Who's Online Now
27 registered members (Harriet Ames, couchgrouch, Barry David Butler, Dave Rice, Brian Austin Whitney, Irwin, 9ne, Germain Brunet, 6 invisible), and 284 guests, and
Key: Admin, Global Mod, Mod
Shout Box
Member Spotlight
TC Perkins
TC Perkins
Posts: 460
Joined: May 2015
Show All Member Profiles 
What's Going On
Do you have any pets?
by Rick Heenan. 03/21/18 11:59 PM
Moving down the line
by RainyDayMan. 03/21/18 11:32 PM
Daily Distractions 12-16-2017 (Best Advice EVER)
by Johnny Daubert. 03/21/18 10:46 PM
If I had a gun. Vic
by Vicarn. 03/21/18 10:25 PM
Blessed With An Album Cut
by Johnny Daubert. 03/21/18 10:11 PM
Official American Idol Discussion
by Brian Austin Whitney. 03/21/18 10:09 PM
Donít Say Just Pay
by Irwin. 03/21/18 06:27 PM
Crazy Beautiful
by Germain Brunet. 03/21/18 06:19 PM
KERRY MOON. ( More Radio Plays. M.Zane. Travis)
by Germain Brunet. 03/21/18 05:52 PM
Thereís a Place
by Germain Brunet. 03/21/18 05:43 PM
Bummer Town
by Travis david. 03/21/18 04:08 PM
Like A Fool (I'll Be Waiting)
by Vicarn. 03/21/18 03:29 PM
Uncommon Grace
by floyd jane. 03/21/18 03:02 PM
Dear Mama (a US civil war song)
by Dave Rice. 03/21/18 10:17 AM
Sweet Kay Tee Gee
by Germain Brunet. 03/21/18 09:32 AM
Who's Bracket is Busted?
by Barry David Butler. 03/21/18 09:31 AM
Words Can Break Your Heart
by joro. 03/21/18 12:09 AM
Spirit of the Delta
by couchgrouch. 03/20/18 08:46 PM
SWEET DREAMS TONIGHT. (Work Tape† Travis/ Mimmo
by Travis david. 03/20/18 07:33 AM
Another Time Another Day
by the_lyricwriter. 03/19/18 09:23 PM
Trail In The Rain/Country?
by Ricki E. Bellos. 03/19/18 08:25 PM
The Wall Of The Tiny Coffins
by Alanjack. 03/19/18 11:36 AM
Beholden To Me
by Travis david. 03/18/18 07:17 PM
Your 1st ever PRO Royalty Check Response
by Johnny Daubert. 03/18/18 07:05 PM
Soft Kitty
by steve_folk. 03/18/18 06:53 PM
Make your mind up
by RainyDayMan. 03/18/18 06:24 PM
Dancing Horses
by lane1777. 03/18/18 03:38 PM
Her Share of the Blame. Travis & Vic
by Travis david. 03/18/18 10:35 AM
Got Signed Today: Cause of This song!
by steve_folk. 03/18/18 09:35 AM
Top Posters(All Time)
Calvin 19,390
Travis david 10,659
Kevin Emmrich 10,535
Jean Bullock 10,330
Kaley Willow 10,240
Two Singers 9,571
Joice Marie 9,186
Mackie H. 8,766
glynda 8,574
Mike Dunbar 8,574
Tricia Baker 8,318
Colin Ward 7,867
Corey 7,357
couchgrouch 7,265
Wyman Lloyd 6,578
Dave Rice 6,516
Mark Kaufman 6,429
Joe Wrabek 6,400
ben willis 6,090
Lynn Orloff 5,788
Louis 5,718
Linda Sings 5,604
Vicarn 5,536
niteshift 5,358
KimberlyinNC 5,210
Derek Hines 4,893
DonnaMarilyn 4,610
Blake Hill 4,528
Bob Cushing 4,351
Neil Cotton 4,291
Bill Osofsky 4,199
Cindy Miller 4,178
Tom Shea 4,173
TamsNumber4 4,023
nightengale 3,965
Roy Cooper 3,914
Caroline 3,865
Kolstad 3,771
Dan Sullivan 3,710
MFB III 3,687
Dottie 3,427
joewatt 3,411
beechnut79 3,335
Bill Cooper 3,279
John Hoffman 3,199
E Swartz 3,049
Skip Johnson 3,027
Pam Hurley 3,007
Terry G 3,005
PopTodd 2,877
Harriet Ames 2,869
Nigel Quin 2,802
MidniteBob 2,706
Tom Tracy 2,558
Polly Hager 2,526
Jerry Jakala 2,524
Nelson 2,514
Al Alvarez 2,499
Eric Thome 2,448
Hummingbird 2,401
Stan Loh 2,263
Sam Wilson 2,241
Judy Hollier 2,232
Erica Ellis 2,202
Wendy D 2,181
TrumanCoyote 2,096
Marty Helly 2,012
DukeWill 1,984
Ray Thyer 1,929
Clint Anglin 1,904
cindyrella 1,888
David Wright 1,866
Clairejeanne 1,851
Cindy LaRosa 1,824
maccharles 1,819
floyd jane 1,797
Ronald Boyt 1,675
Noel Downs 1,620
Iggy 1,613
Cal 1,574
Rick Heenan 1,569
Jack Swain 1,554
Pete Larsen 1,537
Ann Tygart 1,529
Tom Breshers 1,487
RogerS 1,459
Tom Franz 1,452
Ralph Blight 1,440
Chuck Crowe 1,435
Kenneth Cade 1,429
Rick Norton 1,428
bholt 1,411
Letha Allen 1,406
in2piano 1,404
Stan Simons 1,402
mattbanx 1,384
Jen Shaner 1,373
Charlie Wong 1,347
KevinP 1,324
Janice & Bud 1,318
Vondelle 1,316
Tom W. 1,313
Jan Petter 1,301
scottandrew 1,292
GocartMoz 1,268
DakLander 1,265
Ian Ferrin 1,230
PeteG 1,228
Glen King 1,210
IdeaGuy 1,209
AaronAuthier 1,177
Diane Ewing 1,158
summeoyo 1,085
Gerry 1,082
BobbyJoe 1,075
joro 1,068
S.DEE 1,040
yann 1,037
Tony A 1,016
argo 986
peaden 984
lane1777 982
Wolvman 960
IronKnee 912
Jak Kelly 912
krtinberg 890
Drifter 886
Petra 883
RJC 845
Brenda152 840
Nadia 827
Juan 797
TKO 784
frahmes 781
teletwang 762
90 dB 745
tbryson 737
Andy K 734
Andy Kemp 733
ant 732
Jackie444 722
3daveyO3 704
Dayson 703
Dixie 701
Joy Boy 695
Knute 686
9ne 681
Lee Arten 678
Katziis 652
quality 637
CG King 622
douglas 621
Mel 614
NaomiSue 601
Pat Hardy 596
Shandy 589
Ria 587
TAMERA64 583
qbaum 570
nitepiano 565
Tink2 553
Irwin 550
musica 539
deanbell 528
RobertK 527
Roderic 522
Moosesong 522
BB Wilbur 511
goodfolks 499
BonzaiWag 496
Deej56 490
Zeek 487
Stu 486
Steve P. 481
KathyW 462
allenb 459
MaxG 458
Philjo 454
R&M 448
fanito 448
trush48 448
dmk 442
arealrush 437
DGR 436
avweek 435
Stephen D 433
Emmy 431
Rob L 426
marquez 422
kit 419
Softkrome 417
kyrksongs 415
RRon 408
Laura G. 407
Debra 407
eb 406
cuebald 399
EdPerrone 399
Dannyk1 395
Hobart 395
Davyboy49 393
Smile 389
GJShades 387
Ezt 384
tone 380
Marla 380
Cecilee 379
iggyiggy 378
coalminer 377
java 374
spidey 371
sweetsong 370
danny 367
Jim Ryan 360
papaG 353
Alek 352
Z - man 350
John K 348
JamesDF5 347
Jaden 344
ddreuter 341
TheBaz 340
Steggy 339
leif 339
tonedeaf 336
rickwork 334
Eddie Ray 332
Johnboy 328
Bob Lever 328
Helicon1 327
lucian 326
Muskie 321
kc 319
Z. Mulls 318
ptondreau 313
Chris B. 310
trush 304
ed323 297
Ellen M 293
lizzorn 291
nicnac49 290
pomeranj 289
Char 286
ktunes 285
mastrose 280
pammie 279
Register Today!
Welcome to the Just Plain Folks forums! You are currently viewing our forums as a Guest which gives you limited access to most of our discussions and to other features.

By joining our free community you will have access to post and respond to topics, communicate privately with our users (PM), respond to polls, upload content, and access many other features. Registration is fast, simple, and absolutely free; so please join our community today!
Previous Thread
Next Thread
Print Thread
Rate This Thread
#586262 - 02/13/08 10:25 PM Odd question for piano players  
Joined: Jul 2005
Posts: 11,939
Scott Campbell Online content
Scott Campbell  Online Content

Top 10 Poster

Joined: Jul 2005
Posts: 11,939
Lakeland, FL, USA
Guitar is the instrument I play the most. I do a bit of fingerpicking. Nothing fancy like the people who play a rhythm and melody simulataneously. I do what I think is called "pattern picking" which is essentially picking in a repetitive pattern - you shift strings some depending on the chord and you can introduce a few fills to add some bells and whistles. Mostly, it just works nicely for self-accompaniament (that's spelled wrong, I think) when a strum doesn't fit the bill. You can find sound clips and tabs on the net for different patterns. There are several that I use.

I like to add piano to some of my songs but I'd like to do something more than just bang chords. Sometimes I'll make up a pattern for my fingers to follow but I'd like to learn if there are others. Are there patterns that people use for piano self-accompaniament analogous to what I described above for guitar? Left hand follows this pattern on each chord, right hand follows this...

I've tried to find books that might have this kind of info but mostly they just seem to want you to play melodies with the right hand.

Any suggestions for where to look? Or is this something people don't even do on the piano...

I learned a lot of the guitar patterns by jamming with other people. That doesn't seem to work as well for pianos. smile


#586279 - 02/13/08 11:28 PM Re: Odd question for piano players [Re: Scott Campbell]  
Joined: Jun 2006
Posts: 5,604
Linda Sings Offline
Linda Sings  Offline

Top 50 Poster

Joined: Jun 2006
Posts: 5,604
Yep, Scott, this is what I do all the time.
I am not always sure what my fingers are doing, but I am always sure of my fingers. smile
If you have a chord chart, you can look up what the piano chords look like in several places on the net. (google search "piano chords") Figure out which keys belong in the chord, and only play those - in whatever patterns you choose.

Experimentation is best, but an easy one to learn is to roll the notes from bottom to top with the left hand, and keep the right hand just holding down the main 2-3 notes of the chord. You can use the right hand to keep the "strum" rhythm if you want. Or you can roll the fingers of both hands. Or take turns.

If you read sheet music, and have some for the song, you can do this with anything you're playing. Fool around with it a bit. It's fun. My sister taught me the basic technique when I was a teen.

It's actually hard now for me to play any sheet music exactly as written, except straight classical pieces.

Good luck and have fun!


EDIT: I read this book from the library about a year ago, and it was fairly helpful. Mostly it validated what I was already doing by instinct - but it answers a lot of the questions you're asking, in plain English: http://www.amazon.com/Piano-Flash-Favorite-Pro-Whether-Lessons/dp/1401307663

Last edited by Linda Adams; 02/13/08 11:32 PM.
#586422 - 02/14/08 05:07 AM Re: Odd question for piano players [Re: Linda Sings]  
Joined: Jun 2005
Posts: 1,384
mattbanx Offline
Serious Contributor
mattbanx  Offline
Serious Contributor

Joined: Jun 2005
Posts: 1,384
Northern Minnesota
I wanted to play drums some years back doing metal type covers, but when I started recording originals, I could not very well play drums in my apartment unit.
So I picked up a Casio keyboards with percussion sounds.
I finger tap the keys to drum.
Quite limiting trying to balance like that with my fingers trying to sound like a drummer. And I only do my own compositions, which is far from showing off splendid playing.
I did it mainly to have styles to sing on to demonstrate for cover acts that did some originals in their set, which I have here for a link.
But it has sure seemed to help my timing with playing keyboards. In my first recordings, I would try to go 3 or more minutes straight through a song. Tapping keys for the The bass drum with one hand and rock drum with the other along with cymble accents. Because I stopped using samples to try and be more emotive.
Then I could play a bit more complex piano motives as time went by.

I'm not ambidextrious, but it has got me to where I can play at a simple level using both hands better.

Probably would'nt fly as far as the proper learning method, but for someone that may be uncoordinated it could'nt hurt.

#586909 - 02/15/08 02:17 AM Re: Odd question for piano players [Re: mattbanx]  
Joined: Jul 2005
Posts: 11,939
Scott Campbell Online content
Scott Campbell  Online Content

Top 10 Poster

Joined: Jul 2005
Posts: 11,939
Lakeland, FL, USA
Thanks, Linda.

I know all the chord positions - just looking for different ways to move the fingers on them.

Thanks for the suggestion. I already do what you suggested except do the roll with my right hand. So after I read your post, I tried doing it with my left and got quite a different sound. So I'll add it to my toolbox. Many thanks!


#586911 - 02/15/08 02:19 AM Re: Odd question for piano players [Re: Scott Campbell]  
Joined: Jul 2005
Posts: 11,939
Scott Campbell Online content
Scott Campbell  Online Content

Top 10 Poster

Joined: Jul 2005
Posts: 11,939
Lakeland, FL, USA
Is that you, Matt smile

I think my timing is not bad - but that's an interesting exercise you suggest - and will work on many keyboards I reckon.


#586976 - 02/15/08 05:45 AM Re: Odd question for piano players [Re: Scott Campbell]  
Joined: Jun 2006
Posts: 5,604
Linda Sings Offline
Linda Sings  Offline

Top 50 Poster

Joined: Jun 2006
Posts: 5,604
Cool - there you go! Once you have the roll down, you can pretend you're "fingerpicking" the piano keys and come up with more patterns. You're welcome!

#587054 - 02/15/08 01:56 PM Re: Odd question for piano players [Re: Linda Sings]  
Joined: Jan 2001
Posts: 8,058
Johnny Daubert Online content
Top 25 Poster
Johnny Daubert  Online Content
Top 25 Poster

Joined: Jan 2001
Posts: 8,058
New Jersey, USA

This is just one way to start the porcess I think you are wanting to hear:
Do you know how to play chord inversions? If not, just start your right hand chord with the third of that chord, (E note for the C chord, Notes: E G C for one inversion of the C chord. YOu cold also start on the G note, (Notes; G C E). Just your basic three finger chords,,,which you can of course add notes in that fit the song, say the 6th, or 7th, or sus. You could play those notes one at a time much like picking on the guitar. Simulate the sounds. Make the piano sound as if a guitar that is being played the way you play yours when picking. Find those notes on the guitar, and use them in similar ways on the piano.

For the left hand, you could be either on the root, rocking back and forth on octaves, or if able, to have a rythmic pattern of several notes that compliment your right hand pickng sounds style of playing. (NOt as busy, and focusing more on the downbeat.

(The right hand doesn't always have to stay ont he upbeat either, as that is for the drums to pronounce the snare mostly. You could be playing in bewtween the downbeat and the upbeat, to really get a good rythym going. It then makes the holes at the upbeats, which is cool sounding,,,,and again, lets the snare be the real time keeper. A lot of players will not be dead on the upbeat anyway for all beats, so it's just good practice to be either on the downbeat or in between that and the upbeat. (of course playing on the upbeat here and there,,,,and at a softer attack as to not overtake the snare's job and feel.

For another way, for the right hand, you could play two notes mainly, and if they fit the song or chord changes for some,,,,play the root of the chord with the suspended third, (or the fourth). Like in your making it up song,,,,I played some chords with just the root and the suspended third, (Notes; Gb and B), for the Gb chord,,,and playing them as eight notes for some area, for effect, as the vocal was slowing up in phrasing, for what makes a cool contrast of supportive sounds without being on each other's beat all the time.

For the left hand with that type of playing, it's best to just let the deep root sustain, while jumping up to play some accent notes in the octave above.

Sometime, see if Sub can shoot you just the piano track of "making it up as we go", and see if you can pick apart what I mean.

The thing to remember, for not wanting to pound chord all the way through your songs, is to think of your piano sounds as just that,,,sounds you hear coming in and out,,,,accenting, and not taking over the job of saying, "here's all the chords and this is the beat". Allow for holes. Allow for not always being on the upbeat,,,or even downbeat for the right hand. Less is more.

Make your piano be like picking on the guitar,,,,,,then play the guitar in equal strums, and you'll have the reverse of sounds with the picking style you like too! There are options when you can play with notes,,,,not just with chords. Picture your fngers when typing,,,,,then apply that technique to the piano keys. you don't have to always strike chords with one hit. They can be delayed, and starting with one note of the chord,,,and as I mentioned, with other added notes to the chord that isn't being played on the guitar, (like a 6th, or 9th, or 7th, or anything).

You're creative,,,,so first,,,just hear sounds as you play the song in your head, and start to hear accenting sounds.

Remember too, that you can hold a not on the right hand for say 3 and half beats before even going to another chord or notes,,,,AND that hold of that note may be one that will stay while the chords are changing.

Have fun experimenting. Try everything!


Actually a Member Since 1996 or 97 (Number One Hundred Something).
Songnado I and II:

#587684 - 02/17/08 11:23 PM Re: Odd question for piano players [Re: Johnny Daubert]  
Joined: Jul 2005
Posts: 11,939
Scott Campbell Online content
Scott Campbell  Online Content

Top 10 Poster

Joined: Jul 2005
Posts: 11,939
Lakeland, FL, USA
Hey John:

Thanks so much for the detailed response. I know enough to understand everything you're saying.

Some really cool ideas to play around with there. Will start practicing!

Cool! Thanks!


#588788 - 02/21/08 04:49 PM Re: Odd question for piano players [Re: Scott Campbell]  
Joined: Mar 2007
Posts: 168
Dave Derbes Offline
Serious Contributor
Dave Derbes  Offline
Serious Contributor

Joined: Mar 2007
Posts: 168
Pottsville, PA
Having been a drummer/pianist going to guitar... I feel your pain! The piano is cool because you can think of it as both accompaniment and solo at the same time. The left hand does well with octaves and the 5th in the middle. If you have large enough hands or longer fingers, you can play the the 10th (C to E) with the 5th in the middle, rocking back and forth or together.

You an also try some independent hand/finger movements where the left hand climbs up and the right hand moves contrary, and maybe off the beat. Keep in mind that your inner notes can move independently in both hands. (i'm doing poorly explaning this)

I think the beauty of using the piano and what you're trying to do is making use of the non-chordal tones which are very easy to access compared to the guitar. You can visualize them and reach them without being a contortionist.

While I took piano, drum and music lessons for awhile, I did learn a lot just by taking the fake or real book and playing old jazz or standards classics. There you only have melody and chords......so it forces you to be creative in your accompaniment.

Best of luck

#589624 - 02/24/08 03:11 PM Re: Odd question for piano players [Re: Dave Derbes]  
Joined: Jul 2005
Posts: 11,939
Scott Campbell Online content
Scott Campbell  Online Content

Top 10 Poster

Joined: Jul 2005
Posts: 11,939
Lakeland, FL, USA
Hi Dave:

Thanks for the suggestions - I was able to follow your descriptions.

Getting some cool ideas to try here - thanks!


#589685 - 02/24/08 08:13 PM Re: Odd question for piano players [Re: Scott Campbell]  
Joined: Sep 2007
Posts: 6,429
Mark Kaufman Offline
Mark Kaufman  Offline

Top 40 Poster

Joined: Sep 2007
Posts: 6,429
Scott, an idea for hacks like us who can hear it but not necessarily play it...

One of the wonders of multitracking is that you can build a difficult part piecemeal. I know you mentioned doing this with your vocals on "End of the World". So...hammer out one cool "fingerpicking" pattern with two fingers on one track, play the rest on another track or two, then bounce them down to one track.

#591233 - 02/29/08 01:23 AM Re: Odd question for piano players [Re: Mark Kaufman]  
Joined: Jul 2005
Posts: 11,939
Scott Campbell Online content
Scott Campbell  Online Content

Top 10 Poster

Joined: Jul 2005
Posts: 11,939
Lakeland, FL, USA
Hey Lyle:

Ha - I've already done that a few times - though not on anything I've posted. smile

Yes, is a great idea. If I just want to make the best recording I can, I'll do that kind of thing.

Here I'm more interested in further developing my (few) skills on an instrument...


Support Just Plain Folks

We would like to keep the membership in Just Plain Folks FREE! Your donation helps support the many programs we offer including Road Trips and the Music Awards.

Join Just Plain Folks
to receive the free
JPNotes Newsletter!
*this is separate from
message board registration*

Newest Members
udayshankar, RCJames, Jack_Lee, Nverjr, 10East
21018 Registered Users
Forum Statistics
Average Posts Daily47
Most Online1,506
Mar 16th, 2017
Just Plain Quotes
"Sometimes, the best thing you can say, isn't the easiest thing" -Brian Austin Whitney
Today's Birthdays
Tim Barber (71)
Popular Topics(Views)
Powered by UBB.threads™ PHP Forum Software 7.6.0