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#699596 - 03/08/09 06:33 AM Finally Lets Get It Over With!  
Joined: Apr 2005
Posts: 7,997
Mike Caro Substudio Offline
Mike Caro Substudio  Offline

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Joined: Apr 2005
Posts: 7,997
NY
It seems SO many of our threads turn into a new subject (which is cool) One of those subjects is that we are CONSTANTLY comparing todays music to yesterdays.
So now here's one that starts out that way.

Now VERY IMPORTANT lol.. without fighting! This is for FUN!
Lets talk about it with some common sense. And not just badgering todays pop stars. Oh and even though I will make it crystal clear as to what the real deal is... But it will still never be "Finally Over With" LOL smile

And that reason is very simple POP music's life, it's very existence is breathed into by the YOUNG! If your 10 year old knows that The Beatles kick ass over EVERYBODY
today but still loves & enjoys lots of today's music then you got one GREAT kid there ....


RULE#1 - NO using the BIG FOUR. You will see the total destruction of this decade in popular music without even mentioning the big brit four. It's NOT even fair to bring them into the conversation so DON'T LOL. But these were VERY popular acts! smile to say the least!

NO mentioning or using!
The Beatles
The Rolling Stones
Led Zeppelin
The Who

RULE #2 No fighting! lol

---------------------------------------------

Okay here is the challenge. We will add the Fun Chart later.
I'll give you a POP act that was very popular and sold LOADS of records you tell me who is there equal today?? Anytime in this decade. Go!


Pop Act 1 - The Bee Gees Shoot! & GOOD LUCK!

-------------------------------------



Okay enough talk lets get on with the game.. it's starts on the next thread below!


Thanks!
Peace Mike
Sub

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#699600 - 03/08/09 07:05 AM Re: Finally Lets Get It Over With! [Re: Mike Caro Substudio]  
Joined: Apr 2005
Posts: 7,997
Mike Caro Substudio Offline
Mike Caro Substudio  Offline

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Joined: Apr 2005
Posts: 7,997
NY
It will never be really over with....

And that reason is very simple POP music's life, it's very existence is breathed into by the YOUNG! If your 10 year old knows that The Beatles kick ass over EVERYBODY
today but still loves & enjoys lots of today's music then you got one GREAT kid there smile

But if you can't convince them, don't force it. It's THERE TIME & THERE MUSIC & FUN let them have it!! When I was 7 years old and listening to Black Sabbath in my room. My Mom and Dad never had to convince me of ANYTHING.
I KNEW then Johnny Mathis had a GREAT voice and Tony Williams of THe PLATTERS
had magic in his voice. I would sit frozen listening to Johnny Cash's deep voice
and Perry Comos' silky tone. And I know ever Al Jolson song by heart!! smile
And you do not forget the harmonies & feel of the 50's if you LOVE music!

So we will play a GAME here so that means RULES! lol let me lay out a few facts & fictions and clear up the stuff people keep saying over & over and some guidelines as well...

1- We had crap POP music in EVERY decade so it's exactly the same today as it was then.
1A - VERY TRUE expect... you ALWAYS forget the we had FAR FAR FAR FAR more awesome stuff that was VERY,VERY,VERY popular and we had INSTRUMENTALS on the CHARTS! How can any musician think ANYTHING is better than that? How the hell does anyone forget these things? Well anyone "who knows" doesn't that's why today's pop music belongs to today's youth smile
The BEST were actually often the most POPULAR as well. How Rare!

2- We forget we are in 2009. Is there GREAT classical music in the world today.
YES! Does the majority of the world give a rats ass? lol NO! Classical used to be POP! Beethoven was a Rock Star! smile If anyone tells me classical music overall is better than Mozart or Beethoven's era.. I will laugh. The best thing we have in that regard (popular) is our "film composers - John Williams,Jerry Goldsmith,etc...
John Williams is a monster and would be in any damn century smile

2A- If ROCK or SOUL/R&B is your music the 1900's hundreds was the best time to live in... If your are a JAZZ & JAZZ?FUSION head. It is now 2009 that time is OVER in the mainstream. Just like classical music is over as being the popular music.

Do I LOVE Western movies from the 70's 80' 90's and now YES! But the best were made in the 50's overall. Just more & more quality. I LOVE music today but you CAN NOT find the equal of soul music to MOTOWN or the 60's - 70's. Sorry! Wish ya could. It was the TIME! for it!
It can only be cheaper imitations. We are a fast learning race! We burn it out quickly. Another remake in the movies!! Another sample from an old song!
We are just hanging around the adjustment period smile

3- Country Music. My wife calls me the human jukebox as well as other things LOL.
Why? Cause every single informercial that comes on in ANY genre of Popular music from any decade I know all the songs and sing them as they are rolling down the screen and playing.

I have always liked Country Music, I like ALL music. But I feel that the biggest change in popular Country music is just more & more injections of Rock & Teen Pop. I mean look at your biggest Country charted song right now in the overall top 20. "Love Story" It could be any girl pop star doing it. It is not "Stand By Your Man" but it is right? And you have Bon Jovi now lol
In other words it's changed but hasn't changed.

We will FOCUS the discussion on POP! but if you want to post an example for popular country be my guest.



Thanks!
Peace Mike
Sub

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#699606 - 03/08/09 07:59 AM Re: Finally Lets Get It Over With! [Re: Mike Caro Substudio]  
Joined: Apr 2005
Posts: 7,997
Mike Caro Substudio Offline
Mike Caro Substudio  Offline

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Joined: Apr 2005
Posts: 7,997
NY
Geez Sub - Go easy lol... Try to even match The Rascals never mind the Bee Gee's

The Young Rascals 1960's

Groovin
A Beautiful Morning
How Can I Be Sure
I Been Lonely Too Long
Good Lovin'

Wow real Rock mixed with real Soul what a concept smile

I know Big Jim is gonna find something on the radio today for us to best this smile





Thanks!
Peace Mike
Sub

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#699607 - 03/08/09 08:07 AM Re: Finally Lets Get It Over With! [Re: Mike Caro Substudio]  
Joined: Apr 2005
Posts: 7,997
Mike Caro Substudio Offline
Mike Caro Substudio  Offline

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Joined: Apr 2005
Posts: 7,997
NY
Ya know who I really really like today's James Morrison - "You Give Me Something"
Very catchy and well done, soulful and enjoyable in this market of mush smile
He will have to grow & sustain to be one of the greats of all time, not likely for anybody but i wish him luck. He seems to be a cool dude!

About some of todays songs always try to remember this..
Your sitting in the studio and your listening back to this whacky silly song with all these samples and loops and whatever else. Then someone turns to YOU and says'

"Hey this sounds Great! and congratulations for getting it picked up by a major label
for a major artist. It's on the radio everyday for a while anyway.

ALL HITS sound MUCH better when they are YOURS! smile


Thanks!
Peace Mike
Sub

Music & Video's & Photo's
http://www.soundclick.com/bands/default.cfm?bandID=482602

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#699608 - 03/08/09 08:19 AM Re: Finally Lets Get It Over With! [Re: Mike Caro Substudio]  
Joined: Nov 2006
Posts: 8,463
BIG JIM MERRILEES Offline
BIG JIM MERRILEES  Offline

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Joined: Nov 2006
Posts: 8,463
Edinburgh, Scotland. UK
OK Mike I will bite...I am very lucky....I was born in the early fifties....lived through the sixties and seventies..and survived!
Shook my head through the eighties and am completely dumbfounded at the nineties and beyond.
Yes there was disposable music in every era...I cringe NOW at some of the stuff we thought was cool...But most of it was pretty great stuff....it lasted, was revolutionary and it is still played A LOT even by the younger generations.

Nowadays generally we do not see anything groundbreaking or new or innovative....earth shattering....we say OH that has been done before..or nothing special...It is just OK....Some is not even OK.....When was the last time you saw a live band on TV and though OMG they are really great musicians PUSHING THE BOUNDARIES AND RAISING THE BAR?....never heard that sound before WOW. Even better whan was the last time you saw a popstar actually sing live with a truly live band? We had simple technology and most of the gizmos were basic and unreliable...with todays stuff they should be doing a hell of a lot better.

There are some good acts BUT where is the originality and or staying power....I am not a human juke box but can recognise old riffs and patterns from the sixties and seventies being hailed as new.....Hey we were playing those when their parents were still at school.

I blame Simon Cowell....LOL

#699623 - 03/08/09 10:45 AM Re: Finally Lets Get It Over With! [Re: BIG JIM MERRILEES]  
Joined: May 2002
Posts: 986
argo Offline
Serious Contributor
argo  Offline
Serious Contributor

Joined: May 2002
Posts: 986
boston,massachusetts
Hi Mike,
I'll just take one aspect of today's pop music to look at. Girl Singers. I compare today to the '55-'65 era when there were a ton of female vocalists charting hits. very few made it into the '70s with their careers intact. Only the cream of the crop, Diana Ross,Dionne Warwick, ie, but with the advent of Disco in the late '70s a whole new group of female lead vocalists came about including the likes of Donna Summer, Whitney Houston. Maybe someone will talk about the 'boy bands' of the '50's and the '80's, not me though.
Rick

#699659 - 03/08/09 03:24 PM Re: Finally Lets Get It Over With! [Re: argo]  
Joined: Apr 2001
Posts: 18,829
Brian Austin Whitney Offline
Brian Austin Whitney  Offline

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Joined: Apr 2001
Posts: 18,829
Indianapolis, IN USA
It's not a comparable era. Those acts wouldn't have gotten a deal today for the most part because of how the industry works. So comparing people from a different era in terms of commercial music is pointless. It's like comparing eras in Football or Baseball. Does anyone actually think Babe Ruth could make a major league roster today? Too fat. Too slow. Not in good shape. No chance. One of the NFL announcers who played on a Super Bowl winning team said that the Undefeated Miami Dolphins that everyone exalts would get beaten down by this year's Detroit Lions which didn't win a game. He said it wouldn't even be close and that Detroit would win by 60. The speed, size, strength is all just too different.

The older era artist had a gigantic advantage. First, there was runaway corruption at the labels that would make today's corruption look harmless. And no one really knew about it. They paid off every radio station, and they worked the media before media understood what brazen propaganda was all about. People watching, reading and listening to the media were not as savvy either so when they read or saw or heard something, they believed it in a naive way. Big crowds of screaming girls which were all hired to do so fooled people into believing something was going on. Today people ho-hum that kind of silliness. They also rabidly bought airplay so that exactly what they want on the air was played. Sure they still do that today, but the stakes are much much higher. Back then you could buy airplay with some hookers and blow. Now it's multi-million dollars payouts. Back then they didn't have to deal with media conglomerates and stockholders. They could take a risk on an act and wait around for that investment to mature. Today's labels can't do that. It has to be instant success or the A&R guy is fired and the execs are fired and the act is cut loose, albeit under contract so they can't continue their career without permission from the corporation. That factor alone guarentees that today's artist won't have the depth of artists back then. They're too young and unable to develop. Instead they rely on youth and good looks or some type of gimmick, both of which fade away quickly. It's a different business.

So comparing what happens today to what happened decades ago is good folly for those who don't understand the big picture and reality, but if you understand the business, you realize it's as silly as comparing a stage coach to a humvee.

All that said, there's far more GOOD to GREAT music being made today than ever before. Just in the last decade professional quality recordings have grown well more than 10 fold if not 100 fold. More diversity and risk taking happens than ever before. But if people want to hear it, they have to do some work. If you only listen to what 4 multinational major corporations want to feed you, you're going to be sadly disappointed.

Brian


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"Don't sit around and wait for success to come to you... it doesn't know the way." -Brian Austin Whitney

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#699663 - 03/08/09 03:36 PM Re: Finally Lets Get It Over With! [Re: Brian Austin Whitney]  
Joined: May 2001
Posts: 7,294
Ray E. Strode Online content
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Ray E. Strode  Online Content
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Joined: May 2001
Posts: 7,294
Brunswick, Ga. USA
Well lets see,
There was Bob Wills in the 30's, Ernest Tubb in the 40's, Webb Pierce in the 50's, and George Jones in the 60's.

Not to mention, Frank, Dino, Perry, Johnny,(Mathis), and many others. Did I mention Slim Whitman?


Ray E. Strode
#699675 - 03/08/09 04:10 PM Re: Finally Lets Get It Over With! [Re: Ray E. Strode]  
Joined: Apr 2005
Posts: 7,997
Mike Caro Substudio Offline
Mike Caro Substudio  Offline

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Joined: Apr 2005
Posts: 7,997
NY
Actually the discussion keeps coming up over & over & over.

How I feel is that if you are a child or teenager and think today's popular & music scene is better than yesterdays' it is totally 100% cool.

If you are an adult well it is is kinda of unusual to think that way. even if for sentiment alone.

If you are a MUSICIAN or a SONGWRITER and RECORD LABEL or A MUSIC RETAIL store which every single one has closed in my area now and think that way you may be out of your mind smile lol...

I also agree with Brian about sports & sports figures, You can't have GREAT linebackers from then trying to get around 365lb lineman today. Etc....

Although it doesn't fly with all of sports, music is different SIZE & SPEED has nothing to do with music what so ever. Muhammad Ali BEATS ANY fighter of the past or present day on a regular bases. Size included!

If Stevie Wonder were 22 today he couldn't make it?

Anyway I think we always take this debate "somewhere else" smile
But the point of this is to try to stay on POP music that means WHAT is on the RADIO EVERYDAY. Not looking all over the internet to find something. Radio still exists.

So hear is the question - If TODAY"S POP music is better or equal to yesterday's
than someone HAS TO be better and more deeply talented than The BEE GEES
Right?
Who might that be?

I'm waiting smile

What musician thinks there is a POP group today that is superior to
CHICAGO?



Thanks!
Peace Mike
Sub

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http://www.soundclick.com/bands/default.cfm?bandID=482602

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#699677 - 03/08/09 04:16 PM Re: Finally Lets Get It Over With! [Re: Mike Caro Substudio]  
Joined: Apr 2001
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Kaley Willow Offline
Kaley Willow  Offline

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Posts: 10,240
PA
Hi Sub... (tryin this again smile )

What I think's interesting is my daughter..(almost 13) prefers
kiddie pop or what I grew up on. (not suppose to mention some of their names as per your request Sub grin but yeah.the B-----s, and Bread, and the (Monkeys..I know..but she likes them)..she does not hear me state a strong opinion on it....or else believe me, she'd say JUST THE OPPOSITE grin grin ... I feel the era of strong melodies was the 50,60, 70's...but then I wasn't alive back in the 40's 30's or 20's........ Just think it's interesting
that my sweet but very strongly opinionated daughter.. smile
loves the groups I grew up on..... I try to keep quiet about it...and just grin behind her back.

Best to you....
Hugs...
Kaley

#699678 - 03/08/09 04:17 PM Re: Finally Lets Get It Over With! [Re: Mike Caro Substudio]  
Joined: Apr 2005
Posts: 7,997
Mike Caro Substudio Offline
Mike Caro Substudio  Offline

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Joined: Apr 2005
Posts: 7,997
NY
I believe that the big point is like what Brian said, We can't compare!
It's a different TIME now. Does not mean it's better now though, depend who and what you are. At least not from my position in any regard whatsoever.

The music on radio is completely different and always moves on. NO ONE can tell me that they rehearse harder and are better prepared than the Glen Miller or Benny Goodman Band was. Rehearse what? But people in general are not interested in how well you play. And how you execute live. And those bands were still POP music. The kids LOVED THEM and they could feel the music. Just so happens they had GREAT musicians making it.

Different time, different game. smile Pop music belongs to the kids that is why it always best when you are one smile


Thanks!
Peace Mike
Sub

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#699684 - 03/08/09 04:27 PM Re: Finally Lets Get It Over With! [Re: Brian Austin Whitney]  
Joined: Sep 2007
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Mark Kaufman Offline
Mark Kaufman  Offline

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Joined: Sep 2007
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Minneapolis
There is no way for anyone on any side to be either correct or incorrect in this debate.

Right now, the Kaiser Chiefs have a song out called "You Want History". It's an incredibly well produced (okay, so we like a lot of compression these days), well-written and well performed song. But it doesn't sound like the BeeGees and it doesn't sound like the Young Rascals and it doesn't sound like the Chicago. Still, pound for pound, the effort and the result is every bit as good as the others.

Sometimes I prefer to imagine what might happen if a hit from today were to magically appear in 1968 or 1972 or whatever. I think, in many cases, they might take the world by storm.

But the difficulty of this exercise is finding similar niches...there is no Young Rascals niche today...it's old people's music.

#699686 - 03/08/09 04:33 PM Re: Finally Lets Get It Over With! [Re: Mike Caro Substudio]  
Joined: Sep 2008
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Polly Hager Offline
Helping Hand
Polly Hager  Offline
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Cincinnati, OH USA
*Sits on hands...squirming...hands get Tourette's Syndrome...ZEPPELIN IS THE GREATEST!!!* (Exhaling) I'm so sorry! Please disregard that outburst! *smacks own hands*

Am I alone in this, or does anyone else notice that after the early '80's, it seems that up and coming bands just got lazier at writing and playing? I think this is the reason that kids today are getting back into 70's and 80's music. Well, Guitar Hero has something to do with it too. But listen to the intricacies and "call and anawer" between vocalists and guitarists back in the day, and then the simplified, shallow music to overtake the 90's up to now. It's hard to appreciate today's music when you grew up listening to such greats as Jimmy Page, Jeff Beck, John Mclaughlin, Pete Townsend...the list goes on. There was a time, especially at concerts, when the audience, as a collective consciousness, held their breath and hung on a guitar player's every note during a 10-minute solo, or enjoyed the blues/jazz improv of a great rock vocalist. You don't see that now, not from the popular grunge bands or pop bands. Jam bands are in the background, but not on the radio. Some songs I hear today are so predictable and generic I wonder how the artist isn't embarrassed releasing it...maybe they just don't know any better.

One band I think will be around for awhile and is raw enough and honest enough...just a good rock sound and great lyrics, is Foo Fighters.

One that is so underrated it's a major shame, is The Donnas. We're talking old school rock sound and tons of energy, and a guitar player (Allison Robertson) who can match the big boys. She plays with soul, just like the old greats.

What was the challenge again? grin


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#699693 - 03/08/09 04:48 PM Re: Finally Lets Get It Over With! [Re: Mark Kaufman]  
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Mike Caro Substudio Offline
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Originally Posted by Mark Kaufman
There is no way for anyone on any side to be either correct or incorrect in this debate.

Right now, the Kaiser Chiefs have a song out called "You Want History". It's an incredibly well produced (okay, so we like a lot of compression these days), well-written and well performed song. But it doesn't sound like the BeeGees and it doesn't sound like the Young Rascals and it doesn't sound like the Chicago. Still, pound for pound, the effort and the result is every bit as good as the others.

Sometimes I prefer to imagine what might happen if a hit from today were to magically appear in 1968 or 1972 or whatever. I think, in many cases, they might take the world by storm.

But the difficulty of this exercise is finding similar niches...there is no Young Rascals niche today...it's old people's music.


Hi Mark

I like The Kaiser Chiefs alot. And yes they do not sound like The Bee Gee's, Chicago or The Young Rascals. They sound like a lot like quite a few 1980's bands for sure smile

I don't know that they will be able i(n todays world) too last long . Although Nickelback is and they are stale as is it gets.

So for the results to be as good does that mean everything should be as good?




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#699705 - 03/08/09 05:11 PM Re: Finally Lets Get It Over With! [Re: Mike Caro Substudio]  
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Well, take Beck then. In my view, he stands tall next to all three. As does Tori Amos, or PJ Harvey.

But again, my point is that there are multiple comparison points that just can't really work...now vs then, new style vs old style, marketplace "good" vs classic "good". Put it all together and it's just too hard to come up with a comparison that works.

#699708 - 03/08/09 05:30 PM Re: Finally Lets Get It Over With! [Re: Mark Kaufman]  
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Mike Caro Substudio Offline
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Originally Posted by Mark Kaufman
Well, take Beck then. In my view, he stands tall next to all three. As does Tori Amos, or PJ Harvey.

But again, my point is that there are multiple comparison points that just can't really work...now vs then, new style vs old style, marketplace "good" vs classic "good". Put it all together and it's just too hard to come up with a comparison that works.


Mark

I like Beck but he was never nearly as POP as any of the artist's I mentioned but I mainly mentioned in this thread in comparison was the The Bee Gees.
I like Rod Stewart better and Jeff Beck smile

Anyway -Tori Amos Pj HArvey or whoever you are mentioning is NOT sitting on the top of the billboard charts.

We are talking about POP music..

QUEEN was a POP GROUP with BIG HITS as well as a Rock band. Has anyone besides me sat at in front of Queen Live?

If so can they tell me how The Kasier Chiefs who do NOT dominate pop charts or anyone else for that matter does not get get melted off the stage by Queen.

So so far Mark thinks the Kasier Chiefs,PJ Harvey, Tori Amos & Beck are the equal in Pop Music to The Bee Gee's

Anyone else? smile




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#699722 - 03/08/09 06:06 PM Re: Finally Lets Get It Over With! [Re: Mike Caro Substudio]  
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Mark Kaufman Offline
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Well, if this is one of those "you name a group and I'll pound it down" threads, I apologize for misunderstanding. grin

Thing is, the BeeGees, the Young Rascals, and Chicago are now on the oldies stations...and not one of their recordings would have a chance in hell if released today. I will continue to listen to them...but anyone tries to do it the way they did it will get nowhere fast in the 21st century.

This reminds me of a discussion I had with my mother long ago when she poopooed my admiration of the Beatles by saying they were horrible compared to the Big Bands of the 40's...she said there was no comparison, and I agreed...I agreed only because they were both great, and it was like comparing Buster Keaton to Steve Martin.

Maybe the most important question to wonder about is Why do so many people like today's hit songs enough to purchase them? And why aren't they as interested in what we can "prove" is "better"?

I think Good-Better-Best has always been irrelevant in the world of hit songs. What has always mattered is Now--what will work today? And going back through the charts, that holds up...for every great and timeless song, there is an annoying lesser work that was absolutely right for the times, and earned its place as a pop hit. It's not really a game of talent, it's a game of smart thinking.

Don't get mad at me Sub, you know I love you. grin

#699725 - 03/08/09 06:15 PM Re: Finally Lets Get It Over With! [Re: Mike Caro Substudio]  
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The Bee Gees were heavily derided in the Disco Days. Disco music was roundly hated and ridiculed in the media. People of that era said it sucked and didn't compare to previous music.

I'll tell you a current artist as talented as any in previous genrations, even though I personally don't care for what he does. Justin Timberlake. He can sing, dance, act, play live intruments, write, produce and he does a ton for charity and even plays a great game of golf. He's the real deal even though the music he does would be scoffed at by most still living in the 60's and 70's. Even Whitney Houston's music will stand the test of time. U2 is the equal of any band you've mentioned including the fab boys. The specific "style" is different, but he depth and longevity and ability to remain current far surpasses those explosive but relative short careers of many of those 70's bands. U2 is as or more relevant today as they were in the 80's. Madonna has had far more hits than the Bee Gees I believe. It's all relative. I'd place Mellancamp up against and folk rocker from the past you can present.

For an artist to have longevity today, that's a far more impressive accomplishment than acts having long careers back in the day.

As for the 80's music, like Disco in the 70's, it was hated by those who loved hte 60's and 70's music.. but right now it's the most popular classic pop/rock music in the world. You can't go anywhere in Europe without hearing it on nearly every radio station. You don't hear 60's and 70's classic rock anymore there. On Internet Radio (this comes directly from people who know it better than anyone else) 80's music is the most popular format. Kids today love their current music and they love 80's music. Most could care less about the bands mentioned at the top by Mike. Also Elvis has fallen from the radar screen almost completely except among old people. To me Elvis was barely a step above Britney Spears. He was a pop idol who sold himself out to any sleazy project (movies.. ack) available to the highest bidder. Sure, the "Colonel" was pushing that, but it's no different than Britney's "people" selling her soul out either. I can listen to many artists from the 50's and 60's and 70's that don't sound horribly dated. Elvis does. But I am sure some old folks here will find that sacreligious.

You don't hear as many artists today being ground breaking. That's because labels/corporations will not allow them to release such material. But there's some great off the wall and original acts out there. They'll just never get played on the radio and so their styles will never become mass appeal. And most here would hear them for the first time and be repelled by them. That's nearly ALWAYS what happens with something new. People hate it until they love it. Since you won't hear any of it enough to learn the love it, you think there's no great new music being made. But there is. You just have to do some work to find it, learn about it, get used to it and then start loving it.

The days of being hand fed something good are over. People used to hand feed us groups like the "Bee Gees" whether we wanted them or not. Today, the early Bee Gee's (i.e. pre disco) songs would never have a chance to be heard. There's plenty of "Bee Gees" out there. Just not on the radio and not likely ever to be on the radio again.

Brian


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"Don't sit around and wait for success to come to you... it doesn't know the way." -Brian Austin Whitney

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#699726 - 03/08/09 06:21 PM Re: Finally Lets Get It Over With! [Re: Mark Kaufman]  
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Mike Caro Substudio Offline
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Mark

Never mad! Iove ya to smile

I LIKE current music, I don't mean to pound it down. As a producer and a writer I would be foolish t think that way for real...

What I'm slowly trying to show is that times change and this is what it is.
You say Those great groups couldn't be on the radio today, okay? But you think some of the acts today get even a second look when those artist are there competition. Not happening!

Another point I'm trying to show is that back then what was THE BEST was also VERY POPULAR as well as the DAvid Cassidy's etc....
That is NOT what is happening today... The industry does not PROMOTE ALL KINDs of music outside the internet. They stick obscure bands on late night TV and they so many of them are not very promising.

I'll make a Pop Chart for some decades and you can see what I mean.

Does anyone here beside me own all the episodes of the Midnight Special?

After HELEN REDDY performs WEATHER REPORT performs... featuring Jaco Pastorieus on NAtional TV 10 channels only. They are on the CHARTS

Is that not UNREAL to you? That mean the liit;e boys and girls who want sing along with DELTA DAWN here & see Weather Report.
That IS ALL I NEED to see and know to know how much better the POP music was.

I think as REAL music lovers and songwriters/musicains and what have you we can see a little past that "MY PARENTS HATED" stuff. I mean really!

How come I listened to Glen Miller, Marylyn Manson, DMX , King Crimson, & BArry White yesterday and My MOM didn't?




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#699733 - 03/08/09 06:40 PM Re: Finally Lets Get It Over With! [Re: Brian Austin Whitney]  
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Mike Caro Substudio Offline
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The Bee Gees who did very well in the 60's could of disappeared instead they dominated in an era were there original style could have made them history.
For anyone to think of the Bee Gees as only a disco fad is an in-injustice to say the least.

Also Barry Gibb produced so many number #1 hits I think only second to George Martin.. Then he wrote hits for other BIG stars such as Kenny Rogers, Dolly Parton Barbra Streisand etc...

Those guys voices, melodies,versatility and musical talent would dominate today if they were 22 years old now?

Anything flooding the airwaves day & night will eventually "suck" to someone but a fad like Disco had to go! Just like That punky scene in the late 70's that came next.
Only disco players could PLAY! if that matters to the public is another story.

I think Justin Timberlake is very talented only his musical depth is not, I have seen his live performances and he is not very strong. Two chords on the keyboard and just trying to soul slide up & down in a weak Michael impersonation.
I do like him in films better than on stage and record. I don't think he know's what a patch bay is in the studio. But that's noy what makes him a star. Being on The Mickey Mouse Club did that...

At one time Stevie Wonder walked off with every award then it was Michael JAckson
they were winning grammies and they were the BEST around.

Does anyone honestly who is not s child think that Justin Timberlake is as musically talented as Stevie Wonder or even Michael Jackson? Can that possibly be true?

Cause it's not, but that's the point. Pop music is not sharing the spotlight with all the best artists anymore.








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#699740 - 03/08/09 07:06 PM Re: Finally Lets Get It Over With! [Re: Mike Caro Substudio]  
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Okay is time to Start The Chart Enough debates fun time!!

The problem that most have is that they put everyone into the same bag so they can't find the difference. What I'm saying is in the past pop music was put more into one bag. INSTRUMENTALS were HIT SONGS! Ya follow? Who was the last one to do that? Kenny G? in the 80's?

Try keeping the same type of POP artist the same fro each decade and see hw it goes. MAle or female, group or act, Soul or Rock Country Etc... Based..

40's - Bing Crosby, Frank Sinatra, Glen Miller, Tommy Dorsey
50's - Elvis Presely, Nat King Cole, Perry Como Fabian,Ray Charles
60's - Fabian, Frankie Avalon, Frankie Vali
70's - David Cassidy,Bobby Sherman,Donnie Osmond, Leif Garret
80's - MIchael Jackson, Rick Springfield, Lionel Ritchie, Prince...Rick Astley
90's - Rico Suave, lol.. Ricky Martin, Michael Bolton, Billy Ray Cirus
2000's - Justin Timberlake,Ricky Martin, Marc Anthony, ......

Help me now.... smile




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#699753 - 03/08/09 08:05 PM Re: Finally Lets Get It Over With! [Re: Mike Caro Substudio]  
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Turn the debate on its head..... if some of todays bands were magically transported back in time and tried to get hits with their stuff then would they make it.....possibly but I think probably not....different style and different era....however I think technically they would probably struggle I honestly do not think the technical skill today is up to the same quality....Would the artists of yesteryear if magically transported forward to today get hits....probably they would.... their music is still alive today....most of the modern stuff is here today gone tomorrow.

#699765 - 03/08/09 08:54 PM Re: Finally Lets Get It Over With! [Re: BIG JIM MERRILEES]  
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Well Jim, on the technical level I believe the proficiency for those who are really serious and study music is as high as it has ever been. There are some people out there today who are incredible. However, because so many people now consider themselves musicians because they can strum a guitar and have a computer the ratio of highly proficient to the total is way down, and I believe lower than ever.

For example, there was a boy who graduated with one of my daughters who is a serious jazz musician. He plays the saxophone. I also played the saxophone for many years and studied music in college playing the instrument. I happen to love jazz, although it is not my primary focus in music, so I will tell you that he may be the finest saxophone player I have seen in several years. He is a fine enough musician that before he was out of high school he could easily take on a position in any serious jazz band in the country. I went to his high school's senior year recital where he performed a self composed jazz piece featuring himself on the sax, and I tell you he blew me away. It was complex, it was written in a couple of movements so there was a great deal of emotional variety in the piece and the technique he displayed was stunning. I predict he will be a GREAT name in jazz for his generation, and could hold his own with any group playing today.

On the other hand, I am out and about playing regularly and get to see many young musicians every week. many of them I consider friends, and a few of them have promise but most of them are very weak and do not show significant improvement over time. I do not have any high expectations for most of them. That said, some of them are in bands who I feel are bordering on terrible but get press because they represent the youth trends in music. So, some of them will go far beyond anything I think they deserve, but hey it's not my call.

I do not mean to belittle a musician good or bad in any way and will always offer encouragement and advice if they ask, especially if I think there is potential that could bloom if nurtured a little. The quickest way for me to lose respect for a musician is when I see one show utter disrespect for another one, maybe because he feels he is more talented or something. Everyone has to develop, and no one is born a fully formed musical genius. It has to be nurtured.

The biggest problem I see with many of the very young musicians is their own disregard for anything in music that came before they were born. Music evolves and it folds in on itself, with repeating trends. A compleat musician needs to understand what has gone before to advance it, or else, they repeat the weakest parts of the past and think they were an original!

Last edited by Jack Swain; 03/08/09 09:03 PM.
#699800 - 03/08/09 09:49 PM Re: Finally Lets Get It Over With! [Re: Jack Swain]  
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Jack there are some very fine musicians out there...only today I watched a thirteen year old guitarist who jammed with the big boys and blew them away...he had a great sense of humour smiling whilst playing and was as respectful and unassuming as you could get. He busked everything from seventies rock to current chart stuff at an open mic I was hosting he prefers classic rock I might add. That said there are some chartbusting groups whose pianists play with two index fingers and guitarists only seem to know three or four chords ....it is the latter I was referring to.
I agree about disregard...I love music of all kinds and can listen to music from any era.....I like some of the recent stuff...but most of it is pretty mediocre and lack lustre.

#699909 - 03/09/09 11:18 AM Re: Finally Lets Get It Over With! [Re: BIG JIM MERRILEES]  
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This is an interesting discussion. It seems though that today's most important factor is missing from the discussion - except for some of Brian's comments - marketing. It's not about how good of a musician, songwriter, or singer one is - in today's world, it is possible for some very gifted and well-trained people to underachieve on the economic side of their art endeavors. Competition has become exponentially larger with each passing decade and each technological advancement.
What's considered "Pop" today has expanded from what was considered "Pop" in past decades. A lot of listings for "Pop" music at TAXI and similar sites are looking for songs that basically crossover to genres such as R&B and Hip Hop. You can add Country, Rock, and AC to genres that could intersect with the "Pop" genre on today's music genre chart.
I think Mike's list is missing Elton John, George Michael, Kenny Rogers,and any of the Eagles(when they did their solo acts).

#699918 - 03/09/09 12:10 PM Re: Finally Lets Get It Over With! [Re: summeoyo]  
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That about sums it up...it is the classic case of not how good you are it is about who you know and how far they are prepared to back you. Everybody in the hands of Simon Cowell has at least one top ten in them regardless of how untalented they are.

PS I could add dozens to the list.....I wonder how many of the current crop would make such a list in thirty or forty years time.

#700015 - 03/09/09 05:42 PM Re: Finally Lets Get It Over With! [Re: Mike Caro Substudio]  
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I think Britney Spears is just as talented as the BG's. They did not have what she has to offer, like nice body to just stare at. Who cares about she can't sing! Neither could Madonna, but we kept checking her cones out. And isn't that what's important about Pop?
Sales! Sales! Sales. And sex sells!
Kids, in general, are only exposed to what is out there, like we were. I think we were the lucky ones, then.


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#700026 - 03/09/09 06:05 PM Re: Finally Lets Get It Over With! [Re: John Marnie]  
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Some women thought the Beegees long manes, huge white teeth and hairy chests sexy....me I thought it made them look like horses.

#700028 - 03/09/09 06:08 PM Re: Finally Lets Get It Over With! [Re: BIG JIM MERRILEES]  
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Mark Kaufman Offline
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Cones! Horses! grin grin grin

#700126 - 03/09/09 11:50 PM Re: Finally Lets Get It Over With! [Re: Mark Kaufman]  
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I agree with Brian. As far as who is huge on the pop scene and will stand the test of time...U2, hands down. Internationally, they are the biggest band out there. Their songs have melody, depth, great lyrics, and a good beat. They have a good look. I believe they'll be joining the Godfathers of rock at the top of this thread.

Jim, you reiterrated my point exactly. What is it with these bands whose music is so simplistic and thoughtless a kindergartner could write and play it? That would be a good Saturday Night Live skit....The Mahavishnu Orchestra plays on the same bill as Lil' Wayne! grin


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#700135 - 03/10/09 12:36 AM Re: Finally Lets Get It Over With! [Re: Polly Hager]  
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Li'l Wayne is deeper than we might think. "Lollipop", for example, seems like it's about a sucker, when in fact...

#700454 - 03/11/09 02:50 AM Re: Finally Lets Get It Over With! [Re: Mark Kaufman]  
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Current Billboard Top 10 Songs

#1 - Flo Rida - "Right Round"
#2 - T.I. - "Dead & Gone
#3 - LAdy GaGa - "Poker Face"
#4 - Soulja Boy Tell'em - "Kiss Me Thru The Phone
#5 - All American Rejects - "Gives You Hell"
#6 - Kayne West - "Heartless"
#7 - LAdy GaGa - "Just Dance"
#8 - Eminem Dr Dre, 50 Cent - " Crack A Bottle"
#9 - Taylor Swift - "Love Story"
#10 - Kelly Clarkson - "My Life Would Suck Without You"




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#700456 - 03/11/09 03:02 AM Re: Finally Lets Get It Over With! [Re: Mike Caro Substudio]  
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I would like to conclude this thread......

Okay finally here's the deal - Rock and Jazz & Certain elements of R&B are much more absent in today's pop music scene. So is classical influence and some other things. LOOK AT THE THREAD for this FACT! smile

USA's Billboard Top 20 songs LOOK now you will see how dominating hip hop and urban pop is. You have like ONE Country song in the OVERALL top 20 and it's sounds like soft POP to me.
Hip Hop dominates , It's not an opinion it's a FACT. So if you don't LOVE that style you are not gonna LOVE too much pop music today. So there is YOUR ANSWER!

Also good luck landing a song in it when you don't even create ANYTHING like it!
Think about that for a bit....

Rap & Hip Hop is the New Rock N Roll to the majority of the young.
It IS the music parents FEAR! Just like back in the early days of Rock n Roll.
To the POP world general public there are different eyes viewing it The Kids & The Adults. Teenagers love SEX songs, Parents do NOT! Always has been that way should basically always be. smile In this POP Top 20 world sitting with a guitar,piano, bass,drum sets,,horn,violin,conga xylophone for 4- 6 hours a day practicing is NOT HAPPENING what- so - ever.

It's okay to admit - There was a BETTER time for Soul Music,BLues, there was a better time for Rock N Roll and For Jazz & Classical. Cause there WAS! That is the music that interests me. It is NOT on the Top 10 radio anymore, or barely, it used to be that is another FACT. And when it was ALL injected more into POP everyday radio music, I LOVED POP!
ANY decade that has MOTOWN and The Beatles,Stones,Zeppelin & The Who in it WINS!! Unless you are 10 years old or deaf do not attempt to debate this! smile

Jazz players would rather BE PAID WELL. They would like to be in SADE'S band playing cool stuff & being on the radio every 5 freaking minutes.
I think Dave Matthew's may be the last one to have that going on in the top pop.
Kenny G with a top 10 or #1 that was 20 years ago easy...
Play a horn now and Weddings is where you make the most money. What a shame!

Without the injection of the other music's Pop can not be what it used to be. Aside from all the B stuff,cheezier, fad like stuff from every decade. And I like that stuff too)

So of COURSE your decade to decade OBVIOUS equals are like:
Equals to a large degree.

Cher - Madonna - Cyndi Lauper - Britany -
Debbie Reynolds - Olivia - Debbie Gibson - Hannah Montana
The Osmonds - New Edition- Hanson Brothers - Jonas Brothers
Fabian - David CAssidy - David HAsselhof - Billy Ray Cirus
Dianna Ross - Tina Turner - Janet Jackson - Beyonce - Rhianna
Abba - Ace Of BAse - Pussy Cat Dolls

Etc...etc...etc...etc...

That's all Top 20 stuff. Nobody really much better yesterday than today.
That's what you keep thinking of, but the other top 20 acts are unequaled.

Earth Wind & Fire - Stevie Wonder - The Eagles - Queen - Yes - Genesis -
Wings - Chicago - Elton John - Ray Charles - Glenn Miller - Benny Goodman
George Benson - Billy Joel - Clapton - Paul Simon - The Bee Gees - The Allman Brothers - Shall I Go On?

These are GREAT MUSICIANS first, making the music world! Not PRODUCERS!
Producers were great then as well, but there main job.. Do not mess up what these artists do!! No one had to tell Stevie Wonder anything by 1970!

My point was simple, GREAT stuff used to be very popular.
You didn't have to find any of them by accident.

I am not talking about You Tube, The Internet or any place else that ABSOLUTELY ANYONE can promote & sell there music, WE can NOT get our music on the radio and into the top 10 of Billboard. Ya know what I mean...
And you may never in your lifetime and if you are not a young artist or writing Hip Hop or a Country song that Pop Country Stars like Taylor Swift is doing you have basically no chance.

Yet we scratch our heads and say WHY can't we. Well WE are doing NOTHING like what is on that top 10 right now. You have to decide what YOU want to do.
With your music as with your life. To me they are one anyway.


Now understand, when I was working with Dance music producers in the 90's I learned a great deal. I have RESPECT for people who don't play instruments or sing
who make music. That is WHY I felt i could write this thread. I'm NOT just an old ROCK & JAzz & Soul freak. But as far as these producers It is an art in itself what these guys do. And My producer friends were talented musical people. They had an EAR and a finger on the pulse of what was happening. They also used to freak out at all the different thing I brought to the table musically. That's why they hired me night after night for very nice money. But I was often the only PLAYER in the room then..

Actually the thing I do admire about the current top 10 that 90% of it is something I do NOT have the ability to do. That means it is so different I can't get the knack for it.
It's a different world than most of us around here know. I mean we know about it but don't live it.
I also always have a certain amount of respect for things I don't or can't do. Even if they are not for me.

If you loved Rock,Southern Rock, etc... Jazz,Blues,R&B,Funk,Folk, And enjoyed hearing new stuff on the radio every single day, that VARIED greatly from each other.
Then the 1900's is where they were born lived and breathed and were at there best by FAR. See how simple, it's finally over with smile

Best of Luck!


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#700463 - 03/11/09 03:45 AM Re: Finally Lets Get It Over With! [Re: Mike Caro Substudio]  
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Andrew Aversa Offline
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#10 - Kelly Clarkson - "My Life Would Suck Without You"

This almost seems like something that one would see in some sort of parody of pop culture written 10 or 20 years ago. Sad that it's real.


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#700466 - 03/11/09 04:33 AM Re: Finally Lets Get It Over With! [Re: Andrew Aversa]  
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Yeah, I don't mind saying my heart is in the 20th century. Don't care if that makes me a geezer.

Honestly, I pretty much never listened to Top 10 Pop...even in the 70's I was more drawn to the fringes...and those fringes spawned a lot of great stuff. These days I listen mostly to alternative radio, which is why I like mentioning Kaiser Chiefs, Bird and the Bee, Robbers on High Street, New Pornographers, Beck, MIA (oh, but she's getting big now, no more little clubs), Michael Franti, etc. Funny thing about alternative...most of it is so retro it's not even funny...lots of 80's, lots of Beatles, lots of psychedelia. But that Top 10 list...rarely speaks to me, no matter the decade.

The early 70's may be gone, but I can still grieve happily.

#700467 - 03/11/09 05:06 AM Re: Finally Lets Get It Over With! [Re: Mark Kaufman]  
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Bob Cushing Offline
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These guys may not count because they're an off-shoot of the Allman Brothers, but Warren Hayne's band "Government Mule" are THE S*IT!!!


bc
#700516 - 03/11/09 01:02 PM Re: Finally Lets Get It Over With! [Re: Bob Cushing]  
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"Tampa Stan" Good (D) Offline
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"Tampa Stan" Good (D)  Offline
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Hiya Mike... I no longer KNOW the Definition of what's "Pop" these days..since Genrefication's so Set-In.

I've admired Michael Stipe/REM..& he's on the talk shows again, so prepare for Yet Another great CD. Annie Lennox/Eurhythmics has provided many a great Decade's Track, most recent hit's "Wonderful", 2003 #1 US "Dance" Charts. Trent Reznor/NIN seems to be cutting new paths..in what's now catagorized as "Industrial Rock"...but began in mid-80's with "Synth Pop" groups. Besides U2, let's give Prince his due...the man can Still turn out Fine Stuff.

While I enjoyed SOME of the Bee Gees, they seemed to me to be recapping Franki Valli's Falsetto Leads...(& SNL sure had fun teasin' the Guys...) ;-)> Aerosmith still Kills..& "Don't Wanna Miss a Thing" sure wasn't Rock..now was it? ;-)> (Tho, to this Old Timer, they seem clones of The Stones, for the most part.)

Guess we'll all have to hope The Jonas Brothers get good at the Music Part...(but don't hold your breath.)

Hard keepin' an Open Mind when your ears listen mostly to The Oldies..on today's Broadcast Radio.

Best Wishes/Big Guy-Hug,
Stan

#700517 - 03/11/09 01:04 PM Re: Finally Lets Get It Over With! [Re: Bob Cushing]  
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Ray E. Strode Online content
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Ray E. Strode  Online Content
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Brunswick, Ga. USA
OK,
Good music from any Era is good music and bad music from any Era is still bad music.


Ray E. Strode
#700538 - 03/11/09 02:41 PM Re: Finally Lets Get It Over With! [Re: Ray E. Strode]  
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Polly Hager Offline
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Wait, you mean Lil' Wayne ISN'T talking about a lollipop? Just what exactly are you implying, Mr. Kaufman?

And whoever said that Elvis wasn't popular anymore...blasphemy! Elvis and Jesus are synonymous! Just look at the astounding similarities, and Jesus was around 2000 years with a much smaller fan base:

1. They both have five letters in their names that end in "s"
2. They've both been referred to as "The King"
3. They were both good to their mothers
4. They both hung out with hookers
5. Jesus preached the gospel, Elvis sang gospel
6. Jesus turned water into wine, Elvis drank wine and made water
7. They both liked to wear white
8. Jesus lived in the Holy Land, Elvis lived in Graceland

I predict that Elvis will be around for decades to come. May Elvis have mercy on your non-believer, heathen soul!

Last edited by CincyPolly; 03/12/09 12:22 AM.

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#700542 - 03/11/09 02:58 PM Re: Finally Lets Get It Over With! [Re: Andrew Aversa]  
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Mike Caro Substudio Offline
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Originally Posted by Andrew Aversa
#10 - Kelly Clarkson - "My Life Would Suck Without You"

This almost seems like something that one would see in some sort of parody of pop culture written 10 or 20 years ago. Sad that it's real.


She can do whatever she wants smile

I'll never forget my brief encounter with her executive producer/label assigned A&R overseer.

My lyrics needed to be NEW & FRESH like "Since You Been Gone"
So I been trying to write with crayons ever since smile





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#700550 - 03/11/09 03:34 PM Re: Finally Lets Get It Over With! [Re: Mark Kaufman]  
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Mike Caro Substudio Offline
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Originally Posted by Mark Kaufman
Yeah, I don't mind saying my heart is in the 20th century. Don't care if that makes me a geezer.

Honestly, I pretty much never listened to Top 10 Pop...even in the 70's I was more drawn to the fringes...and those fringes spawned a lot of great stuff. These days I listen mostly to alternative radio, which is why I like mentioning Kaiser Chiefs, Bird and the Bee, Robbers on High Street, New Pornographers, Beck, MIA (oh, but she's getting big now, no more little clubs), Michael Franti, etc. Funny thing about alternative...most of it is so retro it's not even funny...lots of 80's, lots of Beatles, lots of psychedelia. But that Top 10 list...rarely speaks to me, no matter the decade.

The early 70's may be gone, but I can still grieve happily.


Hi

Not me I ALWAYS listened to the radio when I was a child. My brother in law owned a record store. I would have my sister call him and ask him to bring me home a small list of 45's every few days or week smile I was about six/seven years old

They gave me a job while baby sitting me at the store lol. Sweep & water plants.
It was in a large African American area, and all day long we listened to Soul Music & R&B. Sold black light posters and paraphernalia.

So one day I'd ask for "Smoking In The Boys Room" and Rhinstone Cowboy, One Tin Soldier. The Night Chicago Died" etc..."I Want You Back" Bad Leroy Brown. And the next day its was "My First Last Everything" "Ramblin Man" "Your Song" Philadelphia Freedom" Frankenstein... "Free Ride" etc.....

But in there store is where I found -
Earth Wind & Fire! THE BEST!
Barry White, Al Green, The Stylistics, Spinners,Harold & The Blue Notes,Teddy P, War, Eddie Kendricks. Marvin Gaye, Issac Hayes, Curtis Mayfield, Brothers Johnson, Sly And The Family Stone, Kool And The Gang, AWB, etc.. etc... etc....

When my friend & writer/producer Mike A says to me how the heck did you learn to orchestrate like this in my song, with these horn & string.wood arrangements when you have NEVER studied or took lessons.

Answer - From listening to POP music constantly. Go put on "Beach Baby" by The First Class. Everything thing you need to know is in there. smile AWESOME!
This little cheezy pop tune is an INCREDIBLE record. Harmonies, time changes, feel changes, great hooky arrangements both song wise and instrument wise.

I don't directly refer to the old records I use them as part of the juke box in my mind,heart & soul. This way there influence is OBVIOUS but I don't rip them off too bad smile

Aside from that I dig lots of current stuff when I can find it. Also LOVEd lots of stuff from the 90's I don't think there is a pop band today any better than "Collective Soul" Also I loved the harder rock bands much more than the 80's Hair Bands & Euro Synth bands. Please I was dying in that decade, thank God for some greats gone solo acts,Santana, EWF and Jazz fusion

I LOVE STP and still enjoy Soundgarden today I have all there CD's AIC as well
Bush's CD was very cool... And RADIO HEADS "The Bends" is AWESOME!

I much prefered the female artist's in the 90's over the 80's as well. Except I love Ricki Lee Jones & Bonnie Raitt, Sade was wonderful.
Artist like Paula Cole,Sarah,Tori Amos, Alanis, Bjork, Amie Mann, Indigo Girls,Eva Cassidy etc.....
Nothing against Madonna,Pat Benatar, Cyndi Lauper,The Bengals, Mellissa Ethridge, and Sheen Easton, Talyor Dane, Sheila E,

Aside from the obvious pop stuff in the 90's the artistic stuff, the ladies, and the rock bands reminded me of the 70's.

Right now I just don't feel there's anybody who I want 5 CD's from never mind 14 CD's from. smile

I'm gonna watch my Al Jolson Story Movie again tonight, That guy was a TrailBlazer!
I'm glad my Dad played & sang him around the house & car all the time.

Good stuff Mark!

MUISC LOVERS - Should try to love ALL music or at least some part of it!






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#700552 - 03/11/09 03:35 PM Re: Finally Lets Get It Over With! [Re: Bob Cushing]  
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Mike Caro Substudio Offline
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Originally Posted by Bob Cushing
These guys may not count because they're an off-shoot of the Allman Brothers, but Warren Hayne's band "Government Mule" are THE S*IT!!!


Yes sir!


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#700555 - 03/11/09 03:51 PM Re: Finally Lets Get It Over With! [Re: ]  
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Mike Caro Substudio Offline
Mike Caro Substudio  Offline

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NY
Originally Posted by "TampaStan" Good
Hiya Mike... I no longer KNOW the Definition of what's "Pop" these days..since Genrefication's so Set-In.

I've admired Michael Stipe/REM..& he's on the talk shows again, so prepare for Yet Another great CD. Annie Lennox/Eurhythmics has provided many a great Decade's Track, most recent hit's "Wonderful", 2003 #1 US "Dance" Charts. Trent Reznor/NIN seems to be cutting new paths..in what's now catagorized as "Industrial Rock"...but began in mid-80's with "Synth Pop" groups. Besides U2, let's give Prince his due...the man can Still turn out Fine Stuff.

While I enjoyed SOME of the Bee Gees, they seemed to me to be recapping Franki Valli's Falsetto Leads...(& SNL sure had fun teasin' the Guys...) ;-)> Aerosmith still Kills..& "Don't Wanna Miss a Thing" sure wasn't Rock..now was it? ;-)> (Tho, to this Old Timer, they seem clones of The Stones, for the most part.)

Guess we'll all have to hope The Jonas Brothers get good at the Music Part...(but don't hold your breath.)

Hard keepin' an Open Mind when your ears listen mostly to The Oldies..on today's Broadcast Radio.

Best Wishes/Big Guy-Hug,
Stan


Hi Stan

It's the list I posted above, that is the most popular music in the world on this date! So says the industry!

I agree with you 100%... And yes you can think whatever you want about "Prince"
But that guys talents are VERY obvious. And he is deep with it... Still I can't listen to him long at all smile Its just a "style" thing.

I LOVE "The Four Seasons" but I never confuse them with the depth of talent The Bee Gees had. Who wrote there own songs! And changed completely in two decades.
Although the songs "Who Loves You" & Swearing To God. My Eyes Adored You" were great transitions into the next decade for the Four Seasons. And mainly Frankie Vali. Smart Moves!

I can't listen to Aerosmith anymore, sorry to say. When I do it's "Toys In The Attic"
and my favorite "Rocks" back to back.
Still to stay in the game that strong is a GREAT feat. One or two sound alike ballads are okay but it's just the same thing over & over now. I'm not CRazy About You Baby" No More! PS - Joe Perry GREAT rock guitarist and a riff king himself

The Jonas Brothers are this decades Hanson Brothers
My only problem with this decade is these acts don't Go away too fast anymore!
MAn we only had to deal with Bobby Sherman for a little while in the 70's

The industry is NOT letting in the stuff that pushes these acts out or at least put them in there respective place....

When i was a child it didn't take me too long to realize The Beatles were far superior to The Monkees.. And I still love The Monkees stuff!

When I was a child I BOUGHT Chuck Mangiones & George Benson's Record.
A child today is NEVER gonna buy Victor Wootens CD cause the RADIO don't play him. If Victor wasn't so ridiculously talented and happy I would feel sorry for him smile




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#700557 - 03/11/09 04:02 PM Re: Finally Lets Get It Over With! [Re: Mike Caro Substudio]  
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Mike Caro Substudio Offline
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I'll never forget being about 20 meeting my girlfriends parents for the first time.
Mom, Dad this is MIke he plays in a Rock Band! I was 6 '3 with Crazy curly hair but my personality & heart landed me the job smile

The Dad (great guy) says Let me show you what great music is all about and give you a little music appreciation course. I smiled and said "sure" lets go!
We sat in the basement with the records for HOURS 1950's - 50's Pop - Doo Wop!
HIS TIME! Not Mine.. Shoot technically mines 3 decades later The !980's

I SANG along with EVERY Platters song word for word.. He was SHOCKED!
Could not believe it!
I knew every song so he went deeper into his collection to show me things and people I never heard. I learned alot those days and he learned I was a REAL music lover and Musician.

I know it's hard but try to keep an open ear,mind & heart. I have to remind myself of this all the time to.


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#700593 - 03/11/09 07:03 PM Re: Finally Lets Get It Over With! [Re: Mike Caro Substudio]  
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Moker Jarrett Offline
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Moker Jarrett  Offline
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jacksonville, fl
The groups/artists in the last twenty years that have a shot at having a legacy rivaling the gr...well i screwed this long winded post up editing something...i'm gonna leave at that this time smile...mj

Last edited by Moker Jarrett; 03/13/09 10:52 AM.
#700678 - 03/12/09 12:29 AM Re: Finally Lets Get It Over With! [Re: Moker Jarrett]  
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Polly Hager Offline
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Kelly Clarkson is the one of two female artists of today that I am excited about. Her voice has the power and range of Ann Wilson from Heart, and she can rock! The other one is Pink. She has an R&B background, but her voice can fluctuate between a soft blues style and a hard rock/punk sound. These women are in the running for the legacy standing, from what I see.


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You're supposed to be grooving as hard as you can, all of the time. - Stephen Gaskin
#700718 - 03/12/09 03:48 AM Re: Finally Lets Get It Over With! [Re: Polly Hager]  
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Mike Caro Substudio Offline
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Originally Posted by CincyPolly
Kelly Clarkson is the one of two female artists of today that I am excited about. Her voice has the power and range of Ann Wilson from Heart, and she can rock! The other one is Pink. She has an R&B background, but her voice can fluctuate between a soft blues style and a hard rock/punk sound. These women are in the running for the legacy standing, from what I see.


Hi Polly

Thanks for sharing on the thread... Do you really think Kelly Clarkson is a "legacy" in the making?

When "Pink" started out she was pretty good musically I thought. But she had to go that silly route that I was explaining recently. Ya know the "Annoying" theory.
Like what Gwen Stephani did, start out a great pop artist/writer and turn to kindegarden song tactics smile annoy the listener with baby talk,chants and sounds.
It is a GREAT tactic to catch some ones attention. Annoy them smile

I kinda feel The Wilson sisters (Heart) REALLY rock and Kelly Clarkson pretends to Rock. The difference seems pretty clear to me. Rock is a life style and attitude and
the most versatile form of popular music there is. Having vocal chops alone doesn't do it, Kelly says she doesn't even have a boyfriend smile The Wilson sisters play & sing like they have smile

Anyway I agree both have very powerful voices, and Kelly has much improved pitch wise. I seen her sing on TV one night a few years back and she couldn't get four words in a row in key. Caught her on Idol tonight much better pitch.

Pink is better and more pro... I think Pink smile would work well fronting in a real band situation. And if that band was creative & good she would have the chance to last or be remembered like Heart or Blondie But I think on the path she's on now it's forget about ya time. Avril Lavine had that same potential.

I never can understand why an artist who is selling really well (for today) and charting with good pop songs like "Complicated" has to resort to Mickey Mouse stuff. I guess the labels or peer pressure has loads to do with it. But they get all outspoken & I don't bend over there politics and other stuff but not there career's or music.

You'd have NEVER seen Janis Joplin do that, and Kelly ain't no Janis.
-------------------------

One time Music critiques made the mistake of bashing Led Zeppelin. That said Zeppelin was making it on the PUBLICITY that Jimmy Page was a YardBird and both Him & J Paul Jone were well known session guys. They were Hype, and after Led Zep III they were finished. As that album didn't fare as well as Zep 1 or II
Zep III is great by the way, Love it!

So anyway Jimmy Page (The Man) quietly goes back into the studio and says, on out next album NO PICTURES of us on the cover! NO NAMES on the album not even the bands name. No Single released as usual, let the label kinda force us to release one.

Just the old man carrying sticks.. Zeppelin 4 went on to sell 28 million copies and be the third biggest selling album of all time.

What a concept be GREAT musicians, do whatever you want musically whenever you want, never have a number one song and sell more albums collectively than just about any one in history. Rich beyond your dreams with credibility and an everlasting legacy.

Now that the thread is coming to an end we can mention the Big Four again lol..



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#700771 - 03/12/09 12:31 PM Re: Finally Lets Get It Over With! [Re: Mike Caro Substudio]  
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Polly Hager Offline
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While I agree that Kelly Clarkson will never be an Ann Wilson, when compared to the rest of today's female vocalists she stands out. I'm just talking about today. Ann Wilson is still rocking and I wouldn't put anyone up against her! I saw her live about 10 years ago in a small venue in Cincinnati with the remnants of Heart, and she did "Black Dog" by Zeppelin (Robert Plant was one of her idols too). I nearly peed my pants! She did several Zeppelin songs actually.

Anyway, yes, what you said about simply being GREAT musicians and letting the music speak for itself, I agree. Like my good friend, Will Rankin, once said: You don't have to be great. You just have to be great at what you do.


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