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#399048 - 04/03/06 01:38 AM april meeting notes......  
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Jim Mason Offline
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just some quick comments on sunday's meeting... small, but mighty turnout...some real positive interaction,.. truly seemed like more of a family picnic than usual... good biz meeting, and the plan to go to every other month seems like the right thing to do...good music and performances... i for one like the idea of no back line, just keeping it "coustic", but would like to plan for future meetings to have backup (from horsefeathers) so that it too becomes more of an event, than the norm... how does anyone else feel about that..? best to all, jim

#399049 - 04/03/06 04:04 AM Re: april meeting notes......  
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Mike Worrall Offline
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Jim,

I'm also in favor of, at least some, meetings being all acoustic. On some occaisions it's seemed like we have spent more time trying to do sound checks for the full band than we spent on performances. The time saved at a meeting that featured acoustic performers could mean more performance time...3 or 4 tunes perhaps.

Maybe we should alternate...acoustic one meeting and the next the full backline and band...

Just a thought,

Mike

#399050 - 04/03/06 11:07 AM Re: april meeting notes......  
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Al Alvarez Offline
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This is interesting.
Since this is "We're all in this together" that includes bands. Yesterday I met a couple of guys at the bar that were impressed by what we do that have a blues band and asked about performing at our next showcase. I think that the acoustic format is an exception especially through this summer where we will only be hosting every other month. If we do only acoustic every other meeting we would exclude bands and I guarentee you the attendance would suffer. Not to mention we don't want anyone to feel alienated. What we need is blockbuster showcases where we have plenty of time and focus on the stage. Just my two cents. Next.
Al

#399051 - 04/03/06 12:06 PM Re: april meeting notes......  
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Jerry Jakala Offline
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Good points Al!
Horse Feather's would not be the only one's affected.What about Cold Harbor & the Transhypnotic Orchestra or the Burners or the Jodell Band?Some of the songwriters would also be discouraged from using the full band sound when they want or need to.
I think we would be loosing a lot more than we would be gaining by cutting out the band scene.

Jerry


------------------
Jerry Jakala


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The difference between genius and stupidity is that there is a limit on genius.-Albert Einstein
#399052 - 04/03/06 11:23 PM Re: april meeting notes......  
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donnoble Offline
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Hey Y'all,
About the topics mentioned yesterday and, by using my fingers and toes, I've come up with a bi-monthly meeting schedule. This is all up for discussion, really.
Jan-No Meeting
Feb-Acoustic Jam
March-No Meeting
April-Band Backup
May-No Meeting
Jun-Acoustic Jam
July-No Meeting
Aug-Band Backup
Sept-No Meeting
Oct-Acoustic Jam
Nov-No Meeting
Dec-Band Backup-Christmas Party Ho-Ho-Ho

#399053 - 04/04/06 10:35 AM Re: april meeting notes......  
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Jerry Jakala Offline
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Part of the charm of the Tampa Bay Chapter of JPF is the willingness of us electric musicians to back songwriters that want to hear or get the feel of their songs with a full band.There are also some JPFer's that only do electric music weather it is solo or in a band situation.Take that away and you are going to isolate/alienate a lot of folks.It's bad enough that the meetings are getting cut down to 6 a year.Electric every other one cuts it down to three a year for Horse Feather's & other electric folks.How would you feel if it was electric only and acoustics every other showcase/meeting?Some of us can shine in a band situation as we are not solo artists per se.To say that I am less than thrilled with this musical segregation is an understatement.
We are all in this together?
Jerry

------------------
Jerry Jakala


http://www.jerryjakala.com
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The difference between genius and stupidity is that there is a limit on genius.-Albert Einstein
#399054 - 04/04/06 12:16 PM Re: april meeting notes......  
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FloridaRanger Offline
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Tampa, Fl, USA
I want to thank those who showed up at the JPF showcase. Al, Tiffany, Mike, Jim, Don, Karen, Jerry, John, The sound system was superior, as most acts were a single performer, set-up and tweaking were easy. Thank God the system was not too loud. I hate it when my ears bleed after a stage performance. I truly believe that we can all obtain the things we seek from JPF, if we rely upon the judgment of each other. We need to listen to each other twice as hard as we listen to ourselves. You see, I cannot ever see my self as others see me. I have no idea if I communicated without feedback. So at the risk of becoming a PARIAH, I would like to see these following things put into our meetings to really connect with each other. As to the Band vs single performer issue, if we had two stages so that one could set up while a "single" played that would expedite things, just no dead air, please.
1. Institute the "BlueBird Café" rule. SHHH…
2. Allow each performer to two songs, If you are like me, you want to do ten- no showboating!. That cuts both ways if you only want to do one song, wait till you have two songs fit for prime time.
3. Circulate a feedback sheet. This sheet would rank
a. Content - rhythm, meter, rhyme, subject, matter
b. Stage command - rapport with crowd, projection, attire, etc.
c. A request for "I’d like to perform that song" Not all material is fit for all entertainers, however I can think of no higher flattery. You will be amazed at what a better musician that you will become by performing another artist’s work. After all, that is how we learned from day one.
4. No one performs unless they agree to participate in the feedback sheet. This way we all meet and interact, instead of the click.
5. Continue monthly meetings


I would appreciate a discussion on these points.

Kevin AKA Ranger

#399055 - 04/04/06 03:08 PM Re: april meeting notes......  
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Jim Terry Offline
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Palm Harbor, FL, USA
I agree with Al and Jerry.All are welcome and should be.I never realized acoustic solo players felt that way about bands.To not have bands so the acoustic folks can play 4 songs instead of 2 seem selfish. Truth is it takes a real dynamic acoustic solo player to hold the attention of a crowed for more than two song anyway.Many of marks were made with one or two song performances.Ed Sullivan Show
David Letterman, Jay Lenno, American Idol give you one shot.We need to check the ship I think it has a hole in it and it will sink if not fixed. JT

#399056 - 04/04/06 04:47 PM Re: april meeting notes......  
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Jerry Jakala Offline
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The Blue Bird Rule SHHH will not work here.
These meetings/showcases are as much about networking as they are about anything else.
Most of us have become friends that see each other once a month and is really the only time to catch up or network.Most of these fine folks are respectful and keep their voices down during a performance.
As for the feed back sheet some one would have to be responsible for them.This would be a good topic for one of the monthly interim meetings.
My two cents worth and I am waiting for the change.
Jerry

------------------
Jerry Jakala


http://www.jerryjakala.com
http://cdbaby.com/cd/jakalajerry2

The difference between genius and stupidity is that there is a limit on genius.-Albert Einstein
#399057 - 04/04/06 05:07 PM Re: april meeting notes......  
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Mike Worrall Offline
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At the risk of getting all wound up, perhaps I need to make myself a little more clear.

- I may really like the acoustic solo/duo/trio genre, but I don't have anything against bands. I'm currently playing in a couple of them.

- There is certainly a place at the showcases for all types of music. However, I have seen, and Al has touched on this in other posts, a bit of complacency setting in. Rather than doing "the same old thing" at every meeting, maybe having showcases which have varied dynamics could lend some renewed vitality to our monthly or bi-monthly efforts. This isn't being exclusionary, it's being focused.

- I don't view a three song performance, depending upon the number of folks who have signed up, as selfish. I think hour long sound checks and 15 minutes to get the act set up to play Bad Company covers might be a little selfish.

- Finally, I don't think the ship has holes in it, I think the sailors have differing points of view. That happens in organizations that have more than one member.

I'll head back to lurk mode now...
Mike

#399058 - 04/04/06 06:54 PM Re: april meeting notes......  
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Direct Current Offline
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I'll add another view on this topic. I think any good original song, well crafted, will sound great on an acoustic. I actually think if you plan for the song to be fully produced and performed with a full band it's first requirement would be the acoustic route. If it sounds good in that format it will sound good or better with a full band. So electic players should embrace playing acoustically on occasions. It will reflect how well your song is crafted.
On the other hand, having just returned from Nashville's NSAI symposium with all the workshops and advice from publishers, labels, songwriters, etc., it was pointed out that if you intend to demo a song, have it fully produced. Do not expect the industry to hear what they could do to the song. They only hear what you give them and nothing more. Knowing that, if you are a acoustic player/songwriter it is important to you to learn about arrangments and how a band would break your song down to individual parts. A whole sound as opposed to a focus on one instrument and one voice.
The point is, if you focus is to sell your song you need to function in both worlds. We need both players. I plan on doing more acoustic performances as a real test to the strength of the song. I am also working with an acoustic player that we want to go full band with his song to determine it's strength there. Having said all that I don't think the everyother method will sell. It restricts that creative process of when were ready to do the next step. The sound check things and delays in getting ready can and should be addressed. It's not professional to drag between songs and between acts and we do want to be professional. One other thing, I cannot remember any occasion where someone did not get to perform due to time restrictions and I have been around since the first meeting.
We all need each other and to lose even one person over this subject means we failed as a organization and as a person.
Dan

#399059 - 04/04/06 07:13 PM Re: april meeting notes......  
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Al Alvarez Offline
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Since day one in February 03 we have had a full backline set up when available. There have been exceptions. We will have backline instruments available at all of our showcases and those that want to play acoustically can play acoustically. Its the way its always been and the way it will be. It hurts no one, only serves to include the full spectrum of players.

#399060 - 04/04/06 08:07 PM Re: april meeting notes......  
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Steve Humes Offline
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I like ideas about stimulating the creativity of the meetings. One good example was the Ricks On The River meeting with David Hurd videoing the performances. This kind of diversification needs to happen more. Perhaps even some CD recordings of the performances.
Since we're all in this together, it only makes sense that all types of acts and configurations are allowed to perform.

The next step would be to have the acts that signed up organized in to their respective catagories, so that the performances are transitioned smoothly.

The other idea that was brought up by Jim is the idea of a voted contest on performances. It might be good to incorporate outside judges, as done at Eddie's Attic in Atlanta or we could do the voting among ourselves. That should work, since we all seem to know each other well. It can help give a guage and motivation to be really "on".

I saw this in action at a national open mic venue in Atlanta, and the level of talent was awesome. It really coaxed the best perfomances out of the participants.

Assuming the common objective here is to improve as musicians, this could really help everyone accomplish that, and help with overall participation and attendance.

Something else that may stimulate progress would be to have the performance sign up done here on the boards beforehand and finalized a week or so before the showcase, and then organized and posted so that all will know what to expect, and the show can be managed smoothly.

Let's all try to come up with our best ideas to maintain these showcases as top notch entertainment!

#399061 - 04/05/06 12:26 AM Re: april meeting notes......  
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Evan Davis Offline
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If you don't mind a relatively new member chiming in, I think diversity is one of the greatest things about JPF, and that all kinds of performances should be welcomed at every meeting.



"Evan Davis is a Songwriter of Great Social and Political Importance." -- SALT TV NEWS.

http://www.myspace.com/evandavismusic
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#399062 - 04/05/06 03:26 AM Re: april meeting notes......  
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Steve Dockendorf Offline
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Although some of the ideas expressed in this thread have struck my fancy more than others, I am nevertheless thrilled by the amount of thoughtful opinions shared.

Now for my two cents. I like every month. I'm out of town a lot and every other month reduces the chances that my business schedule will permit my attendance.

If anyone likes "all acoustic" enough they could host a get-together such as were common with another songwriting association up north. They used the misleading name "song swap." Various members would host others in their home for an evening or afternoon and perform a song or two for each other much as the WMNF show goes - round and around until each has run out of songs or out of time. This type of arrangement is less formal than a house concert and could be used to confirm or tweak a new song prior to performance at one of the meeting/showcases. If the schedule does remain at every other month, then I will be glad to offer my residence in Clearwater for such gatherings. Any feedback on this (both from potential hosts and potential attendees) would be welcome.

I am also for the critique sheet and the necessity to participate on both ends of the sheet.

------------------
Steve Dockendorf
"Quality music for quality people"
dockendorf2000@yahoo.com
www.soundclick.com/stevedockendorf


Steve Dockendorf
Dockendorf Audio Recorders
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dockendorf2000@yahoo.com
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#399063 - 04/05/06 07:21 AM Re: april meeting notes......  
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Tom Stephens Offline
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Ya know, the older I get the more I’ve come to know that “there ain’t nothin’ easy”. Life is hard, work is hard and making
good music is work.. It’s passionate work. It doesn’t matter if you’re an acoustic player, an electric player or a tuba player
you work at it because you love it. Sooner or later you want to be heard in your own format. I’m for monthly meetings and a full backline so everyone can do their thing

Let’s not make this as difficult as everything else…


Tom Stephens

#399064 - 04/05/06 10:19 AM Re: april meeting notes......  
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Jim Mason Offline
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i didn't realize the passions i brought up when i started this topic, so let me say... i truly appreciate the effort that dan, jerry, andy, mikey, alex and whomever is or has been involved with horsefeathers have given to our chapter meetings, working extra time and helping many of us jpf'ers, especially me, look good fronting a band... lord knows, bands have been my success and i love getting to do it... so, for future reference, whatever al says goes, and if he says there will continue to be a back line, great and thanks again for making tampa bay "chapter of the year". and yes, diversity is wonderful and necessary, and i think well represented within our membership. we're all clever people and will find ways to expand our creative drives, like drawing names from a hat to choose cowriting partners and bringing new music to the next scheduled meeting... or agreeing on a topic/subject about which to write....lotsa possibilities..
in closing i want to be perfectly clear that my comment about enjoying the "all acoustic" meeting last sunday was in no way intended to mean anything negative... and i certainly hope i offended no one.. i love this organization and am proud to be a member.. best to all,
jim mason

#399065 - 04/05/06 01:41 PM Re: april meeting notes......  
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EmmitSycamore Offline
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Alas, yet another Tampa JPF meeting fell on a date when I was out of town. Sorry I missed out.

It might be interesting, just as a point of reference, to take note of a format used by another JPF chapter, in this case, Indianapolis. For some years, the standard mode was a brief "open mic" session, followed up with a "by invitation" showcase, where one or more acts each played a set. Of course, the sheer quantity of participants in the Tampa chapter adds a factor that the Indy gang never had to deal with, but in that setting it worked quite well.

Just a thought,
Emmit Sycamore

#399066 - 04/05/06 02:12 PM Re: april meeting notes......  
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Bob Lever Offline
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I thought we had a pretty good thing going as it is. I do like the idea of a little competition, always makes me work harder. I still like monthly meetings. I can't make every one but I do like having the oppurtunity. As far as acoustic vs full backup, If you are planning to have your full band there, like any other gig, show up early and do a sound check. Let's keep this simple.

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Bob Lever
727-278-6168
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#399067 - 04/06/06 09:03 AM Re: april meeting notes......  
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Steve Humes Offline
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Steve Humes  Offline
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Joined: Mar 2005
Posts: 387
Tampa, Fl USA
Lets keep this discussion going and lively and distill what we want to see in future JPF meetings from it.

From what I gather, we will be skipping a time or two during the summer. A little rest is good. maybe we can get some target dates in advance as a goal to work up our best stuff for.

Here is an opportunity to grow this and make our JPF stronger, faster, better!

Lets try this:

Make 3 points, and lets get a consensus.

1. Keep the full backline
2. Sign up for perfomances on the boards prior to showcases
3. Initiate a contest/judging/feedback system

Next!


[This message has been edited by steveintampa (edited 04-06-2006).]

#399068 - 04/06/06 10:21 AM Re: april meeting notes......  
Joined: Mar 2002
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Al Alvarez Offline
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Tampa Florida
Good stuff here. As far as having to sign up for the showcase online, here is the problem I foresee. As hard as we have tried to get more folks involved in this message board for one reason or another it just doesn't happen. I thought about initiating this type of program then I thought it through. We just don't want to discourage anyone at any time for any reason from participating in a live meeting and showcase. Being a promoter this is always the issue.
Lets say I'm active on this board and 10th on the list. That's an automatic excuse to come in late, not take advantage of the meeting portion of the event and not be there to support the nine folks performing before me. Or if I'm just one of those folks who shows up allot and participates but just doesn't use the message board and I find out Im being alienated because of it....
It's really a slippery slope.
My opinion is that by having the sign up sheet available at the start of meet and greet performers are rewarded by showing up on time and can pick their slot. Just seams the fairest way to me.
Keep it rolling, Al

#399069 - 04/06/06 11:02 AM Re: april meeting notes......  
Joined: Nov 2002
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Jak Kelly Offline
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Jak Kelly  Offline
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St Petersburg , FL. USA
Ok, My .04cents worth.

My feeling on this chapter is , if it works, don’t fix it!
We didn’t become the #1 chapter in the country for lack of ideas, or participation.
The “backline” is a fundemental part of our chapter. Horsefeathers works extremely hard to make those who will spend the effort sound great.
Some of us just can’t make the time to rehearse with them before hand, but even with no rehearsal, they
Come through every time!
I had the pleasure of doing a couple tunes with them and they were great! Even tho my health, and lack of practice time was limited.
I also work accoustic solo most of the time and never felt out of place.
The sign up during the meet and greet has always worked fine as far as I’m concerned. As for a critique sheet, well, maybe, but I think the applause we give each other is critique enough for all of us. If you can’t trust your peers, who then?
The only thing I really miss are the speakers we had in the beginning. Always informative and may have brought up things a lot of us hadn’t thought of.
Big Al works his butt off for all of us, lets not make his volunteer job even harder.
He’s always been there for us, lets be there for him!
Ok, maybe I put in .05 cents worth, but I believe in our chapter!



------------------
jak kelly
http://www.jakkelly.com
swampwood1@juno.com
http://openmic.folkalley.com/JakKelly
http://www.soundclick.com/jakkelly

#399070 - 04/06/06 11:42 AM Re: april meeting notes......  
Joined: Apr 2003
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Andy K Offline
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Andy K  Offline
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Clearwater, FL, USA
Just because Al wants to only schedule JPF meetings every other month due to his schedule and time constants, that doesn't mean that someone else can't take the ball and coordinate meetings for the other months that Al can't handle. They could have the format of these meetings be whatever they want (within reason).

That said, I'm going to be too busy to handle scheduling meetings the alternate months. I've already got my hands full with the Professional Growth meetings. In fact, I'll probably miss most of the scheduled regular meetings for the rest of this year as I'll be out of town (Kerrville, Texas, in May, British Columbia in July, Nashville in Sept., LA and PA in Nov).

Here is an opportunity for someone else to shine!

------------------
Stone Marmot
retro pop-rock original music
www.stonemarmot.com
www.soundclick.com/stonemarmot.htm
www.myspace.com/stonemarmot


https://www.stonemarmot.com
Stone Marmot
Nouveau retro pop-rock music
Whatever happened to the Golden Rule is the subject of our latest song,
“The Golden Rule.” Listen at: https://soundcloud.com/stone-marmot/the-golden-rule
and check out its music video: https://youtu.be/0FKlwhjdENc
#399071 - 04/06/06 01:26 PM Re: april meeting notes......  
Joined: Mar 2002
Posts: 2,499
Al Alvarez Offline
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Tampa Florida
This is something that was discussed at the meeting and FOR THOSE WHO DID ATTEND, I suggested that members go out and do more supporting of their fellow JPFers special events and gigs. For instance Jak Kelly has a house concert on the 30th the day we would have scheduled our next JPF meeting and showcase. Miss Goody has scheduled a BBQ and Jamm session also on the 30th. I would think that its pretty common knowledge that we host JPF meetings/showcase on or around the last Sunday of the month but.....There is always going to be something else happening especially in the summer months.
After stepping back and thinking about it for a good while I figured instead of trying to compete with the date that had already been promoted by these two fellow members and the Bluegrass festival going on that weekend maybe it was time for a change to a summer break and host showcases every other month.
That being said....Andy.....
Keeping this chapter going is a community effort but believe me it takes allot of work and promoting to have successful events on a monthly basis and to be there to host them every month. Besides the very few who step up continuously I wonder how your suggestion will fly. We are all members and anyone can host a JPF event, I'm just the coordinator.
There was a reason for this decision. Its summer time. There will be allot of individual gigs and promotions. I think that we need to get out more and start to support house concerts and friendly gatherings that support independent artists. We need to get folks off their butts and start to show some diverse attendance throughout the music community not just once a month at a JPF meeting and then going home and feeling like we did our share.
Some times this ROCK REALLY HURTS my head.
See ya'll next week, I'm taking a break.
A

"Just because Al wants to only schedule JPF meetings every other month due to his schedule and time constants, that doesn't mean that someone else can't take the ball and coordinate meetings for the other months that Al can't handle. They could have the format of these meetings be whatever they want (within reason)."

OUCH!


[This message has been edited by Al The Pal (edited 04-06-2006).]

#399072 - 04/07/06 12:28 AM Re: april meeting notes......  
Joined: Aug 2004
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Jim Mason Offline
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Jim Mason  Offline
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Tampa, Fl USA
HEY AL... "OUCH" IS RIGHT, BRO.... SORRY YOU GOT SLAMMED... DON'T BLAME YOU FOR FEELING A LITTLE SORE.... ANYTHING I CAN DO TO HELP CLEAR UP?? LET ME KNOW.... I'M IN YOUR CORNER....
JIM MASON

#399073 - 04/07/06 02:48 AM Re: april meeting notes......  
Joined: Feb 2004
Posts: 2,524
Jerry Jakala Offline
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Jerry Jakala  Offline
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Pinellas Park.FL USA
For the two plus years that I have been with JPF Al has done an exceptional job as Co ordinator.Chapter of the year plus the Holiday parties,running the meetings/showcases every month.Al instantly makes every one feel a part of the JPF family.This is a labor of love for Al nothing more nothing less.Al does an excellent,excellent job as our leader/co ordinator.Without Al this chapter would not have had or continue to have the successes that it has.Few people realize that within a few days following the meeting Al is making plans and kicking around ideas for the next meeting/showcase.Al's people & organizational skills are unbeatable as far as I am concerned.I doubt that there is anyone that can run these meetings/showcases with the finesse,class & professionalism that Al does.We are dam lucky to have Al as our co ordinator.
Thanks Al for all that you do and continue to do.

Jerry


------------------
Jerry Jakala


http://www.jerryjakala.com
http://cdbaby.com/cd/jakalajerry2

The difference between genius and stupidity is that there is a limit on genius.-Albert Einstein
#399074 - 04/07/06 06:40 AM Re: april meeting notes......  
Joined: Dec 2005
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Jeffery Bennett Offline
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Jeffery Bennett  Offline
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Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 17
Largo,Florida U.S.A.
Al, if not for you I would never had the chance to make it and get into the field of music and I too am in your corner always my friend. And I agree with Jerry and the others, you work so dang hard on getting everyone together and getting things set up and keep the ball rolling always. And also because of you, I have had the pleasure of working with some really talented and wonderful folks such as Dan, Jerry, Rich, Steve Dokendorf & others. So I just wanted to thank you very much for giving me the chance to be able to be a part of such a wonderful group of very talented and very dedicated folks. If there is anything I can do to help, Believe me I sure as heck will.

Jeffery Bennett

#399075 - 04/07/06 08:53 AM Re: april meeting notes......  
Joined: Mar 2005
Posts: 387
Steve Humes Offline
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Steve Humes  Offline
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Tampa, Fl USA
What consensus I have been able to gather from the April meeting this is:

Keep the backline arrangement

Be ready when its your turn to perform

Take off a time or two for the summer

Support other JPF er's gigs by attending

Guest speakers are of interest

This forum is a great way to express ideas that might not have come to mind at the meetings.

All the suggestions and ideas that I have seen here are in the interest of maintaining and improving the high caliber of meetings we are fortunate to have the opportunity to participate in.

Lets keep ideas flowing.

If an idea or suggestion in itself is not agreed or acted on does not mean that it can't lead to other ideas and actions, i.e. spark creativity.

Here's another idea to consider, and discuss:

An acoustic backline.

If I had to pick the one way I have benefitted from JPF the most, it is from the opportunities I have had to accompany other people on their music.

As Dan pointed out, the singer/songwriter can be more well rounded and marketable by learning to arrange the material, as well as perform solo.

Comments?.........

#399076 - 04/07/06 11:17 AM Re: april meeting notes......  
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Jerry Jakala Offline
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Jerry Jakala  Offline
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Pinellas Park.FL USA
Not being a musical Einstein I have no idea what you mean by an acoustic back line.
I do think this is a great idea that shoud be pursued.

Jerry


------------------
Jerry Jakala


http://www.jerryjakala.com
http://cdbaby.com/cd/jakalajerry2

The difference between genius and stupidity is that there is a limit on genius.-Albert Einstein
#399077 - 04/07/06 12:35 PM Re: april meeting notes......  
Joined: Mar 2005
Posts: 387
Steve Humes Offline
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Steve Humes  Offline
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Jerry,

Just a simple backup arrangement situation for singer/songwriters performing more folk/acoustic types of music.

Acoustic lead guitar, bass of any kind, congas/hand percussion, mandolin, cello, backing vocals etc.

We might think about a couple more direct boxes, mics for instruments, and cables for quick set up. I have them, and would be willing to bring them.



[This message has been edited by steveintampa (edited 04-07-2006).]

#399078 - 04/07/06 12:47 PM Re: april meeting notes......  
Joined: Feb 2003
Posts: 164
Direct Current Offline
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Direct Current  Offline
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Clearwater,FL USA
Great idea Steve. I remember a great performance at Java Junction with you and Leigh and Sheila and Chris and perhaps others that was all acoustic. It sounded great. Band sounds can be very pleasing without electric instruments.
Hey Al, I can't speak for someone else's post but I don't think anything negative was meant by it. I read it more as an attempt to encourage others to help take some of the load off you. Anytime you need a break or help with a project, I'm more than willing to lend a hand. You have been carrying the load for a long time. When YOU need a break take it and let others help. The last thing we want to do is burn out our leader.
Dan

#399079 - 04/07/06 08:14 PM Re: april meeting notes......  
Joined: May 2004
Posts: 30
Jim Terry Offline
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Jim Terry  Offline
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Joined: May 2004
Posts: 30
Palm Harbor, FL, USA
E mails Chats instant messages have a way of sounding rude and not conveying what the person truly means.I cannot think of anyone member who is trying to degrade or take over.The very respone and interest that this post created is proof that we all care.We all care for and support AL. He is not often wrong in his decisions.The last guy in the world that would want to offend him would be Andy.I do not often speak for others but due to my respect for both of these fine men I feel a need to write this post.JPfolks needs them both very much.All are welcome and should be to the meetings how well rehersed or fine tuned the show cases go is not at all as important as the fact that we are making MUSIC.It has always been a joy for me to back up an artist at the meetings.what we need to do is do one song and everyone who wants to play on it regardless of ability or instrument of choice does.Just picture it all of us doing some tune any tune all at once. TGIF JT

#399080 - 04/07/06 11:16 PM Re: april meeting notes......  
Joined: Sep 2004
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CanisLupus Offline
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CanisLupus  Offline
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New Port Richey, FL USA
Holy Cow! What a thread. Ok, my $ 0.02. Al and his guidance/steering of JPF is the Bomb and is one of the biggest reasons everyone still attends and active participates...myself included. His experience and charisma are legendary and respected here for sure. However, I also truly believe that there was no mailce in the words of some others, I feel they were constructive suggestions, perhaps not super clearly expressed as such and could've been misinterpreted on any given day - yes?? Maybe? Maybe not.

Anyway, I enjoy monthly meetings but if we have to go to a spread out schedule due to logistics..so be it...not my vote...but either way...I am in.

I do love the fully-powered back line as well as acoustic performances and have participated in both...I have songs that lend themselves to either.

I know...MOR...middle of the road. So what...let's just do this...keep playing and supporting each other and having a blast doing it!

that's my pennies' worth.

------------------
Alex Wolfe Parnes/Canis Lupus Productions
www.canislupusmusic.com

#399081 - 04/08/06 10:52 AM Re: april meeting notes......  
Joined: Apr 2001
Posts: 19,351
Brian Austin Whitney Offline
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Joined: Apr 2001
Posts: 19,351
Indianapolis, IN USA
Hi Folks,

I generally try to stay out of local chapter issues and politics unless someone asks me to get involved (or there's a major problem). The reason I noticed this post is that it's gotten a huge amount of traffic, far more than is normal for anything on the Tampa board this month, so I took a look more closely.

I've done app 1000 JPF Showcases personally all over the US and Canada. Some things work much better than others. If you guys want some perspective from elsewhere I can offer it, but if I do, I am concerned that feathers will be ruffled for a lot of people and that wouldn't be my goal. So I'll let you guys tell me if you want some feedback from an outside perspective. But you all have to agree to have an open mind and also equally feel free to disagree. As I said, I have no interest in stepping on toes.. but I think a fresh perspective without any knowledge of the local politics and history involved might be a useful part of the process.

Let me know,

Brian


Brian Austin Whitney
Founder
Just Plain Folks
jpfolkspro@gmail.com
Skype: Brian Austin Whitney
Facebook: www.facebook.com/justplainfolks

"Don't sit around and wait for success to come to you... it doesn't know the way." -Brian Austin Whitney

"It's easier to be the bigger man when you actually are..."

[Linked Image]
#399082 - 04/08/06 11:24 AM Re: april meeting notes......  
Joined: Apr 2003
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Andy K Offline
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Andy K  Offline
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Clearwater, FL, USA
I don't understand what all the “ouching” is about. Someone must be doing too much reading between the lines (sort of like the old joke about the guy who compliments his girlfriend about the pretty dress she is wearing and she gets all upset, interpreting the comment to mean all her other dresses are ugly).

So far, the Tampa Chapter of JPF has been pretty much a one man show. Sure, some of us have been helping with sound, providing equipment for the meetings, stuff like that, but that is the easy part. It only takes an afternoon and evening each month from our lives. The hard part is finding suitable venues for the meetings, scheduling the meetings so that the times are agreeable to the venues and the majority of the members, provide most of the equipment for these showcases, keeping all the members up to date with what's happening, screening people who want to talk at our meetings (most of whom are probably peddling a product), and probably a lot of other stuff I don't know about. This takes a lot of time and is a lot of hassle, and I'm sure has some out of pocket expenses we don't hear about. I'm surprised Al has done so well and stuck with this for the past three years, especially since he is still working full time and has a wife and private life fighting for his time and energy.

When questioned by Brian Austin Whitney and others on why the Tampa Chapter is so much more active and successful than the other chapters, the answer I give, and the others quickly agree, is because of Al Alvarez. None of the other chapters appear to have someone who is willing and able to put in so much time and is as determined in making sure this thing works!

Which brings up the question: If Al Alvarez were to suddenly disappear, would we still have a Tampa Bay Chapter? I would hope so, but I suspect not for long. Who else is willing to put in this kind of time and energy into making sure this keeps happening? I know I don't have the time and energy. We have had others step forward and organize Christmas parties, house concerts, host interrum meetings, organize a backup band, etc. (thanks Cindy, Sheila and Chris, Stan, Dan, and others I'm probably forgetting [Another opportunity for people to get upset!]). These things are appreciated, help a lot, and take some load off Al. But we need more effort from more people.

Which brings us to our monthly meetings: I got the impression from some of the above comments that some people weren't happy with the meetings in the future only being every other month. I also got the impression some didn't like the way the showcases were being handled, with some preferring all acoustic showcases. I've also heard from others in the past that they don't like the showcases at all and would prefer educational guest speakers or workshops or such. Now I don't know the exact reason why Al has decided to go to meetings every other month, but, from previous private discussions I and others have had with Al, he has been saying for a while that he needs to put more time to his private life and was hoping some of us would take some of the load off his back.

Here is an opportunity for someone else to shine by organizing the “missing” monthly meetings. You could run these meetings any way you want, within reason. I would hope you would coordinate these meetings with Al and the rest of us. Otherwise, you probably won't get much attendance and will divide rather than strengthen the Chapter. And it doesn't have to be one person, either. A group can work on these meetings, or divide them with a different person running every other month. These are suggestions.

Actions speak louder than words. It is easy to complain, blame, and whine (a major problem in today's world). It is much harder to step up to the plate, as Al has, and make things happen.

------------------
Stone Marmot
retro pop-rock original music
www.stonemarmot.com
www.soundclick.com/stonemarmot.htm
www.myspace.com/stonemarmot


https://www.stonemarmot.com
Stone Marmot
Nouveau retro pop-rock music
Whatever happened to the Golden Rule is the subject of our latest song,
“The Golden Rule.” Listen at: https://soundcloud.com/stone-marmot/the-golden-rule
and check out its music video: https://youtu.be/0FKlwhjdENc
#399083 - 04/08/06 02:46 PM Re: april meeting notes......  
Joined: Mar 2002
Posts: 2,499
Al Alvarez Offline
Al Alvarez  Offline


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Joined: Mar 2002
Posts: 2,499
Tampa Florida
Sometimes when you shake things up it puts a little jiggle in the wiggle....


First let me say that I agree with Jim Terry in that many times allot can be lost in online communication. I know I can be a little rough around the edges from time to time but please don't confuse my being somewhat defensive with an issue, and my love for my long time fellow members and friends. People will have misunderstandings from time to time it doesn't mean something constructive can't come out of it with even a stronger personal bond.
I responded to Andy's post directly and maybe with some frustration. Sometimes statements can be misconstrued. Andy has been with us since day one. Andy joined Doc Lovett and I on a road trip to Atlanta in '03' to visit that Chapter and represent Tampa. Andy is at every meeting he can make and always helps with sound, sharing his gear and helping in every way he is asked. He has even Lent of his technical expertise and provided repair to a blown speaker I had, gratis. I appreciate Andy greatly and hope that an online misundertanding doesn't kill that, it doesn't for me. I did feel a little slighted however. Let me explain. And the following is not directed at Andy but may give you all a little more insight into what goes into this endeavour.
For the last three plus years two things that have the utmost importance for us to thrive as a chapter and to help build our music community are...
GO TO THE BOARDS, not just the Tampa message board but look around at our mentors, visit the general and lyric boards, all the boards, get an insight into what JPF really is. I feel its important for everyone to get a sense of the enormity of this organization and feel a part of it. When we say "We're all in this together" it doesn't just mean Tampa Bay, there is a whole JPF worldwide family out there. I was at the awards with Andy and Tampa Stan and some others, its enormous and professional. But I "rarely" see any of our members participating on various JPF boards. At many (Not all) but many meetings I will start off by reading the mission statement for a reason. ( At this point I have seen a couple of faces look down in disgust, like oh [naughty word removed] not that again, makes me feel real good)We always have new faces in the crowd and its as important for them to hear what a special door they are walking through as well as reinforce it with all of our regular membership. We talk about the music awards, Allot, but when asked how many have participated with entries I have to be honest the numbers are disappointing for the reining "Chapter of the Year".
Talk about walking on eggshells I've been doing it for three years. Trying to create an environment to attract new members without alienating the old members and avoiding having the chapter split up into two counties by the way. From day one part of the vision was to host a "Tampa Bay Chapter" if we lose Pinellas county we cut our show rate in half. All these things I have to consider when talking about meetings every month or every other month, interim meetings where some folks may feel they have had their candy for the month and now wont show at a showcase that we have put allot of effort into setting up for example. But I believe in the interim meeting program wholeheartedly. And guess who stepped up and is spearheading it, Andy.
Guest speakers. You have no idea the amount of personal e-mails I get following this issue. Most good but some not so good. I personally don't get it.
Your welcome.....Thus I'm hesitant to bring in guest speakers.
And another factor. When we host these events at commercial venues whether its at Rock-N-Hard, Java Junction, or any other we want to present our organization as professionally as possible. If we alientae the regulars and or present a bad showcase, will we be welcome back? Just something to keep in mind if someone decides to step up.
I could go on and on but then it seams I'm only unhappy as the coordinator and nothing could be further from the truth.I have been promoting shows since the mid eighties and working live entertaiment venues bartending, bouncing and as a floor manager lond before that and I promise, to consistanly draw you have to not only work at what you say but as importantly work at what you don't say.
Allot led up to deciding to have meetings every other month. Personal reasons, sure.
Competing with other social calendar events, sure. And by the way A and R Productions LLC has its first major gig Stage,Lighting and Sound May the 13th at the Park adjacent to the Largo Cultural Center and the promoter has asked for a few good duos and trios. So far JoDell, The Burners and I think Fremont John have closed deals with him. I'll call on more folks if there is a need for more acts.The more active I can keep this stage the more good acts we can help to put on it.
I mentioned that two things are of the utmost importance for our music community to thrive the first being "Go To The Boards"
The second is "GO OUT AND SUPPORT YOUR FELLOW JPF MEMBERS AT THEIR GIGS" We say this all the time and many of you do and many are active performers. Bravo. Sincerely, Thank you.
If you go out to dinner twice a month why not make it to a place where live music is being performed. The Tampa Bay Chapter of Just Plain Folks is one of the strongest chapters in JPF history, why don't we have one of the strongest support systems. Or do we and I'm just not seeing it.? I have seen on the general message board where one of our members actually stated. "Tampa really doesn't have a good music scene" (in so many words, I'm not going back and looking for the quote but I promise, its there) OUCH! OUCH! and DOUBLE OUCH! To state this to the world in any forum,which could not be further from the truth in my opinion was not well thought through.
Tampa Bay has a fantastic music scene. Wednesday night I caught Jim Mason at "Ricks on the River" last night I saw a duo called "Blinky and Fritz" at the Whistle Stop in Safety Harbor and then went down the street and around the corner to Hildegaard's Beer Garden with Jim Mason , Maryann and Kathy Stafford where Jim's friend Wendy was performing, all I can say about her is, WOW. Jim Terry was there and performed (he is soooo good) and I met about a half dozen other local artists.
JPF member Lorna Bracewell opened for Heart at Ruth Eckert Hall. Local band Four Star Riot (Who as far as I know are not JPFers but part of our local music scene none the less)recently opened for Bon Jovi and have a chance to repeat the show very soon in New York. Talk about a scene. Jeff O'Kelly hosts house concerts and offers artist services-Go Jeff. Jak Kelly is headlining at a house concert on the 30th, Goody is hosting a BBQ and Jamm session, Look at Festivals at the Sertoma Ranch, Janus Landing, Slade (Joran) Opelt and the South East Music Alliance. No music scene,Hmmmm. And if you really want an insight into where you can catch live acts all you have to do is see our friends at www.tampabayentertainment.com and www.realitysnap.com
Do we have allot of major artists who have been signed to major labels?.... Let's create a buzz about the local scene and we can get some attention for the artists who do perform here locally. I feel like a cheer leader who has been shaking her pom poms much too long. For those of you who know me personally you know that would not be a pretty site.
For those of you who do step up and participate and host open mics and or put fellow artists on stage, thank you. We do have some solid things going on we just need the participation.
I would really like to try this every other month format and on the off month why can't we get together at Jaks House Concert, or Goody's BBQ or The Bluegrass Festival, or why won't more folks host house concerts?
Everyone has an opinion, that's a good thing. I learned very young that I would rather run with the big dogs even if they were better than me and could beat me up.
That's how you grow, that's how you learn.
We have many with leadership talents, please act as social liaisons and help get folks out to live entertainment.
Now I hope we're all cool. Peace, Love and Hope, Al
www.aandrproductions.com



[This message has been edited by Al The Pal (edited 04-08-2006).]

#399084 - 04/09/06 03:54 AM Re: april meeting notes......  
Joined: Mar 2005
Posts: 775
Steve Dockendorf Offline
Top 500 Poster
Steve Dockendorf  Offline
Top 500 Poster

Joined: Mar 2005
Posts: 775
Clearwater, FL
Al -
Thank you for clarifying the situation. I have already thanked you for your herculean efforts on our behalf, but I will thank you again. Thank you.

Andy -
Your history of support for this group speaks for itself. Thank you.

Jim -
Thank you for sticking your neck out and starting this thread. To communicate or not to communicate. In my humble opinion, MORE communication usually beats the alternative.

To All Members -
I repeat my offer to host a "song swap" at my house. See description in my earlier reply to this post above. If sufficient members express interest, I will set a date.

------------------
Steve Dockendorf
"Quality music for quality people"
dockendorf2000@yahoo.com
www.soundclick.com/stevedockendorf


Steve Dockendorf
Dockendorf Audio Recorders
"Quality music for quality people"
dockendorf2000@yahoo.com
http://www.stevedockendorf.com
http://www.myspace.com/stephendockendorf
http://stevedockendorf.wordpress.com
#399085 - 04/09/06 11:34 AM Re: april meeting notes......  
Joined: Mar 2002
Posts: 2,499
Al Alvarez Offline
Al Alvarez  Offline


Top 100 Poster

Joined: Mar 2002
Posts: 2,499
Tampa Florida
I would like to attend a song swap...I think. is this like a song circle where you go around in a circle and everyone gets to play a song just for fun? Or is it more on the order of critiques?
Al

#399086 - 04/09/06 01:30 PM Re: april meeting notes......  
Joined: Nov 2002
Posts: 912
Jak Kelly Offline
Top 500 Poster
Jak Kelly  Offline
Top 500 Poster

Joined: Nov 2002
Posts: 912
St Petersburg , FL. USA
Hey Big Al,!
You're the best!!!!
And thanks for all the plugs about James Hawkins and My House concert!
Too bad there is so much stuff going on that day, But We will put on the best show around, and thats a promise!!
http://www.geocities.com/swampbiz/index.html?1143241848880

------------------
jak kelly
http://www.jakkelly.com
swampwood1@juno.com
http://openmic.folkalley.com/JakKelly
http://www.soundclick.com/jakkelly
http://www.myspace.com/songwhittler

#399087 - 04/10/06 02:43 AM Re: april meeting notes......  
Joined: Mar 2005
Posts: 775
Steve Dockendorf Offline
Top 500 Poster
Steve Dockendorf  Offline
Top 500 Poster

Joined: Mar 2005
Posts: 775
Clearwater, FL
Al -
(or anyone else who was wondering)

A song swap could be either just for fun or could incorporate critiques. Or both, for that matter, as those who do not desire critiques could just play and those who do desire critiques could get all the critiquing there is to offer. I can also envision incomplete songs being brought in so that potential co-writers in the audience (circle) could have a stab at making suggestions or even completing the song. On any song it is a good idea to bring 8-10 copies of the lyrics. Perhaps a "song circle" is a better term. But either way I appreciate your interest and look forward to doing what I can to help stoke the creative fires of our musical neighborhood.

Any other takers?

------------------
Steve Dockendorf
"Quality music for quality people"
dockendorf2000@yahoo.com
www.soundclick.com/stevedockendorf


Steve Dockendorf
Dockendorf Audio Recorders
"Quality music for quality people"
dockendorf2000@yahoo.com
http://www.stevedockendorf.com
http://www.myspace.com/stephendockendorf
http://stevedockendorf.wordpress.com
#399088 - 04/10/06 12:20 PM Re: april meeting notes......  
Joined: May 2004
Posts: 54
Kathryn Stafford Offline
Serious Contributor
Kathryn Stafford  Offline
Serious Contributor

Joined: May 2004
Posts: 54
I would like to participate in the song circle, swap. Just to share, or try out new stuff, or celebrate other's work. But mostly, to fuel the writing fire.
Thanks.
Kathy

#399089 - 04/11/06 02:39 PM Re: april meeting notes......  
Joined: Apr 2005
Posts: 116
Jules Offline
Serious Contributor
Jules  Offline
Serious Contributor

Joined: Apr 2005
Posts: 116
clearwater, Florida, Pinellas
I would definately like to participate in a song swap. I once attended one in Nashville and it was inspiring and instructional. Great idea.
Jules


Jules
#399090 - 04/15/06 08:55 PM Re: april meeting notes......  
Joined: Sep 2004
Posts: 779
Ms.Goody Haines Offline
Serious Contributor
Ms.Goody Haines  Offline
Serious Contributor

Joined: Sep 2004
Posts: 779
Gulfport, Fla. USA
Song Swap ...yeah!


------------------
Atchya'Later, Ms.Goody

www.GoodyontheGo.com


Atchya'Later, Ms.Goody
"Mellow Melodies with Goody"Internet Radio Show
http://www.MellowMelodies.com

http://www.SongBrookMusic.com

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