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#1130948 - 09/23/17 10:37 AM strange letter from spotify  
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Roy Cooper Offline
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Hi friends..

Maybe someone can explain to me what is happening.

I got a snail-mail letter from spotify this morning and it is a 'Notice of Intention to Obtain a Compulsory License for Making and Distributing Phonrecords', on one of my songs.

It lists the song and recording details of a record company and an artist, with a UPC number.

I have searched for the record company and the artist by no can find them.

The strange thing is the title of the track is the title that I used when I registered the song with the USA copyright office way back.

Since that time I have changed the track title, had it recorded and released it via my record label on spotify and itunes etc etc.

Any thoughts would be appreciated

God Bless Roy and Helen


Last edited by Roy Cooper; 09/23/17 10:38 AM.

'You Have To Kiss A Lot Of Frogs To Find A Prince'

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#1130949 - 09/23/17 10:55 AM Re: strange letter from spotify [Re: Roy Cooper]  
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Ray E. Strode Online content
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Ray E. Strode  Online Content
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Well,
I would assume if someone went thru the U.S. Copyright Office to obtain a Compulsory License they would have been able to find you from the address at the Copyright Office. A Compulsory License can only be obtained if a song has been Published and released for public distribution and the Copyright Owner refuses to issue a License. Until that time no one has a right to demand the Compulsory License. Who has the Copyright on the song. Did you assign it to someone? Keep us updated on the request.


Ray E. Strode
#1130950 - 09/23/17 11:11 AM Re: strange letter from spotify [Re: Ray E. Strode]  
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Roy Cooper Offline
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Thanks Ray.

I have the copyright and its published by my own label. I have it on spotify and itunes, under a different name which is also registered at the copyright office.

No one has asked me for a licence, so no refusal..strange

I never did release under the title they have used...just registration..

God Bless Roy and Helen

Last edited by Roy Cooper; 09/23/17 11:12 AM.

'You Have To Kiss A Lot Of Frogs To Find A Prince'

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#1130951 - 09/23/17 11:59 AM Re: strange letter from spotify [Re: Roy Cooper]  
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Dave Rice Online content
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Dave Rice  Online Content
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Hi Roy:

I get those type letters from a company in Los Angeles. It appears to happen when I decide to "pull" or withdraw an album from CDBaby or others. They claim "compulsory license" but it appears they intend to use my recordings... and not have another artist do a "cover" of my published and registered songs. In my opinion, after reading again, the paragraphs in the "music publishing books" believe their approach is totally illegal. I have written to them requesting they keep "hands off" my recordings. Never got a response. Probably crooks looking for an easy score. Sad commentary on the low level today's music biz seems to be seeking. ----Dave

#1130952 - 09/23/17 12:50 PM Re: strange letter from spotify [Re: Roy Cooper]  
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Roy Cooper Offline
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Thanks Dave for your input. Time will tell lol

I guess there are more angles out there than grains of sand on the beach.

Its good to hear from you friend.

God Bless Roy and Helen


'You Have To Kiss A Lot Of Frogs To Find A Prince'

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#1130966 - 09/24/17 05:34 AM Re: strange letter from spotify [Re: Roy Cooper]  
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Colin Ward Offline
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I wouldn't be surprised if they are seeking a different song with the same name and found yours by mistake.


Colin

I try to critique as if you mean business.....

http://colinwardmusic.com/

http://rosewoodcreekband.com/


#1130967 - 09/24/17 06:14 AM Re: strange letter from spotify [Re: Roy Cooper]  
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Roy Cooper Offline
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Thanks Colin. You could be right. My inclination is to let it ride and see what happens...

It could become a chart buster lol

God Bless Roy and Helen


'You Have To Kiss A Lot Of Frogs To Find A Prince'

Our Record Label

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#1130991 - 09/24/17 03:30 PM Re: strange letter from spotify [Re: Roy Cooper]  
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Jody Whitesides Online content
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NOIs are not strange, but now that streaming is the dominant form of listening to music, they are becoming more common. I get them all the time. What it is is the service looking to let the publisher of a song know that the song in question is heading for use on their service. Its required by law to let the publisher know 30 days prior to its inclusion on the service.

Of course the speed of these NOIs has been slower than the speed of songs being released (which could be why some people think they should sue the streaming service, despite them working on complying with the antiquated law).

In the NOI it will tell you which service, which song, and who the artist is that is releasing it. Go look the song up and listen. If it is your song, you'll start making money which will then go to you if you're registered for Harry Fox and Music Reports (you should be registered with both). If its not your song, best to let HFA or MR know they've got the wrong publisher.


Jody Whitesides
A Funky Audio Lap Dance For Your Ears!
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#1130994 - 09/24/17 04:01 PM Re: strange letter from spotify [Re: Roy Cooper]  
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Dave Rice Online content
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Dave Rice  Online Content
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Well said, Jody:

The notices I received implied a plan to use my song with me singing it (my original recording) and unless the rules have changed... that isn't legal! Are you aware of some new-fangled change that allows people to steal your work with impunity?

Thanks, ----Dave

#1130997 - 09/24/17 04:18 PM Re: strange letter from spotify [Re: Dave Rice]  
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Jody Whitesides Online content
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Originally Posted by Dave Rice
Well said, Jody:

The notices I received implied a plan to use my song with me singing it (my original recording) and unless the rules have changed... that isn't legal! Are you aware of some new-fangled change that allows people to steal your work with impunity?

Dave, a quick search of Spotify shows you are not on that service with any music. I don't know how you conduct your business of releasing songs. That being said, the first question is: Who is your distributor? What is your agreement with them?

Chances are you signed a distribution agreement that allowed your distributor to distribute to any service available now and in the future so they can make money on their catalog. If that's the case, then its your fault for not knowing your distribution agreement, not the streaming service's.


Jody Whitesides
A Funky Audio Lap Dance For Your Ears!
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#1131000 - 09/24/17 05:03 PM Re: strange letter from spotify [Re: Roy Cooper]  
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Dave Rice Online content
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Hi Jody:

My distributor in the first two cases was CDBaby and in the last case, LOUDR. They handle distribution to iTunes and others but as I said, the problem of NOI only happened when I pulled the digital distribution deal from both, CDBaby and LOUDR. (LOUDR has now ceased operations or has been sold or merged with another organization.) My distribution arrangement became null and void according to the language of our original agreement(s) when I took down my albums.

As both, the artist and the publisher, the songs belong to me. I don't want others using my recordings without my permission. I have no issue if they plan to have other artists record my songs, that is the traditional way of doing business for decades.

As far as "streaming services" are concerned, from what I've read about the mere pittances being paid to songwriters, publishers and artists... I would enjoy sending a "yellow stream" in their direction. I don't buy music that way and I prefer not to have my music played that way for that little reward.

Thanks, ----Dave

#1131002 - 09/24/17 05:51 PM Re: strange letter from spotify [Re: Roy Cooper]  
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Jody Whitesides Online content
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Dave, unless you check every service for your music, chances are its not there. Its not on Spotify (which is the service I use on a premium level).

As for Loudr. They're still in business, but all I see that they do is for mechanical licenses for physical formats.

As for other artists covering your songs - good luck. If you're not on streaming services, not really sure how they're ever going to hear you.

At this point you're pissing in the wind at yourself for not putting music on the streaming services. Consumers have spoken and streaming has won. I get it if you're not interested in knowing how many people actually listening to your music. Its scary to know if no-one is listening.


Jody Whitesides
A Funky Audio Lap Dance For Your Ears!
www.jodywhitesides.com
#1131003 - 09/24/17 06:52 PM Re: strange letter from spotify [Re: Roy Cooper]  
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Dave Rice Online content
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Jody:

I believe we are approaching "streaming" from different perspectives. I took my albums down because I was gaining more experience at creating and recording songs... and I realized my early recordings were "not up to speed" with being "airworthy." I wanted them out of the public eye and not available to be heard by human ears or purchased. (Extreme lack of talent on my part.) LOL! Because the Los Angeles Music Organization (un-named by me thus far) planned to "pirate my original recordings" I felt it would be in my best interests to resist and ask them to keep their hands off my music.
They mentioned Pandora and others in their Notice of Intent. I was not impressed.

From this point forward (unless I achieve a personal vocal miracle) I plan to have my songs demoed by better singers than me.
No matter what degree of success I am able to gain... or not, streaming will be out of the question for me unless the rules of the game change to a more favorable model for rewarding songwriters and artists. When I balance the books (expenditures versus income) I am considerably in the red and it appears that streaming would not change that situation.

Yes, from your perspective I may be pissing in the wind but ASCAP still thinks streaming is a bad deal. More power to you if streaming is working for your music. What is really scary is to believe someone is listening to music I created years ago that is sub-standard! I think of myself as a pretty good songwriter but a terrible vocalist. You, on the other hand, have talent and I'm in your corner, my friend.

Regards, ----Dave

#1131012 - 09/24/17 10:07 PM Re: strange letter from spotify [Re: Jody Whitesides]  
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Roy Cooper Offline
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Thanks for your input Jody, its always appreciated.

I understand what you are saying, the big problem for me is that the song, If it is mine, and it looks like it is, is an earlier version that I never released.

The newer version with a different title is already on spotify, and I do have my own label and am my own publisher, but they in the correspondence to me name another record label who I have never heard of and who doesn't seem to exist (same with their artist).

Would my label be the one to collect any royalties if they ever become due, as it is the entity in control of the song at this time.

I don't know what is happening, and if I should just leave well alone.

At least they name me as the writer lol


God Bless Roy and Helen

Last edited by Roy Cooper; 09/24/17 10:28 PM.

'You Have To Kiss A Lot Of Frogs To Find A Prince'

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#1131013 - 09/24/17 11:36 PM Re: strange letter from spotify [Re: Dave Rice]  
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Jody Whitesides Online content
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Originally Posted by Dave Rice
Jody:

I believe we are approaching "streaming" from different perspectives. I took my albums down because I was gaining more experience at creating and recording songs... and I realized my early recordings were "not up to speed" with being "airworthy." I wanted them out of the public eye and not available to be heard by human ears or purchased. (Extreme lack of talent on my part.) LOL! Because the Los Angeles Music Organization (un-named by me thus far) planned to "pirate my original recordings" I felt it would be in my best interests to resist and ask them to keep their hands off my music.
They mentioned Pandora and others in their Notice of Intent. I was not impressed.

From this point forward (unless I achieve a personal vocal miracle) I plan to have my songs demoed by better singers than me.
No matter what degree of success I am able to gain... or not, streaming will be out of the question for me unless the rules of the game change to a more favorable model for rewarding songwriters and artists. When I balance the books (expenditures versus income) I am considerably in the red and it appears that streaming would not change that situation.

Yes, from your perspective I may be pissing in the wind but ASCAP still thinks streaming is a bad deal. More power to you if streaming is working for your music. What is really scary is to believe someone is listening to music I created years ago that is sub-standard! I think of myself as a pretty good songwriter but a terrible vocalist. You, on the other hand, have talent and I'm in your corner, my friend.

Regards, ----Dave

Perfectly good reason to yank anything down. Actually I'm about to yank down an old release, not due to a reason you mentioned, but instead due to a licensing issue beyond my control. Which I will likely start a new thread about once I have a definitive answer tomorrow.

I've already shown the math of why streaming works here on JPF. No reason to rehash it.

Thank you for the kind words.


Jody Whitesides
A Funky Audio Lap Dance For Your Ears!
www.jodywhitesides.com
#1131014 - 09/24/17 11:39 PM Re: strange letter from spotify [Re: Roy Cooper]  
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Jody Whitesides Online content
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Originally Posted by Roy Cooper
Thanks for your input Jody, its always appreciated.

I understand what you are saying, the big problem for me is that the song, If it is mine, and it looks like it is, is an earlier version that I never released.

The newer version with a different title is already on spotify, and I do have my own label and am my own publisher, but they in the correspondence to me name another record label who I have never heard of and who doesn't seem to exist (same with their artist).

Would my label be the one to collect any royalties if they ever become due, as it is the entity in control of the song at this time.

I don't know what is happening, and if I should just leave well alone.

At least they name me as the writer lol

Have you looked it up on Spotify or any other digital service? You'll be able to find out pretty quick if its the version in question. Otherwise, it might well be a simple mix up. If it is an artist that somehow covered your song, then all you have to do is make sure to have it properly registered with your PRO, HFA and Music Reports. Then hope it gets a ton of streams.

If it is a mix up, you should let the company that sent you the NOI know, so they can fix the error.


Jody Whitesides
A Funky Audio Lap Dance For Your Ears!
www.jodywhitesides.com
#1131015 - 09/24/17 11:51 PM Re: strange letter from spotify [Re: Jody Whitesides]  
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Roy Cooper Offline
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Thanks Jody. Problem is that its release date on spotify is sept 30th, so I have to wait anyway..

The company that sent the NOI is spotify itself

God Bless Roy and Helen


'You Have To Kiss A Lot Of Frogs To Find A Prince'

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#1131018 - 09/25/17 11:39 AM Re: strange letter from spotify [Re: Roy Cooper]  
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Jody Whitesides Online content
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Originally Posted by Roy Cooper
Thanks Jody. Problem is that its release date on spotify is sept 30th, so I have to wait anyway..

The company that sent the NOI is spotify itself

That would not be likely as they (Spotify) use Harry Fox to do it.


Jody Whitesides
A Funky Audio Lap Dance For Your Ears!
www.jodywhitesides.com
#1131025 - 09/25/17 09:00 PM Re: strange letter from spotify [Re: Roy Cooper]  
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Roy Cooper Offline
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Here is the form Jody, from spotify

http://www.suitedrecords.com/licensee.htm

God Bless Roy and Helen


'You Have To Kiss A Lot Of Frogs To Find A Prince'

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#1131050 - 09/26/17 03:46 PM Re: strange letter from spotify [Re: Roy Cooper]  
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Jody Whitesides Online content
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That's the service that is requesting the license, but that's not who sent it to you. That would have been Harry Fox. Probably came in an oversized envelope, likely white with a little window showing your address and the return address which is Harry Fox. Generally the mailed version comes with a blue page that has the addresses on it.

And on the 2nd page would be the information about the song, the label releasing it, and the artist doing it.

p.s. - most of mine get emailed now.


Jody Whitesides
A Funky Audio Lap Dance For Your Ears!
www.jodywhitesides.com
#1131051 - 09/26/17 04:22 PM Re: strange letter from spotify [Re: Roy Cooper]  
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Roy Cooper Offline
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You are right Jody...

Spot on

thanks and

God Bless Roy and helen


'You Have To Kiss A Lot Of Frogs To Find A Prince'

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#1131053 - 09/26/17 04:49 PM Re: strange letter from spotify [Re: Roy Cooper]  
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Posts: 18,264
Brian Austin Whitney Offline
Brian Austin Whitney  Offline


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Joined: Apr 2001
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Indianapolis, IN USA
Cool!


Brian Austin Whitney
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#1131056 - 09/27/17 12:19 AM Re: strange letter from spotify [Re: Roy Cooper]  
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Roy Cooper Offline
Roy Cooper  Offline

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Joined: Sep 2009
Posts: 3,908
Thanks Brian and I think you are right

God Bless Roy and Helen


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