Who's Online Now
10 members (Fdemetrio, VNORTH2, Gary E. Andrews, Perry Neal Crawford, couchgrouch, Sunset Poet, Guy E. Trepanier, bennash, Bill Draper, David Gill), 4,088 guests, and 270 robots.
Key: Admin, Global Mod, Mod
Register Today!
Welcome to the Just Plain Folks forums! You are currently viewing our forums as a Guest which gives you limited access to most of our discussions and to other features.

By joining our free community you will have access to post and respond to topics, communicate privately with our users (PM), respond to polls, upload content, and access many other features. Registration is fast, simple, and absolutely free; so please join our community today!
ShoutChat
Comment Guidelines: Do post respectful and insightful comments. Don't flame, hate, spam.
What's Going On
Does Billy Joel belong in top 10?
by Fdemetrio - 03/28/24 11:10 PM
It Is Done
by Sunset Poet - 03/28/24 07:44 PM
Music Industry Summit, Athens Ohio
by Gary E. Andrews - 03/28/24 06:14 PM
Can you save me from me
by VNORTH2 - 03/28/24 03:11 PM
As human as yo
by ckiphen - 03/28/24 09:55 AM
Fox News Reports Stunning Archeological Discovery.
by couchgrouch - 03/27/24 08:02 PM
Wasting My Time
by David Gill - 03/27/24 07:42 AM
Song available
by JAPOV - 03/26/24 03:38 PM
YELLIN AT CLOUDS
by David Gill - 03/26/24 03:20 PM
"Reliving" the great Lou Rawls!
by Brian Austin Whitney - 03/26/24 01:49 PM
::: The Best In My Life :::
by Bill Draper - 03/26/24 01:32 PM
The show must go on
by ckiphen - 03/26/24 09:06 AM
NYC Motel 1972
by rpirone - 03/26/24 12:43 AM
usic Industry Summitt
by Gary E. Andrews - 03/25/24 11:32 PM
The Rant Arena
by JAPOV - 03/25/24 07:39 PM
Song available
by Raymond Byabazaire - 03/25/24 11:55 AM
Song available
by Raymond Byabazaire - 03/25/24 11:55 AM
Lancaster Festival, Lancaster, Ohio
by Gary E. Andrews - 03/25/24 10:51 AM
Wasting my time
by Rob B. - 03/25/24 03:45 AM
Tom Waits.. What's he building
by Fdemetrio - 03/25/24 12:09 AM
Rick Beato, bad lyrics
by Fdemetrio - 03/24/24 11:23 PM
Inspirational Videos Post Them Here
by Sunset Poet - 03/24/24 11:27 AM
Used to take a Genius to Mix
by Fdemetrio - 03/23/24 11:00 AM
"Broken Places"
by Gary E. Andrews - 03/22/24 07:45 PM
All You Are Is A Lie
by Sunset Poet - 03/22/24 06:55 PM
Pour Choices
by Gavin Sinclair - 03/22/24 05:29 PM
Billy's 30 year overdue song.
by Fdemetrio - 03/22/24 01:30 PM
Make my dreams come true
by ckiphen - 03/22/24 10:51 AM
Top Posters
Calvin 19,857
Travis david 12,264
Kevin Emmrich 10,941
Jean Bullock 10,330
Kaley Willow 10,240
Two Singers 9,649
Joice Marie 9,186
Mackie H. 9,003
glynda 8,683
Mike Dunbar 8,574
Tricia Baker 8,318
couchgrouch 8,160
Colin Ward 7,911
Corey 7,357
Vicarn 6,916
Mark Kaufman 6,589
ben willis 6,114
Lynn Orloff 5,788
Louis 5,725
Linda Sings 5,608
KimberlyinNC 5,210
Fdemetrio 4,990
Neil Cotton 4,909
Derek Hines 4,893
DonnaMarilyn 4,670
Blake Hill 4,528
Bob Cushing 4,389
Roy Cooper 4,271
Bill Osofsky 4,199
Tom Shea 4,195
Cindy Miller 4,178
TamsNumber4 4,171
MFB III 4,143
Sunset Poet 4,126
nightengale 4,096
E Swartz 3,985
JAPOV 3,973
beechnut79 3,878
Caroline 3,865
Kolstad 3,845
Dan Sullivan 3,710
Dottie 3,427
joewatt 3,411
Bill Cooper 3,279
John Hoffman 3,199
Skip Johnson 3,027
Pam Hurley 3,007
Terry G 3,005
Nigel Quin 2,891
PopTodd 2,890
Harriet Ames 2,870
MidniteBob 2,761
Nelson 2,616
Tom Tracy 2,558
Jerry Jakala 2,524
Al Alvarez 2,499
Eric Thome 2,448
Hummingbird 2,401
Stan Loh 2,263
Sam Wilson 2,246
Wendy D 2,235
Judy Hollier 2,232
Erica Ellis 2,202
maccharles 2,134
TrumanCoyote 2,096
Marty Helly 2,041
DukeWill 2,002
floyd jane 1,985
Clint Anglin 1,904
cindyrella 1,888
David Wright 1,866
Clairejeanne 1,851
Cindy LaRosa 1,824
Ronald Boyt 1,675
Iggy 1,652
Noel Downs 1,633
Rick Heenan 1,608
Cal 1,574
GocartMoz 1,559
Jack Swain 1,554
Pete Larsen 1,537
Ann Tygart 1,529
Tom Breshers 1,487
RogerS 1,481
Tom Franz 1,473
Chuck Crowe 1,441
Ralph Blight 1,440
Rick Norton 1,429
Kenneth Cade 1,429
bholt 1,411
Letha Allen 1,409
in2piano 1,404
Stan Simons 1,402
Deej56 1,385
mattbanx 1,384
Jen Shaner 1,373
Charlie Wong 1,347
KevinP 1,324
Vondelle 1,316
Tom W. 1,313
Jan Petter 1,301
scottandrew 1,294
lane1777 1,280
Gerry 1,280
DakLander 1,265
IronKnee 1,262
PeteG 1,242
Ian Ferrin 1,235
Glen King 1,214
VNORTH2 1,212
IdeaGuy 1,209
AaronAuthier 1,177
summeoyo 1,174
Diane Ewing 1,162
ckiphen 1,120
joro 1,082
BobbyJoe 1,075
S.DEE 1,040
yann 1,037
9ne 1,035
David Gill 1,032
Tony A 1,016
argo 986
peaden 984
90 dB 964
Wolvman 960
Jak Kelly 912
krtinberg 890
Drifter 886
Petra 883
RJC 845
Brenda152 840
Nadia 829
ant 798
Juan 797
TKO 784
Dayson 781
frahmes 781
bennash 763
teletwang 762
Andy K 750
Andy Kemp 749
tbryson 737
Jackie444 731
Irwin 720
3daveyO3 704
Dixie 701
Joy Boy 695
Pat Hardy 692
Knute 686
Lee Arten 678
Moosesong 668
Katziis 652
R.T.MOORE 638
quality 637
CG King 622
douglas 621
R&M 614
Mel 614
NaomiSue 601
Shandy 590
Ria 587
TAMERA64 583
qbaum 570
nitepiano 566
pRISCILLA 556
Tink2 553
musica 539
deanbell 528
RobertK 527
BonzaiWag 523
Roderic 522
BB Wilbur 513
goodfolks 499
Zeek 487
Stu 486
Steve P. 481
KathyW 462
allenb 459
MaxG 458
Philjo 454
fanito 448
trush48 448
dmk 442
Rob L 439
arealrush 437
DGR 436
avweek 435
Stephen D 433
Emmy 431
marquez 422
kit 419
Softkrome 417
kyrksongs 415
RRon 408
Laura G. 407
VNORTH 407
Debra 407
eb 406
cuebald 399
EdPerrone 399
Dannyk1 395
Hobart 395
Davyboy49 393
Smile 389
GJShades 387
Alek 386
Ezt 384
tone 380
Marla 380
Ann_F 379
iggyiggy 378
coalminer 377
java 374
ddreuter 371
spidey 371
sweetsong 370
danny 367
Rob B. 364
Jim Ryan 360
papaG 353
Z - man 350
JamesDF5 348
John K 348
Jaden 344
TheBaz 340
Steggy 339
leif 339
tonedeaf 336
rickwork 334
Eddie Ray 332
Johnboy 328
Bob Lever 328
Helicon1 327
lucian 326
Muskie 321
kc 319
Z. Mulls 318
ptondreau 313
ONOFFON 312
Chris B. 310
trush 304
ed323 297
Ellen M 294
markus-ky 293
lizzorn 291
nicnac49 290
Char 286
ktunes 285
Top Likes Received
JAPOV 86
VNORTH2 45
bennash 38
Previous Thread
Next Thread
Print Thread
Rate Thread
Joined: Feb 2007
Posts: 72
Likes: 2
J
Serious Contributor
OP Offline
Serious Contributor
J
Joined: Feb 2007
Posts: 72
Likes: 2
I'm interested in getting "The Thanksgiving Song" to Celine Dion.

https://youtu.be/4idFtHzc_T0

Any information would greatly be appreciated.

Be well, be safe,

James Guglielmo

Joined: Dec 2000
Posts: 8,160
Likes: 5
C
Top 25 Poster
Online Content
Top 25 Poster
C
Joined: Dec 2000
Posts: 8,160
Likes: 5
hi James....if you want to get a song to a major artist, it needs a better hook with better development than the pro writers they already use. And, possibly, more importantly, you need a personal relationship with either the artist, their publisher or producer.


Nashville demos etc:

https://www.soundclick.com/bands3/default.cfm?bandID=431939

other demos:

https://soundcloud.com/wabash-cannibal

Amazon Kindle books by Robert George you may enjoy:

1) Americana

2) Teenage Graceland

3) The Will to Be

4) Fort Mystery

5) Wheel Sea

6) My One True Love
Joined: Oct 2017
Posts: 4,990
Likes: 15
F
Top 50 Poster
Online Content
Top 50 Poster
F
Joined: Oct 2017
Posts: 4,990
Likes: 15
Well i dont know about that now, bad songs become hits all the time, not saying that this is bad, just saying I don't think greatness is the main factor

While couchgrouch speaks a kernel of truth here, when you are nobody in the songwriting world, you better have a great song, just to even have a prayer, the artist can write their own bad or mediocre song, and almost always do, these days.

James the short answer to how to get your song to a major artist is...you don't !

Shoot for the low hanging fruit and try to get an indie artist to record your song.it wont pay anything , and doesn't really mean my much, but it can provide some personal satisfaction.

I prefer writing sings for me to perform . I'm way behind too!

But I have heard many bad hits, and even more bad indie cuts, but indie cuts can be had by anyone with a connection or two.

Last edited by Fdemetrio; 11/18/20 08:14 PM.
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 5,827
Top 50 Poster
Offline
Top 50 Poster
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 5,827
Hi James,

Correct me if I am wrong, but I was under the impression that Celine has retired.

As stated, you need to know the artist, their management team, their publisher or producer.

cheers, niteshift

Joined: Dec 2000
Posts: 8,160
Likes: 5
C
Top 25 Poster
Online Content
Top 25 Poster
C
Joined: Dec 2000
Posts: 8,160
Likes: 5
An indie artist isn't low hanging fruit. They want to sing great songs, too. In order to reach them, you need to pitch well written songs to pubs you've established a relationship with.
OR you need a relationship with the artist. That's how I got my recent cut, my co-writers know the artist and the artist liked the song, with a few changes.

It's unlikely a song called "The Thanksgiving Song" will grab them, esp if the opening line is the number of days in the year. You need a hook.

As someone who's had songs pitched to majors, I speak from experience. You can listen to my tunes, James, and judge for yourself if they back up what I say.


Nashville demos etc:

https://www.soundclick.com/bands3/default.cfm?bandID=431939

other demos:

https://soundcloud.com/wabash-cannibal

Amazon Kindle books by Robert George you may enjoy:

1) Americana

2) Teenage Graceland

3) The Will to Be

4) Fort Mystery

5) Wheel Sea

6) My One True Love
Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 4,126
Likes: 29
Top 100 Poster
Online Content
Top 100 Poster
Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 4,126
Likes: 29
it's a lovely song, but sounds more of a "show tune" or a score to me due to the dynamics within the song. Rather than something that you would hear on a popular music album

Reaching Celine Dion has galactical odds against it, even if she is looking for your exact type of song. Nonetheless, good luck with your efforts and...
If you do talk to Celine, tell her that I have a couple of songs I'd like to throw on the stack for consideration. wink

Joined: Oct 2017
Posts: 4,990
Likes: 15
F
Top 50 Poster
Online Content
Top 50 Poster
F
Joined: Oct 2017
Posts: 4,990
Likes: 15
Not the facts Couch , what was that song about a beer, a wedding, that was cut by a former American Idol alum? Somebody knew somebody.

And do you think some of the songs that have been listed here as having a cut, are any good? You don't even think most professional releases are good.

Indie cuts are most definItely low hanging fruit. And there's nothing wrong with low hanging fruit.

" see if you back it up". Lol, dude you're funnier when you are not trying to be.

Listen.....do I back it up? Now, lets say for a minute, he says no, what happens? You explain to him that he's wrong? Lol, does he like chocolate? He's wrong!

The day for pure songwriter has come and gone. Is it within the Rhealm of possibility? Sure. Remotely likely, even if you know the artist personally? With millions of songs written every day, not really.

Write for yourself . if you perform, big plus for you. If not, write with somebody who can perform it....indie, or up coming indie!

Last edited by Fdemetrio; 11/19/20 10:24 AM.
Joined: Dec 2000
Posts: 11,534
Likes: 28
Top 10 Poster
Offline
Top 10 Poster
Joined: Dec 2000
Posts: 11,534
Likes: 28
James, Couch said it best and succinctly. In order to get into "the club" you need a "superior product" and a relationship with an established artist, producer, publisher etc.

My best advice to you is to read what Marc Alan Barnette posts here. He has "been there" and now part of what he does is advise others on their journey. Luckily we get a lot of his thinking here for free. Follow this link and then click on "show posts"

http://www.jpfolks.com/forum/ubbthreads.php/users/19892.html

Good luck with this


If writing ever becomes work I think I'm going to have to stop

Joined: Oct 2017
Posts: 4,990
Likes: 15
F
Top 50 Poster
Online Content
Top 50 Poster
F
Joined: Oct 2017
Posts: 4,990
Likes: 15
John, couch has basically dismissed any song, on any forum, as not being good enough. Some people here have indie cuts. So either he don't know anything, or bad songs can be cuts, just as easily as good ones.

Subjectivity is the main sticking point.

MAB spends most of his time talking about networking, not songwriting. Why? Cause networking is the only way. Everybody's got songs.

I've heard awful songs, or songs I didn't think were good at all become an indie cut.

A strong recording, with networking, is way more important.

Indie cuts are easy if you have a good relationship with a publisher, or upcoming artist.

Its not about great songwriting at all, and really, neither is pro cuts

Last edited by Fdemetrio; 11/19/20 12:46 PM.
Joined: Dec 2000
Posts: 8,160
Likes: 5
C
Top 25 Poster
Online Content
Top 25 Poster
C
Joined: Dec 2000
Posts: 8,160
Likes: 5
Thanks, John. smile

Ps...I'd say more but I've been hired to script Biden's press conferences... wink

Last edited by couchgrouch; 11/19/20 01:29 PM.

Nashville demos etc:

https://www.soundclick.com/bands3/default.cfm?bandID=431939

other demos:

https://soundcloud.com/wabash-cannibal

Amazon Kindle books by Robert George you may enjoy:

1) Americana

2) Teenage Graceland

3) The Will to Be

4) Fort Mystery

5) Wheel Sea

6) My One True Love
Joined: Dec 2000
Posts: 11,534
Likes: 28
Top 10 Poster
Offline
Top 10 Poster
Joined: Dec 2000
Posts: 11,534
Likes: 28
Post deleted. Addressed FD but it really is not worth it.



If writing ever becomes work I think I'm going to have to stop

Joined: Dec 2000
Posts: 8,160
Likes: 5
C
Top 25 Poster
Online Content
Top 25 Poster
C
Joined: Dec 2000
Posts: 8,160
Likes: 5
It's not worth it. His obsession with me is back where it was at TS. First it was comical and a little flattering, then it got creepy, which is where we are now.

Sad that.

Last edited by couchgrouch; 11/19/20 02:36 PM.

Nashville demos etc:

https://www.soundclick.com/bands3/default.cfm?bandID=431939

other demos:

https://soundcloud.com/wabash-cannibal

Amazon Kindle books by Robert George you may enjoy:

1) Americana

2) Teenage Graceland

3) The Will to Be

4) Fort Mystery

5) Wheel Sea

6) My One True Love
Joined: Oct 2017
Posts: 4,990
Likes: 15
F
Top 50 Poster
Online Content
Top 50 Poster
F
Joined: Oct 2017
Posts: 4,990
Likes: 15
Originally Posted by John Voorpostel
Post deleted. Addressed FD but it really is not worth it.


It's not worth it, cause what I said is true. People here have cuts, couch thinks none are good, but they were cut. He thought don't blink, a song for kenny chesney was no good, boy was his face red .

Can't say it takes great songs to have an indie cut, while at same say song cuts are no good


Last edited by Fdemetrio; 11/19/20 04:14 PM.
Joined: Oct 2017
Posts: 4,990
Likes: 15
F
Top 50 Poster
Online Content
Top 50 Poster
F
Joined: Oct 2017
Posts: 4,990
Likes: 15
Originally Posted by couchgrouch
It's not worth it. His obsession with me is back where it was at TS. First it was comical and a little flattering, then it got creepy, which is where we are now.

Sad that.

Couchgrouch the only person obsessed with you Is yourself. You're a career forum songwriter.

Last edited by Fdemetrio; 11/19/20 05:31 PM.
Joined: Oct 2020
Posts: 113
W
Serious Contributor
Offline
Serious Contributor
W
Joined: Oct 2020
Posts: 113
Originally Posted by James Guglielmo
I'm interested in getting "The Thanksgiving Song" to Celine Dion.

https://youtu.be/4idFtHzc_T0

Any information would greatly be appreciated.

Be well, be safe,

James Guglielmo


Ya go straight up to them in Facebook and give it to her. Tiwiter and give it to her, post it in her hometown newspaper forum, anything with a note of connectivity.

Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 5,827
Top 50 Poster
Offline
Top 50 Poster
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 5,827
Sorry William, wrong. It will be ignored. Artists and their agents do not accept unsolicited material.

cheers, niteshift

Joined: Oct 2020
Posts: 113
W
Serious Contributor
Offline
Serious Contributor
W
Joined: Oct 2020
Posts: 113
So Bruce Springsteen somehow by pure karma got to virtually note for note sampling my solo and covering my song? roger taylor loosely interpreted my song? blackmore's ngiht by sheer cosmic coincidence made a song with a nod to my relatives? um, u2 and melissa etheridge decided to use the same title based on me niteshift all because as i suggested to the original poster to do as i did? you see niteshift, i did exactly what i suggested and it worked for me each time

Joined: Dec 2000
Posts: 8,160
Likes: 5
C
Top 25 Poster
Online Content
Top 25 Poster
C
Joined: Dec 2000
Posts: 8,160
Likes: 5
niteshift is correct, James. Major artists don't accept unsolicited material. Rarely, very rarely, will someone of note peruse a site like this. If they do, your song will need a better title and opening line to grab them. It's the same with a publisher. They have STACKS of cds on their desks and their inboxes are stuffed with tunes. Your song needs to grab them or it'll be tossed or deleted.


Nashville demos etc:

https://www.soundclick.com/bands3/default.cfm?bandID=431939

other demos:

https://soundcloud.com/wabash-cannibal

Amazon Kindle books by Robert George you may enjoy:

1) Americana

2) Teenage Graceland

3) The Will to Be

4) Fort Mystery

5) Wheel Sea

6) My One True Love
Joined: Dec 2008
Posts: 10,190
Likes: 30
Top 20 Poster
Offline
Top 20 Poster
Joined: Dec 2008
Posts: 10,190
Likes: 30
You're very talented James. And I think the song is very catchy (especially the verses). Next to impossible, at least today, to get a song to a big artist. Although, there are very few songs celebrating Thanksgiving. And that cool video certainly sells it. So, there are possibilities. Try sharing the video link with some producers/ music supervisors. This could definitely fit nicely in a Hallmark holiday movie. I don't believe Celine's in the market for new material. She started another stage of her life.

Good luck, John smile

Joined: Feb 2007
Posts: 72
Likes: 2
J
Serious Contributor
OP Offline
Serious Contributor
J
Joined: Feb 2007
Posts: 72
Likes: 2
Thank you John for your positive feedback. I will explore those possibilities. Have a great Thanksgiving.

Be well, be safe

James Guglielmo

Joined: Oct 2020
Posts: 113
W
Serious Contributor
Offline
Serious Contributor
W
Joined: Oct 2020
Posts: 113
James, www.reverbnation.com as a member non pay can and will get you noticed but you got to be patient and persistant.

Joined: Dec 2008
Posts: 10,190
Likes: 30
Top 20 Poster
Offline
Top 20 Poster
Joined: Dec 2008
Posts: 10,190
Likes: 30
Originally Posted by WilliamMahler
James, www.reverbnation.com as a member non pay can and will get you noticed but you got to be patient and persistant.


"ReverbNation: 2.5 million members, who have: Uploaded more than 15 million songs" Noticed? James, I'd rather see you submit some music to "Crucial Music": https://www.crucialmusic.com/ I think you'd have a good chance getting the Thanksgiving song into a movie through them. Good thing about Crucial is you'll see licensing and PRO royalties.

John smile

Joined: Oct 2020
Posts: 113
W
Serious Contributor
Offline
Serious Contributor
W
Joined: Oct 2020
Posts: 113
ReverbNation tailors to the individual so long as the individual writes of their genre and specifics, the more info you tell them, they got me hundreds of leads many almost daily to my inbox at reverb.

Joined: Oct 2020
Posts: 113
W
Serious Contributor
Offline
Serious Contributor
W
Joined: Oct 2020
Posts: 113
After reading Crucial Music and Crucial Custom, I'm very tempted to sign up HOWEVER, 3 of my songs are co-written with 2 artists that have no representation by SESAC, BMI or ASCAP that I am aware of. Crucial by their own word will not accept 3 of my songs based on that so that's why I am very hesitant.

Joined: Dec 2008
Posts: 10,190
Likes: 30
Top 20 Poster
Offline
Top 20 Poster
Joined: Dec 2008
Posts: 10,190
Likes: 30
Yes, Crucial Music is very particular. But a great company.

John smile

Joined: Oct 2020
Posts: 113
W
Serious Contributor
Offline
Serious Contributor
W
Joined: Oct 2020
Posts: 113
Originally Posted by John Lawrence Schick
Yes, Crucial Music is very particular. But a great company.

John smile


After reading your accolades, apparently so.

Joined: Dec 2000
Posts: 8,160
Likes: 5
C
Top 25 Poster
Online Content
Top 25 Poster
C
Joined: Dec 2000
Posts: 8,160
Likes: 5
I've had a couple of placements thanks to Crucial. I can't offer advice because I had nothing to do with it, my co-writer did all the work. I just had some minor bureaucratic stuff to do.

They are choosey...


Nashville demos etc:

https://www.soundclick.com/bands3/default.cfm?bandID=431939

other demos:

https://soundcloud.com/wabash-cannibal

Amazon Kindle books by Robert George you may enjoy:

1) Americana

2) Teenage Graceland

3) The Will to Be

4) Fort Mystery

5) Wheel Sea

6) My One True Love
Joined: Dec 2008
Posts: 10,190
Likes: 30
Top 20 Poster
Offline
Top 20 Poster
Joined: Dec 2008
Posts: 10,190
Likes: 30
Congrats Couch! It's like an info maze leading up to being accepted or rejected.But well worth the work!

Best, John smile

Joined: Feb 2007
Posts: 72
Likes: 2
J
Serious Contributor
OP Offline
Serious Contributor
J
Joined: Feb 2007
Posts: 72
Likes: 2
Hello John,

Just wanted you to know that I joined www.crucialmusic.com and I will see where this will lead.
I need to try a different path - the Cdbaby type of path doesn't lead anywhere for me.
Thank you for the advice.

Be well, be safe.

James Guglielmo

Joined: Dec 2000
Posts: 11,534
Likes: 28
Top 10 Poster
Offline
Top 10 Poster
Joined: Dec 2000
Posts: 11,534
Likes: 28
James it is a well written song with a great melody well sung and the video works. So good luck with crucialmusic.com and keep us apprised of where it leads. Hope the right people see it.


If writing ever becomes work I think I'm going to have to stop

Joined: Dec 2008
Posts: 10,190
Likes: 30
Top 20 Poster
Offline
Top 20 Poster
Joined: Dec 2008
Posts: 10,190
Likes: 30
Wish you much success James!

John smile

Joined: Jan 2009
Posts: 5,426
Likes: 16
Top 50 Poster
Offline
Top 50 Poster
Joined: Jan 2009
Posts: 5,426
Likes: 16
Hello everyone.

Sorry I am just seeing this if this is a long running thread. I'm sort of having trouble keeping up some times. I have not said much because frankly there is not a lot I have to offer on many of the subjects going on here. I dont get into the endless political discussions or the insulting nature of a lot of Internet discourse these days. Just have no interest in that. There is more than enough anger, frustration, and bitterness out there. I have no interest in adding to the pile.

There are some subjects I do feel I can offer some insight on, and this is one of them. Getting a song to a "major artist" like Celine Dion" or any artist are to say the least difficult and while not impossible, majorly improbable. There are many reasons for it and many I have mentioned before. Fedemintrio, I am always happy to speak about songwriting, but most of the conversations on sites like these revolve around the "I've got this song now what do I do?" "How do you get a publisher", "How do you get to an artist?" or "What television and film library is best?" or "I've spent all this money and now what do I do to get it back?" Etc.
I respond to what other people want to talk about, and if subjects are out there that I can't offer anything on, I don't. The fact is that most people on songwriters forums already think they have the songwriting aspect covered, so they are rarely interested in any input on that. So Networking is one that comes into play most often.

I always cover four areas:
"Creation of the song.
Presentation of the song.
Networking.
Business.

I'm happy to talk about any one of those, but as everyone knows, I can offer quite a lot of detail. I don't want to do that unless someone asks for it.

But if James, the original poster, has some questions on his original post, I'll be glad to elaborate.

On his posts so far:
On Celine:
Celine is basically retired. She may do certain special events, but the rigors of losing her husband, raising her children, doing her residency in Vegas, etc. have basically left her wanting to withdraw from the public spotlight. She is more than set for life and has accomplished more than most people ever would.She frankly has nothing left to prove. So I would not look for her to make any return any time soon. You should be looking for a "Celine Dion" of the future. Someone closer to you and keep your aspirations workable and achievable.

On a "THANKSGIVING" (or special purpose) song.
Anything that has a finite season has limited commercial appeal. We don't have a "Thanksgiving" season, any more than a "Valentine" season or "Arbor Day" season. So any purchasing potential, radio airplay, etc. would be minimal if at all. Releasing a record is a huge deal and financial investment. Trying to promote something with limited ability to return on an investment, is simply not a good money expense. So you would be hard pressed to find any record label or infact any artist to take a chance on it. Christmas songs have a 5-6 week time frame, and everyone writes for that target. All artists do Christmas records and so it is a better bet that you would have a shot at something with a Christmas release. But there is much, much, MUCH, more competition. I just released one of my own, "NOT SO MERRY CHRISTMAS HERE IN THE TRAILER PARK" with a video, 15 years after writing it. The reason I did is that it is part of a larger compilation CD and the expense of production was very minimal. So it made sense. Most don't make sense.

On Your Song:
It's very nice, but a BEAR to sing for anyone less than an Opera or majorly accomplished singer. One thing about Christmas songs is they are very easy to sing. The entire point of them are seasonal singalongs. The more you complicate a song, the more narrow your ability to pitch the song becomes.

A place you might look are local churches, high school or college music programs, local music teachers. Anyone you could contact and sit down with. The problem with the Internet is that it is so vast, being able to reach anyone with billions of songs a month is actually close to impossible. not to mention that fact that now artists are really only interested in what they themselves create. So you would be much better served to build relationships with artists and write WITH THEM, instead of trying to pitch TO THEM. Everyone has a "self preservation and promotion" instinct in them, and since now, most songs are relative, (which is why you get substandard songs and artists on the radio), we are all going to choose our own creative work over that of anyone else. Since the money has dissapeared out of the music industry as a whole, if you are not going to make any money any way, why waste time with something you had no hand in creating?

On most to think about regarding your song:
You might do your own "singer search" on various web sites, YOU TUBE, FACEBOOK" or other sites, then spend some time screening your own singers, contacting them, and building a relationship, yes, NETWORKING.

For most everything musical, IT IS THE BEST OF TIMES, IT IS THE WORST OF TIMES.
We all have a vast area to get what we do "out there." we can place our work on endless sites and areas. We have creative freedom to do whatever we want, say what we want, how we want it, any way we want.
Getting anyone to pay attention, listen and observe what we do, stop their own endlessly busy lives, is another thing altogether. And to actually PAY US FOR IT? That's a tall order.

Good luck to you and I hope some of this makes sense to you. I wish you well and happy holiday season.

MAB

Joined: Jan 2009
Posts: 5,426
Likes: 16
Top 50 Poster
Offline
Top 50 Poster
Joined: Jan 2009
Posts: 5,426
Likes: 16
Originally Posted by Fdemetrio
[quote=John Voorpostel]Post deleted. Addressed FD but it really is not worth it.


"It's not worth it, cause what I said is true. People here have cuts, couch thinks none are good, but they were cut. He thought don't blink, a song for kenny chesney was no good, boy was his face red" .

Like a lot of things, I have a pretty funny story about that one. Chris Wallin, one of the writers of that song, is a friend of mine and has been for many years before he started having a number of hits on Chesney .Tim McGraw, Montgomery Gentry, George Strait and others. I remember when he was struggling and driving a really horrible beat up car. We used to do a show every Thanksgiving at the Bluebird. He has a great story on that song:

He had written it many years ago, and would go to NSAI meetings. They would do critiques (I was one of the critiquers at one time) in a huge class setting with probably 100 writers at a time. Made for a long night going through songs. They also have a pro song service that does private critiques for members. Chris played it several times for people and nearly everyone thought that it didn't work. He even carries this folded up piece of paper when he does it live,one of the reviews he got, he opens it up and it says something to the effect of:

"Nobody would buy this over sentamental piece of crap. No one would believe the story teller is that old, no one would buy the premise, the melody is mediocre...": etc.

It's like they complained about every piece of the song. Hard to believe now because it was a HUGE hit and it is now cited as an example of how TO write a song.
So Crouchgrouch wasn't the only one confused.

But I find that in pretty much everything in the creative arts. It's very subjective. I do a lot of searching on the net for songs, writers, movies, television shows, cultural phenomenom. A current interest is filmaker Stanley Kubrick. It's so interesting how so many of his very few movies got terrible reviews, and reading comments on them from the general public that range from the "OH MY GOD, THAT IS THE THING THAT CHANGED MY LIFE" to "WTF DID I JUST WATCH?"
It's a pretty amazing width of responses.

And this is what we face as creators. Who is to say what is "good" or "not good." Play something for 100 people and you may get 100 different responses. How it relates to the original poster here is that he has something that fits well for him. His voice works well with the song, his emotions, and beliefs are well displayed through his song lthe video works well for him. I congratulate him and wish him luck.

But Personally, there is NO WAY that I would embrace the song mainly because I COULDN'T SING IT! And since I didn't write it, it just doesn't have the same appeal as it does to him. Songs, books, poetry, films, etc. are all subjective. We have to keep that in mind in anything we do as creative people.
And in the in, the consumer is the one that makes the ultimate decision. If he finds an audience for his music, who are any of us to say what works and doesn't.

MAB

Joined: Oct 2017
Posts: 4,990
Likes: 15
F
Top 50 Poster
Online Content
Top 50 Poster
F
Joined: Oct 2017
Posts: 4,990
Likes: 15
Cool. Well yeah what is good? I think that was the central theme of my responses. I guess people like couch have experience in knowing what a publisher might think, as opposed to what is actually good or not, and that's helpful to know.

The Chesney song was placed on another site, I actually only had heard about it, I never saw the thread. But it was posted in annomity, just to see what the critics would say about it , and they did say stuff about it. Then it was revealed that it was a major cut for Cheney. Personally, it was kind of lame to do that, I mean why waste your time playing a game with people, you had the cut, I'd be outta there celebrating. I'm not sure who actually started the thread...

Anyway, that was the point . what sparked the fight here was on one hand saying that indie cuts require songwriting skill, and goodness, but on the other hand saying other cuts are not good.

Either it takes a good song to have a cut, or it doesn't, can't take a good song, when I wrote it, but when somebody else wrote one, it was something else.

I'd say with all cuts, its alot less about the song than other things. They simply don't need our songs, great or not.

Last edited by Fdemetrio; 12/02/20 02:31 PM.
Joined: Jan 2009
Posts: 5,426
Likes: 16
Top 50 Poster
Offline
Top 50 Poster
Joined: Jan 2009
Posts: 5,426
Likes: 16
Cut's, like anything, are very relative. That is why you hear so many things on the radio, television. movies, etc. that you wonder "How in the world did that get on there?" What we may consider "weak songs" (and no doubt, many are, as well as weak artists) and others that blow us away but never go anywhere, cuts and all songs are important to "look beyond the song." There are so many things involved outside the song itself, that come into play. And people that only focus on the song in a vacumn never see that. It most often goes to the RELATIONSHIP.

I always have stressed the relationship and networking, because that is the central element on successes of songs. Relationships with other writers, artists, publishers, producers, labels, and most importantly, the relationship between the artist and their audience. Relationship is key.

People outside a music town or community, usually overlook this. They look at it as hopelessly inside and political, which it is, but it is deeper than that. It is a FRATERNITY. Eveyrone that comes to this, or any specific community, essentially gives up their lives, homes, families, social setting, and the years of work they have put into their home areas behind them and start completely over. The younger they are, out of high school or college, with less requirements on them, the better. But those are more likely to flame out as well.

It takes years to build up skill level, and political contacts that will help you in your career. I once wrote a booklet called "FRESHMAN YEAR IN NASHVILLE" which was a primer of sorts for people moving to town. It is much like like high school and college,FRESHMAN, SOPHOMORE, JUNIOR, SENIOR, and all of them last three years. You have the people that are here before you, the people that move in around the same time, and a few people that come right after you. These are the people you bond with, write with, hang out with. And those circles of friends interconnect with other circles, writers producers, other people that do the same thing. Those circles are the ones that develop into the successful relationships down the road.
That's how the networking works.

An analogy can be made to any business. If you were going into contruction and wanted your own business, you wouldn't just throw up a shingle and start building houses. You would start at the bottom, do the grunt work, not make much money, but build your skill and reputation. As people know you, you get more jobs, more responsibility and then maybe start side jobs, smaller projects. After a time you might branch out on your own., Years go by and hopefully you would develop into your own business.

These writing relationships and hopefully future artists, are the key to it all. And it's not just Nashville. A friend and former student of mine, lives in the Orange County California area, with connections to the film industry in Los Angeles. Around 20 years ago, when he was in college, he started working in the video game industry, doing music and sound effects for video games. 20 years later and those relationships and skill level culminated in working for Disney, designing music for their theme park, including the "STAR WARS" area of the park. One of the reasons he was able to do that was fro, being nominated for an Oscar award for composition work on "THE WORLD'S GREATEST SHOWMAN" the Hugh Jackman movie. So the networking, as well as abilities, all play into any industry.

This is what people like the original poster, James, don't always understand. And things that Couch Grouch say have validity. All publishers, writers, artists, you name it have a LOT of material. And they work in their circles. The circles expand and contract all the time, with new people coming into things and other people leaving in one way or another. And these are all long developed contacts. So when someone says "I want to get this to Celine Dion" it is never that simple and it is never "just about the song." It is about the relationship.

My approach has always been to "do what you can with what you have." If he made some contacts in the area he lives in, local artists, onllne contacts, building trust, reputation, etc, he would be in a better position to find the "new upcoming Celine Dion" or maybe someone in his own sphere of influence that might do his song on their projects, their web sites, their own things. And some of those contacts might go on and rise to their own levels of success,hopefully taking his work with them. To me, that is the only thing that has ever led to success. And while some may term the independent cuts as "low hanging fruit" I don't really feel that way.Anything that helps you get your work beyond that which you yourself can do is valid.

That is what is often talked about here. Validation .Having someone know you for what you do creatively is validity. Being involved in a community, be it in person or online, and being respected in that is validity. Having cuts, be them major or independent having you and your songs known whether someone else does them or you do them in your self produced projects are validity. It is art. Art can't always be measured in tangible success. We mostly are up against ourselves.

So I hope this fellow and all writers and anyone with the "dream" understand that. There are a lot of levels to this aside from the song itself. But from my point of view, it is all about the relationships. Songs are extension of those relationships.

Hope you are all well.
MAB

Joined: Nov 2011
Posts: 964
Top 500 Poster
Offline
Top 500 Poster
Joined: Nov 2011
Posts: 964
Good advice, Marc; as always. Of course, there are agencies that can also do that work for a songwriter. Such as.........



The Starmaker Machine


Are You the Next Big Thing in the Music Business?
Are your songs better than anything you hear on the radio?
Do your friends and family tell you that you are great?
Are you stuck in BFE, far away from New York, L.A. or Nashville?
Do you have a closet full of your music CD's that you can't even give away?
Do you have a message that the world needs to hear?
Are you a star on the internet forums?
Do you have some money?


Then, I would like to introduce you to The Starmaker Machine! We have the knowledge, experience and connections in the music industry to take your musical career to the next level!


Do you want to play packed stadiums to thousands of screaming fans?
We can make that happen!

Do you want gold records hanging on your home studio walls?
We can make that happen!

Do you want to demand only yellow M & M's on your performance rider?
We can make that happen!

Do you want your face on the cover of Rolling Stone?
We can make that happen!

Do you want to hide your vast wealth in offshore accounts while maintaining your "common man" persona?
We can make that happen!

Do you want a herd of groupies waiting for you at the stage door after your shows?

We can make that happen!


You've already tried it your way, and where are you? Still living in Mom's basement, and working at the Crazy Chicken fast food joint? Still shlepping your guitar to the open mics and posting your music on internet forums?

Stop kidding yourself!

To succeed in the music business, you need to be connected. You need the guidance of professionals who are dedicated to your career. People who can get your music to the right people. You need The Starmaker Machine!


Fact: 14,672 new CD's are released to the public every single second!
Fact: .000000012 % of these CD's will make a profit.
Fact: Most music today is pirated or downloaded for free.
Fact: Most musicians live lives of quiet desperation, ending tragically in drug addiction and suicide.

How can you overcome the daunting challenges of the music business? How can you get your music into the hands of millions of new fans? How can you get the money, prestige and women you truly desire?

By signing up for membership in The Starmaker Machine - that's how!

Success is right around the corner. You can feel it. You are the greatest thing to ever hit the music business. You know it. We know it too! With The Starmaker Machine behind you, all your dreams will come true!

What can you expect to get with your membership?

A professional demo of your song, recorded by top level studio pros!
Your own website on the Starmaker Page!
Two guest passes to The Bluebird Cafeteria in Nashville, Tn!
Two round-trip bus tickets to the Annual Starmaker Convention in Swamp Hollow, Arkansas!
Personal mentoring with Buddy Jay, award-winning songwriter of “Love's Done Got Me” and “The Blue Tick Hound Song”!!
Radio airplay on WSVJ in Wheeling, W.V.
Free membership in Broadcast Music Inc.!
Exclusive song critiques by our staff of award-winning songwriters/A & R / Producers!




Starmaker Staff:

Colonel Bob Parker, President.

Bob has scored a number of charting songs in his long illustrious career, most notably: “She Wouldn't Shut Up, So I Shot Her”, and “There's A Fly In My Beer And A Tear In My Eye” - and who could forget the timeless “Barrooms And Spitoons”?
Bob has also had a huge career on tour, opening for acts like Johnny Dolan's Rough Riders, Nancy Higgenbotham, Charlie Duncan and The Brittles! Bob also hosted a popular Radio Show on WDFR in Bugtussel, Ok.
Bob brings all his years of Music Business Business Experience to everything we do here at TSM, and through his guidance, we are growing every day!


Chet Haskins, C.E.O.
Chet is well known as a pioneer in The Music Business Business, having run a myriad of wildly successful websites catering to amateur songwriters and musicians, such as - “Wannabee.com”, “Poseur.com” and his biggest triumph - “YourSong.com”.
Chet knows all the right people, and can get your song to them!


Emongo Mobubu, Nigerian Chapter President.
Emongo is our rep in Africa. We get a TON of airplay for our clients in Africa! The royalties can be difficult to negotiate, but hey – it's airplay!


Chi Chi Monteno, Latin Music Director
Chi Chi began his music career as the Artistic Director at the BoomBoom Room in Detroit, then moved to L.A. to coordinate the 1st Annual Chicano Punk Festival in Culver City, which was headlined by none other than Juan Yuto! (“Maracas and Cucaraches”).

Why wait? Every passing day you slip further into oblivion! You want the fame – the fortune – YOU KNOW YOU DO!


Sign up TODAY!

1 Year Membership : $1500. USD
3 Year Membership : $6000. USD

Payable to:

Colonel Bob Parker
PO Box 2
Happy Trails Motor Court
Muckoluski, OK.



Membership Form:

Name____________________________________________
Address______________________________________
Email _______________________________________
Credit Card # ___________________________
SSN __________________________________
Bank Account Number(s) ______________________________________

Joined: Jan 2009
Posts: 5,426
Likes: 16
Top 50 Poster
Offline
Top 50 Poster
Joined: Jan 2009
Posts: 5,426
Likes: 16
Uh....riiiight.

There are no end to those types of companies and I'm sure some people do find their way to them. I hope they find what they are looking for. None of the situations that I mention, the actual music industry, that I know, are done like that. Actually, the various relationships and circles that I speak of are formed to screen those types of services out. But there are things like TAXI that give songwriters some real world experience of what it is like to engage in writing for a commercial market.

For my money, experience and whatever, there is nothing that will ever take the place of one on one interaction. There are a lot of ways to spend money, and a lot of people willing to take it. I would suggest before aligning with anyone to contact people that have been INVOLVED with those organizations and do some research before diving into anything. The road to Hell is paved with good intentions and in a world based around dreams, caution should always be used.

Good luck to all.
MAB

Joined: Dec 2008
Posts: 10,190
Likes: 30
Top 20 Poster
Offline
Top 20 Poster
Joined: Dec 2008
Posts: 10,190
Likes: 30
A lot of wisdom in Marc's posts. As far as The Star Maker Machine, a lot of negative comments by users here: https://www.quora.com/Is-Starmaker-really-fake-or-not

John smile

Joined: Jul 2020
Posts: 357
Likes: 5
C
Top 500 Poster
Offline
Top 500 Poster
C
Joined: Jul 2020
Posts: 357
Likes: 5
I love reading these posts.

Joined: Jan 2009
Posts: 5,426
Likes: 16
Top 50 Poster
Offline
Top 50 Poster
Joined: Jan 2009
Posts: 5,426
Likes: 16
Craig, I'm glad you do. Hope they help some.

John, one of the things about my "high school" and "college" analogies, in regard to relationships are that is in all business relationships, there is the "CLIQUE" factor. When you spend years with people, knowing them personally, their quirks and foibles as well as their good side, you know who to trust and who you want to work with, and who not to work with. Each business, is like that. And if you are a publishing, production company, label, etc. you have spent sometimes fortunes to foster and develop those relationships and talent. You are not just going to let anyone on the inside. And with all the insane nuts running around these days, you would be smart to do that.

One of the biggest aspects of this process is screening out weirdos. I don't think i have to tell anyone here how many strange people you encounter involved with music. There is nothing like spending millions on some artist or writer and finding out they are a Harvey Wienstien or Jeffery Epstein. There are many, many cases of an entire company being brought down by the foibles or actions of one person. One of the biggest management companies in Nashville was brought down three years ago due to the propensity of the owner hitting on and having conquests among young male artists. It was a huge scandal, and wiped out one of the biggest agencies in the town.

This is one thing these companies that are listed run into. They actually have reputations and they are not good ones. They charge a good deal of money, and their results are, to say the least, spotty. They also are known for taking anything and any one. That can run into a lot of trouble, because again they often don't know who they are dealing with, and the quality is always less than substantial. And there is the crazy factor. There have been more than a few examples of some frustrated songwriter showing up to an office with a gun demanding to know "what has happened to his cuts?!"

Then there is the "OUTSIDER" factor. Notbody likes people they don't know, just becoming the "bull in the china shop" and pushing people around, particularly when they are throwing money around. There are no end to the examples of this either. I knew one woman in particular, who burned through her inheritence of over $6 millkion dollars of her families silver mining business. She did that in about three years, throwing money around like it was going out of style. Hiring some really good song pluggers, high profile offices, recording studios, etc. Even had a couple friends of mine write for her, even tried to hire me once. The problem was there was something "just not right" about her. There is a difference between Assertiveness and aggressiveness .Being assertive, knowing when to push, and when to relax and let off is one thing. Being aggressive, where everyone gets to know you for your bad qualities is a bad thing. And she was like that. Very arrogant, very dismissive. And now, very broke. She works at a local Walgreens now. I do my best to avoid her whenever I see her.

There have been a lot of these type situations, both inside and outside Nashville, Los Angeles, New York. There are a couple of names I could mention, but won't that EVERYBODY knows and has had some dealings with. They have incredibly bad reputations, yet seem to continue on, changing their names, and going on when they should have been closed down years ago. What they do is not illegal, just unethical. Giving false hope, and playing upon people;'s dreams is just always a seedy thing to do. And I have encountered so many people that have experienced divorces, family disintigration, burning through retirement accounts, that it is a very sad situation.

So, while I don't condem any one person, group, company, etc. I do suggest caution in all people you deal with. Anyone that ever wants to deal with me, are encouraged to talk to people I have worked with. Many of those situations lead to co-writing and networking relationships and that is what I encourage. I am a simple coach, designed to help people gather what they do, get some perspective, then take all that as an overall approach to their career. I promise nothing other than you will know more about the business, the craft and yourself, after working a bit with me, than you did before. The rest is up to you.

As always I wish all of you best holidays in these trying times. Try to enjoy your music and do the best you can. It can be fun and informative.
Never let your highs be too high or lows be too low.
And remember, YOU DON'T CHOOSE MUSIC, MUSIC CHOOSES YOU.

MAB

Joined: Oct 2017
Posts: 4,990
Likes: 15
F
Top 50 Poster
Online Content
Top 50 Poster
F
Joined: Oct 2017
Posts: 4,990
Likes: 15
There used to be a guy in new jersey who would advertise in the local paper, this before the net and stuff, he'd list all these "credits" he had, it reeked to me even back then, so I never submitting anything .

When I went to a pro studio shortly after, with a local recording and producing, and really all instrument guru, he really opened my eyes as to how much of a non musician I was, he just crushed everything he played. im like man, i suck. Eventually it wears off and youre back doing it.

But I mentioned this guy who advertised to him, and he scoffed, " yeah the guy sends you pictures of Frank Sinatras mother and him in the grocery store, and calls that a credit..... If you were my worst enemy, I'd never send you to him.

I never gave it a thought after that!


Last edited by Fdemetrio; 12/04/20 11:55 AM.
Joined: Jul 2020
Posts: 357
Likes: 5
C
Top 500 Poster
Offline
Top 500 Poster
C
Joined: Jul 2020
Posts: 357
Likes: 5
Marc: your insights and experiences are always a worthwhile read.

Joined: Jan 2009
Posts: 5,426
Likes: 16
Top 50 Poster
Offline
Top 50 Poster
Joined: Jan 2009
Posts: 5,426
Likes: 16
Fedemintro,

Here's another "addendum" on these companies that advertise and make all these claims. Over the past 20 years, you've seen more and more of them, because publishing money has all but dissapeared with the age of streaming. The only companies that can collect on their music, are ones with huge legal departments that can chase down money that is owed. And most songs never recieve enough streams to add up to anything, so that is why all these people are always asking about where their money is.

But a lot of companies who were at one time "legitimate publishers" changed to "PINOS" (Publishers in name only) and became song pluggers or cateloge services. Those are fee for service. And some of those are people that came in and bought out other existing companies, so they make these claims about the people they have represented, which may have been true, but it was not THEM doing it. It was the established company from decades ago.

One of the most notorious took the name of an over 100 year old film studio and television network. I have never known how they got away with that. But the company is a real red flag. But most people know them. If they have ever done a contest, published a work, put something online, etc. they have probably gotten an email or letter about "how much potential there is in their writing and for a small fee they can turn them into star makers. "
Same thing as those old comic book or magazine ads that used to say "Will put your lyrics to music..." or "If you can draw this cartoon you can be a commercial artist!" Same deal. Promises on dreams.

The other thing that Nashville has had over the past 20 or so years (most of this started in the early 2000's) when the people I call "The CANN Millionaires" all came to town. There would be these very rich people, Actors, sports stars, people from other musical genres all trying to "go country", or overseas companies trying to cash in on the "Nashville boom"; that goes on from time to time. They go to things like the "CANN Film festival" and all like to get their pictures taken with celebrities, show up at all the charity events, donate money to get their pictures taken, etc.

They would come into town, set up offices, buy real estate, buy recording studios, set up publishing and production companies, and go into business. They would throw a lot of money around, you'd see them in the news, videos, etc. all being seen and heard everywhere. They'd also hire staffs, song pluggers, writers, even develop artists. Some did okay, most failed. It is a tax write off for more of them, and after a few years, get bored and go buy a new yaught or something. Then they fold their offices, lay off their staffs and are gone overnight. A lot of suddenly unemployed people very quickly.

So all these companies become "The Road to Hell is paved with good intentions." Interesting world.
MAB

Joined: Dec 2000
Posts: 8,160
Likes: 5
C
Top 25 Poster
Online Content
Top 25 Poster
C
Joined: Dec 2000
Posts: 8,160
Likes: 5
The thread on TS about Don't Blink was many years ago. As I recall, I did not comment on it until after it was revealed the song had been cut and I'd heard it. And it may have been on another thread about a similar topic.

If I'm wrong, prove it. I might be. It was a long time ago. But I don't think I am.

I do remember saying I wasn't impressed by the song and would never buy it. I never have. I generally don't like Nashville country. It's too corny and cliched. I can't be "red faced" because I don't like a song. It must have been cut for me to hear it on the radio, sharp stuff.

My favorite country tunes of the past 30 years are Garth's No Fences and a few others of his. (Nothing recent)

Plus these.

Almost Home.

The Good Stuff.

Arlington.

Dreaming Fields

On a Bus to St. Cloud

The Song Remembers When.

You'll Be There.

Alice in the Looking Glass.


Classics, one and all.


There are a few others I can't recall offhand.


One thing Don't Blink has is a hook and coherent development. Compare it with FD's most recent "lyric".



The song above isn't good enough. It just isn't.

Period.

Last edited by couchgrouch; 12/07/20 08:40 PM.

Nashville demos etc:

https://www.soundclick.com/bands3/default.cfm?bandID=431939

other demos:

https://soundcloud.com/wabash-cannibal

Amazon Kindle books by Robert George you may enjoy:

1) Americana

2) Teenage Graceland

3) The Will to Be

4) Fort Mystery

5) Wheel Sea

6) My One True Love
Joined: Jan 2009
Posts: 5,426
Likes: 16
Top 50 Poster
Offline
Top 50 Poster
Joined: Jan 2009
Posts: 5,426
Likes: 16
Well, you and a few NSAI critiquers share the same opinion. Chesney's record label, publishers, money investors, managers, Kenny himself and several million fans and radio disagreed. I tend to agree with them. Everyone is entitled to their opinion. But you've always got yours.

MAB

Joined: Dec 2000
Posts: 8,160
Likes: 5
C
Top 25 Poster
Online Content
Top 25 Poster
C
Joined: Dec 2000
Posts: 8,160
Likes: 5
I'm not necessarily disagreeing with them. My tastes don't run in that direction, that's all. I think Dreaming Fields is a far, far superior song. On every level.

I think Shallow is a generic power ballad.

To each his own.


And the road to good intentions is paved with hell.


Nashville demos etc:

https://www.soundclick.com/bands3/default.cfm?bandID=431939

other demos:

https://soundcloud.com/wabash-cannibal

Amazon Kindle books by Robert George you may enjoy:

1) Americana

2) Teenage Graceland

3) The Will to Be

4) Fort Mystery

5) Wheel Sea

6) My One True Love
Joined: Oct 2017
Posts: 4,990
Likes: 15
F
Top 50 Poster
Online Content
Top 50 Poster
F
Joined: Oct 2017
Posts: 4,990
Likes: 15
Doh.... still obsessed with me, tries yo take a shot when not looking.

Look knucklehead, any time you wanna square off on a song challenge,, I'm ready, ill perform mine on YouTube, perhaps you can hold your notebook up to the screen and use that as a video, with no music?

Your co writers, do you a favor, you had a couple of songs that sound halfway decent....but violin hmmm mmm, its tiring.

Shall we raise your piece of paper up to the rafters, as your inducted into the forum songwriters hall of fame????

I mean goshhhhhh.

I totally schooled you on this thread, and you unwittingly support my statements.

Your indie cut is great,....cause it took a great song to have one

Chesney's major was not great......

Just play along if you will, do you see any possible conflict of interest there?

Frankly I don't care for Chesney nor your songs.....

So, where are we at....

All I can say CG is study the greats, perhaps if you become great you will break through, I just don't have much to offer ya on that.

But seriously study the greats like Neil Young and Bruce Springsteen, guys who really know how to write .

Something might happen.

But get that notebook up on YouTube, and for effect turn the page yourself .....

Tee hee

Last edited by Fdemetrio; 12/08/20 02:05 AM.
Joined: Jul 2020
Posts: 357
Likes: 5
C
Top 500 Poster
Offline
Top 500 Poster
C
Joined: Jul 2020
Posts: 357
Likes: 5
I listened to the Thanksgiving song again yesterday and wondered why the writer thought Celine Dion’s voice would work with this. The singer you chose, Jeff, does a very good job on vocals. However, there is a Celine Dion tribute artist who might agree to take a listen named Morgane LaTouche.


Link Copied to Clipboard
Support Just Plain Folks

We would like to keep the membership in Just Plain Folks FREE! Your donation helps support the many programs we offer including Road Trips and the Music Awards.


Newest Members
chriscastle, yasir252, cathennashira, Samwise, HappySousa
21,470 Registered Users
Forum Statistics
Forums117
Topics125,717
Posts1,160,950
Members21,470
Most Online37,523
Jan 25th, 2020
Just Plain Quotes
"If one man can do it, any man can do it. It is true. But the real question is, if one man did it, are you willing to do what it takes to do it as well?" –Brian Austin Whitney
Today's Birthdays
warriorgirl (2024)
Popular Topics(Views)
Powered by UBB.threads™ PHP Forum Software 7.7.5