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#384295 - 01/04/05 12:43 AM This is bad news for folks like me who like their analog tape recorders...  
Joined: Apr 2001
Posts: 941
Patrick Bryant Offline
Patrick Bryant  Offline

Top 500 Poster

Joined: Apr 2001
Posts: 941
Glendale, CA, USA
Quantegy tape plant unexpectedly closes.

http://www.wtvm.com/Global/story.asp?S=2758720&nav=8fapUlma

Temporarily, I hope.


------------------
Later,

Pat

#384296 - 01/05/05 06:59 PM Re: This is bad news for folks like me who like their analog tape recorders...  
Joined: Apr 2001
Posts: 941
Patrick Bryant Offline
Patrick Bryant  Offline

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Joined: Apr 2001
Posts: 941
Glendale, CA, USA
I'm rather disappointed that I'm the only JPF member who cares about this.

Everybody else all-digital, eh?

I've got 25-year-old tape recordings that still play and sound great. Think about that the next time your hard disk crashes. GRRRRRR!

(I'm just in a bad mood today)


------------------
Later,

Pat

#384297 - 01/05/05 07:20 PM Re: This is bad news for folks like me who like their analog tape recorders...  
Joined: Sep 2003
Posts: 1,292
scottandrew Offline
scottandrew  Offline

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Joined: Sep 2003
Posts: 1,292
Seattle, WA
It is kinda sad, yeah.

Although yeah, I haven't used tape since 1995. I don't have room in my tiny studio for tape storage or open reel machines.

Plus, I like not rewinding [Linked Image]

------------------
Scott Andrew
Lo-fi acoustic pop superhero!
http://www.scottandrew.com/music

#384298 - 01/05/05 09:35 PM Re: This is bad news for folks like me who like their analog tape recorders...  
Joined: Mar 2002
Posts: 2,096
TrumanCoyote Offline
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TrumanCoyote  Offline
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Posts: 2,096
Was that the last plant in the world making magnetic tape?

Certainly it can't come as a surprise that the demand for mag tape has dropped. When you can't get it any more, THEN you should be upset.

If you made two lists: one listing reasons people use digital and one listing why people use analog tape, the first list will be very long and the second will have only one entry..."I like it."

#384299 - 01/05/05 11:59 PM Re: This is bad news for folks like me who like their analog tape recorders...  
Joined: Jan 2005
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RickyMinor Offline
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RickyMinor  Offline
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Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 64
Pat, I'm with you!!!!!

I'm a Tascam 388 guy and wouldn't give it up for any of the latest digital home gear. The ease of use and sound produced and bang for the buck can't be matched. I've tried mid priced to high end home Digital recorders and couldn't wait to get rid of them and get back to my 388. I'm old school, I use real intruments and when needed a click and a few outboard effects and obtain great demos! No computers, sequencers, midi or any of that. Stock up on tape! I know tape can go bad in storage but I still crack open new reels that have been sitting in my closet for years and have yet to have a problem. It may get harder to find but it will still be around for some time, probably always.

#384300 - 01/06/05 02:45 AM Re: This is bad news for folks like me who like their analog tape recorders...  
Joined: Mar 2004
Posts: 558
Michael Hollomon Offline
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Michael Hollomon  Offline
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Joined: Mar 2004
Posts: 558
Washington State
Hey Patrick,
You have a fellow tape user here! Nothing sounds like analog. I better get on the phone and order some stash! I hope this isn't a plot to ram digital down our throats!

#384301 - 01/06/05 03:03 AM Re: This is bad news for folks like me who like their analog tape recorders...  
Joined: Apr 2001
Posts: 941
Patrick Bryant Offline
Patrick Bryant  Offline

Top 500 Poster

Joined: Apr 2001
Posts: 941
Glendale, CA, USA
Well, I was in a bad mood, but I'm better now.
My understanding is that Quantegy was still making and selling lots of audio tape but not enough to service all the debt the company had.
There is still cassette and video tape being made at plants in Japan, Korea, etc. I think audio tape will be made again, just be twice as expensive. Quantegy may be successful with its Chapter 11 reorganization, too, but I've heard from some business-savvy people on the Web that it's not a done deal.
I'm with Ricky and Michael inasmuch as I can get a nicer sound out of my 27-year-old Otari 8-track, or my 22-yr-old Studer 2-trk than I can get out of any digital workstation or digital converters that I can afford.
Maybe the very best digital could bring a smile to my face, but the very best digital is out of my price range. On the other hand, I can send a mix on 1/4" analog to a professional mastering house and have it transferred with their high-end gear.
Win-win.
Also, I'm serious about tape being a lasting archival medium that I'll still be able to play back 30 or more years later. I don't think CDRs will hold up that long, or removable data drives.
I started doing home recording using consumer equipment back in 1975. I can still play that stuff.

/rant over


------------------
Later,

Pat

#384302 - 01/06/05 04:46 AM Re: This is bad news for folks like me who like their analog tape recorders...  
Joined: Aug 2001
Posts: 1,822
Larry Williams Offline
Larry Williams  Offline


Serious Contributor

Joined: Aug 2001
Posts: 1,822
Santa Clarita, CA USA
I think some of the recording techniques are different in analog vs digital. I started with a Tascam Portastudio, then worked with real 2" tape on Stevens and Ampex machines in "real" studios, then bought an ADAT - of which I never liked the sound. It wasn't until I bought upgraded converters for my Digi001 did I start thinking digital sounded "OK". My 002R sounds better, since it's newer - and I haven't even tried 96K yet.

However, if you're in doubt about how "analog" digital can sound, check out the Beach Boys "Smile". I'm pretty sure it was done at 88.2 into Protools with a lot of vintage mics and preamps (and older recording styles). I remember a big article in Sound-On-Sound about recording it only a few months ago.

I personally think that a lot of people don't like "digital" sound because there are SO many bad recordings done with it, people start thinking "digital = bad sound".

...and next year, digital will sound even better, but there will probably be just as many really lousy recordings (and bad engineering) done on them.

However, I remember before Quantegy, and you used to buy Ampex 456 tape. You either used that or 3M 250 tape - depending on whether you wanted more low-end punch (Ampex) or a nice even frequency response (3M).

I still have some 1/4" 456 tape reels from my (long-sold) Fostex 1/4" 8-track with Dolby C. Remember those?


------------------
Larry
www.audibleresponse.com

[This message has been edited by Lwilliam (edited 01-06-2005).]

#384303 - 01/06/05 07:16 PM Re: This is bad news for folks like me who like their analog tape recorders...  
Joined: Apr 2001
Posts: 941
Patrick Bryant Offline
Patrick Bryant  Offline

Top 500 Poster

Joined: Apr 2001
Posts: 941
Glendale, CA, USA
Quote
<font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">Originally posted by Lwilliam:
...I still have some 1/4" 456 tape reels from my (long-sold) Fostex 1/4" 8-track with Dolby C. Remember those?

</font>


Yeah, a friend of mine in Oklahoma used to do radio production day-in-and-day-out with one of those. It was a real workhorse for him.

I dunno...my opinion of digital is based largely upon my own experience with my own gear, and though my a/d & d/a measure very low in distortion*, (I've got a cool software called Audio Tester that turns my DAW into a distortion/spectrum analyzer) they can still turn a delicate acoustic guitar part into mush sometimes while the analog recorders don't.

*about .003%, which is mighty low [Linked Image]




------------------
Later,

Pat

#384304 - 01/07/05 04:10 AM Re: This is bad news for folks like me who like their analog tape recorders...  
Joined: Mar 2004
Posts: 558
Michael Hollomon Offline
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Michael Hollomon  Offline
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Joined: Mar 2004
Posts: 558
Washington State
Hey Patrick,
I just jumped on my tape site. Seems I was unable to put in an order for some big 1/2 inch reels. I also still have my Fostex 1/4 inch dog with dolby c. I love the sound of that thing. I am using a Tascam Tsr-8. Bigger sound, but, they should have used Dolby C in my book instead of DBX. I know later versions came with Dolby S. Dolby C, I will always be fond of.

#384305 - 02/25/05 03:56 AM Re: This is bad news for folks like me who like their analog tape recorders...  
Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 4
Rising Star Ent Offline
Casual Observer
Rising Star Ent  Offline
Casual Observer

Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 4
Indianapolis, Indiana 46237
We have a Tascam 1" analog set-up so this is not good news. Tascam M-600 board and MS-16 1" recorder. We did just buy some digital Tascam DA-88's so we have both formats now. But we sill love the analog sound.

I'm sure someone will make analog tape again soon. There are way too many people that still rely on it. There are good and bad things about both analog and digital. But nothing beats the original!

------------------
www.risingstarentertainment.com

#384306 - 02/26/05 02:18 AM Re: This is bad news for folks like me who like their analog tape recorders...  
Joined: Mar 2004
Posts: 558
Michael Hollomon Offline
Serious Contributor
Michael Hollomon  Offline
Serious Contributor

Joined: Mar 2004
Posts: 558
Washington State
Hey All,
I am seeing some tape for sale on e-bay. I am sure some folks bought up a pile because of the shortage.

#384307 - 02/26/05 12:03 PM Re: This is bad news for folks like me who like their analog tape recorders...  
Joined: May 2001
Posts: 6,919
Ray E. Strode Online content
Top 30 Poster
Ray E. Strode  Online Content
Top 30 Poster

Joined: May 2001
Posts: 6,919
Brunswick, Ga. USA
Hi All,
Since this has been posted it seems a lot of studios that still prefer Analog Tape to the new Hard Drive recorders went on a scanveger hunt and found about 2000 reels of tape. Then a spoksman for Quantegy stated that they would still manufacture tape as NASA also uses tape for whatever they use it for. So while magnetic tape may someday go the way of the DoDo bird I don't think it will be anytime soon. This was posted on INDI-MUSIC just recently. You probably can still read it if you do a little searching.
While it isn't reported much a few record labels still offer music on LP records but as we all know the CD is now the standard.


Ray E. Strode
#384308 - 02/26/05 03:35 PM Re: This is bad news for folks like me who like their analog tape recorders...  
Joined: Apr 2001
Posts: 941
Patrick Bryant Offline
Patrick Bryant  Offline

Top 500 Poster

Joined: Apr 2001
Posts: 941
Glendale, CA, USA
Here's a press release I got thru the pro-audio internet grapevine:

>
********************************************
>
> EMTEC-Quality AUDIO TAPE
> NOW AVAILABLE !!!
>
> RMG International announces the availability of
>
>
>
>
> EMTEC-Quality audio pancake tape
>
> EMTEC type Max. playing time in CC
> FERRO PLUS C-60 & C-100 (C-130, C-180)
> FERRO C-60 & C-110
> FLX C-60 & C-115
> Sample quantities will be available at the end of February/beginning
> of March 2005.
> Production quantities is scheduled for April 2005.
>
>
> EMTEC-Quality audio studio tape
>
> EMTEC type Quantegy equivalent type
> SM 911 456 Grand Master
> LPR 35 457
> SM 900 499 - Grand Master Gold Studio
> GP 9 - Grand Master Platinum Studio
> SM 468 478
> PER 368 -
> PER 528 -
> PM97x series 6xx series
> VM 95x series 70x, 8206 series
> ADAT Master
> formatted & blank ADAT audio
> DTRS Master
> formatted & blank DA 8
> Samples will be available in May 2005.
> Continuous supply starts in June 2005.
>
>
> Recordable Media Group International B.V., Oosterhout, The Netherlands
> has been accumulating 37 years of non-interrupted experience on
> magnetic tape manufacturing. With their highly skilled and experienced
> personnel and management, RMG International is fully dedicated to
> magnetic tape. A slim organisational structure enables low overhead.
> When EMTEC closed down, RMG International acquired the EMTEC
> production and quality assurance equipment necessary to convert &
> complete the Oosterhout production lines to the EMTEC standards for
> audio tape production.
>
> RMG International has the EMTEC
> ? production know how
> ? formulations and
> ? patents.
>
> Former EMTEC key personnel is assisting in Oosterhout in order to
> maintain the EMTEC standards.
> Following the installation of the EMTEC equipment and positive results
> of comprehensive studies on availability of the necessary raw
> materials, RMG International started prototype coating for audio
> pancake tape and is now preparing for studio tape.
>
> RMG International, brief History
> 1968 Magnetic tape production for open reel and cassette tape started in
> RMG International Oosterhout plant when it was a Philips division.
> 1981 Joint Venture Philips-Dupont, PD Magnetics B.V., on magnetic tape
> production,
> brand name PDM. 1´2² Video tape for Video 2000 and VHS, 3480/90 data
> cartridges for
> IBM tape storage systems.
> 1991 Installation of state of the art, new plant.
> 1993 SK, Germany, takes over the Oosterhout plant and renames into MPO
> B.V.
> (Magnetic Products Oosterhout B.V.).
> 1998 New, state of the art, coating line goes into operation.
> 2004 April, renamed to Recordable Media Group International B.V..
> 2004 November, acquisition of assets and know how for the production
> of audio pancakes
> for duplication and blank loading and for audio studio tape from
> EMTEC Munich plant.
>
>>

It'll be cool if they can pull it off.




------------------
Later,

Pat

#384309 - 02/27/05 02:17 AM Re: This is bad news for folks like me who like their analog tape recorders...  
Joined: Mar 2004
Posts: 558
Michael Hollomon Offline
Serious Contributor
Michael Hollomon  Offline
Serious Contributor

Joined: Mar 2004
Posts: 558
Washington State
Yeah Pat,
Truman had said tape aint dead on the planet, but, I know it's gonna cost us more and more and more. Gee, did the energy companies finally take over my hobby? Is tape petroleum based????? Heh heh heh..

#384310 - 03/02/05 06:01 AM Re: This is bad news for folks like me who like their analog tape recorders...  
Joined: Mar 2005
Posts: 3
bjpizazz Offline
Casual Observer
bjpizazz  Offline
Casual Observer

Joined: Mar 2005
Posts: 3
Michigan
Quote
<font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">Originally posted by Patrick Bryant:
Well, I was in a bad mood, but I'm better now.
My understanding is that Quantegy was still making and selling lots of audio tape but not enough to service all the debt the company had.
There is still cassette and video tape being made at plants in Japan, Korea, etc. I think audio tape will be made again, just be twice as expensive. Quantegy may be successful with its Chapter 11 reorganization, too, but I've heard from some business-savvy people on the Web that it's not a done deal.
I'm with Ricky and Michael inasmuch as I can get a nicer sound out of my 27-year-old Otari 8-track, or my 22-yr-old Studer 2-trk than I can get out of any digital workstation or digital converters that I can afford.
Maybe the very best digital could bring a smile to my face, but the very best digital is out of my price range. On the other hand, I can send a mix on 1/4" analog to a professional mastering house and have it transferred with their high-end gear.
Win-win.
Also, I'm serious about tape being a lasting archival medium that I'll still be able to play back 30 or more years later. I don't think CDRs will hold up that long, or removable data drives.
I started doing home recording using consumer equipment back in 1975. I can still play that stuff.

/rant over


</font>


Dear Pat I still have my Tascam 38 1/2 inch and all my old recordings still work.
But in the main studio, I use 3 Layla and 1 Gina sound cards stacked in an all SCSI PC system. Using a Mackie 32x8 buss.
(Not that High End ProTools stuff)
I was one of the first beta testers in Michigan to get the cards back in 98. The cards are great, In that they have been running non stop for 6 years without one breakdown. I never turn them off, unless there is a electrical storm. But after the recording is in the computer and mastered, I send the mix to my Tascam 32 for final mix if it is country music, or Gospel. It makes the digital mix warmer, then we burn to CD. I recorded "Chillin' Up In Heaven" by Marcus Cole with the Layla Cards. Mixed to the Tascam 32 and then to dat.
It turned out great made it to www.gospelflava.com for review. Marcus is now lead singer for Commission. If you go there or find it on line. Listen to "I'll Go" or "Feel Beyound the Pain", all mixed with the Layla's
bjpizazz

#384311 - 03/03/05 01:57 AM Re: This is bad news for folks like me who like their analog tape recorders...  
Joined: Apr 2001
Posts: 941
Patrick Bryant Offline
Patrick Bryant  Offline

Top 500 Poster

Joined: Apr 2001
Posts: 941
Glendale, CA, USA
I hear ya, bj - I like to mix to the 2-track as well. Do you usually mix "in the box" or through the console?

The 32 and 38 are decent machines. We used to have them at the video house I worked at and they were workhorses, and sounded good too.

------------------
Later,

Pat

[This message has been edited by Patrick Bryant (edited 03-02-2005).]

#384312 - 03/16/05 03:43 AM Re: This is bad news for folks like me who like their analog tape recorders...  
Joined: Jul 2003
Posts: 159
Cpt.Analog Offline
Serious Contributor
Cpt.Analog  Offline
Serious Contributor

Joined: Jul 2003
Posts: 159
Nashville
I need to check into this.
Because I do a lot of remote recording, I track to digital (I am not loading the old MCI on the truck!). BUT, I still run every mix through the PR99 (499 @ +5dB) on the way into the computer. That analog-tape compression makes mastering sooo much easier.

------------------
"Take 276, you know this used to be fun."
John Entwistle


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