and some exploration of a kazoo, or other instrument, or style, or other uses of words, poetry, short stories, non-fiction, might break loose the real songwriter you want to be. For things to get better, something has to change. What can you change to get what you really want out of your songwriting? Explore. Study. Try some different things. Find it. It's there. Someone will find it and you'll hear it and wonder why you didn't think of that. Explore and find yours.


There will always be another song to be written. Someone will write it. Why not you? www.garyeandrews.com
#801932 - 03/11/10 01:16 AM Re: The Tools of Songwriting [Re: Jack Swain]  
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Noel Downs Offline
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Noel Downs  Offline
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Gungal NSW Australia
As an artist I would go out and see what I have laying around and think what can I turn that into... and once I have my art work I put it up on display .... and maybe people like it and maybe they don't.... some may actually buy some of my work... other bits I store or recycle...

So I reckon number two works unless you are in need of something specific...

smile

Cheers




http://www.soundclick.com/noeldownsandfriends

Tolerance means if you don't like something you ignore it
#801934 - 03/11/10 01:20 AM Re: The Tools of Songwriting [Re: Gary E. Andrews]  
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Gary E. Andrews Online content
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Gary E. Andrews  Online Content
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Portsmouth, Ohio, USA
I also recommend the 'Sister Song' technique.

You get a song idea going but it bogs down. Maybe you don't quite 'get' it yet so you don't know where to take it lyrically, or instrumentally. If you force your way forward it comes out weak, mediocre, uninteresting. Or it kills the creative flow you were enjoying.

Switch off and start another song, the 'Sister' to the first one.

When it bogs down, go back to the first one. You'll find it was incubating a bit while you were working on the second one and maybe you'll get another line or two, or more of the guitar work. If it bogs down, go back to the second song and work on it a bit.

This keeps your creative flow going, keeps the positive emotional satisfaction of emoting, creating, satisfying for you. Soon you'll have not one but two new songs that are structured and lyrically effective, in your opinion. Next you have to see how other opinions feel about it. Explore.


There will always be another song to be written. Someone will write it. Why not you? www.garyeandrews.com
#801935 - 03/11/10 01:25 AM Re: The Tools of Songwriting [Re: Gary E. Andrews]  
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Polly Hager Offline
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Polly Hager  Offline
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I have always felt that songs that were true-to-life were the best. If it's the truth, there IS a built in hook and you don't have to go digging for a story. I haven't written many songs, and only one of them would I consider "good", but it's my heart on my sleeve, for better or for worse, exposing my soul and my inate ability to choose people in my life that will inevitably tear my heart to pieces and walk away without a care. It's probably tasteless to post it here, but since we're talking about hooks, reality versus fiction, here it is (but don't listen if you don't want to...understood).

http://www.soundclick.com/player/single_player.cfm?songid=8485964&q=hi&newref=1

I'd actually like y'all to pick it to pieces...then we can all learn. smile


http://www.soundclick.com/pollyhager
http://www.facebook.com/polly.wilmot
http://www.reverbnation.com/rockcandycincy
You're supposed to be grooving as hard as you can, all of the time. - Stephen Gaskin
#801994 - 03/11/10 08:45 AM Re: The Tools of Songwriting [Re: Polly Hager]  
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BIG JIM MERRILEES Offline
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There was a kid sitting on the end of a pier fishing. He had a stick, some twine a can of worms and a bent pin for a hook. He caught fish after fish after fish. Along came a serious fisherman. He had a huge tackle box with all the latest gizmos and expensive gear including rods and reels worth many thousands. He sat beside the kid and fished but after several hours caught nothing. And the moral to this story is......?

You figure it out. Then see how this story applies to songwriting. I would be interested to hear the various interpretations that you all come up with.

#801999 - 03/11/10 09:53 AM Re: The Tools of Songwriting [Re: BIG JIM MERRILEES]  
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Kevin Edward Rose Offline
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Kevin Edward Rose  Offline
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An effective hook isn't enough. You also need a stick and some twine.

Did I get it, Jim?


Kevin Edward Rose
Celtic, Americana, whatever the folk.
Hailed by Performing Songwriter magazine as a "valued subscriber".
More music sold than Elvis and the Beatles combined!*
http://www.KevinEdwardRose.com
http://www.youtube.com/KevinEdwardRose
#802000 - 03/11/10 10:00 AM Re: The Tools of Songwriting [Re: Kevin Edward Rose]  
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BIG JIM MERRILEES Offline
BIG JIM MERRILEES  Offline

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Wow Kevin you are smarter than the average bear!

#802028 - 03/11/10 01:06 PM Re: The Tools of Songwriting [Re: BIG JIM MERRILEES]  
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Scott Campbell Offline
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Lakeland, FL, USA
The hook should be the icing on the cake - not the cake.

Lots of songs start with a hook - it's what you do after that though that either makes it good or mediocre. Combining a great hook with a mundane lyric or melody is like putting chrome mag wheels on an 1980 Ford Rustbucket. smile

Nice hooks are few and far between for me. When I find one, I ask myself if every line in the lyric is worthy of being in the same song as the hook. If not, I'll change it, even if it takes weeks or a month. I don't consider it done until every line is worthy of the hook.

If that sounds arrogant, keep in mind that while I might think the resulting song is good, I have no expectations that others will. grin

Scott



#802045 - 03/11/10 02:20 PM Re: The Tools of Songwriting [Re: Polly Hager]  
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Jerry Jakala Offline
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Nice song Polly.
I enjoyed it.
Thanks!



http://www.jerryjakala.com
http://cdbaby.com/cd/jakalajerry2

The difference between genius and stupidity is that there is a limit on genius.-Albert Einstein
#802052 - 03/11/10 02:39 PM Re: The Tools of Songwriting [Re: Jerry Jakala]  
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Ray E. Strode Offline
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Ray E. Strode  Offline
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I think I get it Big Jim,
You have all kinds of gizmos for recording music but you ain't getting any action. Wanna send me half of those Mics you are no longer using? I can put them to the same use! I will just knock out a wall or two to make room.


Ray E. Strode
#802067 - 03/11/10 02:58 PM Re: The Tools of Songwriting [Re: BIG JIM MERRILEES]  
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Tom Shea Offline
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Tom Shea  Offline
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Nebraska
This morning I de-constructed a song. I had written the lyrics for a song called More Than a Dream to Me for Justice's new cd. In my mind the music would be flowing and melodic (similar to a disney

I gave the lyrics to Lucas Kellison (Sadson Music Group) who was gong to write the music. Yesterday I went over to the studio and listened to the music he had written for it. Very good, fun, up-tempo, bouncy tween music with some hip hop flavor. (But nothing like I had envisioned for this song). But I realized that my lyrics did not fit the music - so this morning I de-constructed the lyrics, make them much more simple and boppy to fit the mucis.

You do what you have to. Tear the cabinet apart and re-do it.

Tom


Thomas Shea

Thomas Shea - Songwriting
http://www.soundclick.com/thomasshea

Justice - Songs
http://www.soundclick.com/justice-nebraska

#802068 - 03/11/10 03:00 PM Re: The Tools of Songwriting [Re: Tom Shea]  
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Tom Shea Offline
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Nebraska
I usually start with two pieces of wood 1) an idea (not necessarily a hook) and 2) a sense of the music (sometimes after listening to a song that I like that inspires me).

Tom


Thomas Shea

Thomas Shea - Songwriting
http://www.soundclick.com/thomasshea

Justice - Songs
http://www.soundclick.com/justice-nebraska

#802073 - 03/11/10 03:35 PM Re: The Tools of Songwriting [Re: Tom Shea]  
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Colin Ward Offline
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Saint Petersburg. FL
Polly,

That link did not work for me. I don't know which of your songs you are referring to.


Colin

I try to critique as if you mean business.....

http://colinwardmusic.com/

http://rosewoodcreekband.com/


#802092 - 03/11/10 06:11 PM Re: The Tools of Songwriting [Re: Colin Ward]  
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Polly Hager Offline
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Polly Hager  Offline
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Thanks, Jerry! Any crits?

Colin, try this: www.soundclick.com/pollyhager and click on "If You Could". Thanks in advance for dissecting the song! smile


http://www.soundclick.com/pollyhager
http://www.facebook.com/polly.wilmot
http://www.reverbnation.com/rockcandycincy
You're supposed to be grooving as hard as you can, all of the time. - Stephen Gaskin
#802117 - 03/11/10 07:59 PM Re: The Tools of Songwriting [Re: Polly Hager]  
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Colin Ward Offline
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Saint Petersburg. FL
Polly, I remember hearing this before.......I still like it a lot. The only thing I would do different is relabel V3 and V6 as Chorus 1 and 2 and renumber the verses accordingly - then ship it off to a few publishers!

I think you hit the nail on the head when you said a true to life song kinda writers itself.

Well done!!!


Colin

I try to critique as if you mean business.....

http://colinwardmusic.com/

http://rosewoodcreekband.com/


#802135 - 03/11/10 09:32 PM Re: The Tools of Songwriting [Re: Colin Ward]  
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Moker Jarrett Offline
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what's the purpose of the song? commercial,dedication to someone, jingle, film,for you as an artist, cut by another artist? assemble a sketch of the song, where does it take place, who's in it, what time of year is it,what are they doing,what's the conflict, what's the resolution...make a list of possible rhymes to pull from as you write that will help move your theme along...develop musical and lyrical hooks and subhooks...as you start putting it together, don't force it, make it fit...once the hook is solidified drive it home in a fashion that suits the purpose you started with...i.e= if it's a jingle 30 seconds or 60 seconds, for an artist- what subject matter do they do, what's their range? if it's for you and your audience at your shows-hell do what you like, if you ain't pitchin' it there ain't any rules...rules? learn the rules then watch all your favorite writers break em smile How'd I do Bill? hope you've been well...moker

#802173 - 03/12/10 12:31 AM Re: The Tools of Songwriting [Re: Moker Jarrett]  
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Polly Hager Offline
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I've been spying on Marc Barnette's posts, and tried very much to include his advice in this song. Like I said though, this is straight from the heart...came to me so fast I couldn't write it down fast enough...had to keep repeating lines to myself...melody as well. I'd LOVE to pitch it...but it's too long. Hate to cut anything.


http://www.soundclick.com/pollyhager
http://www.facebook.com/polly.wilmot
http://www.reverbnation.com/rockcandycincy
You're supposed to be grooving as hard as you can, all of the time. - Stephen Gaskin
#802774 - 03/14/10 03:38 PM Re: The Tools of Songwriting [Re: Polly Hager]  
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Mark Kaufman Offline
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Minneapolis
Bill, I've seen what you describe so many times...a clever title that you read, and once you open the post, you realize you've already seen the best part. What you have is a lyric built around this title-hook, but not having enough quality in all the other particulars to match the power of that cool title.

Sort of like a car built around a beautiful steering wheel, but the rest is sort of bland...but man, look at that WHEEL! WOW!

Frankly, I think too many songs are written in a frantic search for cleverness. And then, once that great hook is found, the rest of the package is often assembled in haste.

If you're not careful, a good hook can work like a joke...hear it once, it's great; hear it twice and it's not funny anymore. What sustains a good hook over repeated listens is the strength of all the other parts supporting it...even just within the lyric. The meter needs to flow, the balance of imagery and non-imagery must match the concept, the same intelligence that created the clever twist must still be evident in the other phrases.

So I think it's fine to start with the hook (or any other part of the jigsaw puzzle)...you just need to ensure the rest of the song has enough good stuff to keep it shining in its best light.


#802780 - 03/14/10 03:53 PM Re: The Tools of Songwriting [Re: Mark Kaufman]  
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Bob Cushing Offline
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I'm a songwriter. I've also been told I'm a tool!


bc
#802797 - 03/14/10 05:30 PM Re: The Tools of Songwriting [Re: Bob Cushing]  
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Moker Jarrett Offline
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Moker Jarrett  Offline
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jacksonville, fl
well put Mark. I've seen it alot as well, hell, i've been it alot smile not as much as i used to, but i'm still capable of it smile
hope things are rollin' for you bro...moker

#802809 - 03/14/10 06:51 PM Re: The Tools of Songwriting [Re: Moker Jarrett]  
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BIG JIM MERRILEES Offline
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Well put guys the song is the sum of all the parts. Worth pointing out that hooks can also be musical and production driven as well as lyrics.

Lyrics
Melody
Arrangement
performance
Production

These are IMO the five elements that make up a song. Different genres concentrate on different elements but generally a good song must tick all the five boxes.

#803766 - 03/18/10 06:24 PM Re: The Tools of Songwriting [Re: Gary E. Andrews]  
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billrocker Offline
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billrocker  Offline
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Nashville TN
Originally Posted by Gary E. Andrews
I don't think I ever started with THE hook/title and tried to write up to it.

Many lyrics I read, songs I hear, don't seem to have waited to 'get' the story. They went ahead and found a rhyme, or not, but went ahead and wrote lines, got the requisite number 3, or 4, or 8 or 16, then wrote more lines and called it a chorus, maybe went on to another verse, or two or three, maybe repeated the chorus, or wrote some lines and labeled it a bridge. But they never 'got' the song, never really conceived the story, something about real people, or 'ordinary people in extraordinary circumstances.'



This is the PRECISELY the point I was trying to make. Thanks for putting it out there more clearly than I think I did. The point is songs that I get often look more like excuses to use a hook idea than actual songs. I'm not for a moment discounting the importance of a good hook.

Bill Renfrew
www.writethismusic.com

#803770 - 03/18/10 06:30 PM Re: The Tools of Songwriting [Re: Steven August Rieck]  
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billrocker Offline
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Nashville TN
Gus,

Thanks for your kind words. It's a double edged sword. Sometimes (not very often unfortunately) I'll think of (what I think is) a GREAT hook and as we all know that's not an easy thing to do. Do ya chuck that 'cuz the story didn't come first? Of course not. But prudence is required in how the story is delivered. The question is can an authentic story be told that is punctuated by my hook idea or will I have to come up with some fabricated chain of events that somehow lead to me being able to use that hook? I thought of an idea yesterday..."I had to be right, and that's why she left." (not that that's great by any stretch). I'm still thinking...can I tell a story from real life experience (even if it's not my own life) that talks about someone who felt like they had to win every argument and couldn't admit being wrong one too many times? Maybe. Maybe not. but if I just launch into it with some story that isn't very believeable, listeners will most likely view it as a writer making an effort to use a cute play on words rather than tell a really great story.

Thanks for your reply.

Bill Renfrew
http://www.writethismusic.com

#803771 - 03/18/10 06:44 PM Re: The Tools of Songwriting [Re: BIG JIM MERRILEES]  
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billrocker Offline
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billrocker  Offline
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Jim,

You said...
Originally Posted by BIG JIM MERRILEES

The important thing is how good the finished article is not what tools were used or how it was written or produced.

Re a china cabinet...well it does not really matter what tools the cabinet maker used or how he actually made it....the important thing is how it looks when finished....how sturdy it is, how it functions and whether it is of a quality and design you would want to put your best china in.


I couldn't agree more. But given the same creative spirit the one who's more highly skilled in finishing, cutting, measuring, staining, gluing, etc will probably produce the finer work.

I should add that my metaphor was probably a bit misplaced...when I say 'tools' I'm speaking of an artists skills, not the quality of his brushes or how many brushes he owns. In songwriting I'm referring to tools as ability to turn a phrase, use of metaphor, ability to say it without actually saying it, use of imagery, rhyme, etc., not the amount of memory in his laptop or the edition of his rhyming dictionary.

Bill
www.writethismusic.com

#803783 - 03/18/10 07:15 PM Re: The Tools of Songwriting [Re: billrocker]  
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BIG JIM MERRILEES Offline
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Edinburgh, Scotland. UK
That is also what I meant in my post.......It is the sum of ALL the parts that dictates how good and saleable the finished article is. Any weak part of the process will have an adverse effect on the whole thing. No point in being the best craftsman with the best tools but producing specs and a design that nobody wants or alternatively the best design and specs are useless if the craftsman cannot cut a straight line or measure properly.
Your metaphor makes sense. But words are only a part of the process. All the things listed below are the ingredients or tools........ it is up to a songwriter to get the best results from them ALL.
Lyrics
Melody
Arrangement
performance
Production

#803790 - 03/18/10 07:53 PM Re: The Tools of Songwriting [Re: BIG JIM MERRILEES]  
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Mark Kaufman Offline
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I think most hit country writers DO actually write to the hook.

They just don't suck.

#803793 - 03/18/10 08:19 PM Re: The Tools of Songwriting [Re: Mark Kaufman]  
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BIG JIM MERRILEES Offline
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It is also worth mentioning that hooks can not just necessarily mean lyrics. Melody, arrangement, performance and production or a combination CAN ALSO BE EFFECTIVE HOOKS..

#803802 - 03/18/10 08:45 PM Re: The Tools of Songwriting [Re: BIG JIM MERRILEES]  
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billrocker Offline
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billrocker  Offline
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Nashville TN
Jim,

Yup, I agree with you that there're other parts to a musical song than the lyrical hook. For instance, there's that whole music part of it. And yes, a poorly conceived concept that's well crafted will be just that. I just figure stuff like that pretty much goes without saying.

My only point in all this was that our enthusiasm to invoke an idea that seems clever or cute (such as a title with a twist) can sometimes lead to poor judgement in the development of the story that uses that idea as the punchline. I also would guess that the higher the level of skill and experience that a writer posesses, the less chance of that happening. That's all. Not saying all that other stuff isn't important or that this is the most important thing in writing a good song and I'm not saying anything about what makes a song successful. I know better than that. ;>)

Bill
www.writethismusic.com

#803804 - 03/18/10 09:00 PM Re: The Tools of Songwriting [Re: BIG JIM MERRILEES]  
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Gary E. Andrews Online content
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Gary E. Andrews  Online Content
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Portsmouth, Ohio, USA
That's what I call 'hook factor.'

Hook factor starts with the very first sound. It may be a percussive beat. It may be a a single chord stroke on a guitar or keyboard. Or horns.

Then it's the combination of that first sound with the others. The percussion combines with the pitched instruments, and further 'sets' the hook, to continue the 'fishing' metaphor. When a fisherperson jerks the rod it causes the hook to go into the fish's jaw, hooking it.

The voice of the singer then further sets the hook. We like (or don't) the timbre of the voice, the character we sense in it, the urgency, the emotion.

The melody enhances the hook-factor. Listeners get onto the melody and sing along, in their heads at first, and, if they like it, out loud later.

Rhyme is a great element of hook-factor. Nursery 'rhymes' rhyme for that reason; hook-factor. Even young children can 'get' the storyline because the rhyme matches the sound AND makes sense in the story.

The 'right/left' idea as THE hook doesn't strike me as all that strong. The idea of a human being insisting on being right all the time and driving someone away, as the theme of the storyline, could be very strong, and THE hook could probably be found in the process of writing it, as the writer 'gets' the story, conceives what is important in the experience of the singer-character.

The right combination of all the factors, percussion, pitched instruments, vocal treatment, storyline, rhyme, could be very good. The wrong combination could be mediocre or plain bad, memorable, or forgettable.


There will always be another song to be written. Someone will write it. Why not you? www.garyeandrews.com
#803973 - 03/19/10 08:23 PM Re: The Tools of Songwriting [Re: Mark Kaufman]  
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billrocker Offline
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Originally Posted by Mark Kaufman
I think most hit country writers DO actually write to the hook.

They just don't suck.


You know, there's probably more truth there than I've seen in a long time. Also funny as....

I confess, I often start with a hook. Something will pop in my head but...[I won't beat a dead horse...insert what everyone else said here].

with respect,

Bill
www.writethismusic.com


#804474 - 03/22/10 02:08 AM Re: The Tools of Songwriting [Re: Tom Shea]  
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billrocker Offline
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billrocker  Offline
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Nashville TN
Tom,

I'd like to see those lyrics some time. What style of music were you expecting in return? You said it didn't come back sounding like you expected. Just curious. Maybe you could write another song for the music he wrote and seek different music for this one?

Bill Renfrew
www.writethismusic.com


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