JPF Home Page Forums General Messages General Message Forum It's All Over Now, Baby Blue

People need to be shocked out of complacency. The Flobots are doing just that, and our kids are listening.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Vo4c3VgPbkg&feature=related

Ours might be the last generation ignorant enough to support war.

Wanna end war? End the the things that divide us -- like ORGANIZED RELIGION, the root of all evil.

One need only check the daily news to see my point.


39 dead in explosions in western Indian city

AHMADABAD, India - Police says that 39 people have been killed in the serial blasts that hit the western Indian city of Ahmadabad.

According to the latest details available at Ahmadabad city's police control room Sunday another 110 people have been wounded in the 16 blasts that went off in several neighborhoods of the busy city on Saturday evening.

Saturday's blasts came a day after seven small-intensity explosions hit the southern technology hub of Bangalore killing two people.

Several Indian cities have been hit by serial blasts in recent months. The attacks that have been blamed on Islamic militants.


http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20080727/ap_on_re_as/india_explosions

Oh Ye... of little faith!

Want to get rid of war? Get rid of hate. When the human heart accepts everything...race, nationality, politics, economic status, style, sexual preference, religion, and any other superficiality that separates us...without blame, fear or hatred, then we'll get rid of war.

Hate and GREED. The number one reason for war is the desire to rule the world or amass great wealth (e.g., the conquests of Alexander the Great, S. Hussein's wars against Iran and Kuwait). That's not hate; that's greed. In such cases, hate, usually justified by appeals to religion, is the result of propaganda used by those in power to justify the costs. HATE, however, is behind genocide (e.g., Rwanda, Bosnia, Darfaur).

"Fear leads to anger, anger leads to hate, hate leads to suffering"

Yoda

Yes, greed is one of the seven deadly sins. Along with envy, lust, gluttony, sloth, pride and wrath. Any can be springboards to the other. Lust can lead to envy. Pride can lead to gluttony, and etc. In your example, greed leads to wrath. No wrath (hatred) no war.

I posted this over on the h20 for fuel discussion...seems to fit here as well.

I think Merle Haggard said it best...

1st Verse
There's a big, brown cloud in the city,
And the countryside's a sin.
An' the price of life is too high to give up,
Gotta come down again.
When the world wide war is over and done,
And the dream of peace comes true.
We'll all be drinkin' free bubble-up,
Eatin' that rainbow stew.

2nd Verse
When they find out how to burn water,
And the gasoline car is gone.
When an airplane flies without any fuel,
And the sunlight heats our home.
One of these days when the air clears up,
And the sun comes shinin' through.
We'll all be drinkin' free bubble-up,
An' eatin' that rainbow stew.

Chorus
Eatin' rainbow stew in a silver spoon,
Underneath that sky of blue.
We'll allll be drinkin' free bubble-up,
An' eatin' that rainbow stew.

Instrumental break.

You don't have to get high to get happy,
Just think about what's in store.
When people start doin' what they oughta be doin',
Then they won't be booin' no more.
When a President goes through the White House door,
An' does what he says he'll do.
We'll all be drinkin' free bubble-up,
Eatin' that rainbow stew.

Eatin' rainbow stew in a silver spoon,
Underneath that sky of blue.
We'll all be drinkin' that free bubble-up,
And eatin' that rainbow stew.

Eatin' rainbow stew in a silver spoon,
Underneath that sky of blue.
We'll all be drinkin' that free bubble-up,
And eatin' that rainbow stew.


Yup Ole Haggard's right people this world as it stands will never see peace... only when God steps in will things change. The only thing that keeps me going is knowing He is in charge of all these things and he has the power to change everything. He doesn't because he wants us to "get it" and to desire his love for us...He created it all and has every right to step in and put an end to this madness. He doesn't because he wants to give us the free will to be who we are. Unfortunatly what we are is self centered egotists for the most part (myself included) and unless we are able to put others first we will never see peace on earth. Just my 2 1/2 cents.
Derek

There's a quote, attributed to Plato, that comes to mind evey time someone suggests that war is going away anytime soon.

"Only the dead have seen the last of war."

Exactly, Derek. Saint Haggard the Craggy. We'll never get beyond war by talking about it. It takes personal responsibility. When no one on earth lifts a hand in anger, dehumanizes another person, has contempt for others' beliefs, wants to take bounty rather than work for it, when all that happens war will end.

I'll do my part right now. We're off to church.

Amen brother Mike!

Lord willing I'll be relieved from duty and be able to attend myself, but if not I'll worship him from my worksite!
Derek

HI Richard!

Interesting Video & Song...& quite an Obama Pitch.

Kinda reminds me of how Richard Nixon got vilified after Watergate, yet he WAS the Pres who said he'd get us OUT of Vietnam, "With Honor"...& basically did-so..best that was Do-able..& that was a War the Democrats basically got us into.

I don't think Bush is the Most-Competent US Pres we've ever had, yet everyone, includin' the Demos, wanted a War after 9-11, and voted to get one. WILL Obama be able to extricate the US presence in Iraq after-he's-elected? I doubt it very much. We're just NOW getting out of Germany, after WW2. We're STILL in Japan with a Base...(No "Rush" to leave Guantanimo, either...)

Nah..we're saddled with the ol' Superpower "Peacekeeper-to-the-Planet" Mantle that the Brits used to have in THEIR "Empire Days"...& Obama's expected to add ANOTHER $3+ Trillion in National Debt during HIS "Reign" if-elected..(Vs McCain's est'd $7+ Trillion.)

So..listen all ya wanna Kids...no matter WHO gets elected, you STILL get to pick up The Tab.

Ya MAY wanna focus on Which Candidate wants to PROTECT American JOBS the most. That's your only TRUE Hope..(If only so ya CAN pay the tab.) Interestingly, George Washington was in-favor of all sorts of TARIFFS to keep Americans BUYING-American, so was Abraham Lincoln: When the RAILROADS were just gaining-Steam, he helped back Legislation favoring AMERICAN vs cheaper British STEEL being used for their construction. President REAGAN is probably the MAIN reason Harley-Davidson's STILL making Motorcycles...

So...Quiz the Candidates Accordingly: What's each guy's PLAN to expand American Manufacturing & EXPORTS during "His Term"...

As the "War in Iraq" does wind-down, so do all those nice War-Related Contracts..& American Jobs..one of which might be yours.

Good Luck with Your Choice.
Stan

Government is the cause of war. The only reason to have government is to have war. To get rid of war get rid of governments.

Hey Doug

Never knew you were an anarchist! lol
Derek

Here's one for those who, like me, came to this thread thinking it might be something else:

http://youtube.com/watch?v=E06SoECIp1U

Four Dead in Ohio



He's an idiot, a war-mongering idiot.



The rest of the world doesn't want us there. Most importantly, IRAQ doesn't want us there. They keep asking us to leave. Only BUSH wants us there.

This is the most ludicrous thing I think I have ever heard. Al Queda is not a government and they are waging war against the west. Rebels who start revolutions are not governments; they wage war against them. Wars ARE financially supported by governments.

If we got rid of governments, there would be utter chaos. Look at Somalia. If we lived in a country like the, some crack smoking addict looking for his next fix would be able to just walk right up to you, take whatever he wants from you at gunpoint, and unload the contents of the gun into your brain. Exactly nobody will do anything about it.

Eh,
No one supports war. However sometimes you just have to do something even if it's wrong.

If President Bush had nothing after 911 and we had been attacked again all the bleading heart liberals would have been screaming WHY DIDN'T HE DO SOMETHING! So President Bush was, is, in a NO WIN SITUATION. Damned if you do and damned if you don't.

So to clear it up for some of you I am a whole lot closer to President Bush's position than the detractors.

It's like a bank being robbed. According to the Bush Detractors, if we go after the bank robbers, the police, (and the law), are just a bunch of gun happy idiots.

If the Holier-Than-Thou types had had their way after Pearl Harbor we would never gone to war.

Some of you bleading heart liberals make me sick.

Now there is an election comeing up. You have the chance to go into the voting booth and make a choice. If you want a bigger government, more debt, you know to vote for.

Some examples of the liberal positions taken over the last 70 years are now firmly on the record.

A 9 trillion dollar National Debt, Another Bailout, of the housing market, Gas at $4.00, or more a gallon. etc, etc, etc.

We are, for all practical purposes still living under Franklin D. Roosevelt's New Deal. But remember, people voted for it. So if you like your situation keep supporting all the Big Government Programs now entrenched in your life.

And don't expect it too change anytime soon. With the Housing Bailout guess who is going to pay the tab? You are. Or more likely no one is. The whole giant slush fund in Washington is going to collapse and another depression is coming.

You have heard the story of Nero. Nero fiddled while Rome burned.
You all know the story of Hurricane Katrina. Every body in New Orleans thought it was going somewhere else.

The Government has your future in good hands. Dream on.

Hi Ray

There was a time that I agreed with most of your veiwpoint and I still agree with some. I however am not afraid of Obama being president because he's a "liberal". I am afraid of Obama because I don't know what he is. He is seen as being a muslim in his early years, now every website I visit claims he is christian. He refrained from voting while senator so he could keep people from knowing where he stands. I once throught he was a centrist now he seems more liberal than ever, he's certainly got slick willy's charisma, but I have no idea where he really stands... He seems to be for whatever views will get him elected. Do we really want a straw man for as President? I know I don't!
Derek

A few more years of government excess and everybody in this country except politicians will be anarchists.

What makes you think He wants us to "get it"?

Instead of waiting for Him to fix the problem, why not let Him fix it through you? He has already told you how and has commanded you to do it. Why won't you obey Him?
War can't make peace. When we no longer allow leaders to make war, there will be peace.

Hey Richard

While I do agree that government is pushing the edge (especially with this upcoming "yeah right" election) , but I hardly think more than a few will actualy become anarchists anytime soon. Is there a definite sense of mistrust with government and politicians? I'd say yes, but to totally change everything with things the way they currently are? We don't live in a third world country here.. there is plenty of opportunity for those who seek it, and those who seek to do right aren't persecuted all that badly compared to other places in the world. I'm not saying this country doesn't have problems, but I really don't think we have anything to complain about when compared to certain African nations.
Derek

Than you, Stan, for refusing to even consider that things could be better.

I can't believe I'm even going to waste my breath on someone who thinks Nixon was good for America.

No one knows what effect an Obama Presidency will have on this country but we're about to find out, okay, so deal with it.
What we do know is that after eight years of Bush's administration, this country is in the shitter so deep it may never get out.

The next time you open your mouth, remember that the inability to distinguish patriotism from propaganda may very well kill us all.

I agree. But I say, if we continue unabated in the direction we are now headed, it will end in a social revolution.

We are seeing a consolidation of power in this country. Taken to its logical extreme, how does one man who owns everything defend himself against hundreds of millions of people who have nothing? Somehere along the way is social upheaval.

The problem is, politicians have stacked the deck so it is easier for lobbyists to control the people than it is for the people to control their government. Let's not forget, the American dream is governmnent "of the people, by the people, for the people", not government of the people, by corporations, for the wealthy.

::munches popcorn::

Ah, the far right ...... the masters of rhetoric and propaganda.



Would Jesus do that?



If you are going to append 'bleeding heart' to the word LIBERAL every time you use it, can I append 'bible thumping' to the word CONSERVATIVE every time I use it? Seems only fair.

PS - most people do not think that invading Afghanistan was 'the wrong thing to do'. Iraq, on the other hand, WAS WRONG. Your idol is a war-monger.



You miss the point, as usual. I assume you are talking about laws like the Patriot Act which, they tell us, are designed to PROTECT. It isn't my fault that conservatives are happy to be brainwashed and controlled by their government and will swallow any medicine that their pastor tells them to. I mean, you want to overthrow the liberals and turn America into a Christian theocracy anyway, don't you? I guess there is no point in having 'freedom' around if you are going to do that.

I prefer not to give up the rights guaranteed to me in the constitution.



Another piece of BS rhetoric. And you are just flat out WRONG.



And some of you bible thumpers make me nervous. I always get nervous around people who claim to hear the voice of God and who take it upon themselves to decide what is best for the rest of us. Some extremists in the movement want to see public executions of unrepentant homosexuals. Can anyone say 'late 1930s Berlin?'



I would rather pay more taxes supporting a national healthcare program designed to save lives rather than on killing Arabs in the name of freedom.



Blaming democrats for the oil crisis only makes you look foolish. In case you haven't noticed, your boy has been at 1600 Pennsylvania Avenue for almost eight years now. It amazes me how anyone could still support this man, but he is anti-abortion so that makes all his failures OK, right?



Let's get down to the truth. Right wing fundies couldn't care less about big VS small government or more VS less taxes. They care about abortion and gay rights, period.

Amen Richard

Couldn't agree with you more. For one thing instead of dealing with the social issues we have in our own society... we spend our valuable resources trying to police the world ( a losing battle at best) then on top of that as our society ills we pass more laws to encarcerate people for crimes. This only creates better criminals (I've seen this with my own eyes). And the social and moral decay are only getting worse.. so yes your point is well taken... if we don't do something soon we will see anarchy or a dictatorship, I'm not certain which one is worse, but for now life goes on and I for one am not voting for the "popular candtidate!" I may be wasting my vote but I'll be voting for the liberterian cantidate... their viewpoint almost always falls in line with mine.
Derek

Are you saying you think Obama will be a bad president because of his religious affiliations? or that you have to be a Christian to qualify for the presidency. Obama claims to be a Christian. To be perfectly honest, I would STRONGLY PREFER a non-Christian president, namely, because as a member of a minority religion, such a person would have a much better appreciation for tolerance. Most born again fundies are too Hell-bent on winning back America for Jesus.

I live in a third world country - TEXAS. Why do I say that? Because they kill more people every year via execution than all the other states combined. We are the only major power left who still executed its criminals. The rest of the civilized world has come to the CORRECT conclusion that THOU SHALT NOT MURDER should be obeyed. The only reason we still allow execution is because that is what the 'loving' Christians want. Can't you see there is something wrong with this picture?

Hey Rblight

I think my point might have gotten missed. I'd have no problem with Obama if the only reason was religous preference.. my point is he is wishy washy... he doesn't seem to solidly claim in position... If he stood for anything I'd at least know what his charachter is, but he is an enigma... he claims to stand for change (I seem to recall Bill Clinton used the reasoning). But other than that and the classic democratic values... universal healthcare and higher taxes.... what does he really believe in? To me it's only what will get him elected.
Derek

Truthfully Rblight

I agree that execution by the state is wrong... however, the bible does contain levitical laws about reasons why a persons life should be taken. Some of these are as simple as sleeping with another persons spouse.. even prostitutes could be held accountable to the point of death under these laws. Now we are not under the levitical lawe, but I think that is where the idea for the death penalty originated. Now let me say I am in agreement with you... The death penalty is wrong the way we carry it out and I believe that our country is angering God by doing so in fact. Because under the levitical laws it was God and his holy preists passing down the sentence, the state deciding who live and who dies is utterly ridicolous and their standards for deciding equally so. Now Texas being a third world nation? I think that might be blasphemy to your fellow Texans lol.
Derek

I like it. Here are the lyrics:

I can ride my bike with no handlebars
No handlebars
No handlebars

I can ride my bike with no handlebars
No handlebars
No handlebars

Look at me, look at me
hands in the air like it's good to be
ALIVE
and I'm a famous rapper
even when the paths're all crookedy
I can show you how to do-si-do
I can show you how to scratch a record
I can take apart the remote control
And I can almost put it back together
I can tie a knot in a cherry stem
I can tell you about Leif Ericson
I know all the words to "De Colores"
And "I'm Proud to be an American"
Me and my friend saw a platypus
Me and my friend made a comic book
And guess how long it took
I can do anything that I want cuz, look:

I can keep rhythm with no metronome
No metronome
No metronome

And I can see your face on the telephone
On the telephone
On the telephone

Look at me
Look at me
Just called to say that it's good to be
ALIVE
In such a small world
I'm all curled up with a book to read
I can make money open up a thrift store
I can make a living off a magazine
I can design an engine sixty four
Miles to a gallon of gasoline
I can make new antibiotics
I can make computers survive aquatic conditions
I know how to run a business
I can make you wanna buy a product
Movers shakers and producers
Me and my friends understand the future
I see the strings that control the systems
I can do anything with no assistance
Cuz I can lead a nation with a microphone
With a microphone
With a microphone
And I can split the atom of a molecule
Of a molecule
Of a molecule

Look at me
Look at me
Driving and I won't stop
And it feels so good to be
Alive and on top
My reach is global
My tower secure
My cause is noble
My power is pure
I can hand out a million vaccinations
Or let'em all die in exasperation
Have'em all healed of their lacerations
Have'em all killed by assassination
I can make anybody go to prison
Just because I don't like'em and
I can do anything with no permission
I have it all under my command
Because I can guide a missile by satellite
By satellite
By satellite
And I can hit a target through a telescope
Through a telescope
Through a telescope
And I can end the planet in a holocaust
In a holocaust
In a holocaust
In a holocaust
In a holocaust
In a holocaust

I can ride my bike with no handlebars
No handlebars
No handlebars

I can ride my bike with no handlebars
No handlebars

Anyone care to take a stab at the meaning? Is it about Bush or about us? Or is there a difference? It needs to be said. Over and over again.

These are the lyrics that started this discussion? As Samuel mentiones they are actually pretty good, but are they accurate?

Well let's see is it about Geoerge Bush? I don't see that... I see that this could be said about any leader of our goverment... it could also be said about any leader of the free world. So I'm not sure what people are getting from this song, but to me it's just a statment of truth about absolute power ( it currupts absolutely) and truthfully as much as this could be Bush bashing... no president I've ever known has had absolute power... though I could be wrong lol.
Derek

So we should all just jump in a lake because the Bible tells us to?



Says who? There are some denominations of Christianity who still preach that we have to do stupid silly ritualistic things like keep the Sabbath and that our 'loving God' will send us to Hell if we don't.



The death penalty is much older than the bible, I'm afraid.



I am not a native Texas so they will forgive me.

I believe that God is mischaracterized by the writers of the OT. Moreover, I do not accept the bible as the literal, inerrant word of God. It is loaded with errors and falsities. It has used for centuries to justify atrocities committed in the name of religion, yet people worship it like the text itself was a God.

Hey Rblight

I guess this is where we have to agree to disagree. I do believe in the Bible as not only the inerrant literal word of God, but also as his testament to a fallen world on his loving sacrafice for us who were created by the Father and in his image. So from this point we have no way to continue since our core beliefs differ. I hope you understand that I am not in anyway trying to get you to believe differently than you do.. I am simply claiming my own beliefs. I do agree that organized religion has a lot of problems, I do a however still believe in the church and I know that even with it's failings that God is still behind the church as well.
Derek

What it means to me is that we have the power to do anything, including destroy ourselves if we're not careful. It doesn't make any difference who it's about.

Just in case anybody missed this, it is the solution.

I use to believe in it too but eventually reason and logic prevailed over me. Let me ask you this -- why is it so important that a Christian believe every single word in it is literal? That's just plain looney! Why does it matter? Would simply being a book of moral parables somehow take away from the message? Why do I have to believe that Jonah was a real person who was really swallowed by a real fish for three days and nights? Fundamentalists tell me I can't be a real Christian unless I do.

The bible says that the devil took Jesus up to the highest mountaintop where he could see all the kingdoms of the world. Can't you see that this is physically impossible? There were great civilizations in South America so these would have to be included. But guess what? The earth is round, not flat, and those kingdoms are on the other side of it. So this COULDN'T HAVE POSSIBLY HAPPENED, regardless of how high the mountain was.

If you take the bible as a 100% literal word of God, you have no choice BUT to concede its errancy. Jesus also specifically said that he would return during the lifetimes of the apostles. Guess what? They are all dead and no Jesus. If he REALLY prophesied this, then he is a false prophet.

Quite simply, there is no way to maintain a 100% literal interpretation. I have heard some extremely lame arguments in defense of these points -- for example, claiming that the earth was flat in Jesus' day. WHAT? Another argument is that the earth really IS flat and that liberal atheist scientists in conjunction with the Illuminati and the New World Order are perpetrating an elaborate hoax on people. And people wonder why progressives think born again evangelicals are insane.

Pure bullshit.




So, you think making money off it justifies the war. At least you're consistent.

Derek, I have no quarrel with you. But, why get rid of a government you can't trust!? Do you even think about what you are saying?




For starters, you're comparing apples and orangutans. Because I didn't get my throat slit I should be happy I'm only getting stabbed in the back? Come on, man!

Did you know that, for the first time in history, more than half the population in America is on prescription medication? Healthy people don't need medication, Derek. Wouldn't you expect the greatest country in the world to have a better record on health care? I would.
When your TV starts telling you to ask doctor about Rubbusout, it's time to quit watching TV.

Here's the same song with a different video and no particular political reference.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AuK2A1ZqoWs&feature=related

Certain people might find this one less objectionable and actually listen to it without their knees jerkin' all over the place.

Ha, Ha, Ha,
Around and around and around we go, and where we stop, nobody knows. I have presented mostly facts, take em or leave em.

There are two schools of thought in the country.

1. Send more money to the Government and let them take care of your Welfare, Hillary Care/Obama Care or:

2 Keep more of your money and take care of your own welfare.

The first school of thought has been ruling, with short interruptions since FDR.
You would think, after all these years the Big Government/Democrat types would have the problem fixed, solved, completed! If there are still problems to be fixed, after all these years I have to ask, Wha Happen?

All they the have to show for it is a 9 trillion dollar debt, (Your Debt) and no progress.

It has nothing to do with Religion it is basic economics.

Now if Hillary had gotten elected and gotten her Programs enacted, or Obama gets elected and gets his Programs enacted, higher taxes, on the supposedly rich, you can expect an average of one worker in every small business it the country to be laid off, maybe permanently.

As you may know, if you read the news, the American Auto Manufactureers are letting workers go. Others also.

So the Programs that Obama would enact will hurt the very people it is meant to help.

When the government screws big business, big business screws small business. Guess who small business screws?

When big business gets taxed unfairly they either lay people off or move off shore. You've heard Obama talk about making corporations off shore pay their fair share of taxes. Why does he think they moved off shore in the first place? But remember, people voted for it. FDR'S New Deal, remember?

When JFK got elected he said, "THINK NOT WHAT YOUR COUNTRY CAN DO FOR YOU, BUT WHAT YOU CAN DO FOR YOUR COUNTRY" The only thing he forgot to add was SEND MONEY. Hey people, Ya forgot to send the money!

The alternative to anarchy is "Meet the new boss same as the old boss"

Government is the use of force to make the people do or not do what the bosses want. And that's just evil for one group to use force to make another group obey.

Government by definition is evil.

Voting for the lesser evil is still voting for evil.

I made a vow to stay away from these threads because I find them non-productive.

But Ray, you are perpetuating a myth here.

Take a look sometime at when the public debt has increased and when it has decreased. I'll make it easy - go here and look at the graphs in the upper right corner.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_public_debt

Now ask who was president when we started on this disastrous course around 1980? Who was President when it began to turn around in the '90's? And who was President when it started to increase again in 2000 or so?

Scott

You got all your 'facts' directly from the Rush Limbaugh conservative propaganda playbook. Amazing that Christians would be the FIRST to complain about welfare and the idea of taxes being used to keep uninsured children healthy. They just want more tax money in their pockets, unless it is used to support the murder of non-Christians in wars.

Now it is time to tell me that we need to get back to what our founding fathers wanted -- one nation, under (my particular version of) Jesus, with tyranny and repression for all non-Christians! GAG!

This video is really well done. It matches the music much better and generalizes the theme. I played it last night and my 14-year-old started singing all the words. "You know this song?" I said. He did, he's way ahead of me. The message is pretty clear- we are in a time of amazing promise and danger and if we don't get our hands on the handlebars, we are going to crash. The bike represents technology and the passenger represents all of humanity.

Scott: Let's not try and confuse the subjects with facts, now!
Yea, I decided to stay away from these type conversations. No one's mind is going to be changed and these threads just make a whole bunch of JPF'ers look like .... In this one we got religion and politics all mixed into one. It wouldn't bother me much if Brian decided to start banning religious and political threads.

It is better to write songs of protest about -- or better yet, write songs about everyday people that might move folks to try and do right. ... And don't be too preachy about it.

Kevin

Our Economy went in the tank during the Carter years. Reagan fixed some things, but empowered corporations way too much. Now it seems those corporations are running both parties. There's plenty of evil in both major parties and that's why these arguments can go on and on if they are simply about saying "your guy/gal is worse than my guy/gal!" The reality is that the system we have is like a machine and these people are simply cogs in it. All are replacable and all have to work in the direction the machine wants to go, or they are broken. And as long as we keep ignoring the problems in the party of our choice by focusing solely on the problems of the others, we'll never fix anything. Both parties got us into this. Both parties need to get us out. But if McCain get's elected, the Dems will make sure he has ZERO successes if they can help it. They'd rather us fail as a nation than let the other party have measurable success while they are in charge. And the Repubs are exactly the same. If the Dem's get control of everything, nothing will get fixed, but more debt will pile up and the misery index will likely rival that of Carter's era. If McCain wins, everything will come to a screaching halt and even less will get done. That won't fix anything either.

Neither McCain or Obama have acted like a potential leader in my book. Neither have laid out an aggressive plan to fix the major problems we face. All of it is double talk and hedging their bets. T Boone Pickens, who isn't running for anything, has by far the best and most aggressive plan of anyone. Why is HE the one that looks like a leader right now and not any of the people running for President? I think both have let the handlers take over and I think those same handlers will give them the same bad advice.

Unless there's a major world crises or a major US crises, it looks pretty clear that Obama is going to win. He certainly has the love of the media and probably 53% of the voters. But what is he doing with all that good will and momentum? Mostly hiding his intentions from sight and coasting along to the finish line. He should take this opportunity to actually BE the great new leader his PR firm presents him as. But he's wasting the opportunity. I want to hear him say he will FIX these problems within his first term as President. Period. No 10 year plan.. no passing the buck to the next President after he's in office 1 or 2 terms. Fix it now and take the heat which in his case will be minimal. But alas.. he's become just another lame ass weakling in the face of handlers and fund raisers and power elite in Washington. McCain's only chance of winning is to do what I suggest. Offer tangible aggressive plans to fix the major problems in less than 4 years. If he comes out and lays all that out on the line and is honest with the public, he could upset the clear favorite. Obama is like the New England Patriots. McCain is like the Lowly Giants. If he grows a set of balls and does what he can, be may go down in flames, but he also may create the biggest political upset ever and go down in history as the guy who turned it all around. I doubt he'll do it though.

Brian

Brian for president ! ! ! He makes more sense than anyone ! ! Mike Dunbar for veep ! ! !