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#1160904 - 01/23/20 08:46 PM Re: An observation... [Re: couchgrouch]  
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niteshift Online content
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Oprah for president ! grin

cheers, niteshift

#1160905 - 01/23/20 11:34 PM Re: An observation... [Re: couchgrouch]  
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Gavin Sinclair Online content
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Originally Posted by couchgrouch
Yeah...

...you've got plenty of posts on this topic and familiarity with the Democrats' case, yet you've provided no evidence of a crime. You should be a pundit for CNN.

Nixon's impending impeachment caused him to resign. The crime? A bunch of guys broke into the Democratic office at the Watergate Hotel.

Burglary is a crime.

In clear, succinct terms, quote the transcript verbatim, then quote verbatim the law it broke. You can't do it. Schiff can't do it.

There's no predicating crime.



Nobody cares if I can and more importantly Schiff doesn't have to. There doesn't have to be a crime. "What’s a high crime? It doesn’t even have to be a crime. It’s just when you start using your office and you’re acting in a way that hurts people, you’ve committed a high crime.” Lindsey Graham in 1999.

You were probably too young at the time to remember it, but here's one from Justice Joseph Story in 1833, “There are many offences, purely political, which have been held to be within the reach of parliamentary impeachments, not one of which is, in the slightest manner, alluded to in the statute books.” (That's the way they spelled offenses back then)

As it happens, there does seem to have been at least one crime, at least according to the Government Accountability Office, which found that withholding the funds from Ukraine violated the Impoundment Control Act. This was one of the things that worried staffers in the White House and caused them to report their concerns.

#1160906 - 01/23/20 11:40 PM Re: An observation... [Re: couchgrouch]  
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And exactly how many crimes have the Democrats committed trying to get him out of office? And exactly how many crimes have the Clinton's committed that the Democrats whitewashed? Care to answer that one? "Let he who is without sin cast the first stone!" Trump's Biggest crime, winning the election.


Have a goodun,

John W. Selleck BMI Songwriter
A day without learning is a day lost

http://www.soundclick.com/johnsings
http://www.soundclick.com/johnwselleck
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#1160910 - 01/24/20 05:19 AM Re: An observation... [Re: couchgrouch]  
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JAPOV Offline
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Hey Gavin..... I know you don’t really know me very well, and I have a reputation for being involved in some pretty shady business... But, since you’re such a generous and well connected guy, would you mind donating to my cause so I can afford to defend myself? Pretty Please??? smile

#1160912 - 01/24/20 09:33 AM Re: An observation... [Re: couchgrouch]  
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Everett Adams Online content
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As an outsider looking in, I had my doubts about Trump. He was a bit of a loud mouth, boastful reprobate, making promises that even he did not ever expect to have to try to fulfill. I don't think he ever expected to be elected but he spoke to many American's hearts. They elected him much to the displeasure of the Democrats. As far as I can see he has done his best to fulfill the promises he made, even to draining the swamp, he still has a way to go on that one. He has been opposed every step of the way on very promise, in spite of that he has done great things for your economy. I think when he is reelected he will finish fulfilling the rest of his promises, especially about draining the swamp. I may not agree with his approach in running the government, but he was never a Politician, he was always a business man, therefore he is taking the same approach in running the country. The rest of the world is not taking advantage of the USA like they always did, he is negotiating trade deals that are fair to all sides. Countries are afraid to call his bluff, be it in business deals or war, because they know he will not back down. Trump is (what you see is what you get). He is not two faced. Most politicians before elected will promise you the world but once in power they dance around their promises until the next election and try to buy your vote with more promises. I would sooner vote for an reprobate up front than vote for an angel up front and then find he\she is an even bigger reprobate after getting elected.

I never paid much attention to US politics, mainly because I didn't understand your system of politics, but when Obama was running for election, I started following it, actually rooted for him to be elected, I thought he would be good for all, but changed my mind after a few years. In Canada we make the mistake of putting in Liberal governments too often. We are living in a world of no absolutes, anything goes, and most of the people are of that persuasion, so we get the government we deserve. Most times they are in there for a good time (hopefully not a long time) at taxpayers expense. Right now we have an minority government, which means they could lose the right to govern at any time, so they have to govern carefully to hold unto power. When they have majority government they can push through any law they want, fair or unfair to the people.

I don't know how this impeachment farce will turn out, but the next election will be exciting to watch, much mud slinging and blood letting I'm sure.

#1160913 - 01/24/20 09:47 AM Re: An observation... [Re: couchgrouch]  
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Originally Posted by Everett Adams
...as far as I can see he has done his best to fulfill the promises he made, even to draining the swamp, …


Everett, I am not sure where you are getting your information on that one, but from where I sit, Trump's admin has been the most corrupt that the US has had. Maybe it is the 24 hour news cycle, but how many of his cabinet officers and appointees have had to leave office because of their rampant self-dealing. … and, of course, the trump family continually enriching themselves at taxpayer's expense.

All admins have corruption (power corrupts), but were any crimes uncovered in the Obama administration? Or better yet, did any Obama associates go to jail over corrupt practices? No, but there are lots of conspiracy theories (but "fast and furious" seemed to be really wrong). How many of trump associates have been jailed?

Will he be convicted in the Senate, no -- but the impeachment is far from a farce. Trump sought a foreign government to interfere in our electoral process and then withheld official acts to coerce them to do so. I know I'll never convince anyone here, but facts sure are pesky items.

https://www.newsweek.com/2017/11/10/trump-administration-most-corrupt-history-698935.html


"Good science comes in peer reviewed journals. Conspiracy theories come in videos. "
Kevin @ bandcamp: Crows Say Vee-Eh (and Kevin @50/90 2019)
#1160915 - 01/24/20 10:43 AM Re: An observation... [Re: couchgrouch]  
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90 dB Offline
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#1160916 - 01/24/20 10:48 AM Re: An observation... [Re: couchgrouch]  
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Not sure who the source is -- I just picked the first article that I came across (is it from Newsweek) but the premise is still accurate, all those folks are/were corrupt. There are thousand articles on this subject, probably even some from fox.

If any folks in the article are actually innocent, let me know.


"Good science comes in peer reviewed journals. Conspiracy theories come in videos. "
Kevin @ bandcamp: Crows Say Vee-Eh (and Kevin @50/90 2019)
#1160917 - 01/24/20 10:56 AM Re: An observation... [Re: couchgrouch]  
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"Not sure who the source is..."


Then why quote from him? An indictment worthy of Adam Schiff, indeed. smile

#1160921 - 01/24/20 11:24 AM Re: An observation... [Re: 90 dB]  
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JAPOV Offline
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Originally Posted by 90 dB
"Not sure who the source is..."


Then why quote from him? An indictment worthy of Adam Schiff, indeed. smile


LMFAO... smile

#1160922 - 01/24/20 11:26 AM Re: An observation... [Re: couchgrouch]  
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Ray E. Strode Online content
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Eh, Yes,
Trump committed the un-pardonable sin ! He got elected president and beat the Ice Queen doing it! Man it was Hillary's turn. After all she has been running for president her whole life! And by golly he's likely to do it again. Damn the torpedos, full speed ahead! The British Commoners are complaining about the Queen, the American Elites are complaining about Trump! Don't you just love it! After The Trump Impeachment how you gonna keep them down on the farm? Er was that Paris?


Ray E. Strode
#1160923 - 01/24/20 11:28 AM Re: An observation... [Re: Everett Adams]  
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Originally Posted by Everett Adams
As an outsider looking in, I had my doubts about Trump. He was a bit of a loud mouth, boastful reprobate, making promises that even he did not ever expect to have to try to fulfill. I don't think he ever expected to be elected but he spoke to many American's hearts. They elected him much to the displeasure of the Democrats. As far as I can see he has done his best to fulfill the promises he made, even to draining the swamp, he still has a way to go on that one. He has been opposed every step of the way on very promise, in spite of that he has done great things for your economy. I think when he is reelected he will finish fulfilling the rest of his promises, especially about draining the swamp. I may not agree with his approach in running the government, but he was never a Politician, he was always a business man, therefore he is taking the same approach in running the country. The rest of the world is not taking advantage of the USA like they always did, he is negotiating trade deals that are fair to all sides. Countries are afraid to call his bluff, be it in business deals or war, because they know he will not back down. Trump is (what you see is what you get). He is not two faced. Most politicians before elected will promise you the world but once in power they dance around their promises until the next election and try to buy your vote with more promises. I would sooner vote for an reprobate up front than vote for an angel up front and then find he\she is an even bigger reprobate after getting elected.

I never paid much attention to US politics, mainly because I didn't understand your system of politics, but when Obama was running for election, I started following it, actually rooted for him to be elected, I thought he would be good for all, but changed my mind after a few years. In Canada we make the mistake of putting in Liberal governments too often. We are living in a world of no absolutes, anything goes, and most of the people are of that persuasion, so we get the government we deserve. Most times they are in there for a good time (hopefully not a long time) at taxpayers expense. Right now we have an minority government, which means they could lose the right to govern at any time, so they have to govern carefully to hold unto power. When they have majority government they can push through any law they want, fair or unfair to the people.

I don't know how this impeachment farce will turn out, but the next election will be exciting to watch, much mud slinging and blood letting I'm sure.


"we get the government we deserve...." Damn right! Well said Everett!

#1160924 - 01/24/20 11:31 AM Re: An observation... [Re: couchgrouch]  
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I saw your link to the reporter. Seems like he posted a tweet of Nazi soldiers and compared to Ted Cruz's supporter in 2016. Totally out of line, but does not in any way invalidate the accuracy of the article I linked. Sorry, another false flag. heck, trump demonizes opponents all day long with tweets and doctored photos. I think that is out of line, too.

Once again, are the facts important or are insults and mis-directions the only thing you folks can come up with?


"Good science comes in peer reviewed journals. Conspiracy theories come in videos. "
Kevin @ bandcamp: Crows Say Vee-Eh (and Kevin @50/90 2019)
#1160925 - 01/24/20 11:40 AM Re: An observation... [Re: couchgrouch]  
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Ray E. Strode Online content
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Well,
Lessee here. While Trump was running he said he didn't have time to be Politically Correct, it was too late for that. And the people are loving it! Do you see the huge crowds he is still drawing? The people only care about one thing. Their bottom line. And it is getting a bit better. You would think the Dems would start working with him, not against him.


Ray E. Strode
#1160926 - 01/24/20 11:55 AM Re: An observation... [Re: couchgrouch]  
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Fdemetrio Online content
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The whole thing is a partisan frenzy. Those who support Trump are REPUBLICANS. If he did the same exact things he's done as a Democrat, they would not support him, simply because hes a democrat.

Its amazing how our brains compartmentalize. Trump WAS a democrat, and if he thought it would benefit him hed go back to being it.

As long as the country is either one or the other, nothing will ever change.

I agree with some things he's said, I dont agree the economy is better or jobs are better like he claims. Every President claims the same thing. But he hasnt really done much there. https://markets.businessinsider.com...a-bush-administrations-2019-9-1028833119

He says what alot of people are thinking, as I said he's smart, he seems to have a grasp on what the disenchanted people think. But cmon a guy who started with Millions, private Jets and Yachts, actually caring about the middle class? The Middle Class got him elected, he was smart enough to realize that.

And I dont care what side you're on, have you seen the people at Trump Rallies? It makes me start singing FREEBIRD, even if I was a die hard Trump Supporter, I would never show up at one of them rallies. You know he's cracking up as soon as he walks out of those rallies.

Last edited by Fdemetrio; 01/24/20 11:57 AM.
#1160929 - 01/24/20 12:34 PM Re: An observation... [Re: couchgrouch]  
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90 dB Offline
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"Totally out of line, but does not in any way invalidate the accuracy of the article I linked."


Really? You crack me up, man.

#1160930 - 01/24/20 12:35 PM Re: An observation... [Re: couchgrouch]  
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Fdemetrio Online content
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Here's an example of ever changing Political ideologies. It comes down to "what have you done for me lately"

Wikipedia:
Trump registered as a Republican in Manhattan in 1987 and since that time has changed his party affiliation five times. In 1999, Trump changed his party affiliation to the Independence Party of New York. In August 2001, Trump changed his party affiliation to Democratic. In September 2009, Trump changed his party affiliation back to the Republican Party. In December 2011, Trump changed to "no party affiliation" (independent). In April 2012, Trump again returned to the Republican Party.[3]

In a 2004 interview, Trump told CNN's Wolf Blitzer: "In many cases, I probably identify more as Democrat," explaining: "It just seems that the economy does better under the Democrats than the Republicans. Now, it shouldn't be that way. But if you go back, I mean it just seems that the economy does better under the Democrats...But certainly we had some very good economies under Democrats, as well as Republicans. But we've had some pretty bad disaster under the Republicans."[4] In a July 2015 interview, Trump said that he has a broad range of political positions and that "I identify with some things as a Democrat."[3]

During his 2016 campaign for the presidency, Trump consistently described the state of the United States in bleak terms, referring to it as a nation in dire peril that is plagued by lawlessness, poverty, and violence, constantly under threat, and at risk of having "nothing, absolutely nothing, left."[5][6] In accepting the Republican nomination for president, Trump said that "I alone can fix" the system,[7] and pledged that if elected, "Americanism, not globalism, will be our credo."[6] He described himself as a "law and order" candidate and "the voice" of "the forgotten men and women."[8] Trump's inaugural address on January 20, 2017 focused on his campaign theme of America in crisis and decline.[9] He pledged to end what he referred to as "American carnage,"[10][11] depicting the United States in a dystopian light—as a "land of abandoned factories, economic angst, rising crime"—while pledging "a new era in American politics."[9]

Although Trump was the Republican nominee, he has signaled that the official party platform, adopted at the 2016 Republican National Convention, diverges from his own views.[12] According to a Washington Post tally, Trump made some 282 campaign promises over the course of his 2016 campaign.[13]

In February 2017, Trump stated that he was a "total nationalist" in a "true sense".[14] In October 2018, Trump again described himself as a nationalist.[15][16]

#1160931 - 01/24/20 12:59 PM Re: An observation... [Re: couchgrouch]  
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JAPOV Offline
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FD, how can you have a democracy without a two party system? The fact that Trump has been flip-flopping all these years is simply evidence of what it means to be a free American. Imagine what it’s been like for him, to have so much money and influence, and to constantly be swayed one way or the other by the powers that be. That he chose, after all these years of flip-flopping, to go Republican should tell you something.

#1160932 - 01/24/20 01:09 PM Re: An observation... [Re: JAPOV]  
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Fdemetrio Online content
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Originally Posted by JAPOV
FD, how can you have a democracy without a two party system? The fact that Trump has been flip-flopping all these years is simply evidence of what it means to be a free American. Imagine what it’s been like for him, to have so much money and influence, and to constantly be swayed one way or the other by the powers that be. That he chose, after all these years of flip-flopping, to go Republican should tell you something.


Lol, oh cmon Bro. Compartmentalizing.... So hes Republican now, so all is well? Why did he say in 2004 that the economy does better under Democrats?

What if he changes to Democrat next term? Then what? You start bringing up Trump U, or Sexual Assaults, or Racism?

Those things are ok when hes your party. I remember Rebublicans blasting Hilliary for being married to a Predator...Melania?

I have Family who voted for Trump and others who cant stand him. We agreed to never discuss politics at dinner. Considering fist fights have almost broken out over football..

Everybody's entitled to believe what they want and to have whoever they want as President, but some of you guys make Trump out to be an Angel.

At least acknowledge that hes a douchebag, who like the plumber who walks around with his jeans hanging down so you see his butt crack, you live with it cause hes gonna fix the sink...



Last edited by Fdemetrio; 01/24/20 01:23 PM.
#1160934 - 01/24/20 01:42 PM Re: An observation... [Re: couchgrouch]  
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Ray E. Strode Online content
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Aw, Humm, Well,
Trump ran a total legitimate campaign, Hillary ran a totally ill legitimate campaign. The people saw thru it. End of story. Is our election method perfect? No. Is the Electoral College perfect? No. But we have plenty of checks and balances so if things get a bit out of hand in time it can be corrected.

When Dwight Eisenhower decided to run for president they wanted him to run as a democrat. He refused. It is overdue to drain the Swamp. Trump thinks it is time for everybody to stop living off the U.S. Taxpayer. A lot of people agree. We have enough Social Programs in place to sink a fleet of Battleships. Every Pension out there is running out of money. As of now, we are heading right back to the 1930's. When the money runs out who will you blame? Look up POGO. He says, We have found the Enemy, It is us. And Aesop's Fable comes to mind about killing the Goose that laid the Golden Egg. What's that you say Trump is FD? Better think again.


Ray E. Strode
#1160936 - 01/24/20 01:53 PM Re: An observation... [Re: couchgrouch]  
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OMG FD.... Spoken just like a true elitist... With the exception of an 8yr enlistment, I have worked commercial construction, contracting, and maintenance all my life... I have been knee deep and rubbing elbows with the deplorable disenchanted for more than 35yrs. I have mastered the art of saying "Yes Sir" and making it sound just like "F@&K You"! Yet, I am proud to say, I have never thrown hands over a game of football... ROLL TIDE!!! smile

#1160937 - 01/24/20 01:58 PM Re: An observation... [Re: Ray E. Strode]  
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Originally Posted by Ray E. Strode
Aw, Humm, Well,
Trump ran a total legitimate campaign, Hillary ran a totally ill legitimate campaign. The people saw thru it. End of story. Is our election method perfect? No. Is the Electoral College perfect? No. But we have plenty of checks and balances so if things get a bit out of hand in time it can be corrected.

When Dwight Eisenhower decided to run for president they wanted him to run as a democrat. He refused. It is overdue to drain the Swamp. Trump thinks it is time for everybody to stop living off the U.S. Taxpayer. A lot of people agree. We have enough Social Programs in place to sink a fleet of Battleships. Every Pension out there is running out of money. As of now, we are heading right back to the 1930's. When the money runs out who will you blame? Look up POGO. He says, We have found the Enemy, It is us. And Aesop's Fable comes to mind about killing the Goose that laid the Golden Egg. What's that you say Trump is FD? Better think again.


Oh, he won fairly and squarely. He didnt take anything for granted. whereas Hillary thought it was a landslide and became the hare in the story.

Trump was a Democrat, it has nothing to do with Party. If he was Democrat he would still have to believe in not giving social welfare. If he runs under Democrat next term you wont vote for him. That's what im trying to tell you.

Eisenhower may have refused but Trump didnt. Whats your feelin of his Trump University debacle or his unwillingness to rlease his taxes? Hey even Obama eventually handed over his Birth Certificate when Trump started the birther movement. I know the answer, it doesnt matter right?

Besides Trump currently being a Republican, how has he changed your life for the better Ray?



Last edited by Fdemetrio; 01/24/20 02:02 PM.
#1160938 - 01/24/20 02:02 PM Re: An observation... [Re: John W. Selleck]  
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Originally Posted by John W. Selleck
And exactly how many crimes have the Democrats committed trying to get him out of office? And exactly how many crimes have the Clinton's committed that the Democrats whitewashed? Care to answer that one? "Let he who is without sin cast the first stone!" Trump's Biggest crime, winning the election.


I'll answer that. None. That was easy smile

#1160939 - 01/24/20 02:04 PM Re: An observation... [Re: couchgrouch]  
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Hey wait a minute now, dont let my comments on Trump mean for minute I support Hillary or Obama or Bill, They are ALL crooks.

#1160956 - 01/24/20 09:00 PM Re: An observation... [Re: Gavin Sinclair]  
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Originally Posted by Gavin Sinclair
Originally Posted by John W. Selleck
And exactly how many crimes have the Democrats committed trying to get him out of office? And exactly how many crimes have the Clinton's committed that the Democrats whitewashed? Care to answer that one? "Let he who is without sin cast the first stone!" Trump's Biggest crime, winning the election.


I'll answer that. None. That was easy smile


Talk about Kool-Aid, You must have bought out the factory and swallowed it all in a single gulp!


Have a goodun,

John W. Selleck BMI Songwriter
A day without learning is a day lost

http://www.soundclick.com/johnsings
http://www.soundclick.com/johnwselleck
http://www.soundclick.com/johnselleck
#1160957 - 01/24/20 09:12 PM Re: An observation... [Re: Everett Adams]  
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Originally Posted by Everett Adams
As an outsider looking in, I had my doubts about Trump. He was a bit of a loud mouth, boastful reprobate, making promises that even he did not ever expect to have to try to fulfill. I don't think he ever expected to be elected but he spoke to many American's hearts. They elected him much to the displeasure of the Democrats. As far as I can see he has done his best to fulfill the promises he made, even to draining the swamp, he still has a way to go on that one. He has been opposed every step of the way on very promise, in spite of that he has done great things for your economy. I think when he is reelected he will finish fulfilling the rest of his promises, especially about draining the swamp. I may not agree with his approach in running the government, but he was never a Politician, he was always a business man, therefore he is taking the same approach in running the country. The rest of the world is not taking advantage of the USA like they always did, he is negotiating trade deals that are fair to all sides. Countries are afraid to call his bluff, be it in business deals or war, because they know he will not back down. Trump is (what you see is what you get). He is not two faced. Most politicians before elected will promise you the world but once in power they dance around their promises until the next election and try to buy your vote with more promises. I would sooner vote for an reprobate up front than vote for an angel up front and then find he\she is an even bigger reprobate after getting elected.

I never paid much attention to US politics, mainly because I didn't understand your system of politics, but when Obama was running for election, I started following it, actually rooted for him to be elected, I thought he would be good for all, but changed my mind after a few years. In Canada we make the mistake of putting in Liberal governments too often. We are living in a world of no absolutes, anything goes, and most of the people are of that persuasion, so we get the government we deserve. Most times they are in there for a good time (hopefully not a long time) at taxpayers expense. Right now we have an minority government, which means they could lose the right to govern at any time, so they have to govern carefully to hold unto power. When they have majority government they can push through any law they want, fair or unfair to the people.

I don't know how this impeachment farce will turn out, but the next election will be exciting to watch, much mud slinging and blood letting I'm sure.


Thanks Everett, well said!
As far as corruption, LOL!

https://www.investors.com/politics/editorials/think-obama-administration-wasnt-corrupt-think-again/

Or:

https://www.amazon.com/Scandalous-Presidency-Barack-Obama/dp/1682615812


Have a goodun,

John W. Selleck BMI Songwriter
A day without learning is a day lost

http://www.soundclick.com/johnsings
http://www.soundclick.com/johnwselleck
http://www.soundclick.com/johnselleck
#1160958 - 01/24/20 11:17 PM Re: An observation... [Re: John W. Selleck]  
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Originally Posted by John W. Selleck
Originally Posted by Gavin Sinclair
Originally Posted by John W. Selleck
And exactly how many crimes have the Democrats committed trying to get him out of office? And exactly how many crimes have the Clinton's committed that the Democrats whitewashed? Care to answer that one? "Let he who is without sin cast the first stone!" Trump's Biggest crime, winning the election.


I'll answer that. None. That was easy smile


Talk about Kool-Aid, You must have bought out the factory and swallowed it all in a single gulp!

Well, I suppose we all have a tendency to drink our own flavor of Kool-Aid, me included, but I stand by what I said.

To be honest, regardless of party, I'm mystified by people who defend this man. I can only assume that when they watch "Back to the Future," they are rooting for Biff.

#1160963 - 01/25/20 04:15 AM Re: An observation... [Re: Gavin Sinclair]  
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Originally Posted by Gavin Sinclair
Originally Posted by John W. Selleck
Originally Posted by Gavin Sinclair
Originally Posted by John W. Selleck
And exactly how many crimes have the Democrats committed trying to get him out of office? And exactly how many crimes have the Clinton's committed that the Democrats whitewashed? Care to answer that one? "Let he who is without sin cast the first stone!" Trump's Biggest crime, winning the election.


I'll answer that. None. That was easy smile


Talk about Kool-Aid, You must have bought out the factory and swallowed it all in a single gulp!

Well, I suppose we all have a tendency to drink our own flavor of Kool-Aid, me included, but I stand by what I said.

To be honest, regardless of party, I'm mystified by people who defend this man. I can only assume that when they watch "Back to the Future," they are rooting for Biff.


You are not as mystified as I am by the people in the Democratic party that are not in jail yet.


Have a goodun,

John W. Selleck BMI Songwriter
A day without learning is a day lost

http://www.soundclick.com/johnsings
http://www.soundclick.com/johnwselleck
http://www.soundclick.com/johnselleck
#1160965 - 01/25/20 06:39 AM Re: An observation... [Re: couchgrouch]  
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Trump beat the Democrats at their own game, and he continues to give them a thrashing Lol.... The "swamp" is beginning to feed on itself! See how brilliant Trump is? All he had to do was set an appropriate Constitutional standard then shrug his shoulders and watch the globalist, elitist, progressive, socialist, liberal Democrats slit their own throats. The game is over. The libtards are the walking dead, they just don’t know it yet.

Last edited by JAPOV; 01/25/20 06:46 AM.
#1160975 - 01/25/20 07:26 AM Re: An observation... [Re: couchgrouch]  
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@ Gavin
Lol... At least "Biff" had a likable, simple minded, integrity of purpose smile

#1160976 - 01/25/20 10:09 AM Re: An observation... [Re: couchgrouch]  
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Politics is a dirty game but someone has to play it. In Canada we have more choices when it comes to voting, so we pick the ones that appeal to us through the lies they tell us to get elected. The party in power when the election is called has the advantage because they control the purse strings so they can buy off the media to make them look good and the others look bad. The media is what persuades people which way to vote.If newspapers, TV media and radio get a great big grant from the party in power under the guise of helping them stay afloat in a world of less advertising dollars, who do you think is going to get the best reports on the evening news, the party that just saved their butts. Keep them in power and keep the money flowing. I don't know if that is the situation in the US but one never knows what goes on behind closed doors.

When it comes to voting, sometimes you have to choose the lesser of two, three or more evils. It takes lots of money to run for government and most good people don't have the money or the nerve to throw their hat in the ring, so you end up with big business backing what ever party (maybe both) that pleases them and they can control after the election. Sadly what ever party gets power will be controlled by the real power behind the scenes. They will bow to the will of the money so they can stay at the trough and milk the taxpayer for their share as long as they can. Democracy is suppose to be the best form of government but it is so flawed and full of holes that you can drive a truck through it. My understanding of the bible says no one is in power unless God wants him/her there. For what ever reason God puts less than perfect people in power to serve His purpose. Trump is far less than perfect, but God , who knows all, considered him the better choice for America at this time in history than Clinton, I don't question God, He is supreme. Who knows, maybe the next election will change government to suit God's agenda. America, as is most of the world, is divided against itself along the lines of good and evil. What some people call evil, others call good and vice versa, just as the bible said it would be in the last days. Choose whom you will follow, there is no natural ground in this battle.

#1160977 - 01/25/20 10:15 AM Re: An observation... [Re: couchgrouch]  
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It's a bit like Football, we dont care if our wide receiver rapes somebody, or beats his wife, or crashes his Mercedes into a boutique store while drunk on Tequilla. So long as he catches touchdown passes on Sunday then we cheer. Desensitization is a real thing. Weve become immune to all kinds of horrible stuff.

No President is in it to be public servants which is what they should be.

#1160985 - 01/25/20 11:37 AM Re: An observation... [Re: couchgrouch]  
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Eh, Well,
Aaron Arthur, Bugsy, FD, whatever you are calling yourself these days, How does Trump being President help me? Well I would say a bit minor but somewhat less than moderate directly. Indirectly the whole economy is a lot better for everybody so it helps everybody and their economic situation.

Now some people will never see the good Trump is doing. Those are the freeloaders that thinks the government owes them a living. They live on government handouts and will until the money runs out. Then they will look like a deer in the headlights and wonder what happened?

Gee Gavin. Getting off your a** and working never hurt anybody. My wife and I have worked all our lives and we ain't exactly rich but we ain't poor either. Trump thinks you should get off your a** and work. What do you think Gavin???


Ray E. Strode
#1160986 - 01/25/20 11:41 AM Re: An observation... [Re: Ray E. Strode]  
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Originally Posted by Ray E. Strode
Eh, Well,
Aaron Arthur, Bugsy, FD, whatever you are calling yourself these days, How does Trump being President help me? Well I would say a bit minor but somewhat less than moderate directly. Indirectly the whole economy is a lot better for everybody so it helps everybody and their economic situation.

Now some people will never see the good Trump is doing. Those are the freeloaders that thinks the government owes them a living. They live on government handouts and will until the money runs out. Then they will look like a deer in the headlights and wonder what happened?

Gee Gavin. Getting off your a** and working never hurt anybody. My wife and I have worked all our lives and we ain't exactly rich but we ain't poor either. Trump thinks you should get off your a** and work. What do you think Gavin???


How is it better? Show me the numbers.

Your answer to everything is free loaders and handouts? Thats your whole argument? You dont think people are still getting handouts? THEY ARE.


Last edited by Fdemetrio; 01/25/20 11:57 AM.
#1160995 - 01/25/20 03:09 PM Re: An observation... [Re: couchgrouch]  
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JAPOV Offline
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As I mentioned before, Americans are now torn between the Biblical "ideal" of freedom that our forefathers wrote into our Constitution, and the modern day capitalist ideology. Some people sadly believe that governance is all about profit and economic influence... that is very self serving and short sighted. There aren’t enough resources on the face of this planet to cover the $190 trillion of global debt we’re in. Don’t you see? Our greed and profit driven ideologies have outgrown the tangible reality of life. Ultimately, instead of simply giving God credit for all he has provided freely, we have chosen to enslave each other in the name of profit. "Cain and Abel" ring any bells?

No man is perfect and Trump is no exception, but he did keep his promise to recognize Jerusalem as the capital of Israel and move our embassy there; giving Israel all the authority and recognition it needs to legitimately defend itself and be the true stabilizing influence in the middle east that we never could be. That alone speaks volumes to me, personally... but then, I'm a Christian.

#1160996 - 01/25/20 03:15 PM Re: An observation... [Re: John W. Selleck]  
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Originally Posted by John W. Selleck
Originally Posted by Everett Adams
As an outsider looking in, I had my doubts about Trump. He was a bit of a loud mouth, boastful reprobate, making promises that even he did not ever expect to have to try to fulfill. I don't think he ever expected to be elected but he spoke to many American's hearts. They elected him much to the displeasure of the Democrats. As far as I can see he has done his best to fulfill the promises he made, even to draining the swamp, he still has a way to go on that one. He has been opposed every step of the way on very promise, in spite of that he has done great things for your economy. I think when he is reelected he will finish fulfilling the rest of his promises, especially about draining the swamp. I may not agree with his approach in running the government, but he was never a Politician, he was always a business man, therefore he is taking the same approach in running the country. The rest of the world is not taking advantage of the USA like they always did, he is negotiating trade deals that are fair to all sides. Countries are afraid to call his bluff, be it in business deals or war, because they know he will not back down. Trump is (what you see is what you get). He is not two faced. Most politicians before elected will promise you the world but once in power they dance around their promises until the next election and try to buy your vote with more promises. I would sooner vote for an reprobate up front than vote for an angel up front and then find he\she is an even bigger reprobate after getting elected.

I never paid much attention to US politics, mainly because I didn't understand your system of politics, but when Obama was running for election, I started following it, actually rooted for him to be elected, I thought he would be good for all, but changed my mind after a few years. In Canada we make the mistake of putting in Liberal governments too often. We are living in a world of no absolutes, anything goes, and most of the people are of that persuasion, so we get the government we deserve. Most times they are in there for a good time (hopefully not a long time) at taxpayers expense. Right now we have an minority government, which means they could lose the right to govern at any time, so they have to govern carefully to hold unto power. When they have majority government they can push through any law they want, fair or unfair to the people.

I don't know how this impeachment farce will turn out, but the next election will be exciting to watch, much mud slinging and blood letting I'm sure.


Thanks Everett, well said!
As far as corruption, LOL!

https://www.investors.com/politics/editorials/think-obama-administration-wasnt-corrupt-think-again/

Or:

https://www.amazon.com/Scandalous-Presidency-Barack-Obama/dp/1682615812


Here's a useful site for assessing the credibility of media sources. https://mediabiasfactcheck.com/investors-business-daily/

I haven't read that book, but did note that the author is a senior editor at Breitbart and has a very clear political agenda. I'm not saying that would make everything in the book wrong, just that one should approach it with caution, bearing in mind the purpose for which it was written.

#1160997 - 01/25/20 03:27 PM Re: An observation... [Re: JAPOV]  
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Originally Posted by JAPOV
As I mentioned before, Americans are now torn between the Biblical "ideal" of freedom that our forefathers wrote into our Constitution, and the modern day capitalist ideology. Some people sadly believe that governance is all about profit and economic influence... that is very self serving and short sighted. There aren’t enough resources on the face of this planet to cover the $190 trillion of global debt we’re in. Don’t you see? Our greed and profit driven ideologies have outgrown the tangible reality of life. Ultimately, instead of simply giving God credit for all he has provided freely, we have chosen to enslave each other in the name of profit. "Cain and Abel" ring any bells?

No man is perfect and Trump is no exception, but he did keep his promise to recognize Jerusalem as the capital of Israel and move our embassy there; giving Israel all the authority and recognition it needs to legitimately defend itself and be the true stabilizing influence in the middle east that we never could be. That alone speaks volumes to me, personally... but then, I'm a Christian.


I agree our Christian values have disappeared. But there is no way in GOD's mighty name you can talk God and Trump in the same sentence. I mean do you see God in Trumps actions? Aren't deeds more important than words? Three marriages, ok, I dont care how many times he's been married, but Christians seem to, but no problem with Trump...

Lets face it. Here is why Trump is President today:
1. Nobody strong enough on the Dem side
2. White Middle Class people tired of the minorities getting assistance, and the rich getting tax breaks, but nothing for them. (he saw this)

We talk about spending, if your liberal you spend it on welfare, if your republican you spend it on warfare

I mean it doesnt help anything.

In theory, I agree with Trump, but I dont trust him, that's my problem. From Miss America Pageants and The Apprentice to President of the US?

He says alot of things I agree with, but why he says these things.....

Last edited by Fdemetrio; 01/25/20 03:28 PM.
#1160999 - 01/25/20 03:57 PM Re: An observation... [Re: Ray E. Strode]  
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Originally Posted by Ray E. Strode
Eh, Well,
Aaron Arthur, Bugsy, FD, whatever you are calling yourself these days, How does Trump being President help me? Well I would say a bit minor but somewhat less than moderate directly. Indirectly the whole economy is a lot better for everybody so it helps everybody and their economic situation.

Now some people will never see the good Trump is doing. Those are the freeloaders that thinks the government owes them a living. They live on government handouts and will until the money runs out. Then they will look like a deer in the headlights and wonder what happened?

Gee Gavin. Getting off your a** and working never hurt anybody. My wife and I have worked all our lives and we ain't exactly rich but we ain't poor either. Trump thinks you should get off your a** and work. What do you think Gavin???

You've accused me of being a freeloader before, Ray. If I didn't find you funny, I'd be offended. I don't owe you an explanation, but I have never taken a dime of public assistance in my life, so you should probably stop with the snide insinuations. I don't begrudge those who need some help. Many of them are hard working too. Their hard work just doesn't earn them a living wage and we all have to pick up the tab instead of their employers. There are freeloaders too, of course, rich and poor, some are Trump fans and some are not.

Being someone who doesn't "see the good Trump is doing" does not make someone a freeloader. It just makes them someone who doesn't agree with you.

#1161000 - 01/25/20 04:02 PM Re: An observation... [Re: couchgrouch]  
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Oh good grief! "Give a man a fish or teach him to fish..." This is not an original concept. There is a lot of useless fat that can be trimmed from the system, programs that were only put in place to buy and secure votes but today serve absolutely no purpose. Grants for the arts... The study of the reproductive systems of endangered insects... All the time and money wasted just to validate homosexuality... Do you honestly believe this is where your tax dollars should go? Trump is a businessman... You don’t get "the fatted calf" if there’s no calf!

Last edited by JAPOV; 01/25/20 04:07 PM.
#1161001 - 01/25/20 04:20 PM Re: An observation... [Re: couchgrouch]  
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I can think of one lump of useless fat that could be trimmed from the system LOL smile

#1161002 - 01/25/20 04:24 PM Re: An observation... [Re: couchgrouch]  
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"Good science comes in peer reviewed journals. Conspiracy theories come in videos. "
Kevin @ bandcamp: Crows Say Vee-Eh (and Kevin @50/90 2019)
#1161003 - 01/25/20 04:25 PM Re: An observation... [Re: couchgrouch]  
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What’s funny is I know you’re smarter than that Gavin... You just enjoy the argument as much as I do smile

#1161004 - 01/25/20 04:27 PM Re: An observation... [Re: Kevin Emmrich]  
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#1161005 - 01/25/20 04:38 PM Re: An observation... [Re: JAPOV]  
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Yes, I just couldn't resist that slow pitch you threw me, Tony smile

#1161008 - 01/25/20 04:56 PM Re: An observation... [Re: couchgrouch]  
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At least it made it to the plate! Lol...

#1161009 - 01/25/20 04:57 PM Re: An observation... [Re: couchgrouch]  
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Eh, Well,
I never called you a "Freeloader" Gavin. I said those that are freeloaders. You say you are baffled what people see in Trump. To coin a phrase, Trump is a whole lot smarter that you think he is. But that is for another day.

Back some time ago, before you were born Gavin, people would go to work for a company, most likely with Union representation, work there all their lives and retire with a small pension, usually there was a payroll savings plan for them, and Social Security when they reached 65. And they had a good, if not great retirement

But Gavin, the people got Greedy! They thought the company was making lots of money and they wanted more! And on top of that they elected more "Freeloaders" who also didn't have a pot to P*ss in or a window to throw it out of to Congress. The congress decided to raise taxes on the companies. The companies couldn't pay union wages and high taxes so they started leaving the country. And the workers were left out in the cold, by their own hand. I know some people can't see the forest for the trees. As stated by POGO. We have found the enemy, and it is us. Trump sees it Gavin, do you?


Ray E. Strode
#1161016 - 01/25/20 06:37 PM Re: An observation... [Re: Ray E. Strode]  
Joined: Apr 2007
Posts: 3,859
John W. Selleck Offline
Top 100 Poster
John W. Selleck  Offline
Top 100 Poster

Joined: Apr 2007
Posts: 3,859
NJ
Originally Posted by Ray E. Strode
Eh, Well,
Back some time ago, before you were born Gavin, people would go to work for a company, most likely with Union representation, work there all their lives and retire with a small pension, usually there was a payroll savings plan for them, and Social Security when they reached 65. And they had a good, if not great retirement

But Gavin, the people got Greedy! They thought the company was making lots of money and they wanted more! And on top of that they elected more "Freeloaders" who also didn't have a pot to P*ss in or a window to throw it out of to Congress. The congress decided to raise taxes on the companies. The companies couldn't pay union wages and high taxes so they started leaving the country. And the workers were left out in the cold, by their own hand. I know some people can't see the forest for the trees. As stated by POGO. We have found the enemy, and it is us. Trump sees it Gavin, do you?


There are lots of reasons why America has been failing for a lot of years now, the cause of this decline started right after the end of WWII, when we decided we needed to help the people we won the war over to get back on their feet by giving them lots of money, and sweet trade deals that made it so very hard for our own companies to compete in the same market. Our politicians have continued this for all the years after with every trade deal they have written, until Trump. The unions are also to blame for lots of this. They got greedy. The more money their workers make the more the unions could gouge their members, like a vicious circle. Today almost all the pension plans are going bust and union companies are playing hell trying to compete with non-union companies. Add to that the welfare programs, that were started in the 20's, and have gotten "Progressively" worse ever since. It is not only the social welfare programs that have been killing the economy it is the state of mind that comes along with it. Why work, when they will pay you to stay at home and not work? Why work, when all you have to do to get a bigger check is have more babies? Why work, when they will give you everything you need to live; welfare, healthcare, education, housing... Why work harder, when if you do it will mean you don't qualify for some of these programs? Why is it that around 50% of the people are paying almost 100% of income taxes? Add to that, Illegal immigrants and all they have cost this country in jobs and the drain on social welfare programs they should not qualify to receive. Any other country that had 20,000,000+ people cross their border illegally would call it an invasion because that is what it is. Most of them do not want to be Americans, only turn this country into the country they left. Yes, I own a soapbox.


Have a goodun,

John W. Selleck BMI Songwriter
A day without learning is a day lost

http://www.soundclick.com/johnsings
http://www.soundclick.com/johnwselleck
http://www.soundclick.com/johnselleck
#1161040 - 01/26/20 03:47 PM Re: An observation... [Re: couchgrouch]  
Joined: Dec 2000
Posts: 7,748
couchgrouch Online content
Top 30 Poster
couchgrouch  Online Content
Top 30 Poster

Joined: Dec 2000
Posts: 7,748
Kevin, Gavin...you guys seem to be as well informed as the impeachment side is gonna get and...you've got nothing. All those wordy posts (I'm looking at you, Kev), and no evidence of an impeachable offense.

Zero.

A link to a Newsweek article?

Hahaha!!!

Trump is really bad at hiring people. That was apparent by March of 2017. Sorry, but bad instincts aren't an impeachable offense.

If you don't like Trump, there's an election coming up. The Dem candidates are a complete joke, you know it, I know it. If Trump beat the trinity of Hillary/Hollywood/media in 2016, November is gonna be like that old movie Godzilla vs. Bambi.

*SQUISH!!*

That's the sole reason for the clown parade of left wing hoaxes. At least they didn't call Jussie Smollett to testify...Michael Moore would've stolen his sandwich.


Nashville demos etc:

https://www.soundclick.com/bands3/default.cfm?bandID=431939

other demos:

https://soundcloud.com/wabash-cannibal

Amazon Kindle books by Robert George you may enjoy:

1) Americana

2) Teenage Graceland

3) The Will to Be

4) Fort Mystery

5) Wheel Sea

6) My One True Love
#1161041 - 01/26/20 04:02 PM Re: An observation... [Re: couchgrouch]  
Joined: Feb 2007
Posts: 10,645
Kevin Emmrich Offline
Kevin Emmrich  Offline


Top 10 Poster

Joined: Feb 2007
Posts: 10,645
Crozet, VA
Originally Posted by couchgrouch
Kevin, Gavin...you guys seem to be as well informed as the impeachment side is gonna get and...you've got nothing. All those wordy posts (I'm looking at you, Kev), and no evidence of an impeachable offense. Zero.


couch, you just haven't been paying attention.

1.) Withholding official acts (aid, meeting) and trying to get a foreign country to investigate your political opponent. Withholding the aid was determined to be illegal by the OMB. Abuse of power = high crimes and misdemeanors

2.) Withholding testimony and documents from the House who was doing an impeachment inquiry = obstruction of justice.

Edit: you may not believe that these are "convictable" offenses or even offenses that trump should be impeached for, but this is what the house decided.

Last edited by Kevin Emmrich; 01/26/20 04:20 PM.

"Good science comes in peer reviewed journals. Conspiracy theories come in videos. "
Kevin @ bandcamp: Crows Say Vee-Eh (and Kevin @50/90 2019)
#1161042 - 01/26/20 04:28 PM Re: An observation... [Re: couchgrouch]  
Joined: Jun 2019
Posts: 563
JAPOV Offline
Top 500 Poster
JAPOV  Offline
Top 500 Poster

Joined: Jun 2019
Posts: 563
Just goes to show, liberals see what they want to see... Problem with liberals is, they keep pushing the limits till there’s no sense of right or wrong. Then the conservatives have to put things back in order while the liberals deny accountability. I miss the days when folks would debate the difference between democrats and republicans... Back when it was hard to tell the difference because both upheld the Constitution...

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