https://soundcloud.com/d-j-simons-1/tell-me-what-you-were-thinking-of

This is the first song I've posted here. I've been writing a long time. I just want to see what other songwriters are doing and add my two cent's worth once in a while.
Also, let me know how I can help to support our cause. 'll make my first donation later today too)!

Thank you all for letting me in here. Thanks, Dan

Here are the lyrics to "Tell Me What You Were Thinking Of":

Girl, when I look into your eyes, I see
that you're not thinking about me.
When your eyes could hypnotize me, I thought I fell in love.
Tell me what you were thinking of.

Don't you remember I can read your thoughts?
Didn't you think that you'd get caught?
When your eyes could hypnotize me, I thought I fell in love.
Tell me what you were thinking of.

(Instrumental)

Now that you've heard all that I have to say,
you turn your head and look away...
When your eyes could hypnotize me, I thought I fell in love.
Tell me what you were thinking of.

Cut the Introductory Movement in half. We often need to run through it twice to hit our cue to start the vocal. Hitting it after one time through can shorten the time by ten or eleven seconds, better for radio.

It's rough, but time and performance can polish it.

Thank you for the feedback, Gary. I will certainly take your advice. I'm not actually a performer. I'm just write songs and make demos. But I do understand the need to polish my demos too. Thanks again, sir. - Dan

Hi Daniel and welcome!

I like the melody lines and the lyrics.
The guitar riff is good - maybe needs a bit of a break somewhere.
I found the track very loud/brickwalled and I feel the emotional connection suffers because of this.
As they say, maybe the song would benefit from some "light and shade" (dynamics)
Feel free to ignore if you don't agree

Paul

Daniel,

First off, welcome to the Forum. Things are a bit slow these days, but there are still a few of us around, LOL!

As for the song, l love the guitar riff, the vocal is solid, and it has a whole Beatles feel to me . . . a good thing. For me, it’s needs some refinement on the production side of things. As Paul mentioned, it’s a bit abrasive as it stands, and, yes, it drains the killer mood this song would otherwise have. I’d also dial back on some of the effects. Do a reverse SpinalTap and dial it down from 11 . . . and you’ll really have something here. Like the tune a ton!!

All my best,

Deej

Hi Paul,

I actually entirely agree. I pretty much consider it a demo, really. I know it needs a bunch of tweaking and I'm kinda at the point, though,
where I'm in a bit of a "Deer-in-the-headlights" mode. I know it needs what you're suggesting and I'm here to get opinions such as yours.
I'd be a fool to ignore opinions I'm soliciting. (Even if I am anyway ).

Thank you very much for your feedback,

Dan

Hi Deej,

First of all, it's nice to meet you and Paul. I'm very happy to be here. I write stuff and I record stuff, and it seems like I then
put them in a shoebox and put the shoebox in my attic to collect cobwebs.

Anyway, thank you for the compliments.

I get what you're saying regarding the abrasiveness. I have a tendency to lean (heavily) towards hard drums and harsh acoustic guitar work.
In fact, I'm trying to buy a Taylor Baritone 8-string guitar for this reason. So, it sounds like I'm tailoring the song to the sound that I enjoy rather
than present the song as it needs to be presented.

But, that's why I'm here - I'm too close to it and I need your opinion.

Thanks a lot, Deej. I need to check out yours and Paul's stuff when I can clear a path from my day job.

Dan

Daniel,

I feel like I'm listening to a song written by George Harrison after his influence from his Eastern experience. This type of song which has an almost "discordant" melody is cool........but difficult to pull off without a great production team. I think you've done a decent job given the melody etc. I think you could improve your vocal track with some both effects and more unique vocal stylization perhaps. This could be a neat song as a album filler, but not a song that grabs one quickly. I admire your music art-form however, and welcome to JPF.

Enjoyed your music,

steady-eddie

Hi Steady-Eddie,

To be in the same sentence as George Harrison is a great compliment. Thank you for the kinds words also, for the work I've done on this.
My vocals for this and any song I've written , really, sometimes discourage me and I get away from writing for a day or so. I'm not a performer
and I only sing the songs so that they can come to life and then I consider them demos. I wait until there's nobody in my house to record them, so I
did this in two takes within about 15 minutes. I added some effects and I'm happier with it, but not thrilled. I tried to do another take subsequently,
but I couldn't come close to doing the way it is here, so, for now, at least, this is my best attempt. I've got a bunch of work to do now, based on yours
and the other people in this thread have given me. Improvement of the vocals is certainly a priority.

Thanks again for your feedback, Steady-Eddie. It's a great help to me.

Dan

I get the George Harrison thing too I agree that you need to dial it back a bit as far as the recording volume is concerned - at least I think that's what's causing that fuzzy sound. I'm not great at the production stuff, but I assume that's what's Paul means by "brickwalled." I think the song is good enough to deserve that extra work

I like the lyric. Very focused and with a nice visual quality centered on the eyes.

Oh, and welcome!

Hindsight is always 20/20 and it's easy to be a critic lol... Everything I do is a rough draft as well. I think the melody you sing over this chord progression is fantastic, and the overall mood definitely fits the lyric. Some very cool potential here, nice job!

Hi Gavin. Hopefully, I can channel George Harrison someday and really come up with something. Yeah, I agree. I do tend to try to make my recordings too loud. The feedback certainly highlights that. I'm working on dialing it back now. Thank you for the compliments. I tried hard to get the right idea with the lyrics to show the different moods the singer is seeing in her eyes, from what he's seeing now, to what he used to see, to the now again, where she can't look into his eyes to face the truth. The amazing thing that I find about songwriting is that we can sometimes tell a whole story in a couple of dozen words. (But, I do think the melody and backing music sometimes tell a story all by themselves).

Thank you very much for your feedback, Gavin. And it's nice to me you.

Dan

Hi JAPOV, When I solicit feedback, I don't have the hindsight because I'm not far enough ahead to see what's behind me yet. So, I appreciate your feedback. Part of my problem recording is that I do it when I have the house to myself - usually one night a week and I have to squeeze recording time into those few hours. If i don't have issues with my recording equipment and can focus on the recording (rather than resolving equipment issues), I sometimes get lucky and I'm happy with the recording. So now that I've posted this here, I'm ready to use your encouragement and your feedback as well as the feedback from the others here to make it better.

I can't thank you enough for taking your time to help me out and your compliments. And it's nice to meet you!

Dan

Welcome Daniel. I will first off say that I also hear the influence of Harrison. Great job on that. Then I will agree the other's. "Ruff" but full of potential.

Douglas

Nice to meet you, Douglas. Yeah, I loved George's music and sense of humor. I certainly was influenced by him. Thank you for the nice reference to him. I know it's rough, but it's basically a demo and my first run at recording it so that it comes to life. Based on everybody's feedback, I've started polishing it.

Thanks again, for taking the time to give me your feedback!

Dan

Hi guys,

Well, I took everyone's advice and I redid everything except the vocals (it's really hard for me to get that done - I'll fix that when the instrument work done). I compared the first version with the new one and I'm much happier with it. Now, the first version sounds to me like a caveman created it. Anyway, thank you all again for your feedback. here is Rev 1:

https://soundcloud.com/d-j-simons-1/tell-me-what-you-were-thinking-of-2

Thanks,

Dan

Much cleaner, good mix! I wish you would have left the original recording up though... have you deleted an instrument? Harmony Vox perhaps? seems like something's missing...

Hi Daniel

welcome here from an old timer lol.

I like very much what you have written, but could offer my 2 cents.. I hope that you dont mind.
Musically I'm a Neandertal as I just do lyrics.

for me and Its only my opinion which is often wrong.
Having a 'me' in 2 consecitive lines ...ummm

so maye along the lines of

-----------------------------------

Girl, when I look into your eyes, I see
that you're not thinking about me.

It's 'cause your eyes could hypnotize, I thought I fell in love.
Tell me what you were thinking of.

Don't you remember I can read your thoughts?
Didn't you think that you'd get caught?

'Cause your eyes could hypnotize. I thought I fell in love.
Tell me what you were thinking of.

(Instrumental)

Now that you've heard what I have to say
you turn your head and look away!

'Cause your eyes could hypnotize. I thought I fell in love.
Tell me what you were thinking of.
Tell me what you were thinking of.

please keep or use or loose my sugestions

thanks and God Bless to all

Roy

Hi Japov,

I restored the original: https://soundcloud.com/d-j-simons-1/tell-me-what-you-were-thinking-of

I'm curious to see where in the song you've noticed that I've removed something. I'm not surprised, though, because I removed most of the guitar effects,
re-recorded some of the guitar parts and add new ones. I'd love to know what you think is missing.

Thanks for taking your time to jump back on this thread.

Dan

Hi Roy,

Thank you for taking your time to review my song. I certainly don't mind your two cents. In fact, that's why I posted it here. I'm looking for opinions to improve my recordings.
I like your suggestion. If I hadn't worked out the lyrics yet, it would have been an option. My intention of using "When..." was to give the impression that her ability to hypnotize
him with her eyes was gone, in the past - that she can't do it anymore. And, now, in the present, he's wondering what she was really thinking when she could do that - was she
leading him on, or were her feelings genuine and that something changed? Currently, when he looks in her eyes, there's no connection to him. Also, he implies that they were
so connected at one point in time that he could read her mind and, now, looking in her eyes, he can still read her mind enough to see that something's missing. In the end, because
she knows that, and she's got something to hide she can't look him in the eye anymore.

As a matter of discussion, though, sonically, which would sound better as the first word of the chorus, 'Cause or When? (I probably don't take this kind of thing into account as
much as I should).

Thanks again for your feedback, Roy. And it's nice to meet you.

Dan

Your welcome Dan.

It wasnt the When or replacement for that word that I meant.
When is fine...

It was the 'ME' in 2 consecitive lines that I meant.

ie

Girl, when I look into your eyes, I see
that you're not thinking about me.
When your eyes could hypnotize me, I thought I fell in love.
Tell me what you were thinking of.

The 2nd 'me' could IMO be left out...

I could be off way base though...lol

God Bless

Roy

Wow, lol... I guess all that overdrive in the first version sonically filled in a lot of space. Speaking of space, I had a listen with headphones and realized the whole first half of the song is shot straight up the middle. I think your first two guitars need some separation, either pan those L/R and bring your leads closer to center... OR (this is what I would do)... give the first guitar a nice wide slow stereo chorus effect, and the second a short stereo ping-pong delay effect to really give each their own distinct voice in the mix. That stereo effect on your vox is sweet!

Hi Roy,

Oh. Sorry. I see what you mean. Musically, I had 3 notes to fill with "me" and "I". I covered one of them with "me" and two with "I", which becomes "I-I". Normally, I don't like to cover more than one note with one syllable, but I thought that was o.k. to do here. I didn't notice the second "me" until you pointed it out. How about "When your eyes could hypnotize, you know, I thought I fell in love."?

Thanks again for your time, Roy,

Dan
.

Hi JAPOV,

Mostly, I'm just a songwriter making demos (and then letting them collect dust). I've got over 100 that I'd like to record some time. So, I end up recording a song and getting it down enough so that I won't lose it. But I realize that it's more fulfilling to hear what people like you are doing and get feedback for what I'm doing too. From everybody's feedback so far in my first post here, I'm realizing that recording and mixing the songs gives them their just due. And I've really enjoyed going back and making the changes. It actually allows me to experience my own song in depth, rather than making a quick and (very) dirty demo and calling it a day. Anyway, I'm a bit of novice when it comes to mixing, but I'm already learning a lot from you. I'm imaging what you're suggesting and I can already hear what I think I need to do in my head. I'm doing all this with Cakewalk Sonar Professional and Audacity. I'm going to go with your "this is what I would do" suggestion. Do you have any of your own recordings that I can listen to where you are doing those things?

Thanks a million for your time, JAPOV!

Dan

Wholy Crap... AUDACITY? Now I'm really impressed! If I remember correctly, Audacity doesn't even allow you to process effects in real time....
You can however record two mono tracks simultaneously! Which is very useful for getting really "wide stereo" effects. Here's a cool trick! Get yourself a POD, or other stereo guitar effect processor with cabinet simulation, find a nice stereo chorus and run it into your interface L/R. BUT... instead of recording one stereo track, record two mono tracks and pan them L/R. THEN... move one of the tracks foreword or back about 10ms to 20ms and listen to what happens!

Drop down in my song list to "Not allowed" or "If" and have a listen

If you can afford it, I would highly recommend a new MAC. New Apple computers come with a free download of GarageBand, which is really just a tutorial program for LogicPro. Don't be fooled though, GarageBand is very functional and easy to use.

When your eyes could hypnotize, you know, I thought I fell in love... 15 syllables .... sounds OK to me

What about?

When your eyes could hypnotize, I really thought I fell in love.. also 15 syllables

I hope that I am not overthinking too much as sometimes It's easy to do.

God Bless

Roy

Hi Roy,

I've been running "When your eyes could hypnotize, I really thought I fell in love." through my head and it's rolling pretty nicely. I like this one a lot.
And, you're not overthinking it. I'm enjoying the brainstorming. That's why I'm here!

Thanks,

Dan

Thats good to hear Dan

Use or Lose

God Bless

Roy

Yeah, they update Audacity somewhat regularly. The more I mess with Audacity, the more impressed I am with it, especially for the price! If I'm not mistaken, I may have been able to get real time effects working, but I'm not 100% sure. I started messing with your suggestions, but work and life keep pulling me away from it. I will put the Apple computer on my wish list. But I have a Taylor 8-string Baritone ahead of it. I can't wait to get back to the work on the song. You're opening my mind up to some great ideas. Thanks again, JAPOV! Dan

I tweaked the guitar backing a little bit by doing some "ping-ponging" as suggested by JAPOV and tried to thicken the vocals a bit to make them seem a little more in tune. Sometimes I mess with a track too much and end up making things worse. I listen to my voice sometimes and cringe and need to get away from recording for a bit. Nonetheless, I'm having fun making these adjustments you guys are recommending.

Anyway, here is the latest:

https://www.soundclick.com/music/songInfo.cfm?songID=14164341

Thanks,

Dan

I actually like this mix the best, it seems less cluttered and your vocals sound awesome! Now, we just need to get you some real drums and bass!

I'd be willing to help with that if you like...

Hi JAPOV,

Although my ALESIS SR-18 Drum Machine might take offense to the suggestion, I'm certainly open to your help with the drums and bass.
(The bass is real. I just don't take it as structured as I should, mostly because it's hit-or-miss as to whether my laptop will cooperate).

Thanks,

Dan

Ha! Small world, I still use my old Simmons Ekit to trigger my SR18

Set up a drop box! I'm excited lol, this is a cool track... I'm gonna' have some fun with this!

Hi JAPOV,

I created a drop box. Let me know what you want me to do next.

Dan

Just upload all your current trax and post a link (or PM, your call... others may want to contribute as well) WAV files are best, but high rate MP3 will work as well

O.K. I've uploaded a WAV version and I created a shared folder. How can I share it with you (and anybody else that wants access to it)?

I created this link:

https://www.dropbox.com/sh/beco0zbpyyiyf8x/AAB-C8-tYKHqznM9QNQr9N-ba?dl=0

Is that all I needed to do?

Thanks,

Dan

That's it!

But, you need to upload and share the individual trax...

Is that a free version of "Drop Box"? Windows "One Drive" and "Google Drive" work just as well for free... If you're using a Windows computer I recommend setting up a free "One Drive" account

I did upload it, but I didn't share it. Can you try it now?

The link is working fine

Sweet! I can't wait to hear your magic!

Dan

But, you need to upload and share the individual trax...

The file is there. I just messed with "sharing" and I think it's ready now. I apologize for my ignorance, JAPOV.

Dan

Dan,

You are getting this better with each session! The good news for you is that your ears will begin to only accept your improved abilities--you will only get better & better. You have the ear for hearing accompanying melodies, some just can only hear "root" melody. Now focus on the timing between instruments--you 're getting there. You can only take it so far based on your studio potential and mixing knowledge. If within your budget, hire what you cannot perform if needed or desired to take a song to the next level.

Great song with cool potential!

steady-eddie

Hi steady-eddie,

This all really encouraging to hear. I appreciate your nice comments. I've been paying a lot of attention to making the changes you guys have been recommending and I've especially been comparing the changes with an unchanged one. I agree with you - I feel like mixing and peppering the song with accompanying melodies is a process now and it's making me realize what other people are hearing. I'm glad you picked up on the timing between the instruments. I'm actually aware of that, but I've been letting it slide - 'til now, of course! I'm going to go through the song and fix those. And thank you for saying that I seem to have an ear for accompanying melodies. When I hear a song, whether it's mine or somebody else's, a lot of the time, I hear those melodies in my head. And, with this song, I had to stop myself from adding too many of them.

Thank you, sir,

Dan

I like the hypnotic Lennon-esque type sound to this....

I think a better production is in order here....Good retro feel

Hi Steve,

Nice to meet you. Thank you for the reference to John. Some of my favorite Lennon songs are "I'm Only Sleeping", "I'm so Tired", "Cry Baby, Cry", "You've To To Hide Your Love Away", "Across the Universe..." I see what you mean. Yeah, I agree with you and the rest of us here, it does need a better production. I do what I can on my laptop. Maybe the retro feel comes because I wrote it over 30 years ago too.

Thanks for taking your time to listen to it.

Dan

Not sure how you record on a laptop, but I have PRO TOOLS & STUDIO ONE and interfaces etc. & I NEVER use them....

I record my Home Demos on an TASCAM DP 24 Digital Recorder....You don't need any other gear...

If you wanna see what you can do with an investment of under $500, check out the song worktape I just posted..."Double Whiskey Night"

I use Cakewalk Sonar Professional and Audacity software with a USB adapter and an Alesis SR-18 drum machine. But I also have a TASCAM DP-006 which produces great sound, but it's a little difficult to use. I looked at the TASCAM DP-24SD online and it seems like it would be easier to use. (If I decide to get one, I'm sure my wife won't be thrilled with the idea). But I agree with you - TASCAM makes great stuff and I'm tired of fighting software issues. I'm going to check "Double Whiskey Night" right now.

Thanks Steve,

Dan

Yeah, I see what you mean. I'm gonna have to put some stuff up on Ebay now to come up with the funds.

Thanks,

Dan