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#1125274 - 03/12/17 07:53 PM SELLING OUT!!!YES  
Joined: Mar 2017
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DesireInspires Offline
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DesireInspires  Offline
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In all honesty, most people doing music will never have the chance to "sell out". Most musicians get ignored and end up getting a day job to pay the bills.

People that worry about being real and not selling out don't have anything to worry about: most people aren't listening anyway.

You have to worry more about being recognized in the first place. You have to shove your music down people's throats and force your music onto people in order to gain any semblance of respect these days.

Most musicians can't even gain respect, so they will never get the money and the power.

#1125277 - 03/12/17 08:20 PM Re: SELLING OUT!!!YES [Re: DesireInspires]  
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Trentb Offline
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Originally Posted by DesireInspires
In all honesty, most people doing music will never have the chance to "sell out". Most musicians get ignored and end up getting a day job to pay the bills. People that worry about being real and not selling out don't have anything to worry about: most people aren't listening anyway. You have to worry more about being recognized in the first place. You have to shove your music down people's throats and force your music onto people in order to gain any semblance of respect these days. Most musicians can't even gain respect, so they will never get the money and the power.
That's very true. It's all perspective. An artist with millions turning down a Pepsi ad, is said to have integrity. An artist living on the streets would sell any song he had for much less. And nobody seems to care if sport stars sell out.

Peyton Manning and Michael Jordan will do any commercial that lays them millions, and they already have millions

Here's what I think the issue in music is. When an artist comes from working class roots, or even poor roots, they build their fan base on those grounds. People love them more for being where their from than the actual music sometimes.

When they start changing what they do, and making music designed to make money, and not to be great art, people get annoyed. It's like, we are the people who made you what you are, now you become a rich, unrelatable jackass. It's the fans who suffer from selling out, the hard core fans that is. The artist may make new fans do to being so big, but the new fans didn't come up the same way the original fans did. It leaves the original fans disgruntled

Most people will chase the money, but it is hard to swallow when an artist you really thought were for real and sincere. Isn't it hard to accept Paul McCartney singing with Kanye west and Rheanna? It just doesn't seem like the Paul we all knew and loved

Last edited by Trentb; 03/13/17 12:23 PM.
#1125336 - 03/14/17 05:44 AM Re: SELLING OUT!!!YES [Re: Trentb]  
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DesireInspires Offline
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Well, Paul McCartney has the right to work with who he likes. He has the right to make whatever music he likes. People change. Most people only knew him through music, so they really do not have a grasp of who he was, let alone who he is now.

Us laymen are no different. We grow up, go to college, get jobs, start families, and move away from home. Do we become horrible people for not staying in our hometowns and hanging with the same people for our entire lives? No, we change and learn and grow and experience new things. Musicians are no different.

People just like to tear others down once success happens. It doesn't matter if an artist signs a record deal and flops or goes on to sell millions of records. Just the fact that an artist had a shot at success is enough to make others jealous.

So in the end, most people sell out in some way. Some become musicians. Others become teachers, engineers, businessmen, lawyers, journalists, nurses, etc. People gain skills and work for money.

Doing music is a job as well, with a lot more unpredictability involved. It is easy to scoff at successful people, but it takes real insight to examine what made someone successful and try to use their examples as motivation.

#1125337 - 03/14/17 09:54 AM Re: SELLING OUT!!!YES [Re: DesireInspires]  
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Barry David Butler (D) Offline
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#1125339 - 03/14/17 10:09 AM Re: SELLING OUT!!!YES [Re: DesireInspires]  
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Trentb Offline
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Originally Posted by DesireInspires
Well, Paul McCartney has the right to work with who he likes. He has the right to make whatever music he likes. People change. Most people only knew him through music, so they really do not have a grasp of who he was, let alone who he is now. Us laymen are no different. We grow up, go to college, get jobs, start families, and move away from home. Do we become horrible people for not staying in our hometowns and hanging with the same people for our entire lives? No, we change and learn and grow and experience new things. Musicians are no different. People just like to tear others down once success happens. It doesn't matter if an artist signs a record deal and flops or goes on to sell millions of records. Just the fact that an artist had a shot at success is enough to make others jealous. So in the end, most people sell out in some way. Some become musicians. Others become teachers, engineers, businessmen, lawyers, journalists, nurses, etc. People gain skills and work for money. Doing music is a job as well, with a lot more unpredictability involved. It is easy to scoff at successful people, but it takes real insight to examine what made someone successful and try to use their examples as motivation.
He has a right to work with anyone he wants, doesn't mean he has to. We know him through the music, that's it. To me, a man who wrote so many beautiful, time tested, generation jumping music, recording with Kanye West, just seems like a guy trying to stay relevant. Kanye West has proven himself to be a jackass, what he pulled at the Grammys with Taylor Swift.

Maybe he's different than that, but the music of Paul McCartney and Kanye West can't be said in the same sentence, although I will give rappers credit for having skills.

I thought there would be a lot more disgruntled Metallica fans complaining about them performing with lady gaga at the Grammys. Somebidy told me that ship had passed. That old fans of Metallica don't expect anything less. Heck even johnny rotten of the sex pistols became a sell out. Imagine him in the days of sex pistols fame, writing books and going on people's court. I guess age changes you, but I think money changes you more

Last edited by Trentb; 03/14/17 10:23 AM.
#1125372 - 03/14/17 05:08 PM Re: SELLING OUT!!!YES [Re: Trentb]  
Joined: Mar 2017
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DesireInspires Offline
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Originally Posted by Trentb
I guess age changes you, but I think money changes you more


I see nothing wrong with that.

People have to support themselves some way. The people calling artists sellouts have a right to call them sellouts. And those same artists have a right to go and make money however they can make it.

Fame fades but the bills keep coming.

#1125399 - 03/15/17 11:12 AM Re: SELLING OUT!!!YES [Re: DesireInspires]  
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Toby Barns Offline
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As soon as anything "new", "revolutionary" or "counter-culture" has ever happened, it has come from a "grassroots" beginning.

Look at rock-and-roll for instance. In the fifties it began as something that was literally "feared" by the mainstream masses. The kids liked it though. That scared the parents even more!

So it grew. Business minded record companies, publishers, etc. started cashing-in. And rock kept growing. So they made a product and people kept buying and buying the product; world-wide.

So who was selling out? Everybody! Those rockers and doo-wop performers liked getting those new cars and sometimes decent initial paydays. A lot of them got "taken" by the business minds and did not make the "dough" in the long run. But the producers and the biz knew what was selling and they used the artists to deliver marketable product to the public.

Fast forward to the late sixties. The underground, hippies and whatnot were part of a huge underground "counter-culture" that grew from grassroots. How long did it take the record companies and Madison Avenue to recognize a market? Not very long!

Fast forward to every opportunity there has ever been for a commercial entity to make money and the same, fundamental story applies.

If a major record company offers an amazing contract to a band today, do you think that the band may conform to the requests of the record company and producers? Is that selling out?

Many times I have thought that selling-out was a "fan based" opinion.

#1125402 - 03/15/17 11:30 AM Re: SELLING OUT!!!YES [Re: DesireInspires]  
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Trentb Offline
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It's definitely a fan based opinion. I remember when the grateful dead released touch of grey. It got mega radio play, and a lot of teeny boppers and pop kids were listening and buying it, and enjoying it, but the real dead heads were disgusted by it. This ain't the dead man, they never were radio artists...etc

They didn't need that single to make them big, they sold out everywhere they went, but it pissed off a lot of the die hards...hey, die hards in a tie dye...sounds like a song

Last edited by Trentb; 03/15/17 11:32 AM.
#1125403 - 03/15/17 12:09 PM Re: SELLING OUT!!!YES [Re: Trentb]  
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Toby Barns Offline
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Toby Barns  Offline
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Right, there are countless examples of bands and artists like this. Personally, I think "Touch of Grey" and, going way back, "Truckin" are simply really catchy songs.

It's like, "oops, we wrote a catchy charting song".

Well, I sure would like to have that problem!

#1125405 - 03/15/17 12:18 PM Re: SELLING OUT!!!YES [Re: DesireInspires]  
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Trentb Offline
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Trentb  Offline
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For myself , I loved touch of grey, lol

But I wasn't the guy traveling the country, sleeping in vans or tents, making pottery and selling hashish, just to make enough money to see my next Dead show either.

All depends how you view it. Some people a song is just a song, others music is a way of life


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